OFFICIAL 2010-2011 NFL season & predictions thread:

[WalkInMyShoes]

I've seen it year after year with the Packers - they get too confident from winning and then panic when get get behind in a game, doing stupid stuff. I think the Bears game was a wake-up call. It proved that they are not invincible and they'd better have their shit together against the Steelers. I think they can do it, but I think Pittsburgh is going to be tougher than Chicago.

[Saint John]

Enter Aaron Rodgers, a seemingly offensive playoff machine.

Really? He had 0 TD passes and 2 INT's against the Bears and a whopping 1yd TD run. To add to that, once they started knocking him around just a little bit, he ended the game with 2 and a half quarters with 0 points. Lastly, he wasn't even able to make the simplest of throws on 3rd and short and, when pressured, kept throwing the ball at the feet of his receivers. Pittsburgh's D is even more physical than the Bears and I see them roughing him up and him going into a shell ... just like he did against the Bears.

Green Bay is better in only 2 areas ... WR and secondary. Pittsburgh is better in every other aspect and have a better, more seasoned coaching staff. And that's why they're gonna win the game.

I hate to admit it, but Benjamin Todd is one clutch raping, err, QB machine, but overall talent, he isn't as good as Rodgers, Dan. You correctly cited Aaron's Chicago game stats, but did you see his stud like stats vs games AT Philly and AT the ATL?

I agree with hasselback(the guiy on ESPN)...The QB who makes the big play at the end of the game is going to win this. That said, I wouldn't put it past that ugly fuck BTR to escape a 4 man Packer clutch and throw a wobbly 4 yarder for a first down and the game...he always does it. BTR wins this game and he is a Hall of Famer.\\Yes, I know his initials are Born to Run, and I hate that, but the guy is clutch.

Agreed on all counts. The thing that I think really separates Pittsburgh from Green bay is Pittsburgh's ability to have long drives with relatively safe passes and the run. Minimal risk and big time reward (keeping Rodgers off the field). Couple the fact that Green Bay's ground game blows and Pittsburgh is the league's best team against the run, and you have a situation where Pittsburgh can scheme up a storm defensively ... and LeBeau's the best at doing it. Green Bay had a decisive Time Of Possession advantage against the Bears, yet they were still winded in the 4th quarter and had trouble getting to Hanie. How does Green Bay keep TOP from getting away from them? Pittsburgh should really consider running the ball to the outside, throwing a lot of screen passes (which they do very well) and making the GB defense work both sides of the entire field all game. That'll put them in excellent shape in the 4th quarter, and with a clutch QB like Big Ben, that sets your team up for victory. The guy is just aces in the late stages of big games. I expect a winded Packers team to lose this game in the second and fourth quarters.

PS I would bet my nut hairs that Polamalu has been somewhat seriously injured these last 2 weeks and has kept it under wraps. He just hasn't been the same. These 2 weeks might be just what it takes to get him back to 100% and if that's the case, the Packers have no shot.

[YoungJRNY]

Enter Aaron Rodgers, a seemingly offensive playoff machine.

Really? He had 0 TD passes and 2 INT's against the Bears and a whopping 1yd TD run. To add to that, once they started knocking him around just a little bit, he ended the game with 2 and a half quarters with 0 points. Lastly, he wasn't even able to make the simplest of throws on 3rd and short and, when pressured, kept throwing the ball at the feet of his receivers. Pittsburgh's D is even more physical than the Bears and I see them roughing him up and him going into a shell ... just like he did against the Bears.

Green Bay is better in only 2 areas ... WR and secondary. Pittsburgh is better in every other aspect and have a better, more seasoned coaching staff. And that's why they're gonna win the game.

I hate to admit it, but Benjamin Todd is one clutch raping, err, QB machine, but overall talent, he isn't as good as Rodgers, Dan. You correctly cited Aaron's Chicago game stats, but did you see his stud like stats vs games AT Philly and AT the ATL?

I agree with hasselback(the guiy on ESPN)...The QB who makes the big play at the end of the game is going to win this. That said, I wouldn't put it past that ugly fuck BTR to escape a 4 man Packer clutch and throw a wobbly 4 yarder for a first down and the game...he always does it. BTR wins this game and he is a Hall of Famer.\\Yes, I know his initials are Born to Run, and I hate that, but the guy is clutch.

