The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[Tito]

I posted this in the Van Halen thread too. I like Palin more and more.

Trig Paxson Van Palin is the couple's youngest child and second son. According to the governor's spokesperson Sharon Leighow in a statement made shortly after the baby's birth, Trig is Norse and means "true" and "brave victory." Paxson is a region in Alaska the couple favors. Van is a nod to the rock group Van Halen; before Trig's birth, his mother had joked about naming her son Van Palin after the band.

[grimlocked]

I posted this in the Van Halen thread too. I like Palin more and more.

Trig Paxson Van Palin is the couple's youngest child and second son. According to the governor's spokesperson Sharon Leighow in a statement made shortly after the baby's birth, Trig is Norse and means "true" and "brave victory." Paxson is a region in Alaska the couple favors. Van is a nod to the rock group Van Halen; before Trig's birth, his mother had joked about naming her son Van Palin after the band.

That's cute, but hopefully not the reason why you would like her to be VP.

[Barb]

the shoot wolves from the air is pretty bad, where's the sport in that?

While Palin's practice of killing innocent animals may endear her to some male voters (I'm not one of them), most women I know, view hunting as quite barbaric! I suspect that is going to lose her some votes, with the estrogen crowd


John from Boston

That is the one thing I dislike about Palin.

[The_Noble_Cause]

The thing that irritates me about politicians on either side is that they don't write their own darn speeches. I can't imagine Abraham Lincoln, for instance, pawning off the Gettysburg Address.

Obama does.

[grimlocked]

Holy Shit...!!

http://wcbstv.com/topstories/united.nations.general.2.823131.html

Anti-Iran Rally Turns Into Anti-Obama Rally

...

"I am upset by the sign because this is a non-political event," said Janice Shorenstein, president of the Jewish Community Relations Council. "We are here today to cry out against Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, not political. American elections are not part of this event."

This was supposed to be a non-partisan rally, but it seems like it may have been infiltrated by people with other agendas.

[The_Noble_Cause]

This article mentions a speech or two from the primaries.
It was reported that Obama personally wrote the Philadelphia speech and the DNC speech.
Unlike most celeb candidates, he also wrote both his autobigraphies without a ghost writer.
I guess you think he was appointed head of Harvard review due to affirmative action?

[grimlocked]

In this day and age, a candidate would be stupid to not have a helper in composing a speech.

And even if a candidate writes the speech all by himself/herself, it would be stupid to not have a team to read the speech and make suggestions. It's possible that it's always been like this, even in Lincoln's time (who knows).

[treetopovskaya]

omg! where do you think the meat people eat at the grocery store comes from? those animals are killed... slaughtered just the same. i don't like hunting... but if you are doing so to feed your family... what is the difference?

the wolves are being killed to help the population of moose & caribou. if the wolves weren't thinned out they would kill all the moose... & caribou... and whatever else they eat.

i think they should just catch them... have them spayed or neutered & released back into the wild.

anyway... if you eat/wear/use products tested on & or contain animals you really have no room to speak. that's how i see it.

sorry.

the shoot wolves from the air is pretty bad, where's the sport in that?

While Palin's practice of killing innocent animals may endear her to some male voters (I'm not one of them), most women I know, view hunting as quite barbaric! I suspect that is going to lose her some votes, with the estrogen crowd


John from Boston

[Enigma869]

omg! where do you think the meat people eat at the grocery store comes from? those animals are killed... slaughtered just the same. i don't like hunting... but if you are doing so to feed your family... what is the difference?

the wolves are being killed to help the population of moose & caribou. if the wolves weren't thinned out they would kill all the moose... & caribou... and whatever else they eat.

i think they should just catch them... have them spayed or neutered & released back into the wild.

anyway... if you eat/wear/use products tested on & or contain animals you really have no room to speak. that's how i see it.

sorry.

Not sure if your comments are directed at me, but if they are, save the self-righteous bullshit! For the record, I personally don't eat animals, as you put it...nor do I kill them! I never claimed that Puppet Palin was going to rot in hell for killing Bambi I simply stated that killing animals is not usually an activity that most women I have encountered in my life support!


John from Boston

[treetopovskaya]

another thing...

it's not okay to kill an animal but it's fine to terminate an unborn child?

[RedWingFan]

another thing...

it's not okay to kill an animal but it's fine to terminate an unborn child?

Ouch!!!

[Enigma869]

another thing...

it's not okay to kill an animal but it's fine to terminate an unborn child?

Again...not sure if your comment is directed at me, but if you're asking me, then I am pro-choice. I am personally opposed to abortion, but don't believe the government has any business telling a woman what to do with her life and her body! I think women who use abortion as a form of birth control are despicable human beings!


