President Barack Obama - Term 1 and 2 Thread

[Monker]

You've not provided one shred of rational to back up any of your claims or beliefs, only denial.

What "claims and beliefs" have I posted that I have not "backed up"?

[conversationpc]

[The Sushi Hunter]

Me being ex-military, the Bin Laden one's my favorite.

[The Sushi Hunter]

You've not provided one shred of rational to back up any of your claims or beliefs, only denial.

What "claims and beliefs" have I posted that I have not "backed up"?

Lets start with:

America is in the fucked up situation that it is in now because of the individuals that I wrote about above. They are the reason for the problem now. Yet the Prez crafts up a mandate only involving how to get more money from the tax payers to pay into the system and not a document outlining how people like I mentioned above get less or nothing if they don't work and pay into the system. The Prez is holding the hard working tax payers accountable and not the non-working non-tax paying individuals who are living off the system.

And that is why I'm right and your wrong.

Now show me anywhere in the Obamacare document or anywhere else that what I said above is incorrect.

[slucero]

interesting, according to a recent report from the Congressional Budget Office:

The Falling Fortunes of the One Percent

The presidential election has given us two myths about the rich. First, that their incomes, and income inequality, are at all-time highs. Second, that the wealthy pay less in taxes than ever, and lower taxes than the rest of us.

A recent report from the Congressional Budget Office, however, suggests that both may be false.

Let’s consider income first. Between 2007 and 2009, after-tax earnings by Americans in the top one percent for income fell 37 percent. On a pre-tax basis they fell 36 percent in the same period.

That may sound like a minor haircut for One Percenters compared to people who lost their jobs. But when you take into account federal transfers, assistance and taxes paid, the incomes of the bottom 20 percent grew by 3 percent, while it fell a modest 2 percent for the middle 20 percent.

In other words, the incomes of the top one percent fell 18 times more than the incomes for the middle class at the start of the recession.



The result of this big drop at the top was that their share of the country's total income also fell. In 2007, the top one percent earned 16.7 percent of all after-tax income. In 2009, that portion fell to 11.5 percent.

Inequality, in other words, fell during those years. We are now in an age of High-Beta Wealth, where the incomes of the One Percent have become far more manic and prone to wild drops than the rest of the country.

And taxes paid? Despite the oft-repeated fact that tax rates for the wealthy are at an all-time low (which is true), it’s also true that the actual amount paid in taxes by the wealthy is higher than before the recession.



The One Percent paid an average effective tax rate of 28.9 percent on their income — far more than any other group, and more than twice the average effective rate of the middle class, who paid 11 percent on average.

So the rich lost more income and paid more of their money in taxes than the rest of the population.

This is not an argument against taxing the wealthy. And the incomes and tax rates of the wealthy may have jumped back since 2009, with the rebound in financial markets.

But when politicians and pundits talk about the rich just getting richer and paying less taxes, they need to pay closer attention to the actual numbers.

[The Sushi Hunter]

And then after all of the money runs out that has been taken away from the so called 1%, then what will America do to generate more money to pay for the money that is being paid out to the individuals who do not pay into the system?

[pinkfloyd1973]

And then after all of the money runs out that has been taken away from the so called 1%, then what will America do to generate more money to pay for the money that is being paid out to the individuals who do not pay into the system?

"The problem with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money"--Margaret Thatcher

[Monker]

You've not provided one shred of rational to back up any of your claims or beliefs, only denial.

What "claims and beliefs" have I posted that I have not "backed up"?

Lets start with:

America is in the fucked up situation that it is in now because of the individuals that I wrote about above. They are the reason for the problem now. Yet the Prez crafts up a mandate only involving how to get more money from the tax payers to pay into the system and not a document outlining how people like I mentioned above get less or nothing if they don't work and pay into the system. The Prez is holding the hard working tax payers accountable and not the non-working non-tax paying individuals who are living off the system.

And that is why I'm right and your wrong.

Now show me anywhere in the Obamacare document or anywhere else that what I said above is incorrect.

No reason to...the post prior to this is the one you made where you were living on fantasy island.

[Monker]

And then after all of the money runs out that has been taken away from the so called 1%, then what will America do to generate more money to pay for the money that is being paid out to the individuals who do not pay into the system?

another loony tune post.

