The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[Rick]

My Dad (big Republican), just sent me an email, and I wish I hadn't rushed to delete it , because I would like to get some feedback from the great people on this board.

It said something to the effect that on October 5th, just after the Vice Presidential debates, Biden will excuse himself from the ticket, citing health reasons, and Hillary will step in.

It went on with some Republican rhetoric about not buying into it, that it's just a ploy. No shit.

Anyway, if that happens, what kind of effect do you see it having on the race?


I love my Dad btw.

[donnaplease]

mccain's position on roe v wade has changed. he has said in an interview that if he could, yes he would overturn roe. i saw the interview, but can't remember who it was with. it was a few months ago. palin's position is even further right that mccain's.

OK, I did a little looking, and here it is from his camp:

http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/iss ... 71df58.htm

Although I see where he stands, I'm not sure I really understand it any better. I mean, say a Supreme Court does come along and overturn Roe v. Wade, by 'leaving it up to the individual states' how is it really any different than before? As long as your state still keeps them legal, it's a non-issue, isn't it?

I have no issue with abortions, except in the case of partial-birth abortions. I doubt very seriously that Roe v. Wade would ever be overturned, regardless of what the candidates say.

[Rick]

mccain's position on roe v wade has changed. he has said in an interview that if he could, yes he would overturn roe. i saw the interview, but can't remember who it was with. it was a few months ago. palin's position is even further right that mccain's.

OK, I did a little looking, and here it is from his camp:

http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/iss ... 71df58.htm

Although I see where he stands, I'm not sure I really understand it any better. I mean, say a Supreme Court does come along and overturn Roe v. Wade, by 'leaving it up to the individual states' how is it really any different than before? As long as your state still keeps them legal, it's a non-issue, isn't it?

I have no issue with abortions, except in the case of partial-birth abortions. I doubt very seriously that Roe v. Wade would ever be overturned, regardless of what the candidates say.

I think I totally agree with your stance on abortion. I think everyone, men and women should have to watch a film that graphically depicts a partial birth abortion before being granted one. While it's legal anyway. Hopefully it wont be much longer.

[donnaplease]

My Dad (big Republican), just sent me an email, and I wish I hadn't rushed to delete it , because I would like to get some feedback from the great people on this board.

It said something to the effect that on October 5th, just after the Vice Presidential debates, Biden will excuse himself from the ticket, citing health reasons, and Hillary will step in.

It went on with some Republican rhetoric about not buying into it, that it's just a ploy. No shit.

Anyway, if that happens, what kind of effect do you see it having on the race?


I love my Dad btw.

Can you just imagine the SNL skits? Cat-fights, wet t-shirt contests, mud wrestling...

I did hear an Obama speech yesterday on POTUS where he referred to Hillary as "My good friend Hillary" or "My friend Hillary" and I thought that was a little funny. Of course he was talking to a woman's group in Florida at the time, and the content of the speech was sickening because he was very obviously pandering to the women by speaking of women as if they were the only people he was campaigning to. I'm sure all candidates do it, but it was way over the top just the same.

I hate politics.

[The_Noble_Cause]

My Dad (big Republican), just sent me an email, and I wish I hadn't rushed to delete it , because I would like to get some feedback from the great people on this board.

It said something to the effect that on October 5th, just after the Vice Presidential debates, Biden will excuse himself from the ticket, citing health reasons, and Hillary will step in.

It went on with some Republican rhetoric about not buying into it, that it's just a ploy. No shit.

Anyway, if that happens, what kind of effect do you see it having on the race?


I love my Dad btw.

The same email was read on-air by my local Conservative radio station about a day ago.
It's simply not happening.
The pathogenic spread of such lies throughout the right wing sump, however, is truly something to behold.

[Rick]

My Dad (big Republican), just sent me an email, and I wish I hadn't rushed to delete it , because I would like to get some feedback from the great people on this board.

