The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[strangegrey]

I know the polls will probably show different but I thought McCain was the clear winner last night. Both candidates made good points but I thought McCain clearly took Obama off guard on a couple of occasions just judging by the look on Obama's face at some points.

You must have been watching a different debate dude. I didn't see Obama look 'off gaurd' all night. However, McCain looked like a cry baby wanker from about minute 31 to the end. He looked like he had a 12 pound eggplant stuck in his rectum and the only way to clear it out was to run off the stage screaming.


As soon as the t-shirt whining began on the part of McCain, he looked like he had a splintered broom pole shoved up his ass to the base of his spine. His body language was dreadful.


Obama looked relaxed and confident....smiling throughout the whole debate. McCain looked like his head was going to explode..

[conversationpc]

You must have been watching a different debate dude. I didn't see Obama look 'off gaurd' all night.

Nah, I don't think so. Even Rick, right above you, caught it. I didn't say Obama looked lost but he was certainly caught off guard a couple of times.

As far as McCain, I also never said he looked calm, cool, and collected. He was obviously irritable but I think he does his best work when he is PO'd.

[conversationpc]

..vag flap on and on about t-shirts.

He only menioned it once, if I counted correctly.

This country is headed into a deep recession or possibly depression. And this fucking loser is vag flapping about t-shirts that someone wears to an obama rally?

Schieffer posed the question about negative campaigning and what each has done to contribute to it. Responding to that, Obama brought up some of those who were attending McCain rallies. McCain responded by bringing up the t-shirts. He only mentioned it the one time.

I'm sorry folks. He is *NOT* presidential material. I want someone a little more unflappable sitting behind the resolute desk.

Can't disagree with you there.

[strangegrey]

You must have been watching a different debate dude. I didn't see Obama look 'off gaurd' all night.

Nah, I don't think so. Even Rick, right above you, caught it. I didn't say Obama looked lost but he was certainly caught off guard a couple of times.

As far as McCain, I also never said he looked calm, cool, and collected. He was obviously irritable but I think he does his best work when he is PO'd.

I dunno...I guess people watch debates for different reasons...as politics is certainly a personal thing.

What I was looking for in last nights debate, were small signs that McCain was flappable...that he could get rattled...I wanted to see whether Obama's campaign assertions that McCain is 'eratic' would be proven true.


Obama didn't even need to bait him....McCain came unglued on his own. Obama never looked like he came unglued to me. Did he stumble on some answers? sure....However, McCain stumbled *dreadfully* last night as well. For example, he couldn't remember both supreme court justices nominated during bush's term last night. At times he simply refered to Senator Obama as "Obama". English language gaffs rulled the roost with McCain as well, as he couldn't even talk straight at times....screwing up phrases like 'Bresh of Freth Air'

Substantively, his arguments were awful. When pressed about what he would cut, he came back with cutting sugar ethanol!?!?! WTF? I'm sure ethanol production represents a huge sector of this economy. I'd rather see a candidate come back with "Im not sure what we can cut until I get in there and get my hands dirt, but we're going to have to cut something" like obama did....instead of coming out with a bogus project to try to get people to think you're talking in specifics when you're not.

It goes right to McCain's straight talk assertions. When you parade out bogus promises like the above, your claims of straight talk go out of the window and you look like a liar.

Then you combine the entire evening's stupid talk about Joe the fucking plumber....McCain spoke to "Joe" something like 20 times. Obama had no choice but to be dragged down to talk to 'Joe' as well, because if he didn't he would look like a heartless bastard. Thankfully, Obama stayed on topic and only refered to 'Joe' about 4 times. But by dredging in this Joe crap, McPain deceitfully avoided addressing the public...the real people he has to sway here....

The closing arguments summed it up for me as well...McCain's flapping on and on about how he's ready to serve and the fact that a long line of McCains served before him, he's ready.....while Obama launched into specifics on his closing and appealed to the public.

McCain has a hard time appealing to the public....unless it's this Joe the plumber. I guess McPain had to have his own fucking Joe. Palin's got Joe Six pack...Ugh!


Once the dust settles from this...I think you're going to see that this debate was clearly won by obama, because it will likely shift even more of the country Red.




McCain was unfit for the presidency in 2000. He was unfit for the nomination, this time last year....and he's unfit for the presidency in 2008. He's a flappable, emotionally charged, lying douchebucket....with an inability to look past his sly, shitty grin to seek a solution to a problem.