[The Sushi Hunter]

And then after all of the money runs out that has been taken away from the so called 1%, then what will America do to generate more money to pay for the money that is being paid out to the individuals who do not pay into the system?

another loony tune post.

Well here’s your golden opportunity to offer more facts as to why you think this is not true, besides just simply disagreeing with it.

One of the many problems with you and many others like you is you fail to have the slightest understanding of Cause and Effect. You think that all that needs to be done is take more money away from people who have worked and saved more than others have. You think that doing so is a forever fix-all.

Unfortunately you’re not alone, as this type of mental defect is at epidemic proportions across the US and has been ever since they started turning out anyone who can sign their names to a voter registration card. Voters like you are the direct cause America is in the situation that it is in today, and the effects of this are more and more evident with each passing day.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Mr. Vento is a dying breed. He would have been a better president than what we've got now for sure.

Long hours and hard work helped Joey Vento build a landmark restaurant in Philadelphia from the ground up, but that work ethic may have also sent him to an early grave.

That's why Eileen Vento's blood boiled when she heard President Obama declare last week that small business owners like her husband owed others for their success.

“That is ridiculous. My husband had $6 in his pocket when he started.” Vento said to FoxNews.com about Joey Vento, who opened Geno’s Steaks in 1966 in the neighborhood of South Philly.


“He worked hard his whole life to build the place up. We made a lot of money. Unfortunately he didn’t get to enjoy it.”
- Eileen Vento, widow of cheesesteak king Joey Vento

“He worked hard his whole life to build the place up. We made a lot of money. Unfortunately, he didn’t get to enjoy it,” she added.

Vento worked at the shop right up until a heart attack killed him last August at age 71. His widow believes 45 years of toil to build a prosperous life for his family took a toll on him. She bristled at the comment Obama made during a campaign stop in Roanoke, Va., last Friday when he said business owners owed some of their success to help along the way, noting that government often provides the infrastructure needed for success.

“If you got a business, you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen,” Obama said. "If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive."

The comments created a backlash among small business owners and others across the country who feel that entrepreneurship is the backbone of the American economy. Vento's sister-in-law said Joey Vento owed his success to his own hard work and the loyal customers he cultivated.

“He went there at 3 or 4 in the morning and stayed until 11 every night. He did it seven days a week,” said Diana Vergagini. “And when he wasn’t there he'd call in at every shift change asking, ‘How did we do? What’s the bread count? What’s the steak count?’”

Vento gained national notoriety in 2006 when he posted a sign at the order window that read, “This is America: When ordering please ‘speak English.’”

The president's slight of entrepreneurs also riled David Ruff, owner of Petit Jean Meats, in Morrilton, Ark. He said his father and uncle began building the business in the 1920s, when they were kids and would deliver meat on their bicycles throughout the town, located an hour north of Little Rock. They spent their lifetimes making it a success, and Ruff remembers his father Edward's pride when they built a new 70,000-square-foot facility in the 1980s.

"When you start work at 12 years old and at 73 to see what it has become...," he said. "You can't help but be proud of that."

Edward Ruff died of heart failure in 1990 at age 73, but he lived to see the company he devoted his life to become a success. And his son, who now oversees a business that employs 70 people and has annual sales of $14 million, resents any implication that Petit Jean Meats was built on anything but generations of sweat.

"There wasn't a handout," David Ruff said. "We had to borrow the money from the bank. We didn't have any guarantee.

"This is what the president doesn't understand, the risks that people take."

"People work their tails off for 20-30 years before they see a return."


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/07 ... grave-for/

[Monker]

And then after all of the money runs out that has been taken away from the so called 1%, then what will America do to generate more money to pay for the money that is being paid out to the individuals who do not pay into the system?

another loony tune post.

Well here’s your golden opportunity to offer more facts as to why you think this is not true, besides just simply disagreeing with it.

You live in some kinda chicken little fantasy land where the sky is in a continual free-fall, and you asking for proof that you are not living on fantasy island and fell into a rabbit hole? You are saying loopy things like "...what will America do to generate more money to pay for the money that is being paid out" That does even make sense. You are just taking any excuse to rant and rave, and don't even care if you sound loony.

One of the many problems with you and many others like you is you fail to have the slightest understanding of Cause and Effect.

