President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[S2M]

Fuck all politicians....we need a Populist in office.

Amen to that Sean.

My issue is this - I really don't think Barry is doing a good job. He wasn't experienced as a politican, and he promised things he had NO idea if he could follow thru on. Mistake #1.

He is all skin color, and charisma....he has not ONE other thing going for him as a president. And the uneducated, minorities that wanted a man of color in office to 'make history' got what they wanted - now fucking deal with it.

[S2M]

Pop-u-list:

Definition: A politician who holds their finger to the wind to determine their political position instead of forming their own opinion.

BTW...That's pretty much what we have now in the two major parties, besides the paid-off, corrupt, and self-interested politicians who THINK they are doing the will of the people or who have fooled themselves into believing that's what they're doing.

Wrong, Dave....a Populist is a political philosophy urging social and political system change that favours "the people" over "the elites", or favours the common people over the rich and wealthy business owners.

Nice going inserting your skewed sense of definition....

What we have now is Statism, or the idea that a small group of professional politicians know better than the common folks, and should make decisions on their behalf....i.e. the Electoral College....

[conversationpc]

Pop-u-list:

Definition: A politician who holds their finger to the wind to determine their political position instead of forming their own opinion.

BTW...That's pretty much what we have now in the two major parties, besides the paid-off, corrupt, and self-interested politicians who THINK they are doing the will of the people or who have fooled themselves into believing that's what they're doing.

Wrong, Dave....a Populist is a political philosophy urging social and political system change that favours "the people" over "the elites", or favours the common people over the rich and wealthy business owners.

Nice going inserting your skewed sense of definition....

Nope...No one particular class of people should be favored over another regardless of societal status. That, for the most part, describes the framers of the Constitution. People who claim to be populists now (idiots and liars from both parties) only do so to claim they have the copyright on being "for the people". Give me a break.

[S2M]

an unknown populist movement was the question of term limits in the 90s. In every state where term limits were on the state ballot, the measure to limit incumbency passed. 67% in favor. In a not so big surprise, the U.S. Supreme Court shot down term limits in 1995.

One thing I love is referenda on ballots. Gives the common man a say in policy-making....and referenda are a HUGE populist interest....

[Pstburp]

Populism is the worst, leads to wrong decisions in economics and in the end just hurts the poor rather than protect them

[Seven Wishes2]

Right. The solution to America's problems will be found in a modern-day Huey Long.

I think not.

[S2M]

Right. The solution to America's problems will be found in a modern-day Huey Long.

I think not.

Hmmm...never gave H. Ross a serious thought, huh?

[Seven Wishes2]

Ummm...no.

The whole aliens-landed-in-my-backyard-before-my-daughter's-wedding thing threw me off.

You have an obsession with the notion that all one needs to become an effective President is to be a successful businessman.

[S2M]

Ummm...no.

The whole aliens-landed-in-my-backyard-before-my-daughter's-wedding thing threw me off.

You have an obsession with the notion that all one needs to become an effective President is to be a successful businessman.

I do. And the reason is that if you have the business sense to rise to Billionaire status - then you must be doing something right. And that ethic that made you your money will translate to other areas of being a president.

He started as a salesman for IBM, founded EDS in 1962. Sold it to GM in '84 for 2.4 BILLION. Founded Perot Systems in 1988, and sold it to Dell for 3.9 BILLION in 2009. SELF-MADE billionaire.

That's what we need in office. Someone who doesn't need money. Someone who will just focus on fixing this country's finances. And once that happens, everything will follow.

[Seven Wishes2]

Point the first:

The 10 greediest corporations in America:

1) Exxon Mobil made $19 billion in profits in 2009. Exxon not only paid no federal income taxes, it actually received a $156 million rebate from the IRS, according to its SEC filings.

2) Bank of America received a $1.9 billion tax refund from the IRS last year, although it made $4.4 billion in profits and received a bailout from the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Department of nearly $1 trillion.

3) Over the past five years, while General Electric made $26 billion in profits in the United States, it received a $4.1 billion refund from the IRS.

