The FOUR Times Indicted Crook Thread

[verslibre]

But Drumpf's legacy will be that of a pathalogical liar. THAT is a fact! Unless you watch Fox. 6400+ lies.

Disagree. Trump was a well-known braggadocious NY hype man before being elected. Americans elected him knowing all this. None of this is surprising to anyone. We know he exaggerates and invents. He can't help himself. Drew, haven't you ever had a relative that was a little fucked in the head, but meant well, and you loved him/her anyway?

Not everyone.

[Andrew]

Drew, haven't you ever had a relative that was a little fucked in the head, but meant well, and you loved him/her anyway?

I do actually. And he lives in an assisted living facility, not running the free world. Drumpf should be moved forthwith!

[Monker]

But Drumpf's legacy will be that of a pathalogical liar. THAT is a fact! Unless you watch Fox. 6400+ lies.

Disagree. Trump was a well-known braggadocious NY hype man before being elected. Americans elected him knowing all this. None of this is surprising to anyone. We know he exaggerates and invents. He can't help himself. Drew, haven't you ever had a relative that was a little fucked in the head, but meant well, and you loved him/her anyway?

Not everyone.

The electoral college elected him. He did not win the popular vote.

One of Trump's main problems right now is that he never recognized this and tried to gain the support of the majority of the people. Instead, he seems to only cater to the support of his "base".

[The_Noble_Cause]

One of Trump's main problems right now is that he never recognized this and tried to gain the support of the majority of the people. Instead, he seems to only cater to the support of his "base".

Disagree. The views he is acting on, like the trade deficit, are fairly idiosyncratic and he has expressed them for decades. Real leaders influence opinion they don't cater to it. If he wanted to just appeal to a brain-dead base, he would fight to pass TPP.

[Monker]

Monker calling you out on the climate change thing politely.

You say humans are doing more damage in a few decades than millions of years of natural change. I say that is up for debate. Not completely disputing it, just not saying it is something we should tax ourselves to death over. (In the U.S. anyway)

No, that's not what I said. I said, "What is happening in the climate today is it is warming in a matter of DECADES what SHOULD take millions of years. " I did not say "a few" or "damage".

It is NOT up for debate. The planet has a natural carbon cycle. I'm not going to get into attempting to explain that. But, humans interrupt that natural cycle by burning carbon that has been stored for millions of years and creating CO2. When oil and coal are burned for human fuel, it releases CO2 that was STORED for millions of years.

Please give me your sample size of CO2 emissions within a couple of decades and the exact damage that has been done compared to the natural change of climate.

I telework (home office) several days a week and don't have to drive my car and when I go to the office I carpool. I do my part. Can you say the same?

The entire carbon footprint thing and taxing products that are too high, really solves NOTHING. I have never advocated for a carbon tax...all it does is makes things more expensive. I do believe that gas should have a huge tax to make electric cars more desired, and such. But, I'm just throwing something out there.

IMO, pushing for electric cars should be a priority...and I think it is a nation security issue to get us out of the middle east. Then finding alternative fuels to coal and oil for power plants is another priority. Those two things alone are over half of the CO2 the US produces. Then industry could have incentives to convert to electric...which is another 1/3. Once power plants are off fossil fuel, anything that uses the electric grid is carbon free.,

And, I'm not critiquing you for doing whatever you think is right. But, if you had an electric car, it wouldn't matter how much you drive it. All it would take for most people to get an electric car is for gas prices to jump to $5/gallon...then everybody would want one and it would change the way cars are made. Bring in demand, competition, the price will lower and you won't need to spend $50,000 for a Tesla.

As for me, I have a flex fuel car where I use E85 almost exclusively.

[Monker]

One of Trump's main problems right now is that he never recognized this and tried to gain the support of the majority of the people. Instead, he seems to only cater to the support of his "base".

Disagree. The views he is acting on, like the trade deficit, are fairly idiosyncratic and he has expressed them for decades. Real leaders influence opinion they don't cater to it. If he wanted to just appeal to a brain-dead base, he would fight to pass TPP.

Or, he would publicly fight to pass funding for a border wall that he couldn't fund even with a Republican House, and threaten a government shutdown if he doesn't get his way. That's not leadership. That is catering to a base of supporters over an issue that is DOA in a REPUBLICAN congress.

[Andrew]

Trump’s Legacy - https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/11/us/hate- ... index.html

[The_Noble_Cause]

Or, he would publicly fight to pass funding for a border wall that he couldn't fund even with a Republican House, and threaten a government shutdown if he doesn't get his way. That's not leadership. That is catering to a base of supporters over an issue that is DOA in a REPUBLICAN congress.

Should a politician give up on ideals if they are not practical? Personally, I wish Obama fought for the gov't option and card check, despite it not being realistic. Again - real leaders dream of things that never were and say 'Why not?'

