Cool Old Survivor Band Pictures

[axecrew]

I guess we've all forgotten(slander) that most of vital signs was written for dave. It worked and got them a new deal. You forget that had vital signs tanked, they were done as a band on scotti bros. How can you blame them for writing what sells? They saw what worked for vital signs and continued with that. So who do we blame now?

No I'm aware that a lot of VS was written for Dave. Yes it did work. VS is an AOR classic. It's doesn't change the fact that the softening of the image is a far cry from what paved the way for their success: Premonition and EOTT. That's what Survivor was at the core. Sorry it's all about the beret not the oh so photogenic JJ. In fact the post about the camera being good to him almost makes puke. What the hell does that have to do with music? LONG LIVE THE BERET.

The bottomline is that they were headed in a softer direction before JJ was even in the band,therefore he had nothing to do with the fact they went that direction. Other than singing his best on the material. And selling a shit load of records.

[Joe Vana]

:shock: Looks mean a lot .. It may not be right but it is what it is.
Peterik changed the way he wrote tunes ! The keyboards and vocals became the formula when Jimi joined the band. Success soon followed . How can you argue with that success? The band itself may not have liked the direction they had to go but you can't rock the boat when you hit your mark.

I agree the music may have been harder and more melodic . Survivor wasn't Foreigner !
I was a big fan of Dave Bickler but he didn't have that emotional Lou Gramm excitement to his vocals .. I am not saying he wasn't great . Maybe it was Scotti Bros and the promtional machine back then that didn't push all those songs with Bickler on vocals and their image .. I have no idea.

How can you argue with the image of Vital Signs or When Seconds Count ? If Vital Signs didn't hit big Survivor would have ceased to exist back in 1983 period. Jim Peterik however was already becoming a legend song- writer even before all of this with 38 Special.

I think they made a mistake with Too Hot To Sleep . They were full of hits and videos from 84-87 . Having 5 hits was like wow back even then . I believe changing the sound for Too Hot To Sleep was wrong. The whole band from the past wasn't there either except Peterik , Sullivan & Jamison.

Why do people continue to say things like "Peterik changed the way he wrote tunes"...ALL their hits...and 95 % of their tunes were Peterik/Sullivan.....

Fact....

I can careless about the rest of the stuff, but the blatant rewriting of history on here is almost criminal....

JV

[silvergirl66]

:shock: I was a big fan of Dave Bickler but he didn't have that emotional Lou Gramm excitement to his vocals ..

are you freakin serious dude? Dave's vocals a full of emotion. JJ and Dave are two completely different vocalist but both awesome.

[Slander]

:shock: I was a big fan of Dave Bickler but he didn't have that emotional Lou Gramm excitement to his vocals ..

are you freakin serious dude? Dave's vocals a full of emotion. JJ and Dave are two completely different vocalist but both awesome.

Amen. I love Lou Gramm but to downplay Dave's raw emotion is a crime.

[Red13JoePa]

What is it with the "criminal" stuff tossed around here?

[Slander]

What is it with the "criminal" stuff tossed around here?

Because it is a criminal not in the literally sense to revise history! Many on this board must think the world is flat too! Dave Bickler sang with raw emotion! Vital Signs would have been a smash with him as well.

[Red13JoePa]

Slander, one day I'd love it if you favored the board with the reason, or list of reasons why it is you dislike Jimi Jamison so intensely.

Please don't bother replying with the usual passive/aggressive rhetoric about how you have nothing against him, we've all seen it.

When you're ready to admit your Jamison issue and back it up with actual sane reasons I will listen raptly.

But the tossing of the word "criminal" around with people who express admiration for the works of Jamison and Peterik (just not sullivan) is even more dubious than people referring to Jamison or Peterik as "legends" which you whine about.

[Slander]

Slander, one day I'd love it if you favored the board with the reason, or list of reasons why it is you dislike Jimi Jamison so intensely.

I've paid to see JJ in concert and purchased his albums. Vital Signs is an aor masterpiece. Yeah I dislike him intensely! Red JJ is a great talent. I just don't gush over him like the rest of you folks do.

[Red13JoePa]

No, not his singing.
I like Steve Perry's singing and have his albums. That's not the issue. As a bandmate, as a member of Journey I think he was the anti-Christ based on the available empirical evidence that I've gathered to make that inference.

Wether or not you actually ADMIT it, your posts imply that you feel the same about Jamison and Survivor and I'm asking why.

[Slander]

No, not his singing.
I like Steve Perry's singing and have his albums. That's not the issue. As a bandmate, as a member of Journey I think he was the anti-Christ based on the available empirical evidence that I've gathered to make that inference.

Wether or not you actually ADMIT it, your posts imply that you feel the same about Jamison and Survivor and I'm asking why.

Red there is simply no there-there. I'm the one who started this damn post. I thought you guys would get a kick out of seeing JJ pictures. If I hated him so much why on earth would I even bother?

[Joe Vana]

Slander, one day I'd love it if you favored the board with the reason, or list of reasons why it is you dislike Jimi Jamison so intensely.

Please don't bother replying with the usual passive/aggressive rhetoric about how you have nothing against him, we've all seen it.

When you're ready to admit your Jamison issue and back it up with actual sane reasons I will listen raptly.

But the tossing of the word "criminal" around with people who express admiration for the works of Jamison and Peterik (just not sullivan) is even more dubious than people referring to Jamison or Peterik as "legends" which you whine about.

Hey Red!!

It was me that brought up the "criminal" thing.....I was referring to people dreaming and rewriting the history of the band in direct reference to songwriting....it was ALWAYS Peterik/Sullivan....not Peterik, not Sullivan alone.....they together made the band, and that's why until they BOTH work together again it will not sound like Survivor ever again...I truly believe Frankie will put out a great album, but unless the tunes are Peterik/Sullivan it will sound different than what the VINTAGE Survivor sounded like.....Peterik can try forever, Frankie can try forever, but until they reunite we all will have to listen to stuff that does not sound like the Vintage Survivor....I have all the faith in both of them as writers, I have worked with BOTH of them...but, together magic happens.

and by the way....watch this....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfGnVetvFlk

[Eyeof]

Very well said Joe...I think we all chase our tail on here, but as you said none of it will sound like what we long for. For some of us, unless it was JP and FS writing and Dave singing, it's not even going to be the Survivor that long deep for. For some it's the same with JJ...

Funny thing is, I don't have a problem with JJ at all. I listen to those albums all the time, but it is different. I don't hit a mood where I say, i need to listen to Survivor. It's more a mood for Dave era Rock Survivor or more 80's based JJ Survivor. I prefer the Dave stuff, but I like all of it. There is even a place for Reach in my mood swings of music - not much of one, but there is a place. I went through a phase where I could not stop listening to the Fire Makes Steel Demos...

I do have to note, I also went through a phase where I could not put Empires away. Granted, I'm stubborn and it took me eight or nine years to buy it, but I liked it. I actually bought it, after I was disappointed with Reach. I found it superior to Reach for my taste.