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Postby grimlocked » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:23 am

Fact Finder wrote:
The_Noble_Cause wrote:Just breaking - McCain campaign advisor was on the take from Freddie Mac up until a month ago.
McCain claimed those ties were cut in 2005 and encouraged the press to do a thorough background check.
Careful what you wish for...

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/24/us/po ... nted=print

http://www.newsweek.com/id/160561/output/print



McCain sets the record straight....


A Partisan Paper of Record

Today the New York Times launched its latest attack on this campaign in its capacity as an Obama advocacy organization. Let us be clear about what this story alleges: The New York Times charges that McCain-Palin 2008 campaign manager Rick Davis was paid by Freddie Mac until last month, contrary to previous reporting, as well as statements by this campaign and by Mr. Davis himself.

In fact, the allegation is demonstrably false. As has been previously reported, Mr. Davis separated from his consulting firm, Davis Manafort, in 2006. As has been previously reported, Mr. Davis has seen no income from Davis Manafort since 2006. Zero. Mr. Davis has received no salary or compensation since 2006. Mr. Davis has received no profit or partner distributions from that firm on any basis -- weekly, bi-weekly, monthly, bi-monthly, quarterly, semi-annual or annual -- since 2006. Again, zero. Neither has Mr. Davis received any equity in the firm based on profits derived since his financial separation from Davis Manafort in 2006.

Further, and missing from the Times' reporting, Mr. Davis has never -- never -- been a lobbyist for either Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac. Mr. Davis has not served as a registered lobbyist since 2005.

Though these facts are a matter of public record, the New York Times, in what can only be explained as a willful disregard of the truth, failed to research this story or present any semblance of a fairminded treatment of the facts closely at hand. The paper did manage to report one interesting but irrelevant fact: Mr. Davis did participate in a roundtable discussion on the political scene with...Paul Begala.

Again, let us be clear: The New York Times -- in the absence of any supporting evidence -- has insinuated some kind of impropriety on the part of Senator McCain and Rick Davis. But entirely missing from the story is any significant mention of Senator McCain's long advocacy for, and co-sponsorship of legislation to enact, stricter oversight and regulation of both Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- dating back to 2006. Please see the attached floor statement on this issue by Senator McCain from 2006.

To the central point our campaign has made in the last 48 hours: The New York Times has never published a single investigative piece, factually correct or otherwise, examining the relationship between Obama campaign chief strategist David Axelrod, his consulting and lobbying clients, and Senator Obama. Likewise, the New York Times never published an investigative report, factually correct or otherwise, examining the relationship between Former Fannie Mae CEO Jim Johnson and Senator Obama, who appointed Johnson head of his VP search committee, until the writing was on the wall and Johnson was under fire following reports from actual news organizations that he had received preferential loans from predatory mortgage lender Countrywide.

Therefore this "report" from the New York Times must be evaluated in the context of its intent and purpose. It is a partisan attack falsely labeled as objective news. And its most serious allegations are based entirely on the claims of anonymous sources, a familiar yet regretful tactic for the paper.

We all understand that partisan attacks are part of the political process in this country. The debate that stems from these grand and sometimes unruly conversations is what makes this country so exceptional. Indeed, our nation has a long and proud tradition of news organizations that are ideological and partisan in nature, the Huffington Post and the New York Times being two such publications. We celebrate their contribution to the political fabric of America. But while the Huffington Post is utterly transparent, the New York Times obscures its true intentions -- to undermine the candidacy of John McCain and boost the candidacy of Barack Obama -- under the cloak of objective journalism.

The New York Times is trying to fill an ideological niche. It is a business decision, and one made under economic duress, as the New York Times is a failing business. But the paper's reporting on Senator McCain, his campaign, and his staff should be clearly understood by the American people for what it is: a partisan assault aimed at promoting that paper’s preferred candidate, Barack Obama.




McCain didn't really set the record straight:

The statement is basically a non-denial. Part of its focus is to dispute the Times's suggestion that Davis's ownership of Davis Manafort means that he benefits even if he's on leave of absence. There are reasonable arguments on both sides there. The statement also argues that the Times tilts toward the Democrat, and makes guesses about the paper's motives, all reasonable and arguable.

What the statement doesn't dispute is the actual news in the story: the $15,000 monthly payments from Freddie Mac, which began while Davis was still running the firm. You can judge the news value of that for yourself.

So don't mistake the extended non-denial for an argument about the substance of the story. At this point in the race, details like that may be less important than broader electoral positioning, and the campaign seeks to escalate this into an argument with the Times, rather than a conversation about Davis's ties. The question is whether the conservative base -- which hotly contested negative stories about Sarah Palin -- will defend Davis, not a particular conservative hero, with the same vigor.
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Postby Enigma869 » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:33 am

Jana wrote:wow, you guys have taken this thread to a whole new level. Morons & non-morons.