[The_Noble_Cause]

Trump’s Legacy - https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/11/us/hate- ... index.html

The president with orthodox Jewish kids and grandkids is responsible for a spike in anti-semetic crimes? The only president to deliver on the promise of moving the US embassy to Jerusalem is responsible for anti-semetic crimes? C'mon Drew. This is nonsense. As for Jehovah's Witnesses....I have never heard Trump even mention them.

[Andrew]

Like it or not, Drumpf and his gang of old white males have made abuse of other races and religions ok. Good people on both sides was a good starting point.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Like it or not, Drumpf and his gang of old white males have made abuse of other races and religions ok. Good people on both sides was a good starting point.

I don't see this. Trump did better with minorities than any recent GOP candidate. I guess we'll have to see if they still support him in 2020. And when Trump DOES elevate a minority or a woman (ex. Heather Nauert as new ambassador to the UN) to a prominent position, he gets criticized for that as well. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

How do actions - like commuting sentences of non-violent drug offenders (see Alice Johnson) or redirecting federal dollars to high poverty, urban areas (NYT link below) - stoke the flames of racial animosity and hatred? Quite the opposite.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/12/us/p ... x-cut.html

[steveo777]

Like it or not, Drumpf and his gang of old white males have made abuse of other races and religions ok. Good people on both sides was a good starting point.

I don't see this. Trump did better with minorities than any recent GOP candidate. I guess we'll have to see if they still support him in 2020. And when Trump DOES elevate a minority or a woman (ex. Heather Nauert as new ambassador to the UN) to a prominent position, he gets criticized for that as well. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

How do actions - like commuting sentences of non-violent drug offenders (see Alice Johnson) or redirecting federal dollars to high poverty, urban areas (NYT link below) - stoke the flames of racial animosity and hatred? Quite the opposite.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/12/us/p ... x-cut.html

Because the narrative has been marketed by the agenda driven MSM, to the faithful followers who don't know any better. Trump was a pop culture icon among the black community. They sang about wanting to be like him, in rap songs. He was friends with many black leaders. But, once he ran for president the marketing of the narrative began and has not let up.

[ohsherrie]

I love you TNC, please keep fighting the good fight for common sense and reality. For some reason some people can't see what is really happening to and in this country because they're too busy watching or reading their favorite left wing media.

[Andrew]

The above 3 posts are what does my head in. It is the bold assumption that lefties are brainwashed by MSM or left-wing media.

None of you even once entertain the idea that a lefty is intelligent enough to know what is a hard line media outlet and who gives balanced and transparent reporting.

I for one read all manner of press/online/whatever. I'm aware of the RWNJ media and the loony-lefty media.

And why does an opposing media outlet have to be untrustworthy or fake/BS? It's just different than the beliefs you personally may hold.

The truth is revealed in time...

[The_Noble_Cause]

The above 3 posts are what does my head in. It is the bold assumption that lefties are brainwashed by MSM or left-wing media.

None of you even once entertain the idea that a lefty is intelligent enough to know what is a hard line media outlet and who gives balanced and transparent reporting.

I for one read all manner of press/online/whatever. I'm aware of the RWNJ media and the loony-lefty media.

And why does an opposing media outlet have to be untrustworthy or fake/BS? It's just different than the beliefs you personally may hold.

The truth is revealed in time...

Quite a lot of generalizing going on.
I didn't mention ANYTHING about the MSM or your sources in my post.
In fact, I provided a link from the NYTimes - doesn't get much more MSM than that.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I love you TNC, please keep fighting the good fight for common sense and reality. For some reason some people can't see what is really happening to and in this country because they're too busy watching or reading their favorite left wing media.

Thanks Sherrie. I appreciate your views as well.

[Andrew]

I love you TNC, please keep fighting the good fight for common sense and reality. For some reason some people can't see what is really happening to and in this country because they're too busy watching or reading their favorite left wing media.

Thanks Sherrie. I appreciate your views as well.

It was Sherrie’s post I was referring to.

[verslibre]

I just left the tent city at Tornillo. It is a child prison camp. They refused our request to speak with the children who are held there.

The vast majority of these children have parents or other family members who are ready to sponsor them in the US, but the Trump Administration has deliberately created a bottleneck so that it’s difficult for the children to be released.

They’re also threatening to hand over any undocumented family members to ICE, discouraging sponsors from coming forward.

So thousands of children are living in a tent prison. In the desert. For months on end.

https://twitter.com/SenJeffMerkley/status/1074014345867218946

[verslibre]

Quite a lot of generalizing going on.

There sure is. Like when that one guy said "Americans like the con & hustle."

Except we don't, save for those who make a living conning and hustling, like 45.