John from Boston

[treetopovskaya]

j from boston... not directed at you... just ranting to whoever wants to listen.

[csiako]

As a mother, I have a problem with this. There have been many opportunities in my life that I have turned down because they would have taken me away from my child when he was young. I am a progressive, liberal, intelligent, highly educated woman but with this I take issue. When I gave birth to my two children, one died when very young, I knew that I was making a decision and that my children were a priority, especially while young. A special needs child is exactly that, a child with special needs and a un-wed pregnant young woman doesn't need the added stress of 24/7 reporters following her and reporting on her every movement.

From where I work, there's a lot of female employees who probably earn more than what I earn (as a male). There's a few bosses above them who are males who probably earn more than them. My point is that in an organizational structure, you probably have scattered men and women from top to bottom. I have no reason to believe (at least where I work) that those women earn less than what men in those same positions might earn.

ok im confused... are you a mother or are you a male?.. or are you both?

[treetopovskaya]

mr. palin can stay home & play mommy. }:C)

As a mother, I have a problem with this. There have been many opportunities in my life that I have turned down because they would have taken me away from my child when he was young. I am a progressive, liberal, intelligent, highly educated woman but with this I take issue. When I gave birth to my two children, one died when very young, I knew that I was making a decision and that my children were a priority, especially while young. A special needs child is exactly that, a child with special needs and a un-wed pregnant young woman doesn't need the added stress of 24/7 reporters following her and reporting on her every movement.

From where I work, there's a lot of female employees who probably earn more than what I earn (as a male). There's a few bosses above them who are males who probably earn more than them. My point is that in an organizational structure, you probably have scattered men and women from top to bottom. I have no reason to believe (at least where I work) that those women earn less than what men in those same positions might earn.

ok im confused... are you a mother or are you a male?.. or are you both?

[grimlocked]

As a mother, I have a problem with this. There have been many opportunities in my life that I have turned down because they would have taken me away from my child when he was young. I am a progressive, liberal, intelligent, highly educated woman but with this I take issue. When I gave birth to my two children, one died when very young, I knew that I was making a decision and that my children were a priority, especially while young. A special needs child is exactly that, a child with special needs and a un-wed pregnant young woman doesn't need the added stress of 24/7 reporters following her and reporting on her every movement.

From where I work, there's a lot of female employees who probably earn more than what I earn (as a male). There's a few bosses above them who are males who probably earn more than them. My point is that in an organizational structure, you probably have scattered men and women from top to bottom. I have no reason to believe (at least where I work) that those women earn less than what men in those same positions might earn.

ok im confused... are you a mother or are you a male?.. or are you both?

(In an Austin Power voice...) I'm a man, baby!

That first statement you quoted was from a mother. Check out the post in its context:

10. I'm not sure how she would be effective if she has 5 kids to take care of (if she can, I'm all praise for her but at this point, I think her family needs her more specially her young born)

Give me a break...Would you say this about a man who has young children at home? This is not even an issue.

Some people think it's an issue (it's a non-issue for me, but I would feel bad for her family). Read about concerns here: http://www.funadvice.com/q/can_a_woman_ ... ul_in_this, like from one poster:

"Joe Biden traveled home every evening to be with his children. Also his two children were young, but not infants.

I see a tremendous difference between Biden and Palin.
Palin has five children, the youngest 5 months old and a special needs child.
As VP she will not be able to commute each night to be with her children.

I have this to say from a previous question.

I have no problem with the fact that Palin's daughter is pregnant. Kids are kids and no matter how you try, they do what they want. Any of us with children could be in Palin's position.

What I have a problem with, and hear me out, is a mother that would subject her un-wed, pregnant daughter to the scrutiny of a national campaign and would decide to run for VP having a young baby with downs syndrome. It is challenging enough to raise a baby when you are traveling all over the country but to try to raise a baby with special needs while traveling all over the country is next to impossible, unless you allow others to raise that child.

As a mother, I have a problem with this. There have been many opportunities in my life that I have turned down because they would have taken me away from my child when he was young. I am a progressive, liberal, intelligent, highly educated woman but with this I take issue. When I gave birth to my two children, one died when very young, I knew that I was making a decision and that my children were a priority, especially while young. A special needs child is exactly that, a child with special needs and a un-wed pregnant young woman doesn't need the added stress of 24/7 reporters following her and reporting on her every movement.

And for those of you who know a little about me, you know that I would feel the same no matter if the mother was a liberal or a conservative."