You have no clue. Anybody who thinks they can predict the future and good or bad consequences of Obamacare, or any other complicated piece of legislation, is either a liar, politically motivated, or a naive fool. That is not even an opinion - but a FACT. NOBODY knows.

You think that all that needs to be done is take more money away from people who have worked and saved more than others have. You think that doing so is a forever fix-all.

Well, at least I think.

The only thing I have stated regarding the above is that you are not being serious about balancing the budge if you are not willing to raise taxes AND cut social programs AND cut the military. THAT is what I believe.

Raising taxes is not a 'fix all' for everything. But, what the rich pay in taxes is historically low right now. THAT is a fact. They should pay what their rate is...not get around it with loopholes, Capital gains, etc. The effective rate should more closely match the marginal rate.

Unfortunately you’re not alone, as this type of mental defect is at epidemic proportions across the US]/quote]

Wrong. Most people are like you and think it's -possible to predict the future. Most people watch, read, or listen to the 'news' and believe the 'experts' who constantly give false prophecies about what is going to happen. Most people get some bit of information from someone that happens to back up their opinion and it suddenly becomes FACT because it is what they WANT to hear and believe. Most people don't want to believe that Obamacare is such a complicated piece of legislation that trying to predict any outcome of it is a futile waste of time. But, I personally believe the "chicken little" crowd who believe the world is coming to an end because of it are complete idiots....because those radical and simpleton ideas are probably the only prediction that is certain to NOT be right.

Voters like you are the direct cause America is in the situation that it is in today, and the effects of this are more and more evident with each passing day.

Yeah, yeah, we all know you think the sky is falling. Whatever.

[SF-Dano]

Well I don't think Sush is predicting the end of the world. He and others or predicting the end of The USA as they have "known" it. Good thing, bad thing - well that is what we are all arguing about.

[slucero]

Well I don't think Sush is predicting the end of the world. He and others or predicting the end of The USA as they have "known" it. Good thing, bad thing - well that is what we are all arguing about.

I don't think there's any argument here that the country is in bad shape economically.... the data/numbers pretty much bear out that the combination of deficit spending & modern Keynesianistic approach to fiscal policy has not proven wise...

In fairness to Keynes.. he did advocate putting capital away for a rainy day.. something modern policymakers seem to have forgotten how to do..


At the end of the day though it's still about consumer spending... because that is what 70% of US GDP is... consumer spending.. and the consumer is locked up debt-wise, and credit is pretty much not available...

China's economy is going into recession because US demand is dying..

[The Sushi Hunter]

There you go again Monker, believing that simply taking more money from others who have worked harder and saved wisely is the fix-all answer to the problem and that the money from these individuals will never run out. Your completely wrong.

[Monker]

There you go again Monker, believing that simply taking more money from others who have worked harder and saved wisely is the fix-all answer to the problem and that the money from these individuals will never run out. Your completely wrong.

and, you are not only living in Wonderland, you can't even read.

I said, "The only thing I have stated regarding the above is that you are not being serious about balancing the budge if you are not willing to raise taxes AND cut social programs AND cut the military. THAT is what I believe. "

That is not even close to what I quoted in this latest post from you.

And, it is laughable that you are worried about the rich running out of money when they are taxed at such a low rate. Get a clue beyond the propaganda that you reading, listening to, and watching.

[The Sushi Hunter]

There you go again Monker, believing that simply taking more money from others who have worked harder and saved wisely is the fix-all answer to the problem and that the money from these individuals will never run out. Your completely wrong.

and, you are not only living in Wonderland, you can't even read.

I said, "The only thing I have stated regarding the above is that you are not being serious about balancing the budge if you are not willing to raise taxes AND cut social programs AND cut the military. THAT is what I believe. "

That is not even close to what I quoted in this latest post from you.

And, it is laughable that you are worried about the rich running out of money when they are taxed at such a low rate. Get a clue beyond the propaganda that you reading, listening to, and watching.

Obviously your not one of the harder working citizens who manages their money wisely. If you were, you'd be concerned with what the real problem is. Stay in Iowa....

[The Sushi Hunter]

POLL: ROMNEY PULLS TO 5 POINT LEAD...

Same 5-point lead that Obama had at this point in '08...

CAMPAIGN RATTLED...

Keep'em coming, we need a president who will do some good for this country.

