The 2008 US Presidential Election Thread

[Saint John]

:lol: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYKk-uHT ... re=related

That guy needs a valium.

He makes some good points, though.

[Skylorde]

Whatever.

THIS ONE cites actual facts and lets them speak for themselve.

http://iarnuocon.newsvine.com/_news/2008/10/01/1940028-the-republican-roots-of-the-subprime-crisis

Wrong yet AGAIN, Tree.

Let's try to put this in terms your feeble mind can understand 7 brain cells.

Congressmen and Senators from both parties (and even that fucktard Bush to some extent) all participated in this collective orgy to run the economy into the ground. If you think for a second the Democrats hands are clean then you are fucking delusional and giving you credit for having 7 brain cells was grossly overestimated.

Amendment: I forgot to include the greedy CEO's who were literally encouraged (through bad regulation) to write hundreds of billions in bad paper & also all the people who signed for loans they clearly could not afford (It's that personal responsibility thing again, something the left likes to leave up to the government.)

[Saint John]

I give round 1 to Skylorde 10-8.

[treetopovskaya]

nope. i think they're more worried about who people "pal" around with than what they spend on clothing or food. i don't get the feeling the reps are as petty as dems/libs.

isn't if funny that this came out shortly after biden's "crisis" comment? trying to cover that up by discussing how much is spent to dress the rep vp candidate? the spenditures for this campaign has been listed for awhile... & it's public knowledge. some are being more open with how they're spending tho... & where they're getting their money from. hmm.

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/summa ... =N00009638

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/summa ... =N00006424

Had Obama done this, every single Republican on this board would be calling for his immediate withdrawal from the race.

[Tito]

sarah will donate the clothing to charity after the campaign, what a gal!

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14840.html

i don't give a rat's ass how much of a clothing allowance palin has. what bugs me is they sell her as "one of us" and clearly that is not good enough to be veep. and let us not forget the "elite" label placed on obama by the mccain campaign. elite my ass!

quite frankly i'm tired of her and her lack of knowledge. you'd think she would've figured out the role of vp by now. the past few days have been comical with mccain/palin tho and i am appreciative of the laughs. i know the campaign trail must be exhausting and most will slip up, so it's par for the course and nothing too major.

She is one of us. That is why she needs the large expenditures for wardrobe. If one of us had to go out daily in front of large crowds for a long period of time we would need an major improvement in the clothes we wear too. Second and more importantly, who cares about this. This isn't costing the taxpayers one cent. As a taxpayer I care about why Obama had secret service protection, that rivals the President, since the day he announced he was running. No one else had that protection and Hillary only had some protection that she receives as a former first lady. McCain only took protection (standard) well after he won the nomination. No other nominee had secret service protection.

She would make a great V.P. If she's not qualified, and she may not be, then Obama is certainly not qualified to be President. He has never accomplish anything in the private sector or as a state or U.S. Senator to make him qualified. The only thing he has done is slick talk enough dumbies to vote for him. Which if the democrat primary rules had been different he would've fallen short of that. But, the rules are the rules and he played them well.

[conversationpc]

She is one of us. That is why she needs the large expenditures for wardrobe. If one of us had to go out daily in front of large crowds for a long period of time we would need an major improvement in the clothes we wear too. Second and more importantly, who cares about this. This isn't costing the taxpayers one cent.

The problem is they put Palin out there as an average Joe kind of person, so it is relevant to some degree. I personally don't have a problem with them spending a bit of money on her wardrobe but the amount actually spent was kind of ridiculous.

As a taxpayer I care about why Obama had secret service protection, that rivals the President, since the day he announced he was running. No one else had that protection and Hillary only had some protection that she receives as a former first lady. McCain only took protection (standard) well after he won the nomination. No other nominee had secret service protection.

To be fair, I can see why Obama gets the Secret Service protection like that. He's the first serious black candidate for President and he is a potential target, moreso than Hillary was, Palin, etc.

She would make a great V.P. If she's not qualified, and she may not be, then Obama is certainly not qualified to be President.

This, I agree with. She's been a mayor and governor of a state, which is no less accomplished than Obama's resume, in my opinion. Before becoming a Senator, he was a state Senator in Illinois and he's spend a fairly large percentage of his time since becoming a U.S. Senator running for President.

