MR

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEu-Yb52BIQ


The Love Is There
We Will Always Be This Family

Tommy Shaw what happened to the family ?

They didnt eat their meat, so JY, Tommy & the rest were sent to bed too often without any pudding.

You go to bed too often without desert you get angry.

You get angry enough you leave home.


End of story!!!

Come on Froy, this is the 21st Century..

It's called a Divorce!

It happens!

Jodes wrote:Come on Froy, this is the 21st Century..

It's called a Divorce!

It happens!

Its called Hypocrite.
Now you know why Shaw does not talk anymore
He knows he will get caught.

It's called being in PR mode, with a dash of wishful thinking on the side.

And even here, you can see the strained diplomacy around the edges.

Sad, really.

Sure.

"after Babe, we all started to go our different ways" says it all

styxfanNH wrote:"after Babe, we all started to go our different ways" says it all

Yea says how stupid they were
After our only number 1 hit we all went our seperate ways.
What about JY where did he go?

froy wrote:

styxfanNH wrote:"after Babe, we all started to go our different ways" says it all

Yea says how stupid they were
After our only number 1 hit we all went our seperate ways.
What about JY where did he go?

It's all about the money isn't it.

Grotelul wrote:

froy wrote:

styxfanNH wrote:"after Babe, we all started to go our different ways" says it all

Yea says how stupid they were
After our only number 1 hit we all went our seperate ways.
What about JY where did he go?

It's all about the money isn't it.

Always is

Yep.. it's why Dennis changed their contracts in 1990 so that songwriters got more of the royalties instead of it being split 5 even ways.

It would be interesting to see just how much he settled for in the lawsuit..

Because it's ALWAYS ABOUT MONEY.

Jodes wrote:Yep.. it's why Dennis changed their contracts in 1990 so that songwriters got more of the royalties instead of it being split 5 even ways.

Good move
It should have never been split 5 ways in the first place.

Sounds more like a dictatorship then a democracy to me..

The dictatorhip continues today. Just ask Glen Burtnick.
Some family, I can remember three members coming to Dennis in 1983 insisting that he replace brother tommy when he left.

Jodes wrote:Sounds more like a dictatorship then a democracy to me..

Fine you write a number 1 hit song and then split the profits with 4 others
See how fast you say no to that

LordofDaRing wrote:The dictatorhip continues today. Just ask Glen Burtnick.
Some family, I can remember three members coming to Dennis in 1983 insisting that he replace brother tommy when he left.

He said forget it
He also said no reunion in 96 unless brother Tommy was there.

froy wrote:

Jodes wrote:Sounds more like a dictatorship then a democracy to me..

Fine you write a number 1 hit song and then split the profits with 4 others
See how fast you say no to that

I'm not sure why EVERY comment is based on his 'number one hit song'.
Zeppelin never had a number one hit song and they are regaled as one of the top dogs in music EVER.

Imagine if Led Zeppelin put out a song like "Babe". Hey, it would've been number one, but it would've killed their credibility. That's what happened with Styx. Personally, I think it was more that way with Roboto than Babe. Babe was a good song, but it should've been a solo record if the band felt so strongly about it. Probably to preserve 'the family' that you're whining about, the others conceded to Dennis. In fact, I believe that's been stated by your whipping boys Froy. However, there was fallout from that decision in that Dennis wanted to only do those kinds of songs from then on. Paradise Theatre was a good album, but also light weight compared to pre-Cornerstone (She Cares is included there so don't freak out).

Styx was a better band before Dennis led them to chase after the wet-panty market. Seriously.
I'd rather have an album as good as Grand Illusion than one like Cornerstone (which does have some good moments on it) or Kilroy Was Here (even less good songs there). Babe sufficed in opening the band to a new audience. Unfortunately, that song and others like it damaged their 'rock credibility' with a lot of their hardcore fans and also within the band.

I'm not sure why that's so tough for people to admit. The band should've said "Dennis, put it out as a solo song" if they felt that strongly about it. I don't think it was Babe so much as what happened after Babe was recorded.

brywool wrote:

froy wrote:

Jodes wrote:Sounds more like a dictatorship then a democracy to me..

