MR

Sure, the album sold well but supposedly the tour didn't go too well, what with all the silly costumes and DDY (That Other Guy) prancing around as a robot. It's possible that TS and JY sabotaged the tour because they didn't like playing the Kilroy material, which may explain why Caught In The Act is so miserable.

But what would have happened if the tour had gone exceedingly well? I think DDY would have convinced (pressured?) the others into doing yet ANOTHER concept album, probably with more of a Broadway flavor. What do y'all think?

Blue Falcon wrote:Sure, the album sold well but supposedly the tour didn't go too well, what with all the silly costumes and DDY (That Other Guy) prancing around as a robot. It's possible that TS and JY sabotaged the tour because they didn't like playing the Kilroy material, which may explain why Caught In The Act is so miserable.

Tommy's attitude started way before. He was demoing/starting to record GWG in England during the PT tour. Tommy was also high as a kite at that timeframe, so he wasn't in the best frame of mind. Smashing his hand/arm wasn't the smartest move he ever did.

Blue Falcon wrote:But what would have happened if the tour had gone exceedingly well? I think DDY would have convinced (pressured?) the others into doing yet ANOTHER concept album, probably with more of a Broadway flavor. What do y'all think?

I think Tommy would have left with or without Kilroy. JY would have stuck around because well, what else is JY going to do besides Styx? As long as the money is rolling in with Styx - regarless of lineup - JY is fine.

I don't think the late 80s would have dictated another concept album. WHat I do think would have been interesting to hear a Styx album circa 87 or 88 in the midst of the big hair era. Now ponder that!

I've heard/read by most of them that looking back, Kilroy probably should have been Dennis' first solo album/project. It would probably have changed the whole dynamic of the band as we know it today.

Tommy and JY would have had a break from the music that they claim they dislike, and been more open to trying different things upon reuniting. Instead Tommy and JY wrote songs they felt they had to write instead of songs they wanted to write for Kilroy.

styxfanNH wrote:I've heard/read by most of them that looking back, Kilroy probably should have been Dennis' first solo album/project. It would probably have changed the whole dynamic of the band as we know it today.

So they'd end up like Journey after SP's Street Talk. I think the outcome was inevitable. Kilroy accelerated it.

styxfanNH wrote:Tommy and JY would have had a break from the music that they claim they dislike, and been more open to trying different things upon reuniting. Instead Tommy and JY wrote songs they felt they had to write instead of songs they wanted to write for Kilroy.

I'm not so sure about that ... TS needed a break to detox, that's for sure. While I like GWG, his work from 1982 (post-PT) to 1987/88 with Ambition and DY is spotty at best. I don't think Tommy was capable of writing another BCM or Renegade then. He had some good songs, but none stick with you like those did (or even the stuff off of PT sans She Cares).

DOuble Life is actually a good JY song. HMP is typical JY in many ways. I don't see him coming to the table with "fresh" ideas in 1985 or 6 that sound different than HMP or anything off of City Slicker.

DDY is the wildcard here - had Kilroy been his first solo album and it had one hit (even just Roboto) - not only would it have changed the face of the band as you say, but he'd arguably have more power to supposedly hold over them. I don't see that working - again, I think whether it happened when it did or 4 years later, a breakup was inevitable.

Well actually didn't Kilroy Was Here have two top ten hits? I thought Don't Let It End went to like #6..

Does anyone know how many records DDY sold/shipped of Desert Moon? You'd think with a top 10 hit he would have pushed near gold. Any ideas?

Blue Falcon wrote:Sure, the album sold well but supposedly the tour didn't go too well, what with all the silly costumes and DDY (That Other Guy) prancing around as a robot. It's possible that TS and JY sabotaged the tour because they didn't like playing the Kilroy material, which may explain why Caught In The Act is so miserable.

But what would have happened if the tour had gone exceedingly well? I think DDY would have convinced (pressured?) the others into doing yet ANOTHER concept album, probably with more of a Broadway flavor. What do y'all think?

I'm glad that didn't happen, I like the way it turned out today, DDY solo and Styx.

Blue Falcon wrote:But what would have happened if the tour had gone exceedingly well? I think DDY would have convinced (pressured?) the others into doing yet ANOTHER concept album, probably with more of a Broadway flavor. What do y'all think?