Yeah...I think we're getting the polticial and religous threads confused :shock: :shock: :shock:


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Postby 7 Wishes » Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:52 am

First of all, RWF, the correct spelling is "InDokktrination".

Besides, polls that indulge in a proclivity towards informational sub-sets tend to be too limited in scope to have any real statistical significance.
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Postby RossValoryRocks » Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:54 am

7 Wishes wrote:First of all, RWF, the correct spelling is "InDokktrination".

Besides, polls that indulge in a proclivity towards informational sub-sets tend to be too limited in scope to have any real statistical significance.


The only poll that is right is the one on November 4th. Until then it is just speculation.
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Postby 7 Wishes » Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:55 am

I still think we'll be just fine with either candidate in office. McCain is a great man and a good leader - I just think Obama has a better handle on the economy. But unlike Bush's narrow victory in 2004, I won't be upset if McCain wins - I'll welcome his Administration with an open mind.
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Postby Barb » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:13 am

WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.
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Postby conversationpc » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:17 am

Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Wow...It's the right thing to do, in my opinion. Both he and Obama should be on the record by voting on the bailout bill.
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Postby Barb » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:19 am

conversationpc wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Wow...It's the right thing to do, in my opinion. Both he and Obama should be on the record by voting on the bailout bill.


I agree that it is the right thing to do. I'm just shocked that anyone gives a flying crap about doing the right thing.
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Postby iceberg » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:20 am

Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


you mean focus on the problems vs. the politics? very strange move and not one you'd expect from "the same".

he's living up to maverick and wants to put the focus on us all where it needs to be.

interesting.
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Postby iceberg » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:21 am

Barb wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Wow...It's the right thing to do, in my opinion. Both he and Obama should be on the record by voting on the bailout bill.


I agree that it is the right thing to do. I'm just shocked that anyone gives a flying crap about doing the right thing.


like you - i kinda wondered what was up when i saw that. we know who's running for office in november. a debate here and there won't do much to change minds - esp those already made up. but to actually put down politics to focus on problems?

i slid more to his side today.
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Postby The_Noble_Cause » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:23 am

Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Coming from the most absent member of the Senate, this is strictly political stagecraft.
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Postby Barb » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:25 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Coming from the most absent member of the Senate, this is strictly political stagecraft.


:lol:
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Postby iceberg » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:26 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Coming from the most absent member of the Senate, this is strictly political stagecraft.


PRESENT!!!

there. we've got obama's vote now.
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Postby conversationpc » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:28 am

Barb wrote:
The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Coming from the most absent member of the Senate, this is strictly political stagecraft.


:lol:


Yeah, that's kinda what I thought. Who cares? It'll put both guys on record unless Obama wants to look bad. Hopefully, it'll force him to go vote also.
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Postby Barb » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:45 am

ABC is reporting that Obama will not cancel the debate. Now this is getting interesting.
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Postby RedWingFan » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:47 am

Barb wrote:ABC is reporting that Obama will not cancel the debate. Now this is getting interesting.

He's not wasting that 3 days of training he just went through. :lol:
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Postby conversationpc » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:47 am

Barb wrote:ABC is reporting that Obama will not cancel the debate. Now this is getting interesting.


Maybe he will do better debating an empty podium. :lol:
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Postby conversationpc » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:48 am

RedWingFan wrote:
Barb wrote:ABC is reporting that Obama will not cancel the debate. Now this is getting interesting.

He's not wasting that 3 days of training he just went through. :lol:


I wonder if he requested the use of his teleprompter? :lol:
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Postby RedWingFan » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:49 am

conversationpc wrote:
Barb wrote:ABC is reporting that Obama will not cancel the debate. Now this is getting interesting.


Maybe he will do better debating an empty podium. :lol:

Not until he can figure out a way to get rid of the moderator. :lol:
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Postby grimlocked » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:50 am

conversationpc wrote:
Barb wrote:
The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Coming from the most absent member of the Senate, this is strictly political stagecraft.


:lol:


Yeah, that's kinda what I thought. Who cares? It'll put both guys on record unless Obama wants to look bad. Hopefully, it'll force him to go vote also.


This is a smooth move by McCain. Since McCain made the public announcement first, he'd get the credit if ever there's a joint solution with Obama, even though the Obama camp may be the one which initiated it all:

The Obama campaign said Obama had called McCain around 8:30 a.m. Wednesday to propose that they issue a joint statement in support of a package to help fix the economy as soon as possible. McCain called back six hours later and agreed to the idea of the statement, the Obama campaign said. McCain's statement was issued to the media a few minutes later.
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Postby Barb » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:52 am

grimlocked wrote:
conversationpc wrote:
Barb wrote:
The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Coming from the most absent member of the Senate, this is strictly political stagecraft.


:lol:


Yeah, that's kinda what I thought. Who cares? It'll put both guys on record unless Obama wants to look bad. Hopefully, it'll force him to go vote also.


