THE WHOLE STORY?

[Joe Vana]

But in an attempt to try to calm things down a bit I will say the following.

I can verify that BOTH Red13JoePa and Joe Vana are huge Survivor fans and are passionate about the bands music.
And sometimes that passion can get people angry, as is the case here.

Bah.

I'm rolling over to Vana's crib tonight for beers and to preview the new Mecca.

I have seen these so many times...

This will be my last post here as it seems everything becomes a flame war and some people are on here just for that....I simply don't have time for negativity in my life....

People can think as they may on the situations why certain people left (either by force or by their own reasons), in the end only a few certain people know the real truth....and the guys out there professing to know and spreading the demon seed usually get their information from the guy who yells the loudest....and the guy who stays quiet and professional is usually slagged....unfortunate, but it's the reality and WORST part of the internet....and it's the same few making all the noise....

I came on this board to add a different point of view closer to the source.....bad move I guess.

I was asked a while back do other artists I work with go online and why do so little interact with the fans...This is why. They will post on their blog, but not directly to specifics....again...this is why....

See ya......JV

[Journey/Survivor]

But in an attempt to try to calm things down a bit I will say the following.

I can verify that BOTH Red13JoePa and Joe Vana are huge Survivor fans and are passionate about the bands music.
And sometimes that passion can get people angry, as is the case here.

Bah.

I'm rolling over to Vana's crib tonight for beers and to preview the new Mecca.

I have seen these so many times...

This will be my last post here as it seems everything becomes a flame war and some people are on here just for that....I simply don't have time for negativity in my life....

People can think as they may on the situations why certain people left (either by force or by their own reasons), in the end only a few certain people know the real truth....and the guys out there professing to know and spreading the demon seed usually get their information from the guy who yells the loudest....and the guy who stays quiet and professional is usually slagged....unfortunate, but it's the reality and WORST part of the internet....and it's the same few making all the noise....

I came on this board to add a different point of view closer to the source.....bad move I guess.

I was asked a while back do other artists I work with go online and why do so little interact with the fans...This is why. They will post on their blog, but not directly to specifics....again...this is why....

See ya......JV

Joe Vana,

I understand that you don't want to be in the middle of arguments!

But I hope that you will re-consider about not posting on here anymore!

I'm sure we would all like to get some updates on the new Mecca CD. Plus Frankie Sullivan is part of the project, so it's cool to talk about it here on the Survivor board.

Hopefully we can all calm down here, keep things civil and not personal!

I know your busy, and don't have all day to spend on the internet, but please re-consider, and do continue to do some posting on here!

[MarcelJordan]

Joe, come back!

[Red13JoePa]

But in an attempt to try to calm things down a bit I will say the following.

I can verify that BOTH Red13JoePa and Joe Vana are huge Survivor fans and are passionate about the bands music.
And sometimes that passion can get people angry, as is the case here.

Bah.

I'm rolling over to Vana's crib tonight for beers and to preview the new Mecca.

I have seen these so many times...

This will be my last post here as it seems everything becomes a flame war and some people are on here just for that....I simply don't have time for negativity in my life....

People can think as they may on the situations why certain people left (either by force or by their own reasons), in the end only a few certain people know the real truth....and the guys out there professing to know and spreading the demon seed usually get their information from the guy who yells the loudest....and the guy who stays quiet and professional is usually slagged....unfortunate, but it's the reality and WORST part of the internet....and it's the same few making all the noise....

I came on this board to add a different point of view closer to the source.....bad move I guess.

I was asked a while back do other artists I work with go online and why do so little interact with the fans...This is why. They will post on their blog, but not directly to specifics....again...this is why....

See ya......JV

Could you possibly be any more self-righteous about a light remark I made that things weren't really this testy?

Memo to "Vana:" I'm not the only one here or the loudest one here about my viewpoint on your Easter Island Monument Idol. Spare us the melodramatics of the "this guy forced me to leave and ruined it for all of you" speeches.

Post or don't post, but grow some thicker skin.

[Eyeof]

Don't let the door hit you on the tale on your way out...

