The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[The_Noble_Cause]

1- Polls don't mean shit, that's been proven time and time again.

2- The entire political system is a clusterfuck and if Obama wins by any less than 100,000 votes in certain states, it's a corrupt election due to all of the illicit (and allowed, thank you to the courts) ACORN voter registration and influence....

The only reason people know about ACORN's fraudulent registrations is because ACORN was obligated to turn them all in under federal law.
They were appropriately flagged.
The process worked.

[Lula]

I'm seeing Palin in my hometown tomorrow, after having seen McCain just two days ago.

Exciting times in the life of Prog.

cool. ask her who she's wearing

[treetopovskaya]

Tea_'N_Cookies...

collective ownership of RESOURCES is not the same as collective ownership of industry.

soo damn pea-brained.

because of the gas refund? that's not taking from one group of people and giving it to another. that's collecting a tax from oil companies for state natural resources and giving it back to the people

LOL.
Soooo damn dumb.
Call it whatever you want, you're advocating collective ownership of private industry.

[The_Noble_Cause]

there is a huge difference between giving money to SOME people, and giving it to ALL people.

Who's giving money to ALL people?

also, they are not taking this money from SOME people, they are collecting it as a tax from oil companies and instead of spending it they are refunding it to the people... HUGE difference

Actually, what you stated sounds awfully alot like socialism.
From Palin's own mouth:

"And Alaska - we're set up, unlike other states in the union, where it's collectively Alaskans own the resources. So we share in the wealth when the development of these resources occurs."

[ProgRocker53]

I'm a registered Democrat and Palin was one of the main forces that tipped me to the right for this election.

And she embodies Democratic principles in the slightest how?
She's little more than an empty receptable of social wedge issues - abortion, guns, god etc.

Not at all.

I'm a situational voter and I personally feel that McCain and Palin are best-suited for the country now... I'm very pessimistic about Obama's inexperience/past/wealth-spreading and Joe Biden, period. Both Dem candidates are better politicans than leaders, I believe.... while McCain and Palin will be better leaders.

Hell, I'm not even sure Obama's a good politician...

Ok, the above has nothing to do with Democratic principles.

Exactly, which is why I said "not at all."

[7 Wishes]

1- Polls don't mean shit, that's been proven time and time again.

2- The entire political system is a clusterfuck and if Obama wins by any less than 100,000 votes in certain states, it's a corrupt election due to all of the illicit (and allowed, thank you to the courts) ACORN voter registration and influence....

You're joking, right? You do realize the troglodytes of the RNC are up to the usual tactics right now - voter intimidation and disenfranchisement? Whereas the ACORN situation has NOTHING to do with voter fraud, unless your name is Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck AND as such you can register a false address, with a fake SSN that would also have to match DMV records in order for you to be able to vote twice?

Besides, the Disney company is most definitely a tool of the right wing establishment.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Tea_'N_Cookies...

collective ownership of RESOURCES is not the same as collective ownership of industry.

soo damn pea-brained.

Oh, you mean collective ownership of land, just like Marx advocated?

As if bold-faced lying is somehow beneath these guys.

[Lula]

You did.

The only way McCain wins this election is through massive voter disenfranchisement and intimidation in ten swing states. Not even your party can pull THAT off.

don't count out the gop so fast- mailers have been sent to democrats in virginia stating they are to vote nov 5. i won't believe obama will win til it happens. there has been corruption in the past and at this stage in the political game nothing seems impossible.

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Misinform ... _1028.html

palin did not start the practice of giving the residents of alaska cash. my brothers have lived there 34 years and that has been the practice.

[The_Noble_Cause]

palin did not start the practice of giving the residents of alaska cash. my brothers have lived there 34 years and that has been the practice.

I never accused her of starting it.
I'm just pointing out the ripe hypocrisy....but, hey, what else is new.

[treetopovskaya]

heh...

sometimes the most obvious truths are obscured by hate for the opposition. It's funny when you start arguing against your own party's ideals.

[Skylorde]

It's funny how no-one here is TOUCHING the fact that G.Gordon Liddy and McCain are very close friends; the same people who assail Obama's informal relationship with Ayers seem to forget about Liddy.

I'm not because it's a moot point. Shall we all sit around the camp fire and say we agree?

And by the way, Palin's alaska was BY FAR the most socialist state in America thanks to HER leadership:

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/jamessurowiecki/2008/10/red-state-indee.html

I'm surprised you aren't out campaigning for her then

[The_Noble_Cause]

heh...

sometimes the most obvious truths are obscured by hate for the opposition. It's funny when you start arguing against your own party's ideals.

I never argued against it, I'm just pointing out that McCain's "socialist" hail mary pass is built on a house of sand.
Keep spinning.

