Neal talks new music....

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Neal talks new music....

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Thu Jun 16, 2016 9:49 am

Nothing really new here. But any news is worth mentioning...

The group has released four albums since Mr. Perry’s departure — “Arrival” (2001),” “Generations” (2005), “Revelation” (2008) and “Eclipse” (2008). Some band members have balked at doing any further writing and recording because the plummeting sales of albums in the internet age make it hard to justify the expense and effort that goes into making a new album. But Mr. Schon hopes to reverse that thinking and said he has a number of song ideas in hand and plans to start writing soon with Mr. Pineda. He thinks the success of “Santana IV,” his recent reunion album with the classic early lineup of that band, will convince his bandmates that a new Journey album can be viable.

http://mp.floridaweekly.com/news/2016-06-09/Arts_(and)_Entertainment_News/Enjoying_the_Journey.html#

Neal has previously mentioned collaborating with Arnel on new Journey material on his FB. Would be great if something came of it. This way, Cain can go off and write his ballads praising the invisible spaghetti monster. Maybe even get sponsored by Popoff brand miracle water when he finally goes solo.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby Art Vandelay » Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:27 pm

It's always good to hear about possible new music, but the excitement over the new Santana album was a different beast. It was true nostalgia for Santana fans to see and hear the classic line-up after 40+ years. There have been numerous incarnations of Santana since, but none have captured that old school sound. It was a real trip for long-time fans to enjoy.

Journey, having put out a handful of albums over the years, plus being on tour for almost 18 years straight...the level of excitement for new music is just not gonna be there as it was for the Santana album. But at least it's keeping a creative fire lit under Schon's ass.

As this board has often shown, everyone has their own taste and preference in what they want and expect. Whatever the coming years brings for Journey fans....let's enjoy it!
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby perryfan61 » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:33 am

"Cain can go off and write his ballads praising the invisible spaghetti monster. Maybe even get sponsored by Popoff brand miracle water when he finally goes solo."........


I think Jon is doing what he wants to do, what inspires him. While it may not be everyone's cup of tea, we should all be so lucky to find something that makes us happy and fulfilled, especially at this stage of his life.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:44 am

perryfan61 wrote:I think Jon is doing what he wants to do, what inspires him. While it may not be everyone's cup of tea, we should all be so lucky to find something that makes us happy and fulfilled, especially at this stage of his life.


Just a year ago Cain was saying that he was trying to break into the Nashville scene but was having no real luck. Then he mentioned doing a solo rock album. Now he is reinventing himself as a religious artist. Eclipse was a testament to New Age, secular, spiritual hooey. Now he is all about Jesus. I think Cain is pretty much just a self-seeking opportunist. When it comes to Journey music, he talks low sales numbers. When it comes to religious music, he acts as if he is motivated by some higher calling (and not profits). When his religious album sells less than an album of duets by "William Hung & Sanjayana", I fully expect him to move onto some other more profitable terrain. I can hear it now..."Y'know, coming from Chicago, the birthplace of Kanye & Common, hip hop has always run deep in my blood and I felt now is the time to introduce the world to a new side of Jonathan Cain that blah blah blah."
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby perryfan61 » Fri Jun 17, 2016 11:28 am

Well, that's one way of looking at it! He's using this break in the tour to work on his album, so I guess we will have to see how successful it will be. I don't know what the market is for spiritual music, but I doubt that it will sell as much as a new Journey album.

Still, if he's enjoying the creative process, it can't be all bad.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby Archetype » Sat Jun 18, 2016 8:20 am

I'd like to see them do another Red 13 type of release. Maybe 4-5 really strong songs. No need to do a full album when it seems like the whole band isn't totally on board. Enough to keep things interesting. Bring in some outside writers if need be.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby JourneyHard » Sat Jun 18, 2016 8:57 am

I would like to hear Gregg Rolie back with Journey for their next album. Plus, Steve Smith on drums. That would might make the next Journey album a moderate hit.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:05 am

Archetype wrote:I'd like to see them do another Red 13 type of release. Maybe 4-5 really strong songs. No need to do a full album when it seems like the whole band isn't totally on board. Enough to keep things interesting. Bring in some outside writers if need be.


Eclipse was pretty much a full-length version of Red 13.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:06 am

JourneyHard wrote:I would like to hear Gregg Rolie back with Journey for their next album. Plus, Steve Smith on drums. That would might make the next Journey album a moderate hit.