4) Chevron received a $19 million refund from the IRS last year after it made $10 billion in profits in 2009.

5) Boeing, which received a $30 billion contract from the Pentagon to build 179 airborne tankers, got a $124 million refund from the IRS last year.

6) Valero Energy, the 25th largest company in America with $68 billion in sales last year received a $157 million tax refund check from the IRS and, over the past three years, it received a $134 million tax break from the oil and gas manufacturing tax deduction.

7) Goldman Sachs in 2008 only paid 1.1 percent of its income in taxes even though it earned a profit of $2.3 billion and received an almost $800 billion from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury Department.

8.) Citigroup last year made more than $4 billion in profits but paid no federal income taxes. It received a $2.5 trillion bailout from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury.

9) ConocoPhillips, the fifth largest oil company in the United States, made $16 billion in profits from 2007 through 2009, but received $451 million in tax breaks through the oil and gas manufacturing deduction.

10) Over the past five years, Carnival Cruise Lines made more than $11 billion in profits, but its federal income tax rate during those years was just 1.1 percent.

[Seven Wishes2]

Point the second:

The CBO estimates the deficit would BE CUT IN HALF if the Bush-era tax cuts were allowed to expire.

Point the third:

Every single Senate Republican has endorsed a constitutional amendment that would’ve made Ronald Reagan’s fiscal policy unconstitutional. This is a guaranteed way to ensure a disaster when the next recession strikes.

Point the fourth:

How can anyone who makes less than $250,000 (with a brain) vote Republican?

[S2M]

Point the second:

The CBO estimates the deficit would BE CUT IN HALF if the Bush-era tax cuts were allowed to expire.

Point the third:

Every single Senate Republican has endorsed a constitutional amendment that would’ve made Ronald Reagan’s fiscal policy unconstitutional. This is a guaranteed way to ensure a disaster when the next recession strikes.

Point the fourth:

How can anyone who makes less than $250,000 (with a brain) vote Republican?

Easy question. People think that if THEY are doing well - the country is doing well. OR people only care about themselves. Hell, if a repub is in, and I'm doing well - I'll keep voting repub. Fuck the country....

That's the republican voter's mentality.

[Pstburp]

I think that is better a real manager and not someone who speaks beautiful,
Economic decisions sometimes are like unpleasant medicine, but they are necessary to heal a sick economy

[conversationpc]

Point the first:

The 10 greediest corporations in America:

1) Exxon Mobil made $19 billion in profits in 2009. Exxon not only paid no federal income taxes, it actually received a $156 million rebate from the IRS, according to its SEC filings.

2) Bank of America received a $1.9 billion tax refund from the IRS last year, although it made $4.4 billion in profits and received a bailout from the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Department of nearly $1 trillion.

3) Over the past five years, while General Electric made $26 billion in profits in the United States, it received a $4.1 billion refund from the IRS.

4) Chevron received a $19 million refund from the IRS last year after it made $10 billion in profits in 2009.

5) Boeing, which received a $30 billion contract from the Pentagon to build 179 airborne tankers, got a $124 million refund from the IRS last year.

6) Valero Energy, the 25th largest company in America with $68 billion in sales last year received a $157 million tax refund check from the IRS and, over the past three years, it received a $134 million tax break from the oil and gas manufacturing tax deduction.

7) Goldman Sachs in 2008 only paid 1.1 percent of its income in taxes even though it earned a profit of $2.3 billion and received an almost $800 billion from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury Department.

8.) Citigroup last year made more than $4 billion in profits but paid no federal income taxes. It received a $2.5 trillion bailout from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury.

9) ConocoPhillips, the fifth largest oil company in the United States, made $16 billion in profits from 2007 through 2009, but received $451 million in tax breaks through the oil and gas manufacturing deduction.

10) Over the past five years, Carnival Cruise Lines made more than $11 billion in profits, but its federal income tax rate during those years was just 1.1 percent.

