2008 Survivor Setlist

[Eyeof]

No Slander...FS's hard work has torn the band apart and made it a near joke...

if not for him we might still have a DB, JP and MD lineup to say the least...how do you know? Hell, we might even have Ellis for all I know...i know that's hard to fathom for a FS worshiper like you.

Tell me, did he give you a hug or something when you met him? You sure have blind devotion.

Althougth 'you've' criticized him repeatedly...(Yeah fing right).

FS has torn this band apart piece by piece, so spare me the 'he kept it all together BS'....

By the way, JP co-wrote those songs as well and his keys were vital in the sound of the band as well...so who cares?

Long Live the Real SURVIVOR.....

[Red13JoePa]

I have all sullivan's stuff, doesn't mean that my impression of him, based on inferences gathered from occurances over the years, can't be that he's a shitty bandmate.

That's where we differ, I admit it.

[Eyeof]

Heck Red, I have all the stuff as well.

That is where you and I and axe differ from Slander. We have the TRUE ability to be objective.

Must be because we didn't get that 'special' hug...

[Irwin M Fletcher]

i think theres always 2 sides to a story as far as bands go. look at motley when vince neil left in 92. he blamed them and they blamed him! id kill to see survivor in any shape or form! i seen JJ's setlist this year and its mostly Survivor songs including about 3 or 4 that Bickler originally sang! however im happy with that cause thats what most folk want 2 hear isn't it?

[axecrew]

I don't even KNOW Axecrew's vocalist preference

Too tell you the truth Red I did truely like both eras of singers. As slander says,The Dave era had a grittier street sound and The Jimi era had a more polished sound to it. I think that it was easier for Jimi to do the songs by Dave, than Dave to do Jimi's stuff. You have to keep in mind it has or had nothing to do with range or who's better,but remember, Dave has always had vocal cord issues and the higher range stuff would eventually do him in.


Now as for us "trying to cause survivor to fail" as slander puts it. Since we're nobodies and no one ever pays attention to us(except slander that is), why or how could we ever think we could bring down a great conglomerate as survivor enterprises with just words? Words that no one hears or pays attention to?

[Irwin M Fletcher]

ive got survivors debut cd on just now (japanese version)

[Eyeof]

Hey, my man Axe (Now pay close attetion Slander, as this is how you discuss in a civilized manner differences of opinion, without blind hero workship or generally acting like a jackass).

Like you Axe, I like both eras. I wore out EOTT on tape as did i Vital Signs.

I'm not sure I agree with you on DB's handling of JJ era songs. I thing the boot stuff from '93 more than show's Bicker's ability to handle that materail (much of which was actually writen for him). His versions of Broken Promises and Burning Bridges are sick awesome. And on the '93 LaGrange show he flat makes "The Search is Over" his bitch. Gives me chill bumps still.

In contrast, I like the way JJ handles DB materail as well, especially in 1985. His "I See You in Everyone" on Extended Versions is awesome, as is Poor Man's Son. One advantage i feel he did have is the the fact, i wish that we had of gotten to hear DB do JJ stuff on a professional recording, as we did JJ on Extended.

Now see Slander, how we discussed something that we feel differently on, without going crazy or even bringing up FS's name. Can that be done on a post on here? I mean he is Survivor right?

[axecrew]

Hey, my man Axe (Now pay close attetion Slander, as this is how you discuss in a civilized manner differences of opinion, without blind hero workship or generally acting like a jackass).

Like you Axe, I like both eras. I wore out EOTT on tape as did i Vital Signs.

I'm not sure I agree with you on DB's handling of JJ era songs. I thing the boot stuff from '93 more than show's Bicker's ability to handle that materail (much of which was actually writen for him). His versions of Broken Promises and Burning Bridges are sick awesome. And on the '93 LaGrange show he flat makes "The Search is Over" his bitch. Gives me chill bumps still.

In contrast, I like the way JJ handles DB materail as well, especially in 1985. His "I See You in Everyone" on Extended Versions is awesome, as is Poor Man's Son. One advantage i feel he did have is the the fact, i wish that we had of gotten to hear DB do JJ stuff on a professional recording, as we did JJ on Extended.

Now see Slander, how we discussed something that we feel differently on, without going crazy or even bringing up FS's name. Can that be done on a post on here? I mean he is Survivor right?

Eye. That's really disengeniuos of you to sit there and imply that Dave is superior to an AOR icon like Jimi Jamison. How dare you cause me to have to bring objectivity and balnce to this post. God are you pathetic.

