MR

Trial By Fire or Revelation

which is better in your opinion?

Revelation.

I do like the overall sound quality of Trial By Far though it has a very rich feel and stellar vocal work. Revelation is much more driving in its musical approach and overall has the edge on quality songs that are fun to listen to repeatedly - and thats the important part.

Trial By Fire

I confess, I am struggling to connect with Revelation. I find it soulless and unmemorable. I will be trying it on repeat in my car this weekend to try and cement its good points. So far, I actually prefer Generations to Revelation, for all its flaws.

the only song that I liked about Trial by Fire is WYLAW. the musical orchestration is just difficult to ignore. however, without that song, Revelation wins by a mile.

Trial By Fire, not taking anything away from Revelation, but TBF is a masterpiece

No contest..."Revelation"

TBF by at least 6 lengths. I have tried and tried to get behind the new Journey, but I can't yet. Call me the grumpy old man but I prefer the Perry Era period. I actually went to the concert with Styx and REO and came home depressed. There was something missing from the memories I have of Journey. I miss that smooth and at time rough soul crooner, TBF just seems to reach out and grab you and dare you to let it go. The appeal isn't only with the Voice, some of the music itself was very energetic and at the same time smooth and melodic enough to relax your bones. FWIW

TBF is too ballads heavy for my taste, even if some are pretty good. The album is overproduced.

I think that Arrival is better.
I don't think that Revelation is the masterpiece that some are talking about, but overall, I think it is slightly better than TBF.

Journey_Elder wrote:TBF by at least 6 lengths. I have tried and tried to get behind the new Journey, but I can't yet. Call me the grumpy old man but I prefer the Perry Era period. I actually went to the concert with Styx and REO and came home depressed. There was something missing from the memories I have of Journey. I miss that smooth and at time rough soul crooner, TBF just seems to reach out and grab you and dare you to let it go. The appeal isn't only with the Voice, some of the music itself was very energetic and at the same time smooth and melodic enough to relax your bones. FWIW

who doesnt..

Trial By Fire.

I don't hear the same kind of emotion or vocal trapeeze act on Revelation.
Revelation is good. But TBF is better.
I could do without all the nature sound effects but... that's neither here nor there.

Yeah but...

This is Arnel's 1st record with the band... What a performance for a 1st time. The best place for any musician to get their chops to a pro level is on stage in front of people. If they maintain their momentum and his voice makes it the next record could be even better... I wish Perry wasnt such a vag about things. Would be nice if he and Schon could co-write. He knows he cant sing the catalog anymore so why doesnt he just gracefully pass the torch and take pride in the fact that the music is bigger than he is now... Him and Schon co-writing and Arnel singing... Would be interesting. Too bad he is a jaded lover about Journey...

People dont realize how much of a patch work TBF is vocally. IF you use a program like Adobe Audition and separate the center channel from the stereo image you can hear Perry without any effects and hardly any backing music.. It is there that you can hear the edits... Tons of them.... He did not sing for very long on any of the tracks without stopping. Maybe he always "comped" the vocals like that... Hearing him without effects and backing music shows that the damage is there for sure.

Yes, he still sounded awesome because the tonality of his voice rasp or not...

Liquid_Drummer wrote:People dont realize how much of a patch work TBF is vocally. IF you use a program like Adobe Audition and separate the center channel from the stereo image you can hear Perry without any effects and hardly any backing music.. It is there that you can hear the edits... Tons of them.... He did not sing for very long on any of the tracks without stopping. Maybe he always "comped" the vocals like that... Hearing him without effects and backing music shows that the damage is there for sure.

That's exactly what I've heard several times now.

Yes, he still sounded awesome because the tonality of his voice rasp or not...

Agreed.

Centaure wrote:TBF is too ballads heavy for my taste, even if some are pretty good. The album is overproduced.

I think that Arrival is better.
I don't think that Revelation is the masterpiece that some are talking about, but overall, I think it is slightly better than TBF.

Ditto that! I think everyone is caught up in the hype right now. Will be interesting to see what people think of the album in a year or so.

TBF, by a mile. Forget ??? that it's Perry on vocals for a minute. Listen to Cain's piano and Schon's riffs. Alot more imagination going into both. Then there's Smitty!

TBF for me, hands down!!!!

Not taking anything away from what I've heard from Revelation, of course!!!

TBF doesn't beat out much for me.....

Good grief! More comparisons!

Trial By Fire! I don't care if it is a softer album. When you have the classic Escape/Frontiers lineup together, they make magic on those records!

EightyRock wrote:Then there's Smitty!

...which is always a BIG PLUS. LOVE that guy. Talent like motherfucker.

TBF, although it had some cr#p on it. At least they experimented a bit. Revelations is a little pathetic in their attempt to get back to the "legacy" sound. It kind of comes off like an 80's parody to me. Too much synth done in a very cheesy 80's way. Plus the lyrics are dreadful in spots.

Trial By Fire. Perry. Period.