[Monker]

There you go again Monker, believing that simply taking more money from others who have worked harder and saved wisely is the fix-all answer to the problem and that the money from these individuals will never run out. Your completely wrong.

and, you are not only living in Wonderland, you can't even read.

I said, "The only thing I have stated regarding the above is that you are not being serious about balancing the budge if you are not willing to raise taxes AND cut social programs AND cut the military. THAT is what I believe. "

That is not even close to what I quoted in this latest post from you.

And, it is laughable that you are worried about the rich running out of money when they are taxed at such a low rate. Get a clue beyond the propaganda that you reading, listening to, and watching.

Obviously your not one of the harder working citizens who manages their money wisely. If you were, you'd be concerned with what the real problem is. Stay in Iowa....

With 5% unemployment, the best city in America to raise a family, you bet I'll stay here. I'd be foolish not to. I'm not going to get into my finances, but I manage my money just fine, thank you.

The problem is that the way politics works in this country it is easy to obscure the truth misdirection, exaggeration, and outright lies.

[parfait]

POLL: ROMNEY PULLS TO 5 POINT LEAD...

Same 5-point lead that Obama had at this point in '08...

CAMPAIGN RATTLED...

Keep'em coming, we need a president who will do some good for this country.

And that's Romney?

You can't be serious.

[RedWingFan]

POLL: ROMNEY PULLS TO 5 POINT LEAD...

Same 5-point lead that Obama had at this point in '08...

CAMPAIGN RATTLED...

Keep'em coming, we need a president who will do some good for this country.

And that's Romney?

You can't be serious.

Foghorn Leghorn would be an improvement.

[The Sushi Hunter]

We'll see. How much stuff does this current administration have to completely fuck away before some of you realize it's a big problem? The only country where the civilians owe their business success to their government are communist countries like North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.

[Monker]

We'll see. How much stuff does this current administration have to completely fuck away before some of you realize it's a big problem? The only country where the civilians owe their business success to their government are communist countries like North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.

Who is saying business owners owe their success to the government?

[slucero]

the government has always only had about this much:





...to do with business success...


and about this much ( below) to do with fucking up the economy with over-regulation AND de-regulation, usually at the WRONG time and at the SAME time:








They rarely get it right... except for Glass-Steagall, which Congress got right, then FUCKED up 75 years later...

[Monker]

We'll see. How much stuff does this current administration have to completely fuck away before some of you realize it's a big problem? The only country where the civilians owe their business success to their government are communist countries like North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.

Who is saying business owners owe their success to the government?

You sure are dense when it come to comprehending Obama's beliefs/intentions.

“Only government can break the vicious cycles that are crippling our economy, where a lack of spending leads to lost jobs which leads to even less spending.” ___Barry Obama 2009

That has absolutely nothing to do with "business owners owing their success to the government."

[parfait]

We'll see. How much stuff does this current administration have to completely fuck away before some of you realize it's a big problem? The only country where the civilians owe their business success to their government are communist countries like North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.

Who is saying business owners owe their success to the government?

You sure are dense when it come to comprehending Obama's beliefs/intentions.

“Only government can break the vicious cycles that are crippling our economy, where a lack of spending leads to lost jobs which leads to even less spending.” ___Barry Obama 2009

That has absolutely nothing to do with "business owners owing their success to the government."

Stop. That's taken completely out of context. The context makes clear that the president was saying entrepreneurs need government infrastructure like roads and bridges, investments in education and what Obama called "this unbelievable American system that allowed you to thrive."

It's like you're taking your information from Fox News. Come on. No one with a functioning brain would do that.

[conversationpc]

We'll see. How much stuff does this current administration have to completely fuck away before some of you realize it's a big problem? The only country where the civilians owe their business success to their government are communist countries like North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.

Who is saying business owners owe their success to the government?

You sure are dense when it come to comprehending Obama's beliefs/intentions.

“Only government can break the vicious cycles that are crippling our economy, where a lack of spending leads to lost jobs which leads to even less spending.” ___Barry Obama 2009

That has absolutely nothing to do with "business owners owing their success to the government."

Stop. That's taken completely out of context. The context makes clear that the president was saying entrepreneurs need government infrastructure like roads and bridges, investments in education and what Obama called "this unbelievable American system that allowed you to thrive."

It's like you're taking your information from Fox News. Come on. No one with a functioning brain would do that.