The inclusion of Smith or Rolie would make no difference sales-wise imo, but it would be nice to hear.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby Archetype » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:15 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Archetype wrote:I'd like to see them do another Red 13 type of release. Maybe 4-5 really strong songs. No need to do a full album when it seems like the whole band isn't totally on board. Enough to keep things interesting. Bring in some outside writers if need be.


Eclipse was pretty much a full-length version of Red 13.


True. I worded that a little weird. What I meant to say is for them to do an EP. Wasn't referring to what style it should be.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby slucero » Sat Jun 18, 2016 1:58 pm

The band isn't signed to a label..

Cain owns a state of the art recording studio.... so there's no reason they can't go into Cains studio and record a few songs for release over the net...

other than they don't want to....

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.


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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby Journey/Survivor » Sun Jun 19, 2016 4:43 am

slucero wrote:The band isn't signed to a label..

Cain owns a state of the art recording studio.... so there's no reason they can't go into Cains studio and record a few songs for release over the net...

other than Cain doesn't want to....


FIFY.


I've been thinking that myself. That with Cain having a studio, they could easily record a new album without it being too expensive. I know that they didn't do the greatest job producing Red 13 themselves. But if they're too cheap to pay a producer to work with them on a new album, they could produce it themselves.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby scarab » Sun Jun 19, 2016 11:06 pm

At the very least they could do a song for a soundtrack. Something like "Only the Young" that is played a few times in the movie.
They sure missed the boat with Remember Me when it was cut from the final scene of Armageddon. It is a great song.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby JourneyHard » Mon Jun 20, 2016 7:58 am

I don't know who owns the rights to the old unreleased Journey songs. I am sure there must be some on a shelf somewhere. Maybe Neal needs to go to Sony or whomever owns the rights, and then make a new album with Gregg Rolie, Steve Smith and so on, And include some old Steve Perry songs on it, too.

I know I am just daydreaming here, and hoping for this. Steve Perry probably has a deal with Sony or Neal/Jon not to do this very thing. But I can dream. :D
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:21 am

scarab wrote:At the very least they could do a song for a soundtrack. Something like "Only the Young" that is played a few times in the movie.


The only reason they got on Armaggedon was because of Sony. Just because the band writes a great tune, doesn't mean movie studios start banging down their door. I also recall at one point Schon & Hagar were trying to get a PlanetUs tune on the Spiderman soundtrack.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:22 am

Journey/Survivor wrote: I know that they didn't do the greatest job producing Red 13 themselves. But if they're too cheap to pay a producer to work with them on a new album, they could produce it themselves.


Keep in mind, only two tracks on Red 13 were produced by Cain/Schon. The other two were Arrival leftovers. The cost had to be minimal.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby Monker » Mon Jun 20, 2016 1:13 pm

But Mr. Schon hopes to reverse that thinking and said he has a number of song ideas in hand and plans to start writing soon with Mr. Pineda. He thinks the success of “Santana IV,” his recent reunion album with the classic early lineup of that band, will convince his bandmates that a new Journey album can be viable.


LOL...you blew it dude.

You spent years with Augeri saying you wanted a "rockier" version of Journey and distancing the band from the Perry years. Then more of the same talk with JSS. Even though there was no album with JSS, that was what the talk was about and had a lot of people excited to hear it.

Then Arnel comes along. Suddenly, you alienate all of these fans who stuck by the band from Arrival through the JSS tour by releasing a throwback album to the Perry years. Yeah, you had some success. But, it was at the expense of alienated the most hardened of fans. THE BAND was promoting the "legacy sound". THE BAND was embracing the Perry years, and ignoring everything that came after.

Then you release Eclipse which alienated the fanbase you JUST BUILT with Revelation. I mean, really, after two or three years of propaganda stating how the band had embraced the "legacy sound", there is no reason for those Revelation fans to understand why you would release Eclipse. Eclipse was not about the legacy sound...it was about moving on from it - which is what you have wanted to do since 1987.

Now you want to release another album? Exactly what fans do you think you have left that will make this a top 10 album like Santana's? People don't go to Journey shows to hear Arrival, Revelation, or Eclipse. They go to hear the Greatest Hits CD. THAT is your audience now. Your own short sighted actions have put Journey in that position. You own it.