[7 Wishes]

I definitely think that Bugs Bunny's finest work was in the "Giovanni Jones" episode (Long-Haired Hare). When Bugs compels him to sing "When Skys Are Drippy in Mississippi" I laugh so hard milk comes out of my nose.

[finalfight]

This is a fun aside -

From the FilmDrunk website -

http://filmdrunk.uproxx.com/?p=3779#comments

C*nty NY Times columnist Maureen Dowd recently called West Wing creator Aaron Sorkin to ask what a meeting between fictional West Wing president Jed Bartlet (played by Martin Sheen) and presidential candidate Barack Obama would be like. Sorkin wrote the whole thing out, and, ta da! one Dowd column in the can. Hey, Aaron, I have a couple days of movie news I could use your help with…

I’m including the full scene below. It’s a great way to find out what a celebrity thinks about politics, just in case you didn’t watch the Oscars, the Emmys, Oprah, The View, The Daily Show, Jay Leno, Dave Letterman, Hogan Knows Best, 24, Lost… well, pretty much anything other than The Hills. The Hills is always a nice break from politics, the downside is you have watch elementary school dropouts talk about laundry for half an hour.

BARACK OBAMA knocks on the front door of a 300-year-old New Hampshire farmhouse while his Secret Service detail waits in the driveway. The door opens and OBAMA is standing face to face with former President JED BARTLET.
BARTLET Senator.

OBAMA Mr. President.

BARTLET You seem startled.

OBAMA I didn’t expect you to answer the door yourself.

BARTLET I didn’t expect you to be getting beat by John McCain and a Lancôme rep who thinks “The Flintstones” was based on a true story, so let’s call it even.

OBAMA Yes, sir.

BARTLET Come on in.

BARTLET leads OBAMA into his study.

BARTLET That was a hell of a convention.

OBAMA Thank you, I was proud of it.

BARTLET I meant the Republicans. The Us versus Them-a-thon. As a Democrat I was surprised to learn that I don’t like small towns, God, people with jobs or America. I’ve been a little out of touch but is there a mandate that the vice president be skilled at field dressing a moose —

OBAMA Look —

BARTLET — and selling Air Force Two on eBay?

OBAMA Joke all you want, Mr. President, but it worked.

BARTLET Imagine my surprise. What can I do for you, kid?

OBAMA I’m interested in your advice.

BARTLET I can’t give it to you.

OBAMA Why not?

BARTLET I’m supporting McCain.

OBAMA Why?

BARTLET He’s promised to eradicate evil and that was always on my “to do” list.

OBAMA O.K. —

BARTLET And he’s surrounded himself, I think, with the best possible team to get us out of an economic crisis. Why, Sarah Palin just said Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac had “gotten too big and too expensive to the taxpayers.” Can you spot the error in that statement?

OBAMA Yes, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac aren’t funded by taxpayers.

BARTLET Well, at least they are now. Kind of reminds you of the time Bush said that Social Security wasn’t a government program. He was only off by a little — Social Security is the largest government program.

OBAMA I appreciate your sense of humor, sir, but I really could use your advice.

BARTLET Well, it seems to me your problem is a lot like the problem I had twice.

OBAMA Which was?

BARTLET A huge number of Americans thought I thought I was superior to them.

OBAMA And?

BARTLET I was.

OBAMA I mean, how did you overcome that?

BARTLET I won’t lie to you, being fictional was a big advantage.

OBAMA What do you mean?

BARTLET I’m a fictional president. You’re dreaming right now, Senator.

OBAMA I’m asleep?

BARTLET Yes, and you’re losing a ton of white women.

OBAMA Yes, sir.

BARTLET I mean tons.

OBAMA I understand.

BARTLET I didn’t even think there were that many white women.

OBAMA I see the numbers, sir. What do they want from me?

BARTLET I’ve been married to a white woman for 40 years and I still don’t know what she wants from me.

OBAMA How did you do it?

BARTLET Well, I say I’m sorry a lot.

OBAMA I don’t mean your marriage, sir. I mean how did you get America on your side?

BARTLET There again, I didn’t have to be president of America, I just had to be president of the people who watched “The West Wing.”

OBAMA That would make it easier.

BARTLET You’d do very well on NBC. Thursday nights in the old “ER” time slot with “30 Rock” as your lead-in, you’d get seven, seven-five in the demo with a 20, 22 share — you’d be selling $450,000 minutes.

OBAMA What the hell does that mean?

BARTLET TV talk. I thought you’d be interested.

OBAMA I’m not. They pivoted off the argument that I was inexperienced to the criticism that I’m — wait for it — the Messiah, who, by the way, was a community organizer. When I speak I try to lead with inspiration and aptitude. How is that a liability?