[conversationpc]

Interesting bit of info on Palin from Michelle Malkin's site...

Open-borders McCain advisor Juan Hernandez approves…
By Michelle Malkin • October 23, 2008 10:10 AM

…of Sarah Palin’s shamnesty straddle.

Looks like she has been briefed on all the specious, open-borders mantras, has no idea about the proven strategy of attrition, and buys into the “path to citizenship” pabulum embraced by McCain, Grahamnesty, et al.

Dear Sarah,

Where can I send you copies of The Immigration Solution: A Better Plan Than Today’s and Invasion before it’s too late?

And a free piece of advice: Stay away from Juan Hernandez. He is not your friend. He is not a friend of “real America.”

http://michellemalkin.com/2008/10/23/op ... -approves/

This is one of the major problems I have with McCain's campaign. He claims he's learned from the illegal immigration fiasco but he has Juan Hernandez as an adviser, a guy who is a fanatic for completely open borders.

[Tito]

She is one of us. That is why she needs the large expenditures for wardrobe. If one of us had to go out daily in front of large crowds for a long period of time we would need an major improvement in the clothes we wear too. Second and more importantly, who cares about this. This isn't costing the taxpayers one cent.

The problem is they put Palin out there as an average Joe kind of person, so it is relevant to some degree. I personally don't have a problem with them spending a bit of money on her wardrobe but the amount actually spent was kind of ridiculous.

I understand your point. But they have to keep her pretty. I would like to know what Hillary spent on her stuff to compare. It may have been less but she didn't look as good (if you know what I mean). $150k between hair, makeup, wardrobe, shoes, etc. as sad as this sounds probably isn't that hard to amass over a period of time if your buying some of the best stuff.

As a taxpayer I care about why Obama had secret service protection, that rivals the President, since the day he announced he was running. No one else had that protection and Hillary only had some protection that she receives as a former first lady. McCain only took protection (standard) well after he won the nomination. No other nominee had secret service protection.

To be fair, I can see why Obama gets the Secret Service protection like that. He's the first serious black candidate for President and he is a potential target, moreso than Hillary was, Palin, etc.

I'm going to say this one more time. The man is NOT going to get shot. If it was going to happen there would've been at least a legit attempt by now. He will NOT get shot. I guarantee this. I'll bet someone. As a matter of fact, if any of the original presidental contenders from both parites would've been shot at, I would've put my money on Tom Tancredo. The fringe, radical hispanic groups and other anarchist groups were more likely to take Tancredo out than anybody on Obama or any of the other 20 candidates. To my knowledge, he did not have protection and that would've been deserved.

[Tito]

Interesting bit of info on Palin from Michelle Malkin's site...

Open-borders McCain advisor Juan Hernandez approves…
By Michelle Malkin • October 23, 2008 10:10 AM

…of Sarah Palin’s shamnesty straddle.

Looks like she has been briefed on all the specious, open-borders mantras, has no idea about the proven strategy of attrition, and buys into the “path to citizenship” pabulum embraced by McCain, Grahamnesty, et al.

Dear Sarah,

Where can I send you copies of The Immigration Solution: A Better Plan Than Today’s and Invasion before it’s too late?

And a free piece of advice: Stay away from Juan Hernandez. He is not your friend. He is not a friend of “real America.”

http://michellemalkin.com/2008/10/23/op ... -approves/

This is one of the major problems I have with McCain's campaign. He claims he's learned from the illegal immigration fiasco but he has Juan Hernandez as an adviser, a guy who is a fanatic for completely open borders.

If Palin feels this way, then f-ck her after all.

[Rhiannon]

$150k between hair, makeup, wardrobe, shoes, etc. as sad as this sounds probably isn't that hard to amass over a period of time if your buying some of the best stuff.

If someone gave me $150k and told me to buy shoes, clothes, make-up, and stylists, and spa treatments, and that was all I could spend it on, nothing else... I could have it gone... in about a day.

[Enigma869]

She is one of us.

No she's not. Most people that I encounter on a daily basis have more on the ball than this dope!

That is why she needs the large expenditures for wardrobe.

Right, because the average American citizen spends $150K on a wardrobe in two months! What a moronic statement! Get a clue, Frito-Lay! This woman has spent more on her wardrobe in less than two months than "one of us" will spend in our lifetime!