It said something to the effect that on October 5th, just after the Vice Presidential debates, Biden will excuse himself from the ticket, citing health reasons, and Hillary will step in.

It went on with some Republican rhetoric about not buying into it, that it's just a ploy. No shit.

Anyway, if that happens, what kind of effect do you see it having on the race?


I love my Dad btw.

The same email was read on-air by my local Conservative radio station about a day ago.
It's simply not happening.
The pathogenic spread of such lies throughout the right wing sump, however, is truly something to behold.

[RossValoryRocks]

My Dad (big Republican), just sent me an email, and I wish I hadn't rushed to delete it , because I would like to get some feedback from the great people on this board.

It said something to the effect that on October 5th, just after the Vice Presidential debates, Biden will excuse himself from the ticket, citing health reasons, and Hillary will step in.

It went on with some Republican rhetoric about not buying into it, that it's just a ploy. No shit.

Anyway, if that happens, what kind of effect do you see it having on the race?


I love my Dad btw.

If it happens I will stand there and take the cum shot of every liberal on this board.

[Toph]

Non-issue...Who cares about either point?

Agreed. Neither is an issue! Where someone grows up has zero correlation to their ability to govern, effectively.

As I've said several times...Obama is not muslim and naming your kids those ridiculous names has nothing to do with anything.

They are pretty dopey names, but there are many parents, these days, who give their children jackass names! As for the "maverick" thing...it's becoming fucking nauseating. McCain calling himself a "maverick" (and he's the only one calling himself that dopey monniker) is as moronic as the Dallas Cowboys calling themselves "America's Team"! Giving a nickname to yourself is like throwing your own birthday party!

I'm comfortable with Palin's experience and that Obama's experience doesn't do much for me. In my opinion, Obama has no leg up on Palin as far as experience goes and vice versa.

This, my friend, is a contradiction! You say neither has a leg up on the other, and then in the same thought say that you're comfortable with Palin's experience but Obama's experience "doesn't do much for me"! The fact of the matter is that neither Palin, nor Obama has very much experience!


John from Boston

Problem is - the one with no experience is the NUMBER 2 on the Republican ticket. The one with no experience is at the TOP OF THE TICKET for the Democrats - that is the difference. i'll let my #2 grow into the role, but the number 1 guy needs to have experience on day 1, thank you very much.

Vote against Osama Bin Obama!

[Enigma869]

Vote against Osama Bin Obama!

I'm not an Obama fan and am not voting for the guy. Having said that, your comment is fucking ridiculous, and you're a fucking moron for even associating the guy with Bin Laden!


John from Boston

[Rick]

My Dad (big Republican), just sent me an email, and I wish I hadn't rushed to delete it , because I would like to get some feedback from the great people on this board.

It said something to the effect that on October 5th, just after the Vice Presidential debates, Biden will excuse himself from the ticket, citing health reasons, and Hillary will step in.

It went on with some Republican rhetoric about not buying into it, that it's just a ploy. No shit.

Anyway, if that happens, what kind of effect do you see it having on the race?


I love my Dad btw.

If it happens I will stand there and take the cum shot of every liberal on this board.

If they do this, it would be admitting they're being beaten, I think.

[conversationpc]

The same email was read on-air by my local Conservative radio station about a day ago.
It's simply not happening.
The pathogenic spread of such lies throughout the right wing sump, however, is truly something to behold.

As we know by many of the unfounded attacks on Palin recently and the outright lie in the Obama ad, it also happens in the left wing "sump".

[Enigma869]

both of them want to overturn roe v wade and the next prez will be in position to appoint judges to make that happen.

Lula, where have you heard/read this? Just curious if that is REALLY their intention, or if that is another generalization (not by you, but by the far left in general) that has been floated out there as fact.

I don't know McCain's postion on Roe v. Wade, but Palin didn't pull any punches when asked the question. During her interview with Charlie Gibson on ABC, she said that she would absolutely, postively like to see Roe v. Wade overturned. Even though I think she is a horrendous VP candidate, I will at least give her credit for honestly answering a question.