Besides, I really don't think you can place a new album in it's proper place in Journey canon until a few years have passed and it's not the brand new shiny thing it is now. Then we will have some perspective, and we can determine how much we are still listening to Revelation as opposed to all the other Journey albums. That's why I laugh a little bit every time I see a review which says that Revelation is "Journey's best album since XXXX". It's brand new - of course people are going to be excited and many Journey fans want to love it because they want that old Journey magic back again. If you're still excited about it in 2, 5, 7 years, great. I like several of the songs on Revelation, but I can't say where it will be in my rotation a couple of years down the road, and that's fine. At the moment, the Journey albums that see the most spins for me are Frontiers, Arrival, and Escape, in that order, with selected tracks from Generations thrown in there once in a while.

Does this make any sense??

What it is is this.
TBF, though having some outstanding parts, is the worst of the cannonical Journey albums, as I will refer to Infinity through Revelation.

Interestingly I view Trial By Fire much the same way that so many look @ ROR: more Perry solo ablum than Journey album.

Revelation is arguably the best, certainly the best since Raised On Radio.

Top 3 right now are Revelation followed by Raised On Radio, followed by Generations.

Red13JoePa wrote:What it is is this.
TBF, though having some outstanding parts, is the worst of the cannonical Journey albums, as I will refer to Infinity through Revelation.

Revelation is arguably the best, certainly the best since Raised On Radio.

R13, are you saying that arguably Revelation is the best Journey CD? Not sure if I got what you were saying totally...Meaning the best since they started making commercial albums?

Anyway, while I like Revelation, I have to say TBF is by far a more listenable CD to me....If it were not Journey, I don't believe I would pick up Revelation, just because there isn't anything there that would have really pulled me in. I'll always be a fan of Perry's voice, and I think there are some great ballads on TBF as well as MOL that are timeless...

Red13JoePa wrote:What it is is this.
TBF, though having some outstanding parts, is the worst of the cannonical Journey albums, as I will refer to Infinity through Revelation.

Interestingly I view Trial By Fire much the same way that so many look @ ROR: more Perry solo ablum than Journey album.

Revelation is arguably the best, certainly the best since Raised On Radio.

Top 3 right now are Revelation followed by Raised On Radio, followed by Generations.

TBF was far from a Perry solo album. Although I can see how people would think it was due to the ballad heavy aspect, but each band member definitely had their contribution and moments to shine on TBF. Not hearing the depth on most of Revelation that I hoped I would.

Red13JoePa wrote:TBF, though having some outstanding parts, is the worst of the cannonical Journey albums, as I will refer to Infinity through Revelation.

You can't possibly be serious.

conversationpc wrote:No contest..."Revelation"

I agree. No contest.. Trial by Fire.

Barb wrote:

conversationpc wrote:No contest..."Revelation"

I agree. No contest.. Trial by Fire.

You suck!

Jeremey wrote:

Red13JoePa wrote:What it is is this.
TBF, though having some outstanding parts, is the worst of the cannonical Journey albums, as I will refer to Infinity through Revelation.

Revelation is arguably the best, certainly the best since Raised On Radio.

R13, are you saying that arguably Revelation is the best Journey CD? Not sure if I got what you were saying totally...Meaning the best since they started making commercial albums?

Anyway, while I like Revelation, I have to say TBF is by far a more listenable CD to me....If it were not Journey, I don't believe I would pick up Revelation, just because there isn't anything there that would have really pulled me in. I'll always be a fan of Perry's voice, and I think there are some great ballads on TBF as well as MOL that are timeless...

I think I am saying that.
Granted right now I am only about 10-12 full spins in on all 22 tracks.
But I like it the best right now. Generations was for a while, that's been since replaced again by ROR and the new one but I think the entire band is playing better, tighter, and has made their most consistently good set of songs. I think as with Augeri and perry, voices decline but that's juxtaposed with each successive album of better, more complex, more creative, superior, tighter writing and musicianship. I like the way MOST of our favorite bands play and create together in the present time than their "primes."

I'm not ruling out that it could be the novelty/newness aspect that now has me all out of kilter. I wondered the same about Generations 3 years ago, but now 3 years out I love that record damn near just as much.

Mmmmmm.... since I actually enjoy the disc in its entirety and am not tempted to gnash by brains out to NIN after the first 4 tracks, Revelation.

However, those 4 tracks on TBF that I can listen to, knock me on my ass.

...But after that, brain gnashing a la Trent Reznor.

I'd prefer Perry any day, but I only cared for 4 songs on TBF, the others are not my kind of music. Every song on Revelation with the exception of the instrumental is, however, my type of music. Revelation, for me, is a much stronger record.

Barb wrote:

conversationpc wrote:No contest..."Revelation"

I agree. No contest.. Trial by Fire.

Deadly so, I'm afraid.

I'm a pathological Jrny listener who never goes more that 3 months without listening to the Infinity-Generations albums, NEVER look forward to TBF