[Journey/Survivor]

Red and EyeOf,

I respect you guys and I enjoy your posts most of the time, but I do wish you would tone it down with Joe Vana.

Even if you guys choose to reject what he says there are some of us on here that would like for him to still give us some updates every now and then.

I'm not saying that anyone is right or wrong in this, and I'm not taking sides either.

At least Vana is/was giving us some info about both Mecca and Survivor which is a lot better than what we can get from a lot of bands or musicians.

A lot of musicians think that they are the end-all-be-all and that they are above ever conversing with fans. But Vana does not seem like that kind of guy from what I can tell.

So again Red and EyeOf, I like you guys, and I'm not trying to take sides at all, but please
EVERYONE lets try to knock it off with the insults!!!

[Red13JoePa]

"Tone" WHAT down w/ Vana?

Questions were raised (and not for the first time) about what has gone on and why.

If HE wants to get pious about it and play the not really rebutting anything but the "you guys don't know about the Survivor 'Family' card" that's OK but in asking why Dave Bickler would state that he found out he was done as Survivor's singer in 2000 by reading this site I don't think that I or anyone have not bowed before the queen of England.

But if Frankie Trademark holder is so gung ho on keeping SURVIVOR THE BAND ALIVE, how about a new abum or so every 6 years? The US hasn't seen one in since '88. The fans want new music, live albums and he's suing TV shows and ex band members.

I freaking LOVE this guy as a writer and musician and I talk to people about him and they go "oh yea. 'Is This Love' what was that a hit in '86 right?'"

[Journey/Survivor]

"Tone" WHAT down w/ Vana?

Questions were raised (and not for the first time) about what has gone on and why.

If HE wants to get pious about it and play the not really rebutting anything but the "you guys don't know about the Survivor 'Family' card" that's OK but in asking why Dave Bickler would state that he found out he was done as Survivor's singer in 2000 by reading this site I don't think that I or anyone have not bowed before the queen of England.

Check your PM's.

And I'll get back to you again.

[Journey/Survivor]

"Tone" WHAT down w/ Vana?

Questions were raised (and not for the first time) about what has gone on and why.

If HE wants to get pious about it and play the not really rebutting anything but the "you guys don't know about the Survivor 'Family' card" that's OK but in asking why Dave Bickler would state that he found out he was done as Survivor's singer in 2000 by reading this site I don't think that I or anyone have not bowed before the queen of England.

But if Frankie Trademark holder is so gung ho on keeping SURVIVOR THE BAND ALIVE, how about a new abum or so every 6 years? The US hasn't seen one in since '88. The fans want new music, live albums and he's suing TV shows and ex band members.

I freaking LOVE this guy as a writer and musician and I talk to people about him and they go "oh yea. 'Is This Love' what was that a hit in '86 right?'"

Sorry, Red, I meant to get back to you in this post.

No one understands the frustration of not getting enough new material from the band more than I do. I've been a DIE-HARD FAN of the band for 25 years now. I buy every new Survivor album the day it comes out. If Survivor release a new album, it's the highlight of my year. If they do a concert in my area it's the highlight of my Summer.
I found out that Survivor would be releasing a brand new album that was to be called Too Hot To Sleep about a month before it came out, and that was all I could think or talk about for the whole month leading up to it's release on October 3rd 1988. I've never been more psyched up for a new album as I was then for THTS.

I was extremely frustrated beyond belief that there wasn't an entire new album from the band until Reach!!!

I look extremely forward to them releasing their next album!!!

I hope they get their butts moving on getting it out ASAP!!!

From what I have heard it should be out next year sometime.

I think everyone on here (I know I do) knows that you are a huge fan of Survivor's music, and that it's your desire to have new material that motivates you to get on the band over not having enough new material out for us the fans.

There are trolls on this website. Mostly on the Journey board. But Red is NOT a troll, he is a big fan like myself!

And the same goes for Eyeof.

Peace to all!!!