Fine you write a number 1 hit song and then split the profits with 4 others
See how fast you say no to that

I'm not sure why EVERY comment is based on his 'number one hit song'.
Zeppelin never had a number one hit song and they are regaled as one of the top dogs in music EVER.

Imagine if Led Zeppelin put out a song like "Babe". Hey, it would've been number one, but it would've killed their credibility. That's what happened with Styx. Personally, I think it was more that way with Roboto than Babe. Babe was a good song, but it should've been a solo record if the band felt so strongly about it. Probably to preserve 'the family' that you're whining about, the others conceded to Dennis. In fact, I believe that's been stated by your whipping boys Froy. However, there was fallout from that decision in that Dennis wanted to only do those kinds of songs from then on. Paradise Theatre was a good album, but also light weight compared to pre-Cornerstone (She Cares is included there so don't freak out).

Styx was a better band before Dennis led them to chase after the wet-panty market. Seriously.
I'd rather have an album as good as Grand Illusion than one like Cornerstone (which does have some good moments on it) or Kilroy Was Here (even less good songs there). Babe sufficed in opening the band to a new audience. Unfortunately, that song and others like it damaged their 'rock credibility' with a lot of their hardcore fans and also within the band.

I'm not sure why that's so tough for people to admit. The band should've said "Dennis, put it out as a solo song" if they felt that strongly about it. I don't think it was Babe so much as what happened after Babe was recorded.

If you think Styx ever had the same cred as Led Zepplin, you are truly fucked in the head. Yeah, it was Babe that kept Styx from being Zepplin. Styx was cheesy long before Babe. And Dennis wasn't the only slice of cheese in that sandwich either.

"Styx was NEVER cool." -Glen Burtnik

Higgy wrote:

brywool wrote:

froy wrote:

Jodes wrote:Sounds more like a dictatorship then a democracy to me..

Fine you write a number 1 hit song and then split the profits with 4 others
See how fast you say no to that

I'm not sure why EVERY comment is based on his 'number one hit song'.
Zeppelin never had a number one hit song and they are regaled as one of the top dogs in music EVER.

Imagine if Led Zeppelin put out a song like "Babe". Hey, it would've been number one, but it would've killed their credibility. That's what happened with Styx. Personally, I think it was more that way with Roboto than Babe. Babe was a good song, but it should've been a solo record if the band felt so strongly about it. Probably to preserve 'the family' that you're whining about, the others conceded to Dennis. In fact, I believe that's been stated by your whipping boys Froy. However, there was fallout from that decision in that Dennis wanted to only do those kinds of songs from then on. Paradise Theatre was a good album, but also light weight compared to pre-Cornerstone (She Cares is included there so don't freak out).

Styx was a better band before Dennis led them to chase after the wet-panty market. Seriously.
I'd rather have an album as good as Grand Illusion than one like Cornerstone (which does have some good moments on it) or Kilroy Was Here (even less good songs there). Babe sufficed in opening the band to a new audience. Unfortunately, that song and others like it damaged their 'rock credibility' with a lot of their hardcore fans and also within the band.

I'm not sure why that's so tough for people to admit. The band should've said "Dennis, put it out as a solo song" if they felt that strongly about it. I don't think it was Babe so much as what happened after Babe was recorded.

If you think Styx ever had the same cred as Led Zepplin, you are truly fucked in the head. Yeah, it was Babe that kept Styx from being Zepplin. Styx was cheesy long before Babe. And Dennis wasn't the only slice of cheese in that sandwich either.

"Styx was NEVER cool." -Glen Burtnik

You missed the point of the post. The point wasn't likening them to Zep. Zep is used as an example.

Read it more slowly...

To STYX'S HARDCORE ESTABLISHED FANS Styx had progressive rock credibility. They lost a lot of that with THEIR HARDCORE FANS when Babe and what came later came out. Just using Zep as an example. I could give a shit what any 'rock critic' has to say. To many of them, REM was the second coming of God (they sucked).
I'm speaking purely about the bands established fanbase at the time and also the other band members.