Rodgers is certainly more athletic than Ben and can get out of the pocket quicker and faster, but he is very easy to bring down once he is wrapped up, even with one man on him. Ben is a freight train and has pretty nifty foot-work for a big dude, he outweighs Rodgers by an easy 20 pounds (Rodgers: 225; Roethlisberger: 245) but can still get out of trouble and deliver downfield with ease. Rodgers and Ben play similiar style but Green Bay's offense simply is more pass-heavy, even though Pittsburgh has turned into a pass first, run second team. Ben and Rodgers are pretty even when it comes to style, but Ben certainly is tougher in build, which should bode well against a team that's going to come after him.

[conversationpc]

Ben is a freight train and has pretty nifty foot-work for a big dude, he outweighs Rodgers by an easy 25 pounds (Rodgers: 225; Roethlisberger: 245)

That would be 20 pounds.

[YoungJRNY]

Ben is a freight train and has pretty nifty foot-work for a big dude, he outweighs Rodgers by an easy 25 pounds (Rodgers: 225; Roethlisberger: 245)

That would be 20 pounds.

Yes, yes it would be, haha. Too many 5's but we know they don't put the players exact weight, Ben is ATLEAST 250.

[YoungJRNY]

Ben Highlights: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjkPEy2W7L0

Rodgers Highlights: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Umd8wYua2e4


Damn similiar. These quarterbacks have to be same damn frustrating to play against.

[Enigma869]

Yes, yes it would be, haha. Too many 5's but we know they don't put the players exact weight, Ben is ATLEAST 250.

I agree. No way that huge fucker is 245! Maybe that was his weight in high school. Ben will easily be over 3 bills when he stops playing football. He simply has that build. As for Dean's synopsis, I couldn't agree more. We don't agree on that douche Favre, but Ben has shown himself to be stout in the playoffs. The guy will never have a season in his career where he throws for 5000 yards, 35 TD's and 2 picks, but it doesn't matter. He's does a lot of things well on the football field and there aren't a lot of guys I would take ahead of him, in the clutch. That said, Rodgers is definitely the more talented guy out of the two of these guys, in spite of Dan's assertion to the contrary. I certainly agree that Rodgers has a whole lot to prove that Ben has already proven, but let's not forget that Rodgers has never gotten to this game before, so it's his first chance to really prove anything. We'll see how he performs.

[S2M]

Let's cut through the rhetoric. The best thing I can say about Ben is he rarely puts his team in a bad position. Everyone makes it sound like he's this QB whiz kid. He's not. He's serviceable. Above average, but not special. Pittsburgh is defense. Always has been. Bradshaw has 4 titles. That should tell you something right there. Bradshaw is basically Trent Dilfer X4. Please get off of Ben's tip....

[StevePerryHair]

Let's cut through the rhetoric. The best thing I can say about Ben is he rarely puts his team in a bad position. Everyone makes it sound like he's this QB whiz kid. He's not. He's serviceable. Above average, but not special. Pittsburgh is defense. Always has been. Bradshaw has 4 titles. That should tell you something right there. Bradshaw is basically Trent Dilfer X4. Please get off of Ben's tip....

Aren't you in the WRONG thread? If you root for the Steelers in the SB, I may let it slide...

[conversationpc]

Let's cut through the rhetoric. The best thing I can say about Ben is he rarely puts his team in a bad position. Everyone makes it sound like he's this QB whiz kid. He's not. He's serviceable. Above average, but not special. Pittsburgh is defense. Always has been. Bradshaw has 4 titles. That should tell you something right there. Bradshaw is basically Trent Dilfer X4. Please get off of Ben's tip....

Bradshaw is perhaps the most overrated QB in NFL history. Fortunately for him, he had good receivers and running backs and an excellent defense. That being said, Roethlisberger is a lot better than Bradshaw.

[conversationpc]

The guy will never have a season in his career where he throws for 5000 yards, 35 TD's and 2 picks, but it doesn't matter.

Dude threw for 32 TDs in barely over 400 attempts in 2007, so I don't think 35 is out of the question. He'll probably never hit 5000 but, then again, there are 2 QBs in the history of the NFL who have. It still amazes me that Marino did that in his first full season at the position.

[S2M]

Let's cut through the rhetoric. The best thing I can say about Ben is he rarely puts his team in a bad position. Everyone makes it sound like he's this QB whiz kid. He's not. He's serviceable. Above average, but not special. Pittsburgh is defense. Always has been. Bradshaw has 4 titles. That should tell you something right there. Bradshaw is basically Trent Dilfer X4. Please get off of Ben's tip....

Bradshaw is perhaps the most overrated QB in NFL history. Fortunately for him, he had good receivers and running backs and an excellent defense. That being said, Roethlisberger is a lot better than Bradshaw.