[MarcelJordan]

Frankly, I think we as Fans don't REALLY know what went down . Moaning about things isn't going to bring in a new album in anycase. Besides its bad for health

[Slander]

Frankly, I think we as Fans don't REALLY know what went down . Moaning about things isn't going to bring in a new album in anycase. Besides its bad for health

Marcel, I think I speak for you and many others on this board. I find the behavior of many to be shameful. We are privileged to have someone like JV on the board to share his musical experience and all people want to do is trash him? What the hell is that all about? He is closer to what happened than any of us. Secondly he hasn't taken any sides. Just what the f*** do you people want from him? He didn't defend Frankie. JV just wants to move on. I want to move on. Marcel I'm sure you want to move. Hell I know Journey/Survivor wants to move on. I can only assume that people's lives must be so miserable that they must tear down others. The sad thing about a board like this is that you can accomplish that anonymously. JV I personally apologize for the behavior of others. It is a fucking embarrassment to say the least. JV understand that unless you agree with some people on this board that FS is the anti-christ than you will be torn down. By the way a note to Eyeof: Don't let the door hit you. I have yet to see a meaningful positive post about a damn thing. I by the way I'm not going anywhere. I will continue to spread the good word of Survivor despite yours and other antics.

[Slander]

Oh, I thought I was on the Survivor board not the Joe Vana board. I must be on the wrong site.

Red, where did the Survivor board go?

Please you and Eyeof, and Red. Sight specific examples of when and where and what happened between FS, JP, and JJ. If you can't sight them. Then you speculating on the Survivor family is absolute bullshit. I would rather take the word of someone who knows the characters involved. Come on guys site examples or shut the **** up.

[Red13JoePa]

JV I personally apologize for the behavior of others. It is a fucking embarrassment to say the least.

I deny you permission to apologize to Joe on my behalf.

All I've done is question some of the shady chicainery that has gone on around him, that's NOT making him the antichrist.


Frankie Stepford dope, you.

[Joe Vana]

JV I personally apologize for the behavior of others. It is a fucking embarrassment to say the least.

I deny you permission to apologize to Joe on my behalf.

"All I've done is question some of the shady chicainery that has gone on around him"

Shady Chicainery around who??

[Slander]

JV I personally apologize for the behavior of others. It is a fucking embarrassment to say the least.

I deny you permission to apologize to Joe on my behalf.

All I've done is question some of the shady chicainery that has gone on around him, that's NOT making him the antichrist.


Frankie Stepford dope, you.

Just as I thought JOEPA. yourself, Lark, eyeof, don't have shite for evidence of the accusations you make. Very sad indeed. Yeah I will apologize on this boards behalf. I'm sorry but JV deserves a lot better. He came onto share what is going on with Mecca and you guys do this shite? What the hell is wrong with all of you? Seriously. You don't like Frankie. We all get it but who the fuck cares. FS, JP, and JJ have kept their mouth shut about their family matters. I suggest we do the same. JoePa you remind me of fucking Gladys Kravitz on BEWITCHED.

[Red13JoePa]

I deny you permission to apologize to Joe on my behalf.

"All I've done is question some of the shady chicainery that has gone on around him"

Shady Chicainery around who??

Frankie.
FRANKIE!!!!!

Christ alMIGHTY.

Btw, Joe Vana, if this doesn't look right, it's only b/c I'm trying to quote you, the worst quoter EVER.


And listen, Kevin er Slander.
Shut up and the adults talk.

[Slander]

I deny you permission to apologize to Joe on my behalf.

"All I've done is question some of the shady chicainery that has gone on around him"

Shady Chicainery around who??

Frankie.
FRANKIE!!!!!

Christ alMIGHTY.

Btw, Joe Vana, if this doesn't look right, it's only b/c I'm trying to quote you, the worst quoter EVER.


And listen, Kevin er Slander.
Shut up and the adults talk.

Joe or should I say Gladys. Grow a pair please. Adults actually have evidence to support their claims. Once again you don't. I know you enjoy this kind of back and forth but you are out of your league. Just like your beloved Penn State in the big house last week.

[Joe Vana]

I deny you permission to apologize to Joe on my behalf.

"All I've done is question some of the shady chicainery that has gone on around him"

Shady Chicainery around who??

Frankie.
FRANKIE!!!!!

Christ alMIGHTY.

Btw, Joe Vana, if this doesn't look right, it's only b/c I'm trying to quote you, the worst quoter EVER.


