The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[treetopovskaya]

oh... there was a dude wearing a journey shirt at the rally. }:C)

dsb played at the end... as people were leaving. that was neat.

i really never had an interest to ever go to a political rally. friends were going & the hubby wanted to go so i went... the tickets were free! i'm not a rep... or dem... i dunno who i am!

i'm a maverick!! }:CPP

[The_Noble_Cause]

He's not reformed. He's not repentent. End of argument.

And you call yourself a Christian?
It’s ancient history, and singularly characterizing a man who has devoted his life to educational causes as a terrorist, is both inaccurate and playing the voters for dumbasses.
Ayers actually wrote a letter to the NYTimes clarifying what he thought was a very biased article and was very repentant indeed.
But I won’t post it.
After all, you don’t truly care about Bill Ayers owning up to his acts.
You and Barb are here so that with each progressive lowering of the political bar, someone will dance the limbo and say, hey, that’s fair game!

Your hypocrisy is simply astounding. You know absolutely nothing about my wife, brother, friends, etc. The only "Elitist piece of shit" on this entire forum is you. You are subhuman trash.

I’m just recycling a right wing trope.
You said it yourself that Ayers is “a snooty professor.”
Turn on Beck or Limbaugh or any garden variety McCarthyite swine and they are tearing down the institutions of higher learning on a daily basis.

[7 Wishes]

That's because no self-respecting institution of higher learning would extend an acceptance letter into any of their academic programs. O'Reilly, Hannity, Beck, Katz, and Limbaugh (notice a pattern of "left wing media" dominance here, Barb? ) collectively have the intelligence of a slug.

[Saint John]

[Ayers actually wrote a letter to the NYTimes clarifying what he thought was a very biased article and was very repentant indeed.

The former Weatherman, William Ayers, now holds the position of distinguished professor of education at the University of Illinois-Chicago. Although never convicted of any crime, he told the New York Times in September 2001, "I don't regret setting bombs...I feel we didn't do enough."

[The_Noble_Cause]

Bill Ayers on NY Times Article:

September 15, 2001

To The Editors—

In July of this year Dinitia Smith asked my publisher if she might interview me for the New York Times on my forthcoming book, Fugitive Days. From the start she questioned me sharply about bombings, and each time I referred her to my memoir where I discussed the culture of violence we all live with in America, my growing anger in the 1960’s about the structures of racism and the escalating war, and the complex, sometimes extreme and despairing choices I made in those terrible times.

Smith’s angle is captured in the Times headline: “No regrets for a love of explosives” (September 11, 2001). She and I spoke a lot about regrets, about loss, about attempts to account for one’s life. I never said I had any love for explosives, and anyone who knows me found that headline sensationalistic nonsense. I said I had a thousand regrets, but no regrets for opposing the war with every ounce of my strength. I told her that in light of the indiscriminate murder of millions of Vietnamese, we showed remarkable restraint, and that while we tried to sound a piercing alarm in those years, in fact we didn’t do enough to stop the war.

Some readers apparently responded to her piece, published on the same day as the vicious terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, by associating my book with them. This is absurd. My memoir is from start to finish a condemnation of terrorism, of the indiscriminate murder of human beings, whether driven by fanaticism or official policy. It begins literally in the shadow of Hiroshima and comes of age in the killing fields of Southeast Asia. My book criticizes the American obsession with a clean and distanced violence, and the culture of thoughtlessness and carelessness that results from it. We are now witnessing crimes against humanity in our own land on an unthinkable scale, and I fear that we might soon see innocent people in other parts of the world as well as in the U.S. dying and suffering in response.

All that we witnessed September 11—the awful carnage and pain, the heroism of ordinary people—may drive us mad with grief and anger, or it may open us to hope in new ways. Perhaps precisely because we have suffered we can embrace the suffering of others and gather the necessary wisdom to resist the impulse to lash out randomly. The lessons of the anti-war movements of the 1960s and 70s may be more urgent now than ever.

Bill Ayers, Chicago IL

http://billayers.wordpress.com/2008/04/ ... 9-15-2001/

[The_Noble_Cause]

Ayers actually wrote a letter to the NYTimes clarifying what he thought was a very biased article and was very repentant indeed.

The former Weatherman, William Ayers, now holds the position of distinguished professor of education at the University of Illinois-Chicago. Although never convicted of any crime, he told the New York Times in September 2001, "I don't regret setting bombs...I feel we didn't do enough."