Jonathan is right. It won't sell....no matter what music is on it. If you to record another Journey album, fine...but don't even dare to hope that will even hit the hot 100 or have a single on rock radio.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby Monker » Mon Jun 20, 2016 1:18 pm

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Archetype wrote:I'd like to see them do another Red 13 type of release. Maybe 4-5 really strong songs. No need to do a full album when it seems like the whole band isn't totally on board. Enough to keep things interesting. Bring in some outside writers if need be.


Eclipse was pretty much a full-length version of Red 13.


They sound almost, but not quite, completely unlike each other.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Mon Jun 20, 2016 1:31 pm

Monker wrote:They sound almost, but not quite, completely unlike each other.


False.
Like most songs on Eclipse, State of Grace and The Time are guitar-driven rockers with minimal Cain keyboard playing.
State of Grace and The Time can also be considered forerunners to Eclipse because they lack BIG instantly-catchy choruses.
Like most songs on Eclipse, SOG and The Time are not radio friendly in length, with both songs exceeding 6 minutes.
Like Eclipse, there are no wedding ballads on Red 13. The one ballad, Walking Away from the Edge, is about addiction.
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby The_Noble_Cause » Mon Jun 20, 2016 1:59 pm

Monker wrote:Then Arnel comes along. Suddenly, you alienate all of these fans who stuck by the band from Arrival through the JSS tour by releasing a throwback album to the Perry years. Yeah, you had some success. But, it was at the expense of alienated the most hardened of fans.

By any measure, with Arnel the fanbase has expanded. If so many die-hards were alienated, why are you still posting here? I've been here BEFORE you and I wasn't alienated. If Deano was still alive (RIP) he would also be checking in, I'm sure. So please, tell me, just who exactly are these fans that have abandoned the good ship S.S. Schon? Do concert attendance figures back this claim up?

Monker wrote:Then you release Eclipse which alienated the fanbase you JUST BUILT with Revelation. I mean, really, after two or three years of propaganda stating how the band had embraced the "legacy sound", there is no reason for those Revelation fans to understand why you would release Eclipse. Eclipse was not about the legacy sound...it was about moving on from it - which is what you have wanted to do since 1987.


The legacy comments were primarily made about Arnel and not future records.
In 2008, Cain said Arnel "has got the legacy sound and then some."
In 2008, Schon said "I think what we were looking for was the legacy sound. It's a tenor voice, you know, with soul and emotion and able to sing a ballad."
The "legacy sound" doesn't mean the band has to keep ripping-off "Don't Stop Believing" and "Open Arms."

Monker wrote:Now you want to release another album? Exactly what fans do you think you have left that will make this a top 10 album like Santana's? People don't go to Journey shows to hear Arrival, Revelation, or Eclipse. They go to hear the Greatest Hits CD. THAT is your audience now. Your own short sighted actions have put Journey in that position. You own it.


Revelation debuted at #5 and Eclipse debuted at #13. In comparison, Red 13 didn't chart at all and Generations debuted at #170. This forum had doomsayers like you during the Augeri years. When the band first left Sony, that was held up as proof that the band was done. Every little thing was spun as evidence that the band was in a state of decline. None of it was true - then or now. Back then, the constant negativity was espoused by Perry cultists. Now you have become as insensate to facts and reason as they have. Better check yourself.

Monker wrote:Jonathan is right. It won't sell....no matter what music is on it.


Jonathan is wrong. He was done with recording full Journey albums after Arrival was leaked. His judgement is questionable.

Monker wrote:If you to record another Journey album, fine...but don't even dare to hope that will even hit the hot 100 or have a single on rock radio.


The past two Journey albums have debuted in the Billboard Top 20. If the right forces align (as they did with Revelation), I could easily see the band having another moderate hit. People forget, there was a massive media push for Revelation. Azoff really worked his magic. In addition to TV coverage on Oprah & CBS Sunday Morning, Revelation even got a review in the NYTimes. Anybody remember Arrival getting that sort of publicity? Back then, I remember Entertainment Weekly giving Arrival a D rating with a quick sentence instructing readers to "DO Stop Believing." The NYTimes link is below, if anyone is interested. The point is, the publicity campaign for Revelation is not likely to be repeated.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/02/arts/ ... .html?_r=0
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Re: Neal talks new music....

Postby scarab » Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:37 am

The rags to riches story and the reemergence of DSB is long over. Eclipse had great tunes but only the die hards (probably less than 5% who go to their concerts) bought the CD.
If there is any chance of selling like Revelation (which in large part was all the publicity and the reboots) they have to mix things up, maybe get Rolie back, have a few duets with classic artists have an opening act that isn't a 70s rock band.
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