Until we go to a flat tax or fair tax with no tax breaks or kickbacks, I applaud anyone for taking advantage of tax breaks so they can make more money for their employees and stockholders (i.e. people who invest in them through their 401k plans, including teachers, policemen, janitors...in other words, average ordinary Americans).

[conversationpc]

Point the second:

The CBO estimates the deficit would BE CUT IN HALF if the Bush-era tax cuts were allowed to expire.

Wasn't the Obama administration touting the CBO estimates that his healthcare plan wouldn't add much, if anything, to the deficit? The same CBO that now says it will add hundreds of billions to the deficit, not to mention that it'll start costing even more money as it's fully implemented? Yeah, that CBO.

Point the fourth:

How can anyone who makes less than $250,000 (with a brain) vote Republican?

Probably the same way the rest of the dumbmass myrmidons continue voting Democrat.

[RocknRoll]

Point the first:

The 10 greediest corporations in America:

1) Exxon Mobil made $19 billion in profits in 2009. Exxon not only paid no federal income taxes, it actually received a $156 million rebate from the IRS, according to its SEC filings.

2) Bank of America received a $1.9 billion tax refund from the IRS last year, although it made $4.4 billion in profits and received a bailout from the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Department of nearly $1 trillion.

3) Over the past five years, while General Electric made $26 billion in profits in the United States, it received a $4.1 billion refund from the IRS.

4) Chevron received a $19 million refund from the IRS last year after it made $10 billion in profits in 2009.

5) Boeing, which received a $30 billion contract from the Pentagon to build 179 airborne tankers, got a $124 million refund from the IRS last year.

6) Valero Energy, the 25th largest company in America with $68 billion in sales last year received a $157 million tax refund check from the IRS and, over the past three years, it received a $134 million tax break from the oil and gas manufacturing tax deduction.

7) Goldman Sachs in 2008 only paid 1.1 percent of its income in taxes even though it earned a profit of $2.3 billion and received an almost $800 billion from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury Department.

8.) Citigroup last year made more than $4 billion in profits but paid no federal income taxes. It received a $2.5 trillion bailout from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury.

9) ConocoPhillips, the fifth largest oil company in the United States, made $16 billion in profits from 2007 through 2009, but received $451 million in tax breaks through the oil and gas manufacturing deduction.

10) Over the past five years, Carnival Cruise Lines made more than $11 billion in profits, but its federal income tax rate during those years was just 1.1 percent.

Curious where this information comes from since I've seen a few different numbers. GE also lost $30 billion dollars from their subsidery GE Capital in previous years and losses can be carrried forward. I'm certainly no tax expert. Anyway here's some additional info, granted it's from Forbes but just curious regarding the conflicting information.

Mind you, not all global megacorps enjoy such low tax rates. Try to muster some pity for Big Oil. ExxonMobil ( XOM - news - people ) in its 2009 annual report to the SEC, recorded a larger income tax expense than any other U.S. company last year, some $17.6 billion, or 47% of pretax earnings. Exxon's peers Chevron ( CVX - news - people ) and ConocoPhillips ( COP - news - people ) likewise recorded similarly high effective tax rates. The oil companies are oddities among the multinationals because many of the oil-rich countries where they do business levy even higher taxes than the U.S.

[Seven Wishes2]

Unbelievable. Just like a Republican to come running to the defense of the mega-corporations.

Dave, those unparalleled profits are NOT going to the shareholders or employees. The average salary of the average middle and lower class worker last year was 2.1% - just above the rate of inflation. Meanwhile, the average CEO's salary rose 27%.

You guys are such toadies. There comes a time when you have to draw a line in the stand and stop toeing the company line. This shit is just plain wrong, and it should piss you off. Look back at my posts from the past 2 1/2 years, and you'll see I routinely rip the Democrats a new butt hole when they either (predictably) fall flat on their faces or (more often than not) make a bad GOP proposal even worse.

Just ONCE I'd like to see one of you yes-man disobey your marching orders and speak out against something when it really needed to be.

Two sheets to the wind, though, eh?