This is a smooth move by McCain. Since McCain made the public announcement first, he'd get the credit if ever there's a joint solution with Obama, even though the Obama camp may be the one which initiated it all:

The Obama campaign said Obama had called McCain around 8:30 a.m. Wednesday to propose that they issue a joint statement in support of a package to help fix the economy as soon as possible. McCain called back six hours later and agreed to the idea of the statement, the Obama campaign said. McCain's statement was issued to the media a few minutes later.


Even if that is true, it only highlights the extreme differences between the 2: Obama gives a speech. McCain takes action.

Poor Obama. This is quite a dilemma he has on his hands.
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Postby RossValoryRocks » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:53 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Coming from the most absent member of the Senate, this is strictly political stagecraft.


In suspending his campaign I think he is handing the election to Obama. Just my opinion. But he is doing the right thing.

This economic mess demands attention and it demands it now, and not the turn over of almost $1 trillion dollars that the President was asking to be handed to the Sec. of the Treasury.

I think McCain really would rather lose the election than see America fall apart.
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Postby grimlocked » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:00 am

RossValoryRocks wrote:I think McCain really would rather lose the election than see America fall apart.


When McCain picked Palin, I thought of the opposite: He'd rather win the election by securing the conservative base even if it means America falling apart in the event of Palin becoming president.
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Postby The_Noble_Cause » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:03 am

Barb wrote:Even if that is true, it only highlights the extreme differences between the 2: Obama gives a speech. McCain takes action.


Obama privately called McCain to release a joint bi-partisan solution addressing the crisis.
Upon agreeing, McCain went ahead and mass dialed the Washington Press Corp.
This serves the people just how exactly?
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Postby RossValoryRocks » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:05 am

grimlocked wrote:
RossValoryRocks wrote:I think McCain really would rather lose the election than see America fall apart.


When McCain picked Palin, I thought of the opposite: He'd rather win the election by securing the conservative base even if it means America falling apart in the event of Palin becoming president.


I doubt that...McCain has consistently put the welfare of this country above his own ambitions.

Anyways, McCain has just given the election to Obama so it's a moot point.
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Postby iceberg » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:09 am

RossValoryRocks wrote:
The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Barb wrote:WTF? McCain is suspending his campaign and going back to Washington and wants debate postponed to focus on ecomomy?

Hm.


Coming from the most absent member of the Senate, this is strictly political stagecraft.


In suspending his campaign I think he is handing the election to Obama. Just my opinion. But he is doing the right thing.

This economic mess demands attention and it demands it now, and not the turn over of almost $1 trillion dollars that the President was asking to be handed to the Sec. of the Treasury.

I think McCain really would rather lose the election than see America fall apart.


i agree with you in the end. but if obama wants to "talk about what he'd do" vs. roll up sleeves and dive in w/mccain, the average person tired of the bickering back and forth will slide to mccain - i would think - for no other reason than mccain is trying to bypass partisan politics.

look how hard we as a culture make it for our leaders to do the right thing. mccain doesn't really care what people thinks. obama won't make a move w/o a poll in his pocket.
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Postby iceberg » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:10 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Barb wrote:Even if that is true, it only highlights the extreme differences between the 2: Obama gives a speech. McCain takes action.


Obama privately called McCain to release a joint bi-partisan solution addressing the crisis.
Upon agreeing, McCain went ahead and mass dialed the Washington Press Corp.
This serves the people just how exactly?


also in the news mccain called obama and asked him to join in, and even announce it first so he can get that "credit".

now where are we? let the unfounded specuation run i suppose, but it sure is an interesting time we live in. :)
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Postby The_Noble_Cause » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:13 am

iceberg wrote:also in the news mccain called obama and asked him to join in, and even announce it first so he can get that "credit".


Where was this?
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Postby Enigma869 » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:17 am

RossValoryRocks wrote:In suspending his campaign I think he is handing the election to Obama.


I don't agree with this, at all! For the record, the "this" I am referring to is that McCain is handing Obama the election by doing this. Quite the contrary, actually! I think this is a BRILLIANT, strategic move by McCain's campaign. I certainly don't believe that his motives are remotely altruistic, as has been suggested. The guy is a polician, in the midst of a race for the highest office in the land. What better way for him to "look presidential" than to publicize to the American people that he is putting the needs of the country first! Believe me...he couldn't get this story out to the press fast enough!


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Postby iceberg » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:21 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
iceberg wrote:also in the news mccain called obama and asked him to join in, and even announce it first so he can get that "credit".


Where was this?


just things i'm hearing but with the same "merit" as those saying obama made the 1st move.

if obama did make the 1st move why did he not follow up?

in the end i don't care about credit or perception, i care that our next president has a role in shaping the economy he will lead in 2 months. i would think both candidates would WELCOME the ability to provide input on the country they're about to lead for the next 4 years.

i see mcccain trying to put politics down and try. even if a political move.
i see obama wanting to talk about what he'd do if given a chance.

here's his chance and i see what he's doing. he's losing a lot of faith from scared people today.
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