BARTLET Because the idea of American exceptionalism doesn’t extend to Americans being exceptional. If you excelled academically and are able to casually use 690 SAT words then you might as well have the press shoot video of you giving the finger to the Statue of Liberty while the Dixie Chicks sing the University of the Taliban fight song. The people who want English to be the official language of the United States are uncomfortable with their leaders being fluent in it.

OBAMA You’re saying race doesn’t have anything to do with it?

BARTLET I wouldn’t go that far. Brains made me look arrogant but they make you look uppity. Plus, if you had a black daughter —

OBAMA I have two.

BARTLET — who was 17 and pregnant and unmarried and the father was a teenager hoping to launch a rap career with “Thug Life” inked across his chest, you’d come in fifth behind Bob Barr, Ralph Nader and a ficus.

OBAMA You’re not cheering me up.

BARTLET Is that what you came here for?

OBAMA No, but it wouldn’t kill you.

BARTLET Have you tried doing a two-hour special or a really good Christmas show?

OBAMA Sir —

BARTLET Hang on. Home run. Right here. Is there any chance you could get Michelle pregnant before the fall sweeps?

OBAMA The problem is we can’t appear angry. Bush called us the angry left. Did you see anyone in Denver who was angry?

BARTLET Well … let me think. …We went to war against the wrong country, Osama bin Laden just celebrated his seventh anniversary of not being caught either dead or alive, my family’s less safe than it was eight years ago, we’ve lost trillions of dollars, millions of jobs, thousands of lives and we lost an entire city due to bad weather. So, you know … I’m a little angry.

OBAMA What would you do?

BARTLET GET ANGRIER! Call them liars, because that’s what they are. Sarah Palin didn’t say “thanks but no thanks” to the Bridge to Nowhere. She just said “Thanks.” You were raised by a single mother on food stamps — where does a guy with eight houses who was legacied into Annapolis get off calling you an elitist? And by the way, if you do nothing else, take that word back. Elite is a good word, it means well above average. I’d ask them what their problem is with excellence. While you’re at it, I want the word “patriot” back. McCain can say that the transcendent issue of our time is the spread of Islamic fanaticism or he can choose a running mate who doesn’t know the Bush doctrine from the Monroe Doctrine, but he can’t do both at the same time and call it patriotic. They have to lie — the truth isn’t their friend right now. Get angry. Mock them mercilessly; they’ve earned it. McCain decried agents of intolerance, then chose a running mate who had to ask if she was allowed to ban books from a public library. It’s not bad enough she thinks the planet Earth was created in six days 6,000 years ago complete with a man, a woman and a talking snake, she wants schools to teach the rest of our kids to deny geology, anthropology, archaeology and common sense too? It’s not bad enough she’s forcing her own daughter into a loveless marriage to a teenage hood, she wants the rest of us to guide our daughters in that direction too? It’s not enough that a woman shouldn’t have the right to choose, it should be the law of the land that she has to carry and deliver her rapist’s baby too? I don’t know whether or not Governor Palin has the tenacity of a pit bull, but I know for sure she’s got the qualifications of one. And you’re worried about seeming angry? You could eat their lunch, make them cry and tell their mamas about it and God himself would call it restrained. There are times when you are simply required to be impolite. There are times when condescension is called for!

OBAMA Good to get that off your chest?

BARTLET Am I keeping you from something?

OBAMA Well, it’s not as if I didn’t know all of that and it took you like 20 minutes to say.

BARTLET I know, I have a problem, but admitting it is the first step.

OBAMA What’s the second step?

BARTLET I don’t care.

OBAMA So what about hope? Chuck it for outrage and put-downs?

BARTLET No. You’re elite, you can do both. Four weeks ago you had the best week of your campaign, followed — granted, inexplicably — by the worst week of your campaign. And you’re still in a statistical dead heat. You’re a 47-year-old black man with a foreign-sounding name who went to Harvard and thinks devotion to your country and lapel pins aren’t the same thing and you’re in a statistical tie with a war hero and a Cinemax heroine. To these aged eyes, Senator, that’s what progress looks like. You guys got four debates. Get out of my house and go back to work.

OBAMA Wait, what is it you always used to say? When you hit a bump on the show and your people were down and frustrated? You’d give them a pep talk and then you’d always end it with something. What was it …?

BARTLET “Break’s over.”