John from Boston

[Lula]

if roe v wade is overturned, the right to an abortion will not be protected under federal law.

[Barb]

I'm really not understanding this big deal over abortion. First, Sarah Palin in her capacity as VP cannot over turn R v. W. Only the Supreme Court can do that -- and how likely is that going to be, really? Just because there are some conservative justices up there doesn't mean it will be over turned. If for some reason it does ever get over turned, each state can make it's own law and I really can't imagine many of them outlawing abortion at this stage of the game.

There are so many more pressing issues facing this country right now, that to base a vote in this election over something like abortion seems absurd.

[Lula]

my vote for barack obama is not based on his stance on a woman's right to choose. with regards to the supreme court- our next sitting president will most likely be appointing several judges of his choice. roe v wade can very well be overturned. i can promise you there will be states outlawing legal abortion if given the opportunity. a woman should have the right of making her own decision and if she chooses to have an abortion she should be able to do so safely without reverting back to the days of back alley abortions. it is a choice. and any person not able to see the big picture and shrugging it off as never happening, think again.

[S2M]

my vote for barack obama is not based on his stance on a woman's right to choose. with regards to the supreme court- our next sitting president will most likely be appointing several judges of his choice. roe v wade can very well be overturned. i can promise you there will be states outlawing legal abortion if given the opportunity. a woman should have the right of making her own decision and if she chooses to have an abortion she should be able to do so safely without reverting back to the days of back alley abortions. it is a choice. and any person not able to see the big picture and shrugging it off as never happening, think again.

It is NOT a choice, it is a life....the CHOICE was whether or not to spread her fucking legs...and that has since passed.....So now she has a life in her body.

Look no further than the name of the respective movements: Pro-LIFE, and pro-CHOICE....that about says it all, my friend.

Abortions are nothing more than Monday-morning birth control....although in cases of rape, I can see the argument; but in that instance ONLY.

[Rick]

my vote for barack obama is not based on his stance on a woman's right to choose. with regards to the supreme court- our next sitting president will most likely be appointing several judges of his choice. roe v wade can very well be overturned. i can promise you there will be states outlawing legal abortion if given the opportunity. a woman should have the right of making her own decision and if she chooses to have an abortion she should be able to do so safely without reverting back to the days of back alley abortions. it is a choice. and any person not able to see the big picture and shrugging it off as never happening, think again.

It is NOT a choice, it is a life....the CHOICE was whether or not to spread her fucking legs...and that has since passed.....So now she has a life in her body.

Look no further than the name of the respective movements: Pro-LIFE, and pro-CHOICE....that about says it all, my friend.

Abortions are nothing more than Monday-morning birth control....although in cases of rape, I can see the argument; but in that instance ONLY.

That's the argument. Is a fetus a human life? It's definitely the possibility of life, but until that fetus becomes viable, I don't consider it life. Everyone's opinion on this varies, and none of them are wrong, just different. I do object to late term abortions and partial birth abortions because they are usually viable.

Abortions are far more serious than Monday morning birth control. Getting an abortion is very scary for most women and very emotionally traumatic. Sure, it would have been better to use birth control in the first place, but just ask yourself this question. How many times have you had unprotected sex and just lucked out? Some don't luck out. I'm not saying that getting someone pregnant is unlucky, but you know what I mean.

[S2M]

my vote for barack obama is not based on his stance on a woman's right to choose. with regards to the supreme court- our next sitting president will most likely be appointing several judges of his choice. roe v wade can very well be overturned. i can promise you there will be states outlawing legal abortion if given the opportunity. a woman should have the right of making her own decision and if she chooses to have an abortion she should be able to do so safely without reverting back to the days of back alley abortions. it is a choice. and any person not able to see the big picture and shrugging it off as never happening, think again.