[Lula]

palin did not start the practice of giving the residents of alaska cash. my brothers have lived there 34 years and that has been the practice.

I never accused her of starting it.
I'm just pointing out the ripe hypocrisy....but, hey, what else is new.

no no no

i'm making sure that folks aren't touting palin as some great thinker, do gooder type of socialist, cuz that is exactly what this sounds like-

"And Alaska - we're set up, unlike other states in the union, where it's collectively Alaskans own the resources. So we share in the wealth when the development of these resources occurs."

[Skylorde]

The only reason people know about ACORN's fraudulent registrations is because ACORN was obligated to turn them all in under federal law.
They were appropriately flagged.
The process worked.

I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the potential impact of wide scale voter fraud. Election officials in a number of states have said it is physically impossible to verify each and every single registration.

[Lula]

The only reason people know about ACORN's fraudulent registrations is because ACORN was obligated to turn them all in under federal law.
They were appropriately flagged.
The process worked.

I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the potential impact of wide scale voter fraud. Election officials in a number of states have said it is physically impossible to verify each and every single registration.

yeah but don't you have to show ID when voting? we do in CA

[Skylorde]

Whereas the ACORN situation has NOTHING to do with voter fraud, unless your name is Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck AND as such you can register a false address, with a fake SSN that would also have to match DMV records in order for you to be able to vote twice?

Given what Acorn has already attempted to pull off, what makes you think they aren't capable of going to those extremes? The point is this isn't a silly stunt by some college kids. Fucking with the integrity (what is left of it) of the election process isn't a laughing matter.

[LazzMan]

The only reason people know about ACORN's fraudulent registrations is because ACORN was obligated to turn them all in under federal law.
They were appropriately flagged.
The process worked.

I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the potential impact of wide scale voter fraud. Election officials in a number of states have said it is physically impossible to verify each and every single registration.

yeah but don't you have to show ID when voting? we do in CA

Not in WI. Only 39 states require a picture I.D. and/or proof of residence. However, in all 50 states you need to show a picture I.D. to buy cold medicine. Curious...

[RossValoryRocks]

It's funny how no-one here is TOUCHING the fact that G.Gordon Liddy and McCain are very close friends; the same people who assail Obama's informal relationship with Ayers seem to forget about Liddy.

And by the way, Palin's alaska was BY FAR the most socialist state in America thanks to HER leadership:

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/jamessurowiecki/2008/10/red-state-indee.html

Liddy broke laws...but he never killed anyone...Ayers group did...a bit of a difference there...

[RossValoryRocks]

You did.

The only way McCain wins this election is through massive voter disenfranchisement and intimidation in ten swing states. Not even your party can pull THAT off.

Well Obama is going to win...with MASSIVE voter fraud helping out...so it balances out...

[Lula]

Whereas the ACORN situation has NOTHING to do with voter fraud, unless your name is Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck AND as such you can register a false address, with a fake SSN that would also have to match DMV records in order for you to be able to vote twice?

Given what Acorn has already attempted to pull off, what makes you think they aren't capable of going to those extremes? The point is this isn't a silly stunt by some college kids. Fucking with the integrity (what is left of it) of the election process isn't a laughing matter.

i am not defending acorn, but what exactly did they attempt to pull off? aren't they just doing what the law says- to submit all registrations, but they're flagging the suspect ones. the organization has several offices being investigated...... time will tell.

[7 Wishes]

Well Obama is going to win...with MASSIVE voter fraud helping out...so it balances out...

Proof, please? That's such a bullshit move, Stu.

It's the REPUBLICANS who are up to the usual shenanigans.

Oh, and Palin IS a socialist, by the way. Or, at very least, a communist.

"And Alaska—we’re set up, unlike other states in the union, where it’s collectively Alaskans own the resources. So we share in the wealth when the development of these resources occurs. … It’s to maximize benefits for Alaskans, not an individual company, not some multinational somewhere, but for Alaskans."

[Lula]

You did.

The only way McCain wins this election is through massive voter disenfranchisement and intimidation in ten swing states. Not even your party can pull THAT off.

Well Obama is going to win...with MASSIVE voter fraud helping out...so it balances out...

MASSIVE voter fraud? care to expand on that?

[RossValoryRocks]

Whereas the ACORN situation has NOTHING to do with voter fraud, unless your name is Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck AND as such you can register a false address, with a fake SSN that would also have to match DMV records in order for you to be able to vote twice?

Given what Acorn has already attempted to pull off, what makes you think they aren't capable of going to those extremes? The point is this isn't a silly stunt by some college kids. Fucking with the integrity (what is left of it) of the election process isn't a laughing matter.

i am not defending acorn, but what exactly did they attempt to pull off? aren't they just doing what the law says- to submit all registrations, but they're flagging the suspect ones. the organization has several offices being investigated...... time will tell.