I disagree. Pitt is still a defensive team. All Ben is required to do is not fuck up. He doesn't need to rack up 40 points to offset a porous defense. He makes good decisions usually. He is not the second coming. He isn't the defense reader Rodgers, Manning, and Brady are. He has average arm strength. He IS tough to bring down, and he is more mobile than both Manning and Brady - that's a plus. Hides behind a stout defense.

[Enigma869]

I disagree. Pitt is still a defensive team. All Ben is required to do is not fuck up. He doesn't need to rack up 40 points to offset a porous defense. He makes good decisions usually. He is not the second coming. He isn't the defense reader Rodgers, Manning, and Brady are. He has average arm strength. He IS tough to bring down, and he is more mobile than both Manning and Brady - that's a plus. Hides behind a stout defense.

While I don't disagree with you that defense is the reason Pittsburgh wins, it's ridiculous to say that Ben hides behind his defense. Listen, I never claimed he was Peyton Manning and I don't think he would even claim that. That said, it's not like the guy throws 10 TD passes a season. Pittsburgh has already shown they can win with or without Ben, so I'm not sure even Steeler fans would disagree with your point that their defense is far more important than who is taking the snaps. If the Steelers win this game, The Pussy Hunter instantly becomes a first ballot HOF.

By the way, I couldn't agree with your point on Bradshaw more. He is easily one of the least talented QB to ever be inducted into the HOF. The other thing that can't be ignored (unless your from Pittsburgh) is that those teams who won all those titles in the 70's were juiced up seven ways til' Tuesday. Many believed their own team doctor was giving the players of that era steroids.

[Enigma869]

and he is more mobile than both Manning and Brady

So are most senior citizens

[YoungJRNY]

Let's cut through the rhetoric. The best thing I can say about Ben is he rarely puts his team in a bad position. Everyone makes it sound like he's this QB whiz kid. He's not. He's serviceable. Above average, but not special. Pittsburgh is defense. Always has been. Bradshaw has 4 titles. That should tell you something right there. Bradshaw is basically Trent Dilfer X4. Please get off of Ben's tip....

Bradshaw is perhaps the most overrated QB in NFL history. Fortunately for him, he had good receivers and running backs and an excellent defense. That being said, Roethlisberger is a lot better than Bradshaw.

I disagree. Pitt is still a defensive team. All Ben is required to do is not fuck up. He doesn't need to rack up 40 points to offset a porous defense. He makes good decisions usually. He is not the second coming. He isn't the defense reader Rodgers, Manning, and Brady are. He has average arm strength. He IS tough to bring down, and he is more mobile than both Manning and Brady - that's a plus. Hides behind a stout defense.

This isn't 2005 anymore, haha. Watch more closely. Since his first two seasons, Roethlisberger has been going down field more often than ANYONE and has an incredible yards per- attempt when he slings it downfield, one of the best ever in NFL history. Of course the Steelers are built on defense and always have been a defensive team built around a blue-collar city, but you can't sit there and never acknowledge Ben's personal stats and accomplishment whether or not how the defense played. The Steelers has had a very, very POOR offensive line for about 4 years now and Ben has done a phenomenal job with the numbers he's put up with being under duress for most of his career and he goes downfield often and beats teams with his arm, which his stats certainly show in key & clutch situations.

The truth is Roethlisberger is one of the most effective passers in the history of the game ... if you know which stats to study. The single most important stat in football, and maybe in all of North American sports, is passing yards per attempt. Roethlisberger boasts an incredible 8.01 YPA in his career. How good is that? It's No. 5 on the all-time list. (No. 1 Otto Graham averaged 8.62 YPA during his six-year NFL career; no coincidence his Browns played for the NFL title all six years.)

Roethlisberger's misunderstood effectiveness, more than anything else, explains why the Steelers suddenly became contenders, and won two Super Bowls after 25 years of frustration, immediately after he took the reins of the Pittsburgh offense in 2004.

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/w ... z1CAMDWVeg

If I'm not mistaken, I believe this is Ben's 4th season leading in that category of passing yards per attempt. Brady has only led it once in his career.

From the beginning of this season, here was Ben's numbers compared to the great, Joe Montana (Ben has obviously surpassed most of these stats this season, going onto his 3rd Super Bowl.)

If you want to compare stats to a player in NFL history that is considered one of the best ever, the closest comparison is one Joe Montana.