That might be believable if Obama hadn't already had a long history of believing in bigger government and that rights come from the government instead of the government being responsible to protect the rights that already belong to the people.

[parfait]

We'll see. How much stuff does this current administration have to completely fuck away before some of you realize it's a big problem? The only country where the civilians owe their business success to their government are communist countries like North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.

Who is saying business owners owe their success to the government?

You sure are dense when it come to comprehending Obama's beliefs/intentions.

“Only government can break the vicious cycles that are crippling our economy, where a lack of spending leads to lost jobs which leads to even less spending.” ___Barry Obama 2009

That has absolutely nothing to do with "business owners owing their success to the government."

Stop. That's taken completely out of context. The context makes clear that the president was saying entrepreneurs need government infrastructure like roads and bridges, investments in education and what Obama called "this unbelievable American system that allowed you to thrive."

It's like you're taking your information from Fox News. Come on. No one with a functioning brain would do that.

That might be believable if Obama hadn't already had a long history of believing in bigger government and that rights come from the government instead of the government being responsible to protect the rights that already belong to the people.

You're in the biggest recession since the 30'ies. Much of the increase in spending has come from mandatory spending, from mandatory programs. Those programs have expanded mostly because of the recession, which has prompted more people to apply for stuff like Medicaid and Social Security, as well as the growth in people hitting retirement age.

I'm not saying he's perfect. Far from it. He's even worse than Bush on personal liberty and social policies -and that's saying something. But no one in their right mind would pick Romney before Obama. The Republican party is an embarrassment. The only thing they talk about is less taxes for the rich, abortion, bombing the middle east, Obama's an socialist/muslim/communist and that there's a war on religion.

Romney? Bachmann? Perry? Cain? The current Republican party is a joke.

[slucero]

The US government's activities as a share of GDP:


Beginning of last century: under 10%

As of today: over 40%

By the time Obamacare is fully implemented: over 50%


...make it clear that this country is now operating on principles that run completely contrary to those that promote success and economic well-being.

The consequence of continuing to operate on this model will be a steady decline in the quality of life for most Americans, while favoring a ruling elite that produces nothing… except more roadblocks.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Absolutely not taken out of context. That is exactly what he said. And it backfired in his silly ass. Now he's building a bike that peddles backwards and everyone that believes him is just another link in that pathetic bicycle's chain. We all know what he was up to. Once he got everyone to agree with him on that, he'd then say business owners now have an obligation to pay back something extra above and beyond what is fair and on the level for what the government so call did for them, allowing them to become successful. But he didn't get that far......FAIL!

You think that bridges and roads makes or breaks a business? Obviously you've not been out of the American bubble that your living in here in the US. Go to Japan and see how many business owners live right above their business, businesses that have been around over countless family generations. And their clients that is their bread and butter, locals who do business locally and don't need a car to live their lives. And these business owners are in most part very successful. This just isn't going on in places like Japan either. If the roads and bridges weren't built, entire communities would be depending on their community for everything and that works as it is proven in places such as Japan. I'm sure there are plenty of places in Europe that operate exactly the same way. And if you still don't think so, answer me then why companies such as Solyndra failed after using the same bridges and roads as all the other companies who actually did succeed, and succeed without the $500Million dollar Obamasjackoffhelpinghand so generously gave to Solyndra.

This current administration is one huge epic FAIL! The only thing good that came out of the time he's been in office was securing Bin Laden's liberty, but that was not him, that was the seals. He just gave them the go signal. Seals are the ones responsible for that hard work. There's a big difference between handing someone the go signal and actually going out and getting the job done. Make no fucking mistake about that.

We'll see. How much stuff does this current administration have to completely fuck away before some of you realize it's a big problem? The only country where the civilians owe their business success to their government are communist countries like North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.

Who is saying business owners owe their success to the government?

You sure are dense when it come to comprehending Obama's beliefs/intentions.

“Only government can break the vicious cycles that are crippling our economy, where a lack of spending leads to lost jobs which leads to even less spending.” ___Barry Obama 2009

That has absolutely nothing to do with "business owners owing their success to the government."

Stop. That's taken completely out of context. The context makes clear that the president was saying entrepreneurs need government infrastructure like roads and bridges, investments in education and what Obama called "this unbelievable American system that allowed you to thrive."

It's like you're taking your information from Fox News. Come on. No one with a functioning brain would do that.