[The_Noble_Cause]

It was Sherrie’s post I was referring to.

Thanks for clarifying. However, you said "the above 3 posts" and I was one of them.

[The_Noble_Cause]

There sure is. Like when that one guy said "Americans like the con & hustle."

Except we don't, save for those who make a living conning and hustling, like 45.

The Powerball, reality TV shows, and the deification of self-made rap moguls / Kardashian hobags would indicate otherwise. The entire narrative of the American dream is about those who made it to the top - either by hook or by crook. If you don't think citizens have a soft spot for PT Barnum type hucksters, you don't know America.

[verslibre]

There sure is. Like when that one guy said "Americans like the con & hustle."

Except we don't, save for those who make a living conning and hustling, like 45.

The Powerball, reality TV shows, and the deification of self-made rap moguls / Kardashian hobags would indicate otherwise. The entire narrative of the American dream is about those who made it to the top - either by hook or by crook. If you don't think citizens have a soft spot for PT Barnum type hucksters, you don't know America.

I don't play the Powerball.
I don't watch reality TV. (Wait, does American Ninja Warrior count?)
I don't deify any of those losers and I never have.

I guess I'm the exception. I'm out of touch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCkJ5lGPqFs

[ohsherrie]

When it comes to the border, 'Beto' doubles down on dumb
By Charles Hurt - The Washington Times - Sunday, December 16, 2018

Just when you think politics cannot get any stupider in this country, in skateboards Robert Francis O’Rourke. That would be the same Robert Francis O’Rourke of privileged upbringing and expensive boarding school pedigree who today goes by “Beto” because it sounds Hispanic now that he has decided to get into electoral politics. Whatever happened to all the outrage over “cultural appropriation”? You cannot say it is only a problem when conservatives or Republicans do it. Just look at wacky left wing Democrat Sen. Elizabeth Warren, whose national political ambitions have been crushed by her shameless smash-and-grab at trying to be “Pocahontas” for electoral purposes.

It is all so deeply, deeply stupid. It would all be pathetically funny, except that it is all so toxic and detrimental to a body politic founded upon and devoted to all people being equal. Not perfection, obviously. But always striving for that perfect ideal. One thing is certain: If you are not even trying for the principle of all people being equal — regardless of race, religion or gender — you will never get anywhere near it. These people have entirely thrown in the towel and given up. They don’t even pretend to be trying anymore.

If any other profession in America operated on this level of celebrated racial profiling, it would be put out of business — no doubt by the very same kleptocratic political merchants who have currently elevated it to such dizzying heights. But it is not just color-by-numbers in some political coloring book for these people. It actually extends to real political policy. Policies that kill people.

Talking to supporters last week, Mr. O’Rourke rightly lamented the tragedy of people dying trying to cross the border illegally into the United States. This is especially tragic when we are talking about young children dragged by adults — often mercenary coyote smugglers — across such lethally treacherous terrain. To blame, according to this Prep School Politico? The wall, he says.

The “wall that we have already built that pushes people who are at their most desperate and vulnerable to ever-more inhospitable stretches of the Chihuahua Desert.” What is amazing here is that while the Prep School Politico doesn’t make much of any point to support his anti-borders political stance, his statement does make exactly President Trump’s point. Which is that walls work — thereby preventing people from crossing at places where they have been erected.

Mr. O’Rourke’s assertion is not just some ill-considered comment whipped up in the political frenzy of the moment. In a tweet, he doubled down. “Border Patrol reported 329 migrant deaths in 2016. In 2017, 294 deaths. Seven were children,” he pointed out, underscoring the grievous humanitarian obligation that America has to finally secure our dangerous border with Mexico.

Inexplicably, however, the Prep School Pundit added: “The solution is not more walls. It’s not more partisanship and rhetoric.”

Again, if he cared about poor, dying migrant children as much as he cares about “partisanship and rhetoric,” Mr. O’Rourke would acknowledge that, indeed, walls do work. When people stop trying to traverse deadly deserts to illegally invade our borders, only then will children stop dying.

Perhaps if his name was actually “Beto,” he might actually care about them.

[Monker]

When it comes to the border, 'Beto' doubles down on dumb
By Charles Hurt - The Washington Times - Sunday, December 16, 2018

Just when you think politics cannot get any stupider in this country, in skateboards Robert Francis O’Rourke. That would be the same Robert Francis O’Rourke of privileged upbringing and expensive boarding school pedigree who today goes by “Beto” because it sounds Hispanic now that he has decided to get into electoral politics.

This is simply a lie. Beto was asked this question in a debate and he explained that in the community where he grew up EVERYBODY named "Robert" was called "Beto" and he has used the name his entire life.