[WIX]

Look, the polls don't mean shit, bush was behind in the polls and still won.

When people go into vote they are gonna look at the names and visualize

Are they gonna want 4 years of goofy ears Barack Hussein Obama and Forgettable Joe 3 pack Biden.

Or do they want 4 years of One term Mcain and The beautiful Hockey Mom with a real sense of humor.

either way we are fricked, I am writing in Ross Perot !

[RossValoryRocks]

Substantively, his arguments were awful. When pressed about what he would cut, he came back with cutting sugar ethanol!?!?! WTF? I'm sure ethanol production represents a huge sector of this economy. I'd rather see a candidate come back with "Im not sure what we can cut until I get in there and get my hands dirt, but we're going to have to cut something" like obama did....instead of coming out with a bogus project to try to get people to think you're talking in specifics when you're not.

What fucking debate did you watch?? You thrash McCain for not being versed in the knowledge he needed and yet you don't even know what he really said.

He said he would end ethanol subsidies, and remove the huge tarrif on imported ethanol to get can sugar based ethanol into the country cheaply. Not that he would cut sugar ethanol.

Ethanol subsidies run between $1.05 and $1.38 per gallon, that WE as tax payers shell out. (Info here: http://www.econbrowser.com/archives/200 ... bsidi.html)

Before you go ripping McCain Frank you need to get YOUR facts straight.

[strangegrey]

I know *exactly* what he said...mccain DID say he was in favor of cutting ethanol production....return to the transcripts.

Howeer...you're missing the points here. The question was directed to come up with *substantive* ways in which the budget would be cut to satisfy balancing the budget in 4 years (an empty promise mccain made lastnight but in all likelihood, cant make good on) Again, I'm sure we're talking about a *huge* chunk of the debt.{/sarcasm} If taxpayers are paying through the nose, as your non-authoritative link suggests...then McPain *didnt* answer the question...at all. Speaking to his lack of integrity. If it's being directly funded through taxation, it's *not* burdening the debt.

[strangegrey]

Look, the polls don't mean shit, bush was behind in the polls and still won.

When people go into vote they are gonna look at the names and visualize

Are they gonna want 4 years of goofy ears Barack Hussein Obama and Forgettable Joe 3 pack Biden.

Or do they want 4 years of One term Mcain and The beautiful Hockey Mom with a real sense of humor.

either way we are fricked, I am writing in Ross Perot !

I wish I could write in a vote....

My bashing of McPain in no way implies an endorsement of Obama...I was just in complete shock at how awful, unintelligent, flustered, uncomfortable, unpresidential mccain was last night.


I dont like either candidate. I was against McCain winning this nomination from the get go. I threw my hat in to support him when he picked Palin as arunning mate. When Palin couldn't identify a supreme court case outside of roe v. wade (which was given to her), I decided Palin was a dumb fucking idiot that didn't deserve the position she was handed....and came to the conclusion that the only reason McCain chose her was because of her legs.

[Enigma869]

Obama didn't even need to bait him....McCain came unglued on his own. Obama never looked like he came unglued to me. Did he stumble on some answers? sure....However, McCain stumbled *dreadfully* last night as well. For example, he couldn't remember both supreme court justices nominated during bush's term last night. At times he simply refered to Senator Obama as "Obama". English language gaffs rulled the roost with McCain as well, as he couldn't even talk straight at times....screwing up phrases like 'Bresh of Freth Air'

Yeah...and he even attributed the "sub prime mortgage crisis" to "Fannie and Freddie Mae". Someone should enlighten Mr. McCain that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are all conforming loans and not "sub-prime"! They are two separate issues!


John from Boston

[conversationpc]

Yeah...and he even attributed the "sub prime mortgage crisis" to "Fannie and Freddie Mae".

Lots of people mess those names up. I've done it as well and I'm fairly well spoken.

[RedWingFan]

This country is headed into a deep recession or possibly depression. And this fucking loser is vag flapping about t-shirts that someone wears to an obama rally?


The country's got deep seated problems...and this fucking guy is worried about a t-shirt that hurts his feelings.!!!

So let me get this straight. McCain "suspends" his campaign to try to help out with the economic issue, and you whine about it.
McCain responds to Obama's accusation of hatred at McCain rallies by pointing out hateful T-shirts at Obama rallies and you whine about it. You would have been happier if McCain would have started talking about the bailout after Obama insulted everybody that took the time to attend a McCain rally?