So let's keep pimping the mega-corporations and supporting a tax code that, if ended, could cut the deficit in half overnight. Whatever.

[RocknRoll]

Unbelievable. Just like a Republican to come running to the defense of the mega-corporations.

Dave, those unparalleled profits are NOT going to the shareholders or employees. The average salary of the average middle and lower class worker last year was 2.1% - just above the rate of inflation. Meanwhile, the average CEO's salary rose 27%.

You guys are such toadies. There comes a time when you have to draw a line in the stand and stop toeing the company line. This shit is just plain wrong, and it should piss you off. Look back at my posts from the past 2 1/2 years, and you'll see I routinely rip the Democrats a new butt hole when they either (predictably) fall flat on their faces or (more often than not) make a bad GOP proposal even worse.

Just ONCE I'd like to see one of you yes-man disobey your marching orders and speak out against something when it really needed to be.

Two sheets to the wind, though, eh?

So let's keep pimping the mega-corporations and supporting a tax code that, if ended, could cut the deficit in half overnight. Whatever.

Hey, I'm not defending CEO salaries and profits due go to the shareholders and employees 401Ks. Shareholders will pay taxes on the dividends and capital gains when they sell their stock. All I know is I would much rather work for a profitable company whose share price is rising due to increased dividends and stock buybacks. My future would be a lot more secure.

The reason I posted this was I had heard the rationale regarding GE's tax rate this year (losses from prior years by GE Capital), which will increase next year (hopefully, they will still be making money) and that integrated oil companies pay the highest tax rates out of all the other US companies. Which is why I was curious where your information came from?

[S2M]

Roll this around on your tongue for awhile: The CEO of DirecTV made over $32,000,000 ducats last year.

Meanwhile, in a related story, a father of 4 ate a rubber hose last night in his garage because he got laid off due to downsizing....

[Gin and Tonic Sky]

Pop-u-list:

Definition: A politician who holds their finger to the wind to determine their political position instead of forming their own opinion.

BTW...That's pretty much what we have now in the two major parties, besides the paid-off, corrupt, and self-interested politicians who THINK they are doing the will of the people or who have fooled themselves into believing that's what they're doing.

Wrong, Dave....a Populist is a political philosophy urging social and political system change that favours "the people" over "the elites", or favours the common people over the rich and wealthy business owners.
Nice going inserting your skewed sense of definition....
What we have now is Statism, or the idea that a small group of professional politicians know better than the common folks, and should make decisions on their behalf....i.e. the Electoral College....

Not quite

Statism – the idea that ends can best be achieved through the collective state, and that individual rights should be subordinated to the needs of the state. Under statism coercion is justified . That co-ercion can take a number of forms – e.g taxing the incomes of individuals and business , running a welfare state regulation, state ownership of the economy, jailing dissidents
Poplulism is not a political philosophy- it’s a mode of political engagement, or a tactic used by poltiticans , leaders, candidates to get what they want through a mass appeal to the common man. It has nothing to listening to the individual or respecting his rights. In fact populism is a tactic widely used by statists, and in the 20th / 21th century populism is really allied to statism.
Some recommending reading – Ayn Rand slams both statism and populism in Atlas Shrugged, Capitalism the Unkown Ideal As a matter of fact as someone who has expressed an admiration of that persons work , I’m a little surprised at your definitions

[S2M]

Here's another one:

Jon Bon Jovi owns 100s of acres in NJ, but only pays $100 in state property tax because he raises Bees. He gets a government tax break/credit/subsidy because he rasies bees.

Deano's butt buddy owns 100s of farming acreage, but only pays $200 a year in property tax because he employs an organic farmer to work that land...WOW, just wow. Meanwhile, his next door neighbors pay over $6000/yr in property taxes for just an Acre and a half.

Kudos to the US Goverment for micromanaging life with subsidies...

[Seven Wishes2]

...and the rich get richer...

Meanwhile, fuck the average guy. The guy the GOP couldn't give two shits about, even though middle-income white men are a majority of its constituency.

[conversationpc]

Unbelievable. Just like a Republican to come running to the defense of the mega-corporations.