Yeh, that's the very article in question dumbass.

[Barb]

And liberals wonder why they are looked upon as being condescending elitists. Spending your Saturday evening defending a domestic terrorist. What a riot!

[Barb]

That's because no self-respecting institution of higher learning would extend an acceptance letter into any of their academic programs. O'Reilly, Hannity, Beck, Katz, and Limbaugh (notice a pattern of "left wing media" dominance here, Barb? ) collectively have the intelligence of a slug.

For the record, O'Reilly went to Boston U and Harvard and he is the dumbest of the bunch, save Hannity who is dumber than a door knob.

[The_Noble_Cause]

For the record, O'Reilly went to Boston U and Harvard and he is the dumbest of the bunch, save Hannity who is dumber than a door knob.

O'Reilly is far smarter than all of them, or at least isn't rigidly bound to any one orthodoxy.

[Saint John]

Yeh, that's the very article in question dumbass.

Fuck you.

[The_Noble_Cause]

And liberals wonder why they are looked upon as being condescending elitists. Spending your Saturday evening defending a domestic terrorist. What a riot!

Reformed domestic terrorist.

[Barb]

For the record, O'Reilly went to Boston U and Harvard and he is the dumbest of the bunch, save Hannity who is dumber than a door knob.

O'Reilly is far smarter than all of them, or at least isn't rigidly bound to any one orthodoxy.

Oh no he is not. I've seen him make some of the dumbest most uninformed arguments on earth. He does have the Harvard arrogance nailed though.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Oh no he is not. I've seen him make some of the dumbest most uninformed arguments on earth. He does have the Harvard arrogance nailed though.

At least he's willing to break character every now and then.
Limbaugh and Beck's Conservative ideologue routine will become their own worst enemy.
Savage has the right idea and is inching more and more towards Lou Dobbs fake-populism every day.

[Barb]

Oh no he is not. I've seen him make some of the dumbest most uninformed arguments on earth. He does have the Harvard arrogance nailed though.

At least he's willing to break character every now and then.
Limbaugh and Beck's Conservative ideologue routine will become their worst own enemy.
Savage has the right idea and is inching more and more toward Lou Dobbs fake-populism every day.

I personally think Michael Savage is mentally ill. He is the angriest person on radio. He always has someone to hate. Glenn is just Glenn. His conservative ideology is WHO HE IS on and off the air and he is as real as it gets. He irritates me sometimes and I feel like his message is often times too "the sky is falling! the sky is falling!" but I still love him. He's like a friend that I know I can trust to tell me what he really believes even if I disagree. He is so successful because he is real. He's been wrong on a lot of things, but he's also been right. In truth, I actually miss the Glenn who talks about social issues and injects humor into his daily show. Since his TV show started, he's become far too political and regrettably, politically correct. I want his TV show gone and the unguarded Glenn to return.

Rush Limbaugh is a great Republican cheerleader if that is what you're into. I'm not. Sometimes I like to to listen to him after specific events, i.e. debates, etc. but for the most part, his show is very dry and he doesn't do anything for me.

Sean Hannity is about as annoying as a human being can be. I think he is probably a good person, but he says the same damn thing day after day, night after night. The reason Alan Colmes even has a job is because he makes Hannity look smart.

I don't think much of Bill O'Reilly as a person. I think he is fake, arrogant and only cares about what will get him the highest ratings. However, I do watch his show every single day because he covers interesting topics. I have all of his books and think he is a great writer. His personality just gets on my nerves.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Oh no he is not. I've seen him make some of the dumbest most uninformed arguments on earth. He does have the Harvard arrogance nailed though.

At least he's willing to break character every now and then.
Limbaugh and Beck's Conservative ideologue routine will become their worst own enemy.
Savage has the right idea and is inching more and more toward Lou Dobbs fake-populism every day.

I personally think Michael Savage is mentally ill. He is the angriest person on radio. He always has someone to hate. Glenn is just Glenn. His conservative ideology is WHO HE IS on and off the air and he is as real as it gets. He irritates me sometimes and I feel like his message is often times too "the sky is falling! the sky is falling!" but I still love him. He's like a friend that I know I can trust to tell me what he really believes even if I disagree. He is so successful because he is real. He's been wrong on a lot of things, but he's also been right. In truth, I actually miss the Glenn who talks about social issues and injects humor into his daily show. Since his TV show started, he's become far too political and regrettably, politically correct. I want his TV show gone and the unguarded Glenn to return.