Ok now my real answer.......I agree with you and maybe I mis-stated myself. What I was trying to say is that because the songs were in a higher register and Dave's past history of throat and voice problems,that over time those songs would've caused him problems with his voice again. I saw Dave with them back then and he did those songs really good,they were different but good. He had no trouble getting the notes,although they might've tuned them down a little to make it easier(Don't really know or not). I did enjoy seeing Dave do those songs because it was Survivor. Even saw the Dave Carl show. That's the one where Dave Carl had to fill in for sullivan because he broke some ribs while doing a roofing job. Not sure if it was his house or not. In fact if you have the bootleg from that show Jim mentions that sullivan had fallen off a roof and broke a couple of ribs earlier in the day. Not sure if he was helping someone or it was his day job. Yes that's right,the great Francis M. Sullivan had a day job back then. Kinda sad that a great guy like him,not too mention the guy with the signature sound of survivor, would have to take a day job. I know that Jimi worked in a bar,but there's a difference between working in it because you own it,and working in it because you have to.

[Joe Vana]

Hey, my man Axe (Now pay close attetion Slander, as this is how you discuss in a civilized manner differences of opinion, without blind hero workship or generally acting like a jackass).

Like you Axe, I like both eras. I wore out EOTT on tape as did i Vital Signs.

I'm not sure I agree with you on DB's handling of JJ era songs. I thing the boot stuff from '93 more than show's Bicker's ability to handle that materail (much of which was actually writen for him). His versions of Broken Promises and Burning Bridges are sick awesome. And on the '93 LaGrange show he flat makes "The Search is Over" his bitch. Gives me chill bumps still.

In contrast, I like the way JJ handles DB materail as well, especially in 1985. His "I See You in Everyone" on Extended Versions is awesome, as is Poor Man's Son. One advantage i feel he did have is the the fact, i wish that we had of gotten to hear DB do JJ stuff on a professional recording, as we did JJ on Extended.

Now see Slander, how we discussed something that we feel differently on, without going crazy or even bringing up FS's name. Can that be done on a post on here? I mean he is Survivor right?

Eye. That's really disengeniuos of you to sit there and imply that Dave is superior to an AOR icon like Jimi Jamison. How dare you cause me to have to bring objectivity and balnce to this post. God are you pathetic.

Ok now my real answer.......I agree with you and maybe I mis-stated myself. What I was trying to say is that because the songs were in a higher register and Dave's past history of throat and voice problems,that over time those songs would've caused him problems with his voice again. I saw Dave with them back then and he did those songs really good,they were different but good. He had no trouble getting the notes,although they might've tuned them down a little to make it easier(Don't really know or not). I did enjoy seeing Dave do those songs because it was Survivor. Even saw the Dave Carl show. That's the one where Dave Carl had to fill in for sullivan because he broke some ribs while doing a roofing job. Not sure if it was his house or not. In fact if you have the bootleg from that show Jim mentions that sullivan had fallen off a roof and broke a couple of ribs earlier in the day. Not sure if he was helping someone or it was his day job. Yes that's right,the great Francis M. Sullivan had a day job back then. Kinda sad that a great guy like him,not too mention the guy with the signature sound of survivor, would have to take a day job. I know that Jimi worked in a bar,but there's a difference between working in it because you own it,and working in it because you have to.

Wow.....NO....FS has NEVER had a "Day Job" since Survivor took off....he is VERY well off.....let's just leave it at that.....

JV

[axecrew]

Hey, my man Axe (Now pay close attetion Slander, as this is how you discuss in a civilized manner differences of opinion, without blind hero workship or generally acting like a jackass).

Like you Axe, I like both eras. I wore out EOTT on tape as did i Vital Signs.

I'm not sure I agree with you on DB's handling of JJ era songs. I thing the boot stuff from '93 more than show's Bicker's ability to handle that materail (much of which was actually writen for him). His versions of Broken Promises and Burning Bridges are sick awesome. And on the '93 LaGrange show he flat makes "The Search is Over" his bitch. Gives me chill bumps still.

In contrast, I like the way JJ handles DB materail as well, especially in 1985. His "I See You in Everyone" on Extended Versions is awesome, as is Poor Man's Son. One advantage i feel he did have is the the fact, i wish that we had of gotten to hear DB do JJ stuff on a professional recording, as we did JJ on Extended.

Now see Slander, how we discussed something that we feel differently on, without going crazy or even bringing up FS's name. Can that be done on a post on here? I mean he is Survivor right?