Passing Yards

Montana: 19,166

Roethlisberger: 19,302



Passing Attempts

Montana 2548

Roethlisberger 2411



Yards Per Attempt

Montana: 7.5

Roethlisberger: 8.0



TD Passes

Montana: 132

Roethlisberger: 127



Touchdown Percentage Per Pass

Montana: 5.1 percent

Roethlisberger: 5.3 percent



Completions

Montana: 1614

Roethlisberger 1526



Percentage

Montana: 63.3 percent

Roethlisberger: 63.3 percent



Win Percentage

Montana: 65 percent

Roethlisberger: 69 percent



Interception Percentage

Montana: 2.6 percent

Roethlisberger: 3.3 percent



Yards Per Completion

Montana: 11.8

Roethlisberger: 12.6



Fourth Quarter Comebacks

Montana: 12

Roethlisberger: 17



Game-Winning Drives

Montana: 11

Roethlisberger: 21



Postseason Play

Montana: Nine postseason games

Roethlisberger: 10 postseason games



Montana: 7-2 record in postseason

Roethlisberger: 8-2 record in postseason (now 10-2)



Montana: 0-2 record on the road in postseason

Roethlisberger: 3-0 record on the road in postseason



Montana: 2464 passing yards in postseason

Roethlisberger: 2239 passing yards in postseason



Montana: 60 percent completion percentage in post season

Roethlisberger: 61.9 percent completion percentage in post season



Montana: 7.6 yards per attempt in postseason

Roethlisberger: 8.0 yards per attempt in posteason



Montana: 17-12 TD to INT ratio in postseason

Roethlisberger: 15-12 TD to INT ratio in postseason

Does ANYBODY think that Joe Montana does not deserve to be in the Hall of Fame?

[Saint John]

Does ANYBODY think that Joe Montana does not deserve to be in the Hall of Fame?

Those stats seem to be based upon their first "X" amount of seasons. Impressive, nonetheless.

[YoungJRNY]

Does ANYBODY think that Joe Montana does not deserve to be in the Hall of Fame?

Those stats seem to be based upon their first "X" amount of seasons. Impressive, nonetheless.

Montana 1980-85 seasons. Roethlisberger 2004-2009 seasons.

[Saint John]

Does ANYBODY think that Joe Montana does not deserve to be in the Hall of Fame?

Those stats seem to be based upon their first "X" amount of seasons. Impressive, nonetheless.

Montana 1980-85 seasons. Roethlisberger 2004-2009 seasons.

Makes perfect sense.

[S2M]

Game winning Drives, and 4th quarter Comebacks are the TWO most overrated stats in NFL history. So basically a team sucks for 3 quarters and suddenly gets a mulligan because they had a good 15 minutes? Nope.

and that other stat: Record in postseason - Ben has LESS yards in admittedly MORE games

[YoungJRNY]

Game winning Drives, and 4th quarter Comebacks are the TWO most overrated stats in NFL history. So basically a team sucks for 3 quarters and suddenly gets a mulligan because they had a good 15 minutes? Nope.

Is this overrated? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gs5IARvyZg

[Enigma869]

Game winning Drives, and 4th quarter Comebacks are the TWO most overrated stats in NFL history. So basically a team sucks for 3 quarters and suddenly gets a mulligan because they had a good 15 minutes? Nope.

Wow...this is fucking scary that I'm actually agreeing with you again. A game winning drive can be completely undone by a shitty defense (ask Tom Brady about this during the Super Bowl against the Giants). It really is a meaningless stat.

Record in postseason - Ben has LESS yards in admittedly MORE games

As far as I'm concerned, the only record that matters is that Ben's teams are 9-2 in the postseason. That is a phenomenal stat!

[S2M]

And just for the record, as of Aug of 2009 - Montana has 31 4th Q. Comebacks - Ben had 15. Brady has more 4th Q. comebacks than Ben. Brady had 20 by then.

[Enigma869]

Is this overrated? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gs5IARvyZg

If the Cardinals scored on the ensuing kickoff, it absolutely would have been overrated! That's precisely the point. Listen, kudos to Ben for driving his team down the field, but it's only a "game-winning drive" if the special teams and the defense does their job, so it really is an overrated stat. I've always believed that. As S2M said, 4th quarter comebacks means you're team is losing, so I'm not sure why anyone should be impressed by that. I'd much rather play with the lead and not be forced to comeback.

[Enigma869]

And just for the record, as of Aug of 2009 - Montana has 31 4th Q. Comebacks - Ben had 15. Brady has more 4th Q. comebacks than Ben. Brady had 20 by then.