And listen, Kevin er Slander.
Shut up and the adults talk.

I'll turn my quoting badge in at the pricipals office then!!!!

[Red13JoePa]

You'll get there, Young Joe.

Just have to up your post count by a couple K like me.


As for you, Slander: Knock off the cracks about Penn State. I have it on good word that Paterno tried to call to get Survivor to play a 5-song set at the pep rally to fire the team up, but like he did when Andrew tried to reach him about the Jamo situation Frankie had gone inccomunicado and changed his cell ph #.

By that time, it was too late to get Jamo to replace them again and b/c they couldn't get Survivor to show they came out flat.

[Eyeof]

Slander buzz off...who are you do declare what a meaningful post is...all of your post are exactly the same anyone...even the ones where you are pretending to be Joe Vana, or whoever the heck that is...

joe, i apologize for Slander's bad language...hope we don't have any children on here...of coure, since Slander is probably "Joe" then you are apologizing to yourself...if not then i thought you weren't coming back anyway...maybe Slander will go with you...

Slander, all i have ever said is that Frankie is a liar...and he is...

you want examples...sure...

Go back to the boad in the late '90's...he trashed JJ, trashed JJ, trashed JJ, said he would never play with him again..then he fired dave and got JJ back...that makes him a liar...

Then he didn't tell Dave and denied that...A liar again...

Let's see....there is two...and that's just the times he lied to us..yes me...directly...

That's not counting the endless times he LIED about an album coming out...

So joe, I really don't give a rats butt about what you know or think you know or you for that matter...it's a message board and I can voice my opinion as i please...if you don't like it...please, don't come back...we only need you (Slander) posting once anyways...

[Eyeof]

And to think of it Slander, the more I think about it the more you piss me off with your bs. You self righteous piece of crap. To say I’ve never had a meaningful post…you go to hell. I challenge you to tell me one more person in this room that has shared more concerts, bootlegs, demos than me?

I’ve taken every piece I could collect and I never asked for a trade. You ask anyone in here. I put all I had up on rapidshare or whatever just to share the music. I staged the entire tournament of Survivor songs and counted up all the results, I’ve opened endless debate on the music my man.

What have you brought into the fold? The same old tired and worn out post defending your idol worship of one man. Who care…You go away you self righteous jerk. The board would sure be a better place for it.

[Joe Vana]

Slander buzz off...who are you do declare what a meaningful post is...all of your post are exactly the same anyone...even the ones where you are pretending to be Joe Vana, or whoever the heck that is...

joe, i apologize for Slander's bad language...hope we don't have any children on here...of coure, since Slander is probably "Joe" then you are apologizing to yourself...if not then i thought you weren't coming back anyway...maybe Slander will go with you...

Slander, all i have ever said is that Frankie is a liar...and he is...

you want examples...sure...

Go back to the boad in the late '90's...he trashed JJ, trashed JJ, trashed JJ, said he would never play with him again..then he fired dave and got JJ back...that makes him a liar...

Then he didn't tell Dave and denied that...A liar again...

Let's see....there is two...and that's just the times he lied to us..yes me...directly...

That's not counting the endless times he LIED about an album coming out...

So joe, I really don't give a rats butt about what you know or think you know or you for that matter...it's a message board and I can voice my opinion as i please...if you don't like it...please, don't come back...we only need you (Slander) posting once anyways...

I am Slander??

No man...I am Joe Vana...and you are???

Oh thats right, you hide behind a computer moniter with a fake handle...

WHO I know?? What I know??

Listen little man....the pure tonnage of things I know that you don't could stop a team of oxen in their tracks....

I answered questions people asked me....you merely comment on them...get it???

EyeofSHIT.....

[Red13JoePa]

To say I’ve never had a meaningful post…you go to hell. I staged the entire tournament of Survivor songs and counted up all the results,

Coolest thing we ever did here.

Caused a LOT controversy to have Reach's Fire Makes Steel in the finals, too.

[Eyeof]

wow...how could i have been so wrong. I stand corrected...You are just the stuff dreams are made of. I still have no idea who you are even if you are joe vana...and guess what...I don't care to.