Eye. That's really disengeniuos of you to sit there and imply that Dave is superior to an AOR icon like Jimi Jamison. How dare you cause me to have to bring objectivity and balnce to this post. God are you pathetic.

Ok now my real answer.......I agree with you and maybe I mis-stated myself. What I was trying to say is that because the songs were in a higher register and Dave's past history of throat and voice problems,that over time those songs would've caused him problems with his voice again. I saw Dave with them back then and he did those songs really good,they were different but good. He had no trouble getting the notes,although they might've tuned them down a little to make it easier(Don't really know or not). I did enjoy seeing Dave do those songs because it was Survivor. Even saw the Dave Carl show. That's the one where Dave Carl had to fill in for sullivan because he broke some ribs while doing a roofing job. Not sure if it was his house or not. In fact if you have the bootleg from that show Jim mentions that sullivan had fallen off a roof and broke a couple of ribs earlier in the day. Not sure if he was helping someone or it was his day job. Yes that's right,the great Francis M. Sullivan had a day job back then. Kinda sad that a great guy like him,not too mention the guy with the signature sound of survivor, would have to take a day job. I know that Jimi worked in a bar,but there's a difference between working in it because you own it,and working in it because you have to.

Wow.....NO....FS has NEVER had a "Day Job" since Survivor took off....he is VERY well off.....let's just leave it at that.....

JV

Joe...it was a joke....I just find it hilarious that the great wealthy sullivan was on a roof working on it instead of hiring someone to do it.

[kgdjpubs]

I'm not sure I agree with you on DB's handling of JJ era songs. I thing the boot stuff from '93 more than show's Bicker's ability to handle that materail (much of which was actually writen for him). His versions of Broken Promises and Burning Bridges are sick awesome. And on the '93 LaGrange show he flat makes "The Search is Over" his bitch. Gives me chill bumps still.

'tis true, and he slayed the rock material on Too Hot To Sleep live...but he flat out murdered Desperate Dreams on that same show. On the rock or slightly edgy material, Bickler does very well. Without knowing the full story, it is very possible that Broken Promises was written for Bickler's voice, which would make perfect sense why he sounds so good on that song. Also, that raw edge in his voice makes Search sound really good as opposed to the full-on melodic treatment that you get with Jamison. On the extremely melodic material however, Bickler's voice doesn't do as well. Great singer, but Jamison is the more versatile of the two.

In contrast, I like the way JJ handles DB materail as well, especially in 1985. His "I See You in Everyone" on Extended Versions is awesome, as is Poor Man's Son. One advantage i feel he did have is the the fact, i wish that we had of gotten to hear DB do JJ stuff on a professional recording, as we did JJ on Extended.

In theory, JJ SHOULD do I see You in Everyone very well....since I don't know of a recording of Dave ever doing that song. That said, JJ tended to struggle a bit on Bickler's highest material--see the his version of Ever Since the World Began. Also, his voice was more melodic and took the raw edge off of Bickler's songs--with mixed results.

Both are very good, but other than a similar range, they are two totally different singers.

[Eyeof]

my apologies, i was referring to 'I'm not that Man Anymore'....

[Eyeof]

Slander will be crushed...rumor is he spent all morning tearking the shingles of his roof, in hopes of hiring FS to come and repair them...

[Irwin M Fletcher]

Slander will be crushed...rumor is he spent all morning tearking the shingles of his roof, in hopes of hiring FS to come and repair them...

i read on another post that FS is quite well off and doesn't need to work

[Joe Vana]

Hey, my man Axe (Now pay close attetion Slander, as this is how you discuss in a civilized manner differences of opinion, without blind hero workship or generally acting like a jackass).

Like you Axe, I like both eras. I wore out EOTT on tape as did i Vital Signs.

I'm not sure I agree with you on DB's handling of JJ era songs. I thing the boot stuff from '93 more than show's Bicker's ability to handle that materail (much of which was actually writen for him). His versions of Broken Promises and Burning Bridges are sick awesome. And on the '93 LaGrange show he flat makes "The Search is Over" his bitch. Gives me chill bumps still.

In contrast, I like the way JJ handles DB materail as well, especially in 1985. His "I See You in Everyone" on Extended Versions is awesome, as is Poor Man's Son. One advantage i feel he did have is the the fact, i wish that we had of gotten to hear DB do JJ stuff on a professional recording, as we did JJ on Extended.