Second and more importantly, who cares about this.

As Dave pointed out, it's an issue because she is passing herself off as a regular "hockey mom". I haven't met a hockey mom in my life who has ever spent $150K, in their lifetime for their wardrobe. Also, Puppet Palin's mantra this entire campaign is how she is so different than all other politicians. She has also claimed to be a "reformer". While I do agree that her wardrobe expenditures aren't a big issue, in the grand scheme of things, it does at least prove that she is the same wasteful politician that we've had for generations!

This isn't costing the taxpayers one cent.

This may not be, but you conveniently forgot to mention that she's costing the taxpayers of Alaska all kinds of money, by flying her gaggle of kids around on "official business". I'm quite sure that her 17 year old, knocked up daughter, would be better served attending parenting classes, than costing the taxpayers of Alaska money, for her travels!

She would make a great V.P.

Based on what? The fact that she can see Russia from her porch? Or, is it the fact that she is so well read? Maybe it's her knowledge of The Supreme Court! I know...It must be because she is so well educated about the position she is seeking! Just come out and say it...You'd like to bend her over and have your way with her, so you think that makes her qualified to run our country! There certainly are no other facts that could possibly lead anyone to believe that this woman is remotely qualified. Hell, this is the first time in my life that I've heard so many people (from her own party) come out and publically say that this woman isn't qualified! The only people I see voting for McCain are those who love the fact that Puppet Palin is steadfastly against abortion and believes that guns are a good thing. If you announce that you're pro-life or pro-choice, you're certain to get a certain percentage of votes, just because there will always be some whose entire existence revolves around these issues!


John from Boston

[Andrew]

I understand your point. But they have to keep her pretty.

Yeah, that takes the focus of what she is saying

[CatEyes]

She would make a great V.P.

Based on what? The fact that she can see Russia from her porch?

Actually seeing Russia from her porch probably gives her more foreign policy experience than W ever had.
Hell, the only thing he could see from the porch of the ranch at Crawford was more Texas.



Cat

[Tito]

I understand your point. But they have to keep her pretty.

Yeah, that takes the focus of what she is saying

Go to bed.

[Rhiannon]

I understand your point. But they have to keep her pretty.

Yeah, that takes the focus of what she is saying

Go to bed.

He's in the UK, dork! It's like dinnertime over there.

[Tito]

This isn't costing the taxpayers one cent.

This may not be, but you conveniently forgot to mention that she's costing the taxpayers of Alaska all kinds of money, by flying her gaggle of kids around on "official business". I'm quite sure that her 17 year old, knocked up daughter, would be better served attending parenting classes, than costing the taxpayers of Alaska money, for her travels!

John from Boston

I do not condone the travel expense at all. But in context, she's not the only one and most likely most if not all do it. Grant it, it does NOT make it right. Our governor refuses to live in the governor's mansion in Springfield and flys everyday from Chicago to Springfield and back to Chicago. I believe the amount is $9,000 everyday. So her $21k, although not right, pales in comparassion to the waste of my governor. It also pales in comparassion to Obama's expenses to the taxpayers and his own campaign expenses.

She would make a great V.P.

Based on what? The fact that she can see Russia from her porch? Or, is it the fact that she is so well read? Maybe it's her knowledge of The Supreme Court! I know...It must be because she is so well educated about the position she is seeking! Just come out and say it...You'd like to bend her over and have your way with her, so you think that makes her qualified to run our country! There certainly are no other facts that could possibly lead anyone to believe that this woman is remotely qualified. Hell, this is the first time in my life that I've heard so many people (from her own party) come out and publically say that this woman isn't qualified! The only people I see voting for McCain are those who love the fact that Puppet Palin is steadfastly against abortion and believes that guns are a good thing. If you announce that you're pro-life or pro-choice, you're certain to get a certain percentage of votes, just because there will always be some whose entire existence revolves around these issues!


John from Boston

All of the above and especially the guns part. I truly believe in a limited government so her (lack of) so called experience is not a concern to me. But, the point I am trying to make is, she is more qualified to be V.P. than Obama is to be President. If the question is are both them qualified for their positions overall, the answer is probably no. So, if you're going to slam her for being not qualified and that may be legit than Obama isn't qualified either. If you feel Obama is qualified, then she is for V.P.