Rush Limbaugh is a great Republican cheerleader if that is what you're into. I'm not. Sometimes I like to to listen to him after specific events, i.e. debates, etc. but for the most part, his show is very dry and he doesn't do anything for me.

Sean Hannity is about as annoying as a human being can be. I think he is probably a good person, but he says the same damn thing day after day, night after night. The reason Alan Comes even has a job is because he makes Hannity look smart.

I don't think much of Bill O'Reilly as a person. I think he is fake, arrogant and only cares about what will get him the highest ratings. However, I do watch his show every single day because he covers interesting topics. I have all of his books and think he is a great writer. His personality just gets on my nerves.

Michael Savage, for all his ranting against Howard Stern as a sewer rant, actually has more in common with the self-proclaimed King of all Media than his other AM radio counterparts.
Beneath the "liberalism is a mental disorder" shtick, lies a very gifted writer and comedian.
I am almost feel sorry that he is so pigeon-holed into the Conservative format.
When Beck is funny I enjoy him, but far too often he is juvenile.
Savage, on ther other hand, cracks me up even when I disagree.
It is the perfect lead-in to Art Bell 'cuz Savage's paranoid rantings often sound like they emanate from an underground bunker on the eve of the apocalypse.
It's misanthropic radio for the mutually self-loathing.

[7 Wishes]

Rush is a great disinfotainer, as well as being a fan of buffets and doughnuts.

Put him in a traditional debate setting, however, with someone with a reasonable facsimile of intelligence and ability, and he would get brutalized. He's only comfortable in the confines of his own self-delusional alternate universe. He's a remarkably unintelligent, bellicose hate-monger. That some people actually believe his verbal diarrhea is at the same time disturbing and amusing.

I love some of his doozies...

AIDS
But [AIDS] hasn't made that jump to the heterosexual
community."
Rush Limbaugh
June 9, 2004 broadcast of The Rush Limbaugh Show

Blacks
"Why should Blacks be heard? They're 12% of the population.
Who the hell cares."

"Take that bone out of your nose and call me back."

"Have you ever noticed how all composite pictures of wanted criminals resemble Jesse Jackson?"

"The NAACP should have riot rehearsals. They should get a liquor store and practice robberies."

"I think what we've had here is a little social concern in the NFL. The media has been very desirous that a black quarterback do well. There is a little hope invested in McNabb, and he got a lot of credit for the performance of this team that he didn't deserve."

Drug Abuse (don't forget he was an abuser himself)
"And we have laws against selling drugs, pushing drugs, using drugs, importing drugs. And the laws are good because we know what happens to people in societies and neighborhoods which become consumed by them. And so if people are violating the law by doing drugs, they ought to be accused and they ought to be convicted and they ought to be sent up." "When you strip it all away, Jerry Garcia (former Grateful Dead guitarist) destroyed his life on drugs. And yet he's being honored, like some godlike figure. Our priorities are out of whack, folks." (well ditto heads? I bet you still love this drug addicted, law-breaking drug freak. Ever hear of 'just say no' or how by buying drugs you are supporting Osama?).

Feminism (I confess I love this quote)
"Feminism was established so as to allow unattractive women easier access to the mainstream of society."

Homeless
"One of the things I want to do before I die is conduct the homeless Olympics...the 10-meter shopping cart relay, the dumpster dig, and the hop, skip, and trip."

Lindsey Graham
"I may be wrong ... Lindsey Graham is certainly close enough to [McCain] to die of anal poisoning." Rush

Mexicans
"If we are going to start rewarding no skills and stupid people-- I'm serious, let the unskilled jobs that take absolutely no knowledge whatsoever to do--let the stupid and unskilled Mexicans do that work."

Michael J. Fox (Parkinson's disease)
"He is exaggerating the effects of the disease. He's moving all around and shaking and it's purely an act. . . . This is really shameless of Michael J. Fox. Either he didn't take his medication or he's acting. This is the only time I've ever seen Michael J. Fox portray any of the symptoms of the disease he has. He can barely control himself."

Nuclear Weapons
"The only way to reduce the number of nuclear weapons is to use them."

Trees
"The most beautiful thing about a tree is what you do after you cut it down."