Now see Slander, how we discussed something that we feel differently on, without going crazy or even bringing up FS's name. Can that be done on a post on here? I mean he is Survivor right?

Eye. That's really disengeniuos of you to sit there and imply that Dave is superior to an AOR icon like Jimi Jamison. How dare you cause me to have to bring objectivity and balnce to this post. God are you pathetic.

Ok now my real answer.......I agree with you and maybe I mis-stated myself. What I was trying to say is that because the songs were in a higher register and Dave's past history of throat and voice problems,that over time those songs would've caused him problems with his voice again. I saw Dave with them back then and he did those songs really good,they were different but good. He had no trouble getting the notes,although they might've tuned them down a little to make it easier(Don't really know or not). I did enjoy seeing Dave do those songs because it was Survivor. Even saw the Dave Carl show. That's the one where Dave Carl had to fill in for sullivan because he broke some ribs while doing a roofing job. Not sure if it was his house or not. In fact if you have the bootleg from that show Jim mentions that sullivan had fallen off a roof and broke a couple of ribs earlier in the day. Not sure if he was helping someone or it was his day job. Yes that's right,the great Francis M. Sullivan had a day job back then. Kinda sad that a great guy like him,not too mention the guy with the signature sound of survivor, would have to take a day job. I know that Jimi worked in a bar,but there's a difference between working in it because you own it,and working in it because you have to.

Wow.....NO....FS has NEVER had a "Day Job" since Survivor took off....he is VERY well off.....let's just leave it at that.....

JV

Joe...it was a joke....I just find it hilarious that the great wealthy sullivan was on a roof working on it instead of hiring someone to do it.

Speaks alot about him.....FS has millions more than I ever will, but he thinks of himself as a regular guy.....always treats me like I am the rich one....he thinks he is just a "regular Joe"....and that is one of the the things I love most about him.....

And....if Jamo did work at a bar so what.....I respect the guys talents and his passion for singing....I own a bar and a restaurant and I do whatever is needed.....Hell, last year I was working on a drain in the morning and onstage with Toto that night.....and believe me, those guys are as real as it gets!!!

JV

[Joe Vana]

I'm not sure I agree with you on DB's handling of JJ era songs. I thing the boot stuff from '93 more than show's Bicker's ability to handle that materail (much of which was actually writen for him). His versions of Broken Promises and Burning Bridges are sick awesome. And on the '93 LaGrange show he flat makes "The Search is Over" his bitch. Gives me chill bumps still.

'tis true, and he slayed the rock material on Too Hot To Sleep live...but he flat out murdered Desperate Dreams on that same show. On the rock or slightly edgy material, Bickler does very well. Without knowing the full story, it is very possible that Broken Promises was written for Bickler's voice, which would make perfect sense why he sounds so good on that song. Also, that raw edge in his voice makes Search sound really good as opposed to the full-on melodic treatment that you get with Jamison. On the extremely melodic material however, Bickler's voice doesn't do as well. Great singer, but Jamison is the more versatile of the two.

In contrast, I like the way JJ handles DB materail as well, especially in 1985. His "I See You in Everyone" on Extended Versions is awesome, as is Poor Man's Son. One advantage i feel he did have is the the fact, i wish that we had of gotten to hear DB do JJ stuff on a professional recording, as we did JJ on Extended.

In theory, JJ SHOULD do I see You in Everyone very well....since I don't know of a recording of Dave ever doing that song. That said, JJ tended to struggle a bit on Bickler's highest material--see the his version of Ever Since the World Began. Also, his voice was more melodic and took the raw edge off of Bickler's songs--with mixed results.

Both are very good, but other than a similar range, they are two totally different singers.

Agreed...but....remember this.....there were days Jamo could REALLY get up there.....WAYYY up there...and days Dave would struggle and visa versa....it's a singers curse....I am fighting reflux right now....and it hurts your range.....don't kill these guys because of a bad night here or there....they are fucking killer 90% of the time....if you knew how fucking hard it is to keep your axe in shape you would crap.....

I hear and read alot about both of these guys on here....cut em BOTH some slack....Jamo lovers please respect Dave, and Dave lovers do the same....

They both are amazing, leave it at that and don't compare them....apples and oranges....and I love em both....

JV

[MarcelJordan]

No Slander...FS's hard work has torn the band apart and made it a near joke...

if not for him we might still have a DB, JP and MD lineup to say the least...how do you know? Hell, we might even have Ellis for all I know...i know that's hard to fathom for a FS worshiper like you.