[conversationpc]

McCain responds to Obama's accusation of hatred at McCain rallies by pointing out hateful T-shirts at Obama rallies and you whine about it.

Yeah, I don't get the fixation on the t-shirts thing. McCain only mentioned it one time during the debate, didn't he?

[Enigma869]

Yeah...and he even attributed the "sub prime mortgage crisis" to "Fannie and Freddie Mae".

Lots of people mess those names up. I've done it as well and I'm fairly well spoken.

I think you're missing the point, Dave. I really wasn't picking apart that he was fucking up words, because he did that for most of the night. My larger point was that he was lumping sub-prime with Fannie and Freddie, when the sub-prime industry was a complete separate entity from Fannie and Freddie.


John from Boston

[BobbyinTN]

It was McCain's best debate yet. I think it was the best debate. However, McCain spent more time attacking than addressing issues. Obama seemed cool and calm, but I think he got a little pissed a couple of times.

The bottom line is McCain energized his base, Obama actually expanded his support.

I wouldn't say he won by a landslide, but Obama definitely won that debate.

[strangegrey]

McCain responds to Obama's accusation of hatred at McCain rallies by pointing out hateful T-shirts at Obama rallies and you whine about it.

Yeah, I don't get the fixation on the t-shirts thing. McCain only mentioned it one time during the debate, didn't he?

Dave, he stayed on the t-shirt topic for like 5 fucking minutes. it was painful.

I've never seen a case of prybaby politics since the democrats during the 2000 election

[Saint John]

McCain should be frustrated. It's gotta be hard to be barely able to lift your arms from injuries suffered protecting your country while trying to cope with being behind in the polls to a man who has surrounded himself his entire life with anti-american socialists and communists. While McCain certainly isn't the world's gretaest candidate he should at least win by default if Americans have any common sense. Obama's company over the last 20+ years has basically made voting for him a borderline act of treason.

[Enigma869]

Dave, he stayed on the t-shirt topic for like 5 fucking minutes. it was painful.

I've never seen a case of prybaby politics since the democrats during the 2000 election

What made it look worse was Obama's response. He said something to the effect that "I don't think the American people really want to hear about our hurt feelings. They want solutions for the problems they're facing", and he was spot on with that reply!

Like others, I am VERY reluctant to believe polls. Some of these people polled change their mind, while others flat out lie their asses off. That said, I will still be stunned if Obama doesn't win by double digits. I know some have said last night was McCain's best debate. I certainly don't agree. He talked less about issues last night than any of the other debates. I thought it was Obama's best performance, and I believe it wrapped up the presidency for him. I'm still not voting for either one of these guys, because I don't think either is to be trusted.


John from Boston

[Enigma869]

McCain should be frustrated. It's gotta be hard to be barely able to lift your arms from injuries suffered protecting your country while trying to cope with being behind in the polls to a man who has surrounded himself his entire life with anti-american socialists and communists. While McCain certainly isn't the world's gretaest candidate he should at least win by default if Americans have any common sense. Obama's company over the last 20+ years has basically made voting for him a borderline act of treason.

The only flaw in your argument is that McCain selected a dope, with a box of rocks in her head, as his running mate! I think many people in this election will be voting against Puppet Palin and not against John McCain!


John from Boston

[RedWingFan]

Dave, he stayed on the t-shirt topic for like 5 fucking minutes. it was painful.

I've never seen a case of prybaby politics since the democrats during the 2000 election

What made it look worse was Obama's response. He said something to the effect that "I don't think the American people really want to hear about our hurt feelings. They want solutions for the problems they're facing", and he was spot on with that reply!

Yeah, and to anyone who knows anything. That response was laughable coming from someone who confronted Maureen Dowd about writing about his ears. Someone who cries if his middle name is mentioned. Hell, everyone who's not going to vote for him has been told we're not voting for him because we're racist.

[Rhiannon]

The only flaw in your argument is that McCain selected a dope, with a box of rocks in her head, as his running mate! I think many people in this election will be voting against Puppet Palin and not against John McCain!

Honestly... could she be any worse than VPs before her... Quayle, Gore, Cheney... they're all blockheads too if you ask me.