"We have more trees in this country today than when the Declaration of Independence was written. The wackos will tell you that's impossible."

"There are more acres of forestland in America today than when Columbus discovered the continent in 1492" (not true, obviously).

More Bullshit:
"Don't let the liberals deceive you into believing that a decade of sustained growth without inflation in America (in the '80s) resulted in a bigger gap between the have and the have-nots. Figures compiled by the Congressional Budget Office dispel that myth".
Reality: CBO numbers for after-tax incomes show that in 1980 the richest fifth of our country had eight times the income of the poorest fifth. By 1989, the ratio was more than 20-to-1. 2)

Limbaugh: "The poorest people in America are better off than the mainstream families of Europe" (radio, 1993).
Reality: The poorest 20 percent of Americans can purchase an average of $5,433 worth of goods with their income. Meanwhile, in Germany, the average person can purchase $20,610 worth of goods; in France, $19,200; in Britain, $16,730 (World Development Report 1994, published by the World Bank).

[The_Noble_Cause]

Rush is a great disinfotainer, as well as being a fan of buffets and doughnuts.

Rush is one of the greatest broadcasters in history.
Unfortunately, he is also a pathological liar pawning off bullshit as fact.
And it's not just commentary or opinion either, he will make up statistics, figures etc.

[Lula]

well dog gone it sarah is in so cal and she didn't call me!

now she spouts, as she wrinkles up that cute nose of hers, that barack is "palling around with terrorists" that target their (this) country. who the heck is she talkin bout anyway??

She's talking about William Ayers.

i know donna. i was being sarcastic . i'm just havin some fun. sarah's my gal!

barack was at the ripe old age of 8 when bill went on his maniacal uprising. i guess he was his babysitter

[Lula]

i suppose if you're not a fan of the boss you would think he sucks. i saw it and i liked it, but i am a fan.

same thing with regards to your comment about sarah's rally in so cal. of course there were people there, she has fans. i think it's really cool she made an appearance here even though the state is clearly blue, there are some republicans and they deserve to feel like they are important to the candidate.

the william ayers thing is lame. i hope the mccain campaign keeps hammering the weak connection home and the obama campaign stays focused on the economy. the american people care about putting food on the table, having a table to put the food on, and having a job, etc. not some 30 yr old attempt at a revolution.

[treetopovskaya]

i really believe if it were mccain who "palled" around with terrorist or attended a church were hatred was preached for 20+ years... only to leave because people caught on... not because he wanted to leave... i bet people would see things differently then they currently do.

i'm beginning to think obama could commit murder & people would still make excuses for him.

sheep.

[7 Wishes]

Did anyone see video of Bruce in Philly yesterday. The dude sucks ass, especially when he's solo acoustic, it was terrible.

I'm not even going to honor this with a diatribe. He has more talent in his fingernail than you do in your entire body.

Just because he - and a majority of Americans and a VAST majority of the rest of the world - does not agree with your closed-minded views, does not diminish his extraordinary talents.

[7 Wishes]

i really believe if it were mccain who "palled" around with terrorist or attended a church were hatred was preached for 20+ years... only to leave because people caught on... not because he wanted to leave... i bet people would see things differently then they currently do.

i'm beginning to think obama could commit murder & people would still make excuses for him.

sheep.

Wow, are you full of it.

Obama is under a microscope far more than McCain. It will be truly remarkable if he can overcome the fact that 40% of Americans will NOT vote for him simply because he's not white.

[The_Noble_Cause]

i really believe if it were mccain who "palled" around with terrorist

McCain's got shadowy connections RIGHT NOW - not from his pampers and huggies days - and no one says a word.
Wanna go toe-to-toe for sheer slimeball tactics?
Let's crack open the untapped hellraiser puzzle box of Vietnam vets and POWs waiting in the wings to accuse McCain of singing like a canary and selling out flightpaths of US aircraft.
Rush used to talk about them before McSenile locked up his party's nomination.
At this point, Obama is under no obligation to reciprocate civility, because the opposing party has shown exactly NONE.

...or attended a church were hatred was preached for 20+ years... only to leave because people caught on... not because he wanted to leave... i bet people would see things differently then they currently do.

At a minimum, the church is attended by 3000 congregants every Sunday.
Are they all radical American-haters plotting to destroy the country?
You're a cracker.