NOT SEVERAL...almost ALL of them...and their people from out of state are VOTING in the states they are "helping" to register people in, even if those states aren't their state of residency!

People are going to be prosecuted in Ohio, but the vote still counts...the one in Ohio and the one in whatever state is really home...and there are THOUSANDS of them.

[ProgRocker53]

A man in Columbus, Ohio admitted to having been registered by ACORN and had voted for Obama 70-odd times.

[Lula]

Whereas the ACORN situation has NOTHING to do with voter fraud, unless your name is Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck AND as such you can register a false address, with a fake SSN that would also have to match DMV records in order for you to be able to vote twice?

Given what Acorn has already attempted to pull off, what makes you think they aren't capable of going to those extremes? The point is this isn't a silly stunt by some college kids. Fucking with the integrity (what is left of it) of the election process isn't a laughing matter.

i am not defending acorn, but what exactly did they attempt to pull off? aren't they just doing what the law says- to submit all registrations, but they're flagging the suspect ones. the organization has several offices being investigated...... time will tell.

NOT SEVERAL...almost ALL of them...and their people from out of state are VOTING in the states they are "helping" to register people in, even if those states aren't their state of residency!

People are going to be prosecuted in Ohio, but the vote still counts...the one in Ohio and the one in whatever state is really home...and there are THOUSANDS of them.

okay stu i'll give you the opportunity to substantiate this claim with a source please.

[Lula]

A man in Columbus, Ohio admitted to having been registered by ACORN and had voted for Obama 70-odd times.

prey tell, how does one vote 70 times? story link, please.

[RossValoryRocks]

You did.

The only way McCain wins this election is through massive voter disenfranchisement and intimidation in ten swing states. Not even your party can pull THAT off.

Well Obama is going to win...with MASSIVE voter fraud helping out...so it balances out...

MASSIVE voter fraud? care to expand on that?

Are you not reading what ACORN has done?

Don't give me the bullshit about "Mickey Mouse" either, for every Mickey Mouse registered there is a Jim Smith with the same SSN registered in 12 different places who has case 10 early votes in Ohio especially (they don't require ID, same here in PA, no ID required) and those votes are going to be counted.

The republicans don't want to disenfranchise anyone, but they do want to make sure every vote is LEGAL. How can you not agree with that?

[RossValoryRocks]

A man in Columbus, Ohio admitted to having been registered by ACORN and had voted for Obama 70-odd times.

prey tell, how does one vote 70 times? story link, please.

By voting early in different precincts, or absentee ballot. Prog lives in Ohio, I used to and still have many friends there, the stories are all over the place about it. But because of the financial mess no on is paying much attention.

[The_Noble_Cause]

You did.

The only way McCain wins this election is through massive voter disenfranchisement and intimidation in ten swing states. Not even your party can pull THAT off.

Well Obama is going to win...with MASSIVE voter fraud helping out...so it balances out...

MASSIVE voter fraud? care to expand on that?

Are you not reading what ACORN has done?

Don't give me the bullshit about "Mickey Mouse" either, for every Mickey Mouse registered there is a Jim Smith with the same SSN registered in 12 different places who has case 10 early votes in Ohio especially (they don't require ID, same here in PA, no ID required) and those votes are going to be counted.

The republicans don't want to disenfranchise anyone, but they do want to make sure every vote is LEGAL. How can you not agree with that?

Aren't we only finding out about this because ACORN adhered to federal law and turned EVERY registration in?
Being that it was ACORN who paid the canvassers to sign people up, aren't they the ones getting the short end of the stick here?

[RossValoryRocks]

Whereas the ACORN situation has NOTHING to do with voter fraud, unless your name is Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck AND as such you can register a false address, with a fake SSN that would also have to match DMV records in order for you to be able to vote twice?

Given what Acorn has already attempted to pull off, what makes you think they aren't capable of going to those extremes? The point is this isn't a silly stunt by some college kids. Fucking with the integrity (what is left of it) of the election process isn't a laughing matter.

i am not defending acorn, but what exactly did they attempt to pull off? aren't they just doing what the law says- to submit all registrations, but they're flagging the suspect ones. the organization has several offices being investigated...... time will tell.

NOT SEVERAL...almost ALL of them...and their people from out of state are VOTING in the states they are "helping" to register people in, even if those states aren't their state of residency!

People are going to be prosecuted in Ohio, but the vote still counts...the one in Ohio and the one in whatever state is really home...and there are THOUSANDS of them.

okay stu i'll give you the opportunity to substantiate this claim with a source please.

http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.jsp?a ... 4977473610

He was registered to vote 70 times, it didn't say how many time he actually voted.

This is the BIG one though...

http://palestra.net/blogs/read/17368