[RedWingFan]

McCain should be frustrated. It's gotta be hard to be barely able to lift your arms from injuries suffered protecting your country while trying to cope with being behind in the polls to a man who has surrounded himself his entire life with anti-american socialists and communists. While McCain certainly isn't the world's gretaest candidate he should at least win by default if Americans have any common sense. Obama's company over the last 20+ years has basically made voting for him a borderline act of treason.

The only flaw in your argument is that McCain selected a dope, with a box of rocks in her head, as his running mate! I think many people in this election will be voting against Puppet Palin and not against John McCain!


John from Boston

Remember your disappointment at the VP debate. Following which the poll gap closed.

[strangegrey]

t-shirts...8 words

McCain:
And I'm not going to stand for somebody saying that because someone yelled something at a rally -- there's a lot of things that have been yelled at your rallies, Sen. Obama, that I'm not happy about either.

In fact, some T-shirts that are very...

Obama: John, I...

McCain: ... unacceptable. So the point is -- the point is that I have repudiated every time someone's been out of line, whether they've been part of my campaign or not, and I will continue to do that.

Some of you are unappeasable...

No...the subject itself continued for 4-5 minutes. While the actual use of the words was limited, the subject surrounding it was exhausting....


It's not a case of being unappeasable. You're just unable to look at this dispassionately and objectively.


There's a reason why McCain is losing this election and people can blame Palin, the economy, fannie mac & freddie may , and various other issues....But the fact still remains that McCain was considered a fraudulent republican from day one on this presidential race. Hell, Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity, Levin and tons of right-wing radio and tv people were actively burying DisDain for months prior to the final outcome of the primaries. He's NOT representitive of conservatives....

Perhaps some conservatives actually think his work has been representitive of conservatives ideals...I'll submit that they're high.

The biggest problem McCain has had since he began running for president is the conservative-base. He never had it. He never will. I'm sorry...picking a VP candidate in order to shore up the base is a sign of poorly run campaign. The VP candidate should help you grab the middle...

So let me get this straight. McCain "suspends" his campaign to try to help out with the economic issue, and you whine about it.

But he didn't help at all. His actions were 100% grandstanding to elicit support with idiots who might have misinterpretted his actions as 'caring.' Nothing more. Plus, if he truly suspended his campaign, why on earth did I get 4 calls from his people looking for contributions the thursday during the suspension. He didn't suspend shit. He lied to the public to try to get people to go "Oh, look at him...he stiffed Letterman, he's a leader!"

And just to prevent you from trying to retort that he ultimately got something done and the subsequent bailout ammendment voted on by the senate was *his* doing and *his* so called leadership....then he's a fucking liar...because his entire campaign has been cornerstoned on anti-pork and earmarks. The ammended bailout is one of the most pork laden bills in history....and he signed this piece of shit? If so, he's a fucking liar.....lying to the public on his intentions of stopping pork.

Conversely, if he had nothing to do with this bailout....then his actions were 100% for show...nothing less.

So either his campaign cornerstone of no-earmarks is a solid promise and he has zero leadership abilities....or his so-called leadership abilities helped broker one of the worst cases of pork-laden law in history.

Which is it? You can't have both!

McCain responds to Obama's accusation of hatred at McCain rallies by pointing out hateful T-shirts at Obama rallies and you whine about it.

Your two arguments are not at all mutually exclusive. Lets get real. It's a fucking campaign. Attacks will get negative. Sidestepping questions (while preventing substantive discussion and debate) and whining over t-shirts for 5 fucking minutes does nothing for DisDain other than ruin his chances of winning the debate. It was a dumb as nails move....and I've come to expect that from him.

[Enigma869]

Yeah, and to anyone who knows anything. That response was laughable coming from someone who confronted Maureen Dowd about writing about his ears. Someone who cries if his middle name is mentioned. Hell, everyone who's not going to vote for him has been told we're not voting for him because we're racist.

While you may not be voting for Obama for legitimate reasons, you are VERY naive if you think that there won't be a percentage of people who don't vote for him, because the color of his skin! Also, the middle name thing is simply ridiclous to me. Regardless of what anyone says, there is an element of racism to constantly using the man's middle name, because if his middle name was James, not one of the fucking yahoos who keeps using his middle name, would have mentioned his name one single time!


John from Boston

[Tito]

It's been awhile since I've watched a debate with some democrats.