It is NOT a choice, it is a life....the CHOICE was whether or not to spread her fucking legs...and that has since passed.....So now she has a life in her body.

Look no further than the name of the respective movements: Pro-LIFE, and pro-CHOICE....that about says it all, my friend.

Abortions are nothing more than Monday-morning birth control....although in cases of rape, I can see the argument; but in that instance ONLY.

That's the argument. Is a fetus a human life? It's definitely the possibility of life, but until that fetus becomes viable, I don't consider it life. Everyone's opinion on this varies, and none of them are wrong, just different. I do object to late term abortions and partial birth abortions because they are usually viable.

Abortions are far more serious than Monday morning birth control. Getting an abortion is very scary for most women and very emotionally traumatic. Sure, it would have been better to use birth control in the first place, but just ask yourself this question. How many times have you had unprotected sex and just lucked out? Some don't luck out. I'm not saying that getting someone pregnant is unlucky, but you know what I mean.

I don't know about viable/not viable...that is quite the slippery slope.

So it would be alright to steal an idea from someone....let's say a brief synopsis of a story they are writing. But is isn't a NOVEL yet, so it is a non-viable idea...so that would be alright to steal then? I guess the issue is 'potential'. Unless the 'thing' is aborted it WILL become a life.

a Life, not a life....there is a god, there isn't a god.....the argument on both side's strength is in the absense of concrete proof. And I guess that is the strength of the abortion debate as well. When does this coagulation of matter/tissue become a life?

But I don't think the crux of the argument is whether it is a life or not...the crux....well according to the pro-choicers is CHOICE. My body, my choice. I fucked up so now I will make sure this potential life gets nixed. Simple as that. The life is RARELY discussed. They only care about someone telling them what to do. Why not have the child, and let someone have it that will WANT it? Eh...quickie divorces, easy to attain bankruptcies, abortions.....where is the accountability?

[donnaplease]

my vote for barack obama is not based on his stance on a woman's right to choose. with regards to the supreme court- our next sitting president will most likely be appointing several judges of his choice. roe v wade can very well be overturned. i can promise you there will be states outlawing legal abortion if given the opportunity. a woman should have the right of making her own decision and if she chooses to have an abortion she should be able to do so safely without reverting back to the days of back alley abortions. it is a choice. and any person not able to see the big picture and shrugging it off as never happening, think again.

It is NOT a choice, it is a life....the CHOICE was whether or not to spread her fucking legs...and that has since passed.....So now she has a life in her body.

Look no further than the name of the respective movements: Pro-LIFE, and pro-CHOICE....that about says it all, my friend.

Abortions are nothing more than Monday-morning birth control....although in cases of rape, I can see the argument; but in that instance ONLY.

That's the argument. Is a fetus a human life? It's definitely the possibility of life, but until that fetus becomes viable, I don't consider it life. Everyone's opinion on this varies, and none of them are wrong, just different. I do object to late term abortions and partial birth abortions because they are usually viable.

Abortions are far more serious than Monday morning birth control. Getting an abortion is very scary for most women and very emotionally traumatic. Sure, it would have been better to use birth control in the first place, but just ask yourself this question. How many times have you had unprotected sex and just lucked out? Some don't luck out. I'm not saying that getting someone pregnant is unlucky, but you know what I mean.

I don't see Roe v. Wade ever getting overturned. It's been 35 years, it's going nowhere. Candidates are asked opinions on certain hot-button topics, and they should tell us their views. The back-alley abortion clinics are a thing of the past. However, I don't believe it should be an 'anything goes' issue. Poking a hole in a partially born baby's skull and vacuuming it's brains out just because you can... is wrong. In ALL circumstances!

I also think we've got lots of other topics that are more important to focus on than Roe v. Wade. I read the 'sex education' guidelines that BO voted for in Illinois regarding education for grades K-12. I'm a little stunned, to be honest. "Level 1" would be the age-appropriate level for kindergartners. It advocates educating these kids about masterbation, STDs and same-sex relationships, but when it comes to the topic of abstinance, there are no topics for teaching this age level.