Maybe this will make it more easy to understand:

Say you're in a Metal cover band that's playing Metal Cover Band Clubs.
Say one of the members, a key member, wants to do a Carpenters tribute in the middle of the set with this same Metal band in these same Metal clubs.

You think that's gonna sit well with the Metal Cover band's fans? No.

DeYoung himself said "I thought when I played Babe live, I was going to get Tomatoes thrown at me or assassinated". He was wrong of course. That would've happened had he played "First Time"!

The problem wasn't Babe. The problem was that Babe opened the door to all the other stuff.

I'm not so sure they lost much of their hardcore fans with Babe. When they came out with Paradise Theater after it, it was the number one album at the time. Perhaps with Kilroy they lost some, but I honestly think by that point it was inevitable. I just don't think progressive rock as we think of it stood much of a chance at that point. Music tastes were changing. I just think the idea to blame one member is somewhat ridiculous, just as it's equally ridiculous to assume one member made the band. I'm sure there are fans who felt they "sold out" when they the various songs/albums spoken of here, but I still have to wonder would anyone's choices really be all that different under the circumstances these men had at the time?

Peace

froy wrote:

Jodes wrote:Sounds more like a dictatorship then a democracy to me..

Fine you write a number 1 hit song and then split the profits with 4 others
See how fast you say no to that

The credited writer got their full rate for each song. It was the publishing/production royalties that were split 5 ways, partly to compensate for the disparity in the writing credits.

And thats what Dennis Changed so that he could make EVEN MORE..

Jodes wrote:And thats what Dennis Changed so that he could make EVEN MORE..

And what about the role of producer?
Did he get paid for that?
Um no he did it for free saving thousands

No point here

froy wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEu-Yb52BIQ


The Love Is There
We Will Always Be This Family

Tommy Shaw what happened to the family ?

Wow 10 years later, is this called "Beating the Dead horse and his whole family"?

froy wrote:

Jodes wrote:And thats what Dennis Changed so that he could make EVEN MORE..

And what about the role of producer?
Did he get paid for that?
Um no he did it for free saving thousands

IIRC, he received a producer's salary after he started taking sole production credit with EOTC. Whether he was doing the job of sole producer prior to that time without receiving commensurate salary (and whether the amount of production control he actually had was welcomed by the rest of the organization) is a matter of debate.

LordofDaRing wrote:The dictatorhip continues today. Just ask Glen Burtnick.

Did Glen and Dennis have a new falling out?

blt man wrote:

LordofDaRing wrote:The dictatorhip continues today. Just ask Glen Burtnick.

Did Glen and Dennis have a new falling out?

Must have happened just recently, he was with Dennis at the Taste of Blue Ash (November I Think).

As far as I know, they didn't. I think it's just a relationship where they work together when they want, they don't when they don't. It's not like Glen was at every show since those dates in NJ.

I'm hoping my DDY interview comes through in the next 3 - 4 months and I'll ask.

Pretty sure LoDR was referring to the current band, not DDY.

Unless he meant to leave the S out of "dictatorship," which ...well, could mean any of 'em, I suppose.

Glenn saying Styx was never cool is not exactly correct. Up to Grand Illusion I remember Styx having a very solid rep. as a progressive rock band and they were mentioned in the same breath as Genesis, Yes, Pink Floyd, Rush etc. The Grand Illusion was voted the 8th best album of all time at the local FM rock station in Toronto in '78. I remember POE being the first album that the reputation started to crack. Believe it or not, back in those days BCM and Renegade were considered somewhat commercial and the beginnings of a band starting to sell out. This was never my opinion, but of the progressive rock clique I hung out with at the time. It was only after POE was released that people started to make fun of me being a Styx fan. Most of my friends were fans of Rush, Zep, Yes, Genesis etc.

After POE, Styx was lumped into the Journey, REO, Foreigner category of commercial rock bands, which I thought was never fair. I always thought Styx had more to offer than those bands (even though I don't mind those bands).