My beef is with Slander, not you, as I don't even know who you are. You obviously have a higher opinion of yourself then I do, but hey, for a man who the the pure tonnage of things he knows that I don't could stop a team of oxen in their tracks, I guess I should just thank you for your time...

Whatever...your OPINION means no more than reds or larks or mine or Slander's for that matter...JERK.

[Slander]

And to think of it Slander, the more I think about it the more you piss me off with your bs. You self righteous piece of crap. To say I’ve never had a meaningful post…you go to hell. I challenge you to tell me one more person in this room that has shared more concerts, bootlegs, demos than me?

I’ve taken every piece I could collect and I never asked for a trade. You ask anyone in here. I put all I had up on rapidshare or whatever just to share the music. I staged the entire tournament of Survivor songs and counted up all the results, I’ve opened endless debate on the music my man.

What have you brought into the fold? The same old tired and worn out post defending your idol worship of one man. Who care…You go away you self righteous jerk. The board would sure be a better place for it.

Well I'm glad I got a response. Thanks Eyeof. When I meant meaningful I didn't mean the content that you have offered up. Many appreciate that. Kudo's. Congrats. As far as I'm concerned you are doing more damage with your continued ridicule. What the fuck has JV done to you? Seriously? As far as defending FS? I have defended him and I have also been critical of him when warranted. I have been critical many times. Having said that I don't get into rediculous personal attacks. They serve no purpose. What do I bring to the table? Nothing but support of the band. I try to bring in anything POSITIVE I hear as soon as I hear it. I try to keep the board lively. I do what I do to keep Survivor alive. Bashing Frankie Sullivan with your bullshit is counter productive. I am not going anywhere. I would rather be a self-righteous jerk any day than to be fucking gossip queen. Survivor was as family. They had problems. It's none of our damn business what caused JP, JJ, and FS to break up. I can assure you FS was not the cause of everything. Like in all families there is always plent of blame to go around and many sides to the story. I ask you Eyeof, once again, where are your examples, dates, times, etc. If you can't provide any than quit speculating. Let's move on enjoy the current works that JP, JJ, and FS are involved in.

[Red13JoePa]

I can assure you FS was not the cause of everything.

Of course not.

Joe Vana did it

[Joe Vana]

I can assure you FS was not the cause of everything.

Of course not.

Joe Vana did it

Thanks alot JoePa....hahhahahaha

I was they butler in the study with the candlestick holder......

[Slander]

Whatever...your OPINION means no more than reds or larks or mine or Slander's for that matter...JERK.

You really want us all to sit here and believe that yours, mine, Red, etc opinions of what happened with Survivor means as much as JV's? What utter crap. There is a difference between expert opinion and armchair bullshit.

[Joe Vana]

Whatever...your OPINION means no more than reds or larks or mine or Slander's for that matter...JERK.

You really want us all to sit here and believe that yours, mine, Red, etc opinions of what happened with Survivor means as much as JV's? What utter crap. There is a difference between expert opinion and armchair bullshit.

Slander....thanks....BUT....my OPINION does NOT mean anymore than Eyeof, JoePa or whoever....BUT, facts for that matter are another story....

This is a great board....let's not let it become the Wizard of Oz....otherwise known as the Journey forum......JV

[Slander]

Whatever...your OPINION means no more than reds or larks or mine or Slander's for that matter...JERK.

You really want us all to sit here and believe that yours, mine, Red, etc opinions of what happened with Survivor means as much as JV's? What utter crap. There is a difference between expert opinion and armchair bullshit.

Slander....thanks....BUT....my OPINION does NOT mean anymore than Eyeof, JoePa or whoever....BUT, facts for that matter are another story....

This is a great board....let's not let it become the Wizard of Oz....otherwise known as the Journey forum......JV

JV thanks. I agree it is a great board. I want to keep it that way. I hope you stay on board (no pun intended). I enjoy the insight you bring. JV I have a background in covering sports. This reminds me of when my friends would throughout their opinions but so-n-so quarterback etc and I would be in the locker room knowing what actually went down. They still stuck to their opinions without the facts. I can relate.