[treetopovskaya]

we shouldn't bring up obama's "past" or certain "ties" with questionable people but it's fine to talk about mccain's? it okay to bring up that mccain left his first wife? how is that any of our business anyway & how does that affect the way he'll run our country? it just boggles my mind really.

someone brought up that cindy mccain abused painkillers... well... obama (you know... the guy actually RUNNING for office) used street drugs. he openly admits this fact in his book.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php? ... geId=70991

[The_Noble_Cause]

we shouldn't bring up obama's "past" or certain "ties" with questionable people but it's fine to talk about mccain's?

Huge difference pointing out ties to current Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac wheelers and dealers, and claims about Obama hanging with a perpetrator of terroristic activities from 40 years ago and who, by all accounts, has turned over a new leaf towards education.

....it okay to bring up that mccain left his first wife?

Show me one quote where Obama mentioned this. I defy you.

someone brought up that cindy mccain abused painkillers... well... obama (you know... the guy actually RUNNING for office) used street drugs. he openly admits this fact in his book.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php? ... geId=70991

And the current commander in chief is a dry drunk and on again, off again, coke fiend.
As if that fact weighed even the slightest toll on your decision to elect him twice?
Don't make me shit.

[treetopovskaya]

it was the people here on mr that brought up mccain leaving his wife... in this thread. i never said obama did.

you don't know who i voted for.

anyway... what i was trying to point out was there is a bias... & i see it coming more from the left.

we shouldn't bring up obama's "past" or certain "ties" with questionable people but it's fine to talk about mccain's?

Huge difference pointing out ties to current Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac wheelers and dealers, and claims about Obama hanging with a perpetrator of terroristic activities from 40 years ago and who, by all accounts, has turned over a new leaf towards education.

....it okay to bring up that mccain left his first wife?

Show me one quote where Obama mentioned this. I defy you.

someone brought up that cindy mccain abused painkillers... well... obama (you know... the guy actually RUNNING for office) used street drugs. he openly admits this fact in his book.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php? ... geId=70991

And the current commander in chief is a dry drunk and on again, off again, coke fiend.
As if that fact weighed even the slightest toll on your decision to elect him twice?
Don't make me shit.

[donnaplease]

Huge difference pointing out ties to current Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac wheelers and dealers, and claims about Obama hanging with a perpetrator of terroristic activities from 40 years ago and who, by all accounts, has turned over a new leaf towards education.

With the talk of extreme-left college professors "indoctrinating" students who they are supposed to be educating, this new leaf is a little scary. I would never allow my child to attend a school where even a one-time terrorist is employed.

I don't buy this 'new leaf' theory. What has he done to reform himself? Saying he's a teacher isn't enough for me.

There are just too many of these relationships with questionable characters for me. If not Ayers, then Wright, and that other crazy preacher. Then there's Obama's wife, who said that she wasn't proud to be an American until her husband was running for president... I don't question the man's intelligence. I do, however question his alliances, his judgment and his patriotism.

[treetopovskaya]

I do, however question his alliances, his judgment and his patriotism.

exactly!

[The_Noble_Cause]

With the talk of extreme-left college professors "indoctrinating" students who they are supposed to be educating....

Usually stemming from those never educated (i.e. the Limbaughs, Becks, Hannitys etc.)
The idea that students are being indoctrinated shows a lack of regard for the two-way process of learning, and a low opinion for students' abilities to think for themselves.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Deborah Harrington, president of the Woods Fund, a philanthropic organization in Chicago, said Obama was a director from 1994 through 2001. That overlaps Ayers’ time as a director by three years. It also means Obama served with Ayers for the final months of 2001, after Ayers made his comments to the New York Times.

Meaningless. Ayers already said the article was a hatchet job.

Sen. Hillary Clinton.

“I also believe that Senator Obama served on a board with Mr. Ayers for a period of time, the Woods Foundation, which was a paid directorship position. And, if I’m not mistaken, that relationship with Mr. Ayers on this board continued after 9/11 and after his reported comments, which were deeply hurtful to people in New York and, I would hope, to every American, because they were published on 9/11, and he said that he was just sorry they hadn’t done more.”

This reflects more poorly on Hillary then anyone else.
Invoking the date of 9-11, when any thinking person knows the newspapers that day were written and hit the presses long before any planes hit the buildings.

Ayers stepping on the flag.

That settles it. Obama clearly wants to blow up skyscrapers. I'm sold. Where is the nearest voter registration center?