Dave, those unparalleled profits are NOT going to the shareholders or employees. The average salary of the average middle and lower class worker last year was 2.1% - just above the rate of inflation. Meanwhile, the average CEO's salary rose 27%.

You guys are such toadies. There comes a time when you have to draw a line in the stand and stop toeing the company line. This shit is just plain wrong, and it should piss you off. Look back at my posts from the past 2 1/2 years, and you'll see I routinely rip the Democrats a new butt hole when they either (predictably) fall flat on their faces or (more often than not) make a bad GOP proposal even worse.

Just ONCE I'd like to see one of you yes-man disobey your marching orders and speak out against something when it really needed to be.

Two sheets to the wind, though, eh?

So let's keep pimping the mega-corporations and supporting a tax code that, if ended, could cut the deficit in half overnight. Whatever.

Marching orders...Laughable. Like the Democrat myrmidons like Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer, who got caught saying they were following marching orders and then proceeded to do exactly that after they had already found out the reporters were on line. You're a hypocrite. You don't routinely rip anything.

I've stated often my support for the Fair Tax, which would effectively end lobbying and special interests but that's apparently just those "two sheets to the wind", huh? That's real reform, not the candy-ass kind you're looking for.

[Seven Wishes2]

Dave, I've berated the Democrats more times in the past month than you, LiePaster, and DaskalasisFan have, collectively, since the inception of this board.

[conversationpc]

Dave, I've berated the Democrats more times in the past month than you, LiePaster, and DaskalasisFan have, collecatively, since the inception of this board.

You apparently haven't paid much attention then.

BTW...What's "collecatively".

[S2M]

...and the rich get richer...

Meanwhile, fuck the average guy. The guy the GOP couldn't give two shits about, even though middle-income white men are a majority of its constituency.

And that's why i often get mad at most conservatives. They claim all you have to do is work, and the american dream is yours. BS, there is no AD anymore. 95% of people who are rich either were born into it, got a lucky break, or knew someone. Every individual in this country is not on the same level playing field. All men are not created equal.

In a nation where GE owns NBC, supports Barry during the campaign - then once in office Barry bails out GE, and gives MAJOR tax exemptions/breaks. That is a nation that scares the fuck out of me....And its only going to get worse.

[Seven Wishes2]

Dave, I've berated the Democrats more times in the past month than you, LiePaster, and DaskalasisFan have, collecatively, since the inception of this board.

You apparently haven't paid much attention then.

BTW...What's "collecatively".

A heinous spelling error. Heh heh. That's what happens when you get yourself on of them there English de-grees from UConn.

[S2M]

Memo to Dave - although, I too, support a fair/flat tax - you and I will never see it in our lifetimes. The Tax system/code employs hundreds of thousands of people. They would be out of jobs, not to mention tax attorneys. Pipe dream, my friend.

I think I erred. I mean a consumption tax...flat/fair/consumption tax.....whatever!!!!

[RocknRoll]

...and the rich get richer...

Meanwhile, fuck the average guy. The guy the GOP couldn't give two shits about, even though middle-income white men are a majority of its constituency.

And that's why i often get mad at most conservatives. They claim all you have to do is work, and the american dream is yours. BS, there is no AD anymore. 95% of people who are rich either were born into it, got a lucky break, or knew someone. Every individual in this country is not on the same level playing field. All men are not created equal.

In a nation where GE owns NBC, supports Barry during the campaign - then once in office Barry bails out GE, and gives MAJOR tax exemptions/breaks. That is a nation that scares the fuck out of me....And its only going to get worse.

...ummm GE sold 51% of NBC to Comcast, but they did own it in 2008. I don't know how that's going to play out!

[Seven Wishes2]

So, is everyone else as excited as I am that Barry announced his candidacy for 2012?

Whatever. Again, if the unemployment rate gets below 7.5% before the election cycle, he'll win in a landslide. Otherwise, it's up in the air. Honestly, I don't care anymore. He's pretty much alienated everyone at this stage.