What the quote above DOES show is the racial hatred of the writer towards Hispanics. The guy has a issue...and it totally discredits the rest of the article as politically biased bullshit.

[The_Noble_Cause]

This is simply a lie. Beto was asked this question in a debate and he explained that in the community where he grew up EVERYBODY named "Robert" was called "Beto" and he has used the name his entire life.

Just because a politician says something doesn't make it the truth. In fact, it's usually the opposite. Hurt's obviously being snarky, but he has a valid point. Why is an Irish-American culturally appropriating a Mexican nickname?

[Monker]

This is simply a lie. Beto was asked this question in a debate and he explained that in the community where he grew up EVERYBODY named "Robert" was called "Beto" and he has used the name his entire life.

Just because a politician says something doesn't make it the truth. In fact, it's usually the opposite. Hurt's obviously being snarky, but he has a valid point. Why is an Irish-American culturally appropriating a Mexican nickname?

Yeah, whatever. And, Obama is a secret Muslim with a fake birth certificate. What you are writing above is the same type of conspiracy crap laced with settle racism.

Beto answered this question in public debate televised nationally on CNN. If it was a lie it would have been exposed by now. The burden is on those who believe this wacky crap to prove their views. If he went by any other name, I'm sure you can find dozens of people who went to school with him say he was not known as "Beto".

[The_Noble_Cause]

Yeah, whatever. And, Obama is a secret Muslim with a fake birth certificate. What you are writing above is the same type of conspiracy crap laced with settle racism.

Nothing I said was a conspiracy or racist. These are just loaded words you like to toss around to attempt to intimidate people.
Here's the facts - Beto is a Spanish nickname for Roberto. Beto O'Rourke is an Irish American.

I don't care if it's a nickname from childhood. Do you think the kid from The Little Rascals has "Alfalfa" on his business card? This is yet another example of you eating Democratic ass.

Beto answered this question in public debate televised nationally on CNN.

I don't care. Only a zombie would take a politician at their word.

[Monker]

Nothing I said was a conspiracy or racist. These are just loaded words you like to toss around to attempt to intimidate people.
Here's the facts - Beto is a Spanish nickname for Roberto. Beto O'Rourke is an Irish American.

I don't care if it's a nickname from childhood. Do you think the kid from The Little Rascals has "Alfalfa" on his business card? This is yet another example of you eating Democratic ass.

It's not a "nickname from childhood". As he said, it is the name he has used his entire life. If Alfalfa was used as his name his entire life, yes, I would expect it to be on his business card. If he ran for office, I would have the same reaction if someone from the other party implied he "changed his name" to try to appear more rural and attract those voters.

The facts you choose to ignore are that he grew up in an ethnically mixed neighborhood where EVERYBODY named Robert, or Albert, or Umberto was called Beto. It was the normal thing for him because that is what he was surrounded with, not by Irish immigrants in NY.

I don't care. Only a zombie would take a politician at their word.

And, only a fool would challenge the authenticity of the name someone chooses. And, only a racist would Imply he chooses it because he wants to appeal to Mexican immigrants.

[The_Noble_Cause]

It's not a "nickname from childhood".

Oh really?

"A lanky Web developer, universally known as Beto, his childhood nickname, O'Rourke was elected to the El Paso City Council six years ago.."

https://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/31/maga ... uarez.html

"Born Robert Francis O'Rourke, the Irish-American candidate goes by his childhood nickname of Beto, short for Roberto."

https://www.newsweek.com/ted-cruz-beto- ... xas-826727

"O'Rourke's given name is Robert, but he goes by Beto, a childhood nickname that stuck."

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/ch ... 381c14ef20

"O'Rourke has said it's a childhood nickname that stuck."

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/411 ... e-hispanic

"Born Robert Francis O'Rourke, the Irish-American candidate goes by his childhood nickname of Beto, short for Roberto."

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/ted-cruz ... 21530.html

The facts you choose to ignore are that he grew up in an ethnically mixed neighborhood where EVERYBODY named Robert, or Albert, or Umberto was called Beto. It was the normal thing for him because that is what he was surrounded with, not by Irish immigrants in NY.

Again, you are just taking a politician's word as the gospel truth. It's funny tho, a few months ago you stated that "The Democrats have far too many other younger people coming up." When asked to be specific, you declined. Now you are on here inventing facts to defend Beto. You're such a transparent partisan hack.

And, only a fool would challenge the authenticity of the name someone chooses. And, only a racist would Imply he chooses it because he wants to appeal to Mexican immigrants.

In this day and age of safe spaces and trigger warnings, an Irish-American culturally appropriating an ethnic nickname is fair game. Play by your own rules.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Pretty sad that the only vocal politician praising the announced troop withdrawal from Syria is Rand Paul. Where the fuck is the left?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCAUhOrwQ0c