Tell me, did he give you a hug or something when you met him? You sure have blind devotion.

Althougth 'you've' criticized him repeatedly...(Yeah fing right).

FS has torn this band apart piece by piece, so spare me the 'he kept it all together BS'....

By the way, JP co-wrote those songs as well and his keys were vital in the sound of the band as well...so who cares?

Long Live the Real SURVIVOR.....

The REAL Survivor was when JP and FS were together. I think they both KNOW it.

[Irwin M Fletcher]

No Slander...FS's hard work has torn the band apart and made it a near joke...

if not for him we might still have a DB, JP and MD lineup to say the least...how do you know? Hell, we might even have Ellis for all I know...i know that's hard to fathom for a FS worshiper like you.

Tell me, did he give you a hug or something when you met him? You sure have blind devotion.

Althougth 'you've' criticized him repeatedly...(Yeah fing right).

FS has torn this band apart piece by piece, so spare me the 'he kept it all together BS'....

By the way, JP co-wrote those songs as well and his keys were vital in the sound of the band as well...so who cares?

Long Live the Real SURVIVOR.....

The REAL Survivor was when JP and FS were together. I think they both KNOW it.

i agree! JJ and DB were a huge part of survivor obv, but it was Sullivan and Peterik that wrote the songs and had the heart i think

[Slander]

No Slander...FS's hard work has torn the band apart and made it a near joke...

if not for him we might still have a DB, JP and MD lineup to say the least...how do you know? Hell, we might even have Ellis for all I know...i know that's hard to fathom for a FS worshiper like you.

Tell me, did he give you a hug or something when you met him? You sure have blind devotion.

Althougth 'you've' criticized him repeatedly...(Yeah fing right).

FS has torn this band apart piece by piece, so spare me the 'he kept it all together BS'....

By the way, JP co-wrote those songs as well and his keys were vital in the sound of the band as well...so who cares?

Long Live the Real SURVIVOR.....

The REAL Survivor was when JP and FS were together. I think they both KNOW it.

i agree! JJ and DB were a huge part of survivor obv, but it was Sullivan and Peterik that wrote the songs and had the heart i think

Here-Here! Wish the two were still together but the two put out good stuff away from each other too.

[Eyeof]

Great points JV...

Everyone knows i'm a dave fanatic, but I could even really tell that the years from 1993-1999 took a pretty large toll on his voice...Same for JJ from 2001 to 2006...Heck, have you heard Axl Rose lately? He can still belt it out, but not the same. When I see Motley, Vinice sings every fourth word half the time...Steven Tyler, sounds nothing like he did in the early days, but more power to all the guys from finding a way to keep it going. I mean, hey none of us are much like we were in 1985.

Who do you think has done the best job over the years in the music business of hanging on to their voices?

[Irwin M Fletcher]

No Slander...FS's hard work has torn the band apart and made it a near joke...

if not for him we might still have a DB, JP and MD lineup to say the least...how do you know? Hell, we might even have Ellis for all I know...i know that's hard to fathom for a FS worshiper like you.

Tell me, did he give you a hug or something when you met him? You sure have blind devotion.

Althougth 'you've' criticized him repeatedly...(Yeah fing right).

FS has torn this band apart piece by piece, so spare me the 'he kept it all together BS'....

By the way, JP co-wrote those songs as well and his keys were vital in the sound of the band as well...so who cares?

Long Live the Real SURVIVOR.....

The REAL Survivor was when JP and FS were together. I think they both KNOW it.

i agree! JJ and DB were a huge part of survivor obv, but it was Sullivan and Peterik that wrote the songs and had the heart i think

Here-Here! Wish the two were still together but the two put out good stuff away from each other too.

i agree

[Irwin M Fletcher]

Great points JV...

Everyone knows i'm a dave fanatic, but I could even really tell that the years from 1993-1999 took a pretty large toll on his voice...Same for JJ from 2001 to 2006...Heck, have you heard Axl Rose lately? He can still belt it out, but not the same. When I see Motley, Vinice sings every fourth word half the time...Steven Tyler, sounds nothing like he did in the early days, but more power to all the guys from finding a way to keep it going. I mean, hey none of us are much like we were in 1985.

Who do you think has done the best job over the years in the music business of hanging on to their voices?

id probably say jon bon jovi, glenn hughes, ann wilson, but very few sound the same as they did back in the day. i suppose touring for 20/30 years would fuck ur voice anyway. ive seen some singers i was well disappointed in when i heard their voice but still great shows