[Lula]

my vote for barack obama is not based on his stance on a woman's right to choose. with regards to the supreme court- our next sitting president will most likely be appointing several judges of his choice. roe v wade can very well be overturned. i can promise you there will be states outlawing legal abortion if given the opportunity. a woman should have the right of making her own decision and if she chooses to have an abortion she should be able to do so safely without reverting back to the days of back alley abortions. it is a choice. and any person not able to see the big picture and shrugging it off as never happening, think again.

It is NOT a choice, it is a life....the CHOICE was whether or not to spread her fucking legs...and that has since passed.....So now she has a life in her body.

Look no further than the name of the respective movements: Pro-LIFE, and pro-CHOICE....that about says it all, my friend.

Abortions are nothing more than Monday-morning birth control....although in cases of rape, I can see the argument; but in that instance ONLY.

wow. your first sentence really had me dumbfounded..... you sort of recovered with you last comment. i don't ever pretend to no what motivates anyone. an abortion is a very personal choice. i would not be so quick to assume she "spread her fucking legs." what a vile comment.

[treetopovskaya]

i'm kind of on the fence with abortion. i do believe it should remain legal because people will have them regardless... if legal or not... so might as well make it a safe medical procedure. i also think if a women is younger than 18 her parents should be notified. people shouldn't use it has a form of birth control though. people need to be less stupid & use birth control until they're ready to start a family... in this day & age with all the info that's out there... there really shouldn't be any "mistakes".

they're is always adoption... many couples have problems conceiving. bring some good to a bad situation...

i dunno... 40 million (FORTY MILLION) abortions since the mid 70s... that is just insane when you think about it... come on people... use a freakin condom and/or birth control. cheese & rice.

i really don't have any sympathy for idiots. if you *WILLINGLY* lay down & spread your leg you should take responsibility for whatever happens.

[Lula]

i would never advocate a woman of any age have an abortion. regardless of the results of my amnio my boys were always going to be born. at the same time it is a personal choice. a young woman wanting to have sex should never be of mind that she could just have an abortion. that is why i think a thorough teaching of sex education to age appropriate students is necessary. the thing with obama and sex ed is being blown way out. the man has two little girls he's raising, come on do some of you really think barck obama wants to teach kindergartners about masturbation?

[csiako]

i would never advocate a woman of any age have an abortion. regardless of the results of my amnio my boys were always going to be born. at the same time it is a personal choice. a young woman wanting to have sex should never be of mind that she could just have an abortion. that is why i think a thorough teaching of sex education to age appropriate students is necessary. the thing with obama and sex ed is being blown way out. the man has two little girls he's raising, come on do some of you really think barck obama wants to teach kindergartners about masturbation?

i don't know what anybody else thinks, i only know what they have voted on or acted upon.

[csiako]

i'm kind of on the fence with abortion. i do believe it should remain legal because people will have them regardless... if legal or not... so might as well make it a safe medical procedure. i also think if a women is younger than 18 her parents should be notified. people shouldn't use it has a form of birth control though. people need to be less stupid & use birth control until they're ready to start a family... in this day & age with all the info that's out there... there really shouldn't be any "mistakes".

they're is always adoption... many couples have problems conceiving. bring some good to a bad situation...

i dunno... 40 million (FORTY MILLION) abortions since the mid 70s... that is just insane when you think about it... come on people... use a freakin condom and/or birth control. cheese & rice.

i really don't have any sympathy for idiots. if you *WILLINGLY* lay down & spread your leg you should take responsibility for whatever happens.

i disagree on making it legal for the sake of making it a safe medical procedure, if thats the case why not make prostitution legal

[conversationpc]

That's the argument. Is a fetus a human life? It's definitely the possibility of life, but until that fetus becomes viable, I don't consider it life. Everyone's opinion on this varies, and none of them are wrong, just different. I do object to late term abortions and partial birth abortions because they are usually viable.