[Enigma869]

Biden disapproves of an ad Obama ran. Dissension in the ranks! Nothing better than a bunch of dopey politicians fighting with each other!

http://news.aol.com/elections/article/b ... 1200614810


John from Boston

[grimlocked]

Biden disapproves of an ad Obama ran. Dissension in the ranks! Nothing better than a bunch of dopey politicians fighting with each other!

http://news.aol.com/elections/article/b ... 1200614810


John from Boston

This is Biden's response to this:

“I was asked about an ad I’d never seen, reacting merely to press reports,” Biden explained. “Having now reviewed the ad, it is even more clear to me that given the disgraceful tenor of Senator McCain’s ads and their persistent falsehoods, his campaign is in no position to criticize…”

[RossValoryRocks]

Biden disapproves of an ad Obama ran. Dissension in the ranks! Nothing better than a bunch of dopey politicians fighting with each other!

http://news.aol.com/elections/article/b ... 1200614810


John from Boston

This is Biden's response to this:

“I was asked about an ad I’d never seen, reacting merely to press reports,” Biden explained. “Having now reviewed the ad, it is even more clear to me that given the disgraceful tenor of Senator McCain’s ads and their persistent falsehoods, his campaign is in no position to criticize…”

So basically..."They did it so it's ok that we do it too". It makes BOTH campaigns a bunch on hypocrites!

I am disgusted by the whole tone of BOTH campaigns. Someone needs to rise above the negative bullshit.

[grimlocked]

Biden disapproves of an ad Obama ran. Dissension in the ranks! Nothing better than a bunch of dopey politicians fighting with each other!

http://news.aol.com/elections/article/b ... 1200614810


John from Boston

This is Biden's response to this:

“I was asked about an ad I’d never seen, reacting merely to press reports,” Biden explained. “Having now reviewed the ad, it is even more clear to me that given the disgraceful tenor of Senator McCain’s ads and their persistent falsehoods, his campaign is in no position to criticize…”

So basically..."They did it so it's ok that we do it too". It makes BOTH campaigns a bunch on hypocrites!

I am disgusted by the whole tone of BOTH campaigns. Someone needs to rise above the negative bullshit.

Amen!!!

Unfortunately, a big chunk of the voting public "believes" the soundbites without any research. So negativity to some extent works. That's the reality. If one camp does it to a public that has a tendency to believe all the lies, it would be suicide for the other camp to just sit there and turn the other cheek.

Now, if every voter does his/her research and expects some level of decency and ethics, these things wouldn't happen.

[conversationpc]

I am personally opposed to abortion, but don't believe the government has any business telling a woman what to do with her life and her body!

Newsflash...An unborn child has its own separate life AND body.

[Enigma869]

Newsflash...An unborn child has its own separate life AND body.

Not a debate I'm getting into with you. I have a "newsflash" for you...Not everyone agrees that life begins at conception! That's obviously your opinion, but not everyone shares it. While I am not a fan of abortion (and even talked a friend out of it who now has a 14 year old son, thanks to our talk), there are instances where abortion is absolutely warranted, in my opinion! The government and religious zealots should keep their nose out of it, as far as I'm concerned!


John from Boston

[Enigma869]

More idiocy from Puppet Palin. This dopey chick needs to get some better advice. You would think it would occur to her that trying to be so secretive about EVERYTHING leads to speculation about dishonesty and/or incompetence! Policians need to be transparent! Especially when they're running for the second highest office in the land!

http://news.aol.com/elections/article/r ... 1200610028


John from Boston

[7 Wishes]

It was just a photo op anyway...it has no bearing on her complete and total lack of knowledge or capacity in foreign affairs.

At least she can see Russia from her porch.

She is the Republican version of Barbara Boxer, only MUCH hotter.

[RossValoryRocks]

It was just a photo op anyway...it has no bearing on her complete and total lack of knowledge or capacity in foreign affairs.

At least she can see Russia from her porch.

She is the Republican version of Barbara Boxer, only MUCH hotter.

Wait a minute...you said something nasty about a Democrat???

Wow...come on over here and give a hug...progress at last!

She is much hotter than Boxer too!

[7 Wishes]

If you need any Mondale or Dukakis material, let me know. I have pages of 'em.

And Representative Dennis is a jackass, too.

[7 Wishes]

The McCain camp DOES want Palin to keep quiet unless she's speaking to conservatives at a rally and able to stay completely on message:
[url]
http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/200809 ... tico/13783[/url]

[Since 78]

It was just a photo op anyway...it has no bearing on her complete and total lack of knowledge or capacity in foreign affairs.

At least she can see Russia from her porch.

She is the Republican version of Barbara Boxer, only MUCH hotter.

Wait a minute...you said something nasty about a Democrat???

Wow...come on over here and give a hug...progress at last!

She is much hotter than Boxer too!

+2