[Trailblazer]

Not only is she going to be an angry First Lady if elected, Michelle Obama will also be the Leona Helmsley version of a First Lady:

THOUGH he’s battling GOP accusations that he’s an Ivy League elitist, Barack Obama has a lifestyle of the rich and famous, like TV show host Robin Leach, who always signed off, “Champagne wishes and caviar dreams!” While he was at a meeting at the Waldorf-Astoria at 4 p.m. Wednesday, Michelle Obama called room service and ordered lobster hors d’oeuvres, two whole steamed lobsters, Iranian caviar and champagne, a tipster told Page Six.

Iranian Caviar?? A $450.00 lunch?? Barack's $900.00 suits??

Not true according to Snopes.com....

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/roomservice.asp

[Tito]

I understand your point. But they have to keep her pretty.

Yeah, that takes the focus of what she is saying

Go to bed.

He's in the UK, dork! It's like dinnertime over there.

Oh. Then, Andrew mind your own business. This isn't your country.

[conversationpc]

This may not be, but you conveniently forgot to mention that she's costing the taxpayers of Alaska all kinds of money, by flying her gaggle of kids around on "official business". I'm quite sure that her 17 year old, knocked up daughter, would be better served attending parenting classes, than costing the taxpayers of Alaska money, for her travels!

It's not illegal to do that in Alaska nor unethical, in my opinion. Don't forget that she saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions, by selling the previous governor's jet.

[Tito]

This may not be, but you conveniently forgot to mention that she's costing the taxpayers of Alaska all kinds of money, by flying her gaggle of kids around on "official business". I'm quite sure that her 17 year old, knocked up daughter, would be better served attending parenting classes, than costing the taxpayers of Alaska money, for her travels!

It's not illegal to do that in Alaska nor unethical, in my opinion. Don't forget that she saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions, by selling the previous governor's jet.

Ahhh, forgot about that. Good point.

[strangegrey]

Anyone that's focusing on Palin's wardrobe is a buffoon.

The fact of the matter is that a woman politician IS judged on appearance, just as much if not MORE than male counterparts. Why hasn't the press harped all over Obama's full wardrobe of 3000 dollar suits? or McCain's 600 dollar shoes? WTF?

Sorry, it's a double standard that exists today...and for the liberals and democrats to be harping over it suggests that they're fucking hypocrits of the highest order. Because if they claim they're the party for women's rights and equality....then it should be a non-FUCKING-issue. Period. No rebutal on this...because there's NOTHING that can be said to justify focusing on how much money a woman running for office spends on clothing. Until someone comes back and tells me the net worth of Obama's professional fucking wardrobe, McCain's or Biden's...and can justify a *significant* gap in spending, I heartily suggest that they shut the fuck up on this non-issue.


Stick to the facts and issues surrounding Palin's intelligence, experience and qualifications to become VP....theres *PLENTY* of fodder there for people to base an informed opinion and debate platform. THESE issues matter...

...not some perceived impression on what Palin's clothing expenditures brings to the table...because in order for someone to make such a bold-two-faced claim, they had BETTER come to the table with FACTS outlining the clothing expenditures by men in this race....and perhaps a comparison to expenditures by women that USED to be in this race. I'd be willing to submit that similar expenditures by Obama's campaign, Hilary's, McCain's are present.


A non-issue.....but it most certainly exposes the sexist leanings of those that would raise it.


Like I said....stick to the real issues, like her policy-gaffes, her inability to construct coherent rebutals to follow up questions, etc, etc. THOSE issues are not only valid but relevant....not whether or not she has a fucking designer suit.

[Tito]

Anyone that's focusing on Palin's wardrobe is a buffoon.

The fact of the matter is that a woman politician IS judged on appearance, just as much if not MORE than male counterparts. Why hasn't the press harped all over Obama's full wardrobe of 3000 dollar suits? or McCain's 600 dollar shoes? WTF?

Sorry, it's a double standard that exists today...and for the liberals and democrats to be harping over it suggests that they're fucking hypocrits of the highest order. Because if they claim they're the party for women's rights and equality....then it should be a non-FUCKING-issue. Period. No rebutal on this...because there's NOTHING that can be said to justify focusing on how much money a woman running for office spends on clothing. Until someone comes back and tells me the net worth of Obama's professional fucking wardrobe, McCain's or Biden's...and can justify a *significant* gap in spending, I heartily suggest that they shut the fuck up on this non-issue.