It's possible that if the tour had been a blockbuster and the album a high watermark of their career, they might have been able to ignore the internal strife long enough to deliver one more album, but anything they came out with at that point would likely have been a DDY solo album in all but name (see also: The Wall -> Final Cut) and wouldn't have solved the band's internal crises at all. I agree with Allan that the breakup was more or less inevitable.

However, had the band lasted into the mid-to-late 80's I can see their image and impact being similar (if not as potent) to that of Journey circa Rasied On Radio or Fleetwood Mac circa Tango In The Night. Seems a more likely niche for them than with the hair bands.

stabbim wrote:

Blue Falcon wrote:But what would have happened if the tour had gone exceedingly well? I think DDY would have convinced (pressured?) the others into doing yet ANOTHER concept album, probably with more of a Broadway flavor. What do y'all think?

It's possible that if the tour had been a blockbuster and the album a high watermark of their career, they might have been able to ignore the internal strife long enough to deliver one more album, but anything they came out with at that point would likely have been a DDY solo album in all but name (see also: The Wall -> Final Cut) and wouldn't have solved the band's internal crises at all. I agree with Allan that the breakup was more or less inevitable.

However, had the band lasted into the mid-to-late 80's I can see their image and impact being similar (if not as potent) to that of Journey circa Rasied On Radio or Fleetwood Mac circa Tango In The Night. Seems a more likely niche for them than with the hair bands.

Good comparisions (Final Cut and Tango in the Night/Raised on Radio). I think that's pretty much what Styx would have sounded like - a lot of Yamaha DX7, that bright strat-sounding guitar, very sterile ... you know the sound.

We can play the what if game back to 1979 and what if they had actually gotten rid of Dennis, never released Cornerstone as it was with "Babe", and went on without him? I don't think we'd be talking Styx. There would be no PT. No Kilroy. No Edge. No Glen. Styx would have faded into oblivion in the early 80s.

Face reality - Styx had a great run from 1977 through 1983 of basically being at or near the top. That is more than most bands. The burnout point for successful bands seems to hover in the 6 - 10 year mark, and after that, they can't duplicate their success or come close. Bon Jovi to me is an extreme aberration of this - Bon Jovi has somehow managed to still sell a shitload of albums and fill stadiums to this day.

Rush is also an aberration because their fans do follow their career even if they release a new album. The Stones release new albums, but really tour the hits and that's all people want to hear. They've become irrlevant as a new music act (IMHO).

It could be worse. We could have a Creedence Clearwater Revisitied situation. As many potshots as JY takes at DDY, the lines are legally drawn. They both know where they stand.

StyxCollector wrote:Good comparisions (Final Cut and Tango in the Night/Raised on Radio). I think that's pretty much what Styx would have sounded like - a lot of Yamaha DX7, that bright strat-sounding guitar, very sterile ... you know the sound.

Indeed. Twas the style at the time.

Face reality - Styx had a great run from 1977 through 1983 of basically being at or near the top. That is more than most bands. The burnout point for successful bands seems to hover in the 6 - 10 year mark, and after that, they can't duplicate their success or come close.

Well, there's nothing wistful in my speculations (or reaction to others' speculations.) It's just a fun intellectual exercise. I am perfectly content with the way things worked out musically for all involved. Everything put out by the band and their related solo & side projects has some good & some bad, and I'm grateful for the good.

But then, I think Hallucination is a better album than just about anything from the much-vaunted 77-83 period, so what do I know?

I was wondering the road that might have been taken when DDY was kicked out of Styx. I wasn't sure of the time frame, but if it was before the release of Cornerstone, I wonder, if Styx had gone on without him, would Dennis have produced a solo recording that had both Babe and First Time. ( I believe so) If those two had both been No. 1 hits, things might have been very, very different in the career tracks of Dennis and his former band.

I think if that had occurred, Dennis might have produced a Paradise Theater album, and possibly a Kilroy album, sounding similar to what he produced with Styx, but having large differences as well. It is interesting to wonder what might have been since the return of Dennis to Styx produced their first No. 1 album with his concept of Paradise Theater.

As to Desert Moon. I believe the album did not sell gold but the single did.

Bugsy

In regards to Desert Moon, it was an awkward time to release an album back then. It was the year the transfer from Vinyl to CD occurred and music fans were trying to decide what format to buy, not to mention that both the CD and Vinyl were released in smaller than normal quantities of each as the record compnay tried to figure out what format to concentrate in. This is why there are so few original copies of it on CD. It should have done better, but with no tour and a pissed record label that there was no tour - the promotion $$$ quickly died.