There is no argument any longer. The scientific community is not divided on this. It IS human life from the time of conception. Being viable outside the womb is not a sound argument, either. Some elderly people are not viable, either, but we don't kill them. I've even seen some comments from well-known pro-abortionists in recent years admitting that life does begin at conception but that it doesn't matter.

Medical science does say that life begins at conception...

To accept the fact that after fertilization has taken place, a new human has come into being is no longer a matter of taste or opinion. The human nature of the human being from conception to old age is not a metaphysical contention, it is plain experimental evidence.

In biology and in medicine, it is an accepted fact that the life of an individual organism, produced by sexual reproducton begins at conception or fertilization.

The individuality of the unborn baby is established at conception. It is genetically related to its parents, but it is also very different...the 23 chromosomes each parent contributes to the baby can be rearranged in 8,388,608 different ways to produce the 46 chromosome complement of the new individual. There are more than 8 million ways in which the baby might differ from his/her parents.

[treetopovskaya]

education is key. sex ed should be taught in school... but parents really need to take a bigger roll in raising & educating their kids. not just leave it up to someone else... the schools or friends... EEK!

the things i learned from my friends... scary! }:C)

[treetopovskaya]

because people will have them anyway... like they did before it was made legal & performed safely. nobody wants to go back to the day where young girls were dying from botched abortions... or doing things to make themselves miscarry.

all i can say is thank god my hubby's birth mother kept him & gave him up to a loving home... along with all his sibs. she gave him life... & he grew into a pretty cool guy. }:C)) what an amazing thing she did & may not even realize... because of her i have my best friend & soul mate.

sorry... mush mush mush... blllllllllllahhhhhhhhhh...

i'm kind of on the fence with abortion. i do believe it should remain legal because people will have them regardless... if legal or not... so might as well make it a safe medical procedure. i also think if a women is younger than 18 her parents should be notified. people shouldn't use it has a form of birth control though. people need to be less stupid & use birth control until they're ready to start a family... in this day & age with all the info that's out there... there really shouldn't be any "mistakes".

they're is always adoption... many couples have problems conceiving. bring some good to a bad situation...

i dunno... 40 million (FORTY MILLION) abortions since the mid 70s... that is just insane when you think about it... come on people... use a freakin condom and/or birth control. cheese & rice.

i really don't have any sympathy for idiots. if you *WILLINGLY* lay down & spread your leg you should take responsibility for whatever happens.

i disagree on making it legal for the sake of making it a safe medical procedure, if thats the case why not make prostitution legal

[conversationpc]

because people will have them anyway... like they did before it was made legal & performed safely. nobody wants to go back to the day where young girls were dying from botched abortions... or doing things to make themselves miscarry.

"Because people will have them anyway" is really the worst excuse for having/not having a law that there is. Women still die from botched abortions only you never hear about it because it's not reported and there are all kinds of possible side effects, some serious from even supposed safe abortions.

[JrnyScarab]

Being viable outside the womb is not a sound argument, either. Some elderly people are not viable, either, but we don't kill them.

There are some mentally ill people and people with disabilities that are far greater human beings than some of the dreck that is alive. I can imagine that some of the poor souls that were aborted were in this class of people. If anyone should be aborted I vote for the politicians. Lying scum.

[conversationpc]

Being viable outside the womb is not a sound argument, either. Some elderly people are not viable, either, but we don't kill them.

There are some mentally ill people and people with disabilities that are far greater human beings than some of the dreck that is alive. I can imagine that some of the poor souls that were aborted were in this class of people. If anyone should be aborted I vote for the politicians. Lying scum.

I can't remember the name right off but there is one prominent supporter of abortion that is even beginning to argue that children can be killed up to the age of two years old.