...not some perceived impression on what Palin's clothing expenditures brings to the table...because in order for someone to make such a bold-two-faced claim, they had BETTER come to the table with FACTS outlining the clothing expenditures by men in this race....and perhaps a comparison to expenditures by women that USED to be in this race. I'd be willing to submit that similar expenditures by Obama's campaign, Hilary's, McCain's are present.

A non-issue.....but it most certainly exposes the sexist leanings of those that would raise it.

Thank you.

[Skylorde]

Anyone that's focusing on Palin's wardrobe is a buffoon.
Sorry, it's a double standard that exists today...and for the liberals and democrats to be harping over it suggests that they're fucking hypocrits of the highest order. Because if they claim they're the party for women's rights and equality....then it should be a non-FUCKING-issue. Period. No rebutal on this...because there's NOTHING that can be said to justify focusing on how much money a woman running for office spends on clothing.

Ding ding ding ding. Strangegrey wins the prize behind door #3.

When liberals talk about Women's rights, equality, etc, what they REALLY mean is women who CONFORM to their leftist ideas and leftist beliefs. All bets are off for the ones who dont walk the walk and talk the talk.

This is no different than Liberals screaming about "freedom of speech" then clammering to bring back the fairness doctrine LOL. The liberal definition of freedom of speech is its "free speech" as long as what you have to say is acceptable to them. If not then you are racist, fascist, fear monger, vast right wing conspiracy (did I leave anything out?)

THAT being said, the right would be all over this if the roles were reversed AND you can bet your next paycheck the left would use the sexism defense.

[conversationpc]

This is no different than Liberals screaming about "freedom of speech" then clammering to bring back the fairness doctrine LOL. The liberal definition of freedom of speech is its "free speech" as long as what you have to say is acceptable to them. If not then you are racist, fascist, fear monger, vast right wing conspiracy (did I leave anything out?)

TNC will probably get back to you on that. He plays ALL those cards.

[SteveForever]

Personally I cannot wait for the election to be over!
I'm not going to watch t.v. until 3 days after the election, til the final vote is in and the winners are announced.....

2 weeks......

[RedWingFan]

Whatever.

THIS ONE cites actual facts and lets them speak for themselve.

http://iarnuocon.newsvine.com/_news/2008/10/01/1940028-the-republican-roots-of-the-subprime-crisis

Wrong yet AGAIN, Tree.

Let's try to put this in terms your feeble mind can understand 7 brain cells.

Am I the only one who LMAO at this?

[Arkansas]

Personally I cannot wait for the election to be over!
I'm not going to watch t.v. until 3 days after the election, til the final vote is in and the winners are announced.....

2 weeks......

3 days?! This thing could have more legal challenges than Bush/Gore ever dreamed of.
More like 3 months.


later~

[RedWingFan]

The liberal definition of freedom of speech is its "free speech" as long as what you have to say is acceptable to them. If not then you are racist, fascist, fear monger, vast right wing conspiracy (did I leave anything out?)

You forgot, homophobic and "quesioning their patriotism."

[The_Noble_Cause]

it actually wasn't spam. a very good friend sent me the link. this op-ed piece was published in a newspaper...

http://www.ornery.org/essays/warwatch/2008-10-05-1.html

Like the omnipresent 'Obama is a muslim' chain emails, this Orson Scott Card piece is now appearing in inboxes and on message forums all across the web.
You can call it whatever you want.

[The_Noble_Cause]

nope. i think they're more worried about who people "pal" around with than what they spend on clothing or food. i don't get the feeling the reps are as petty as dems/libs.

Feelings are not facts, and as usual, you are not informed on your own candidate of choice.
It was the McCain camp who berated Obama for, of all petty things, what he drinks and eats.

"Only celebrities like Barack Obama go to the gym three times a day, demand MET-RX chocolate roasted-peanut protein bars and bottles of a hard to find organic brew - Black Forrest Berry Honest Tea - and worry about the price of arugula," McCain campaign manager Rick Davis wrote in a recent memo...

http://www.nypost.com/seven/08012008/ne ... 122525.htm