It's still overrated

[YoungJRNY]

Game winning Drives, and 4th quarter Comebacks are the TWO most overrated stats in NFL history. So basically a team sucks for 3 quarters and suddenly gets a mulligan because they had a good 15 minutes? Nope.

Wow...this is fucking scary that I'm actually agreeing with you again. A game winning drive can be completely undone by a shitty defense (ask Tom Brady about this during the Super Bowl against the Giants). It really is a meaningless stat.

Record in postseason - Ben has LESS yards in admittedly MORE games

As far as I'm concerned, the only record that matters is that Ben's teams are 9-2 in the postseason. That is a phenomenal stat!

10-2.

[S2M]

Game winning Drives, and 4th quarter Comebacks are the TWO most overrated stats in NFL history. So basically a team sucks for 3 quarters and suddenly gets a mulligan because they had a good 15 minutes? Nope.

Wow...this is fucking scary that I'm actually agreeing with you again. A game winning drive can be completely undone by a shitty defense (ask Tom Brady about this during the Super Bowl against the Giants). It really is a meaningless stat.

Record in postseason - Ben has LESS yards in admittedly MORE games

As far as I'm concerned, the only record that matters is that Ben's teams are 9-2 in the postseason. That is a phenomenal stat!

I care about wins in football just a bit more than I do about wins as a stat in Baseball. A pitcher that gives up 9 runs, but gets bailed out by a offense that scored 10 - doesn't deserve a win, and isn't looked upon as a quality start in my book. Whereas a QB who puts up 7 points(rushing TD by RB), whose defense held the opposing team scoreless, should be looked at the same way...the QB gets the win but that win is deceiving.

[YoungJRNY]

Is this overrated? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gs5IARvyZg

If the Cardinals scored on the ensuing kickoff, it absolutely would have been overrated! That's precisely the point. Listen, kudos to Ben for driving his team down the field, but it's only a "game-winning drive" if the special teams and the defense does their job, so it really is an overrated stat. I've always believed that. As S2M said, 4th quarter comebacks means you're team is losing, so I'm not sure why anyone should be impressed by that. I'd much rather play with the lead and not be forced to comeback.

Agree but I'm not talking about the team, we are talking about quarterbacks getting it done when there is virtually no time for error. It's impressive because quarterbacks aren't defined by stats or numbers, they are defined by moments in big football games and preferably, 3rd down conversions. I don't think 4th QRT comebacks are overrated whatsoever, it takes a very impressive team effort, esp from the leader of the offense, the quarterback, to get it done in the final minutes no matter what happened before hand.

[Enigma869]

I care about wins in football just a bit more than I do about wins as a stat in Baseball. A pitcher that gives up 9 runs, but gets bailed out by a offense that scored 10 - doesn't deserve a win, and isn't looked upon as a quality start in my book. Whereas a QB who puts up 7 points(rushing TD by RB), whose defense held the opposing team scoreless, should be looked at the same way...the QB gets the win but that win is deceiving.

I couldn't agree with you more in baseball. I think the case can be made in football with some QB's (Terry Bradshaw and Troy Aikman come to mind). That said, do you seriously believe Peyton Manning's wins (and I'm obviously not talking about postseason, because his record in the postseason sucks) are overrated? I'm telling you that Colts team wouldn't win 5 games a season without Manning, so in his case, it's not overrated, AT ALL. There are a few teams that are stacked in other areas who win without a very good QB, but most of the successful teams in the NFL are successful because they have very good or great NFL QB's. It's always been a QB league and that's the case more now than it's ever been.

[Enigma869]

I don't think 4th QRT comebacks are overrated whatsoever, it takes a very impressive team effort, esp from the leader of the offense, the quarterback, to get it done in the final minutes no matter what happened before hand.

You're really missing the point. Listen, I'm not minimizing any QB's ability to drive his team down the field. That doesn't change the fact that if the defense or special teams pukes on their cleats on the very next possession, what the QB just did couldn't be less relevant to the game at hand, and it's no longer a "game winning drive". It's simply forgotten. Believe me when I tell you...there aren't 5 people outside of New England who know that Tom Brady threw what would have been the Super Bowl winning TD to Randy Moss against the Giants with less than 5 minutes left in the game, because the Patriots defense gave the game away on the very next possession!

[Saint John]

Game winning Drives, and 4th quarter Comebacks are the TWO most overrated stats in NFL history. So basically a team sucks for 3 quarters and suddenly gets a mulligan because they had a good 15 minutes? Nope.

Is this overrated? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gs5IARvyZg

That was fun to watch again!