I was watching up in the breakroom.

A couple people from the maintenance company sat down. McCain said his line about "using the hatchet then using the scalpel."
Cleaninglady:"What's a scapel"
Cleaningguy:"It's a big knife"
I couldn't stop laughing.

They spoke english!

[Enigma869]

Well lets see...right this minute Sarah is speaking to 15,000 in Bangor,Maine. Some 20,000 saw HER in Penn. Close to 30,000 saw HER in Va at the race track. On the other hand Biden WITH Bill and Hill drew 3,000 the other day. Hmmmm.....

Virginia International Raceway

Listen Republican Ass Kisser...I could give a fuck how many people Puppet Palin draws. She drew 12 people at Salem High School in New Hampshire yesterday, and 11 of them were custodians, washing the floor I don't care if Palin fills a 100,000 person arena. It doesn't change the fact that she's a fucking moron, who needs to get back to Alaska to kill some animals, before hunting season ends!


John from Boston

[Saint John]

McCain should be frustrated. It's gotta be hard to be barely able to lift your arms from injuries suffered protecting your country while trying to cope with being behind in the polls to a man who has surrounded himself his entire life with anti-american socialists and communists. While McCain certainly isn't the world's gretaest candidate he should at least win by default if Americans have any common sense. Obama's company over the last 20+ years has basically made voting for him a borderline act of treason.

The only flaw in your argument is that McCain selected a dope, with a box of rocks in her head, as his running mate! I think many people in this election will be voting against Puppet Palin and not against John McCain!


John from Boston

Sarah Palin has the highest approval rating of any governor in this country. She's taken on big oil, made her state better and even fought to give fags benefits. She's shown the ability to fight big companies, fix state problems, and cross the aisle to veto a bill denying benefits to gays, as unconstitutional. She's fought for benefits for those that choose to live a disgusting lifestyle even though she disagrees with that lifestyle.

[strangegrey]

Honestly... could she be any worse than VPs before her... Quayle, Gore, Cheney... they're all blockheads too if you ask me.

Gore, I will submit, is an intelligent person...sometimes dreadfully misguided.
Cheney is as smart a tactician as they come and he's brilliant....he lacks personal likability and the dems have exploited that.
Quayle...well, I'm not going there. I certainly think he's got a bad rap from the "potatoe" thing...but there's intelligence there. Hell, I have so much trouble with double consonants that it's not funny...but I've got a pretty impressive academic resume.

I will submit, that each and every above mentioned Vice President could name at least 3-4 supreme court cases. Palin could only name one, and that one was served to her on a silver platter.

[Saint John]

you are VERY naive if you think that there won't be a percentage of people who don't vote for him, because the color of his skin!

As are you if you think the 90+ percent he received over Hillary during the primary wasn't because the color of his skin. Especially after all that the Clinton's did for blacks.

[RedWingFan]

Well lets see...right this minute Sarah is speaking to 15,000 in Bangor,Maine. Some 20,000 saw HER in Penn. Close to 30,000 saw HER in Va at the race track. On the other hand Biden WITH Bill and Hill drew 3,000 the other day. Hmmmm.....

Virginia International Raceway

Listen Republican Ass Kisser...I could give a fuck how many people Puppet Palin draws. She drew 12 people at Salem High School in New Hampshire yesterday, and 11 of them were custodians, washing the floor I don't care if Palin fills a 100,000 person arena. It doesn't change the fact that she's a fucking moron, who needs to get back to Alaska to kill some animals, before hunting season ends!


John from Boston

Someone gives you photographic evidence of her popularity and you fly off the handle in anger, and start calling her a moron. Are you 12?

[Enigma869]

Honestly... could she be any worse than VPs before her... Quayle, Gore, Cheney... they're all blockheads too if you ask me.

While I agree with you that the previous VP's you mentioned were useless, Palin takes stupidity to a whole new level. Quayle got castigated for not being able to spell potato. I'll take a guy who can't spell, over a moron who can't think of a single newspaper or magazine she has ever read in her life. I won't even get into the Supreme Court thing or her exceptional foreign policy credentials that she cited, all because Putin used to fly into Alaska's airspace. Honestly, I don't know how the most ardent McCain supporter can defend this jackass. If I were a McCain supporter, I'd be pissed that he picked the woman, because he would probably win this election if he selected someone who was remotely qualified!


John from Boston