Survivor Playing Springtime Rockfest in Hamburg, Germany

[Eyeof]

You know what is weird...Reach is the only album I have ever seen that just dissapeared from Itunes....I mean why? You can't run out of copies, its digital.

[Eyeof]

Maybe FS can't stand the fact that Jamison is able to get a better record deal than "Survivor." But with Peterik involved I can surely see that being the case...

It's silly that JJ can release albums and FS can't find a way to...I might have something to do with teh vocalist indeed...

[Slander]

Maybe FS can't stand the fact that Jamison is able to get a better record deal than "Survivor." But with Peterik involved I can surely see that being the case...

It's silly that JJ can release albums and FS can't find a way to...I might have something to do with teh vocalist indeed...

Hello Eyeof, agree with your second point completely. Makes no sense JJ can release an album and Survivor can't. I'm not buying the argument that REACH didn't sell well. My guess is that FS wants more than what a label is willing to give him and that's fs prerogative. It just sucks for fans of the band who desperately want new music. I also understand FS not wanting to put Survivor's name on a crappy label too. As far as the vocalist, while Robin isn't your taste and I understand that completely, it's not like he hasn't been associated with bands that can move records. In fact, I bet MSG with Robin on vocals might sell well. No?

[DavidWT]

Hello Eyeof, agree with your second point completely. Makes no sense JJ can release an album and Survivor can't. I'm not buying the argument that REACH didn't sell well. My guess is that FS wants more than what a label is willing to give him and that's fs prerogative. It just sucks for fans of the band who desperately want new music. I also understand FS not wanting to put Survivor's name on a crappy label too. As far as the vocalist, while Robin isn't your taste and I understand that completely, it's not like he hasn't been associated with bands that can move records. In fact, I bet MSG with Robin on vocals might sell well. No?

The odd thing is, about a year or two ago, FS was talking about how he already had some kind of deal to get this album released He never gave any specifics about it, but I do remember him saying that he was very excited about the deal. So I wonder what happened since then? Did the deal fall through? Or did FS change his mind and decided that he wanted more money?
To be realistic, I don't think FS is in a position to demand a huge price. Survivor is long past its heyday, and even in its prime, it wasn't rivaling the real powerhitters of melodic rock. I mean, they weren't selling out arenas and stadiums even at the pinnacle of their career.
Maybe it has more to do with distribution rights. One thing that really sucked about "Reach" (aside from about half the songs-- sorry, couldn't resist), was that it was absolutely impossible to find anywhere in the U.S. I would imagine Frankie wants to avoid that happening again.

[Slander]

Survivor is long past its heyday, and even in its prime, it wasn't rivaling the real powerhitters of melodic rock. I mean, they weren't selling out arenas and stadiums even at the pinnacle of their career.
Maybe it has more to do with distribution rights. One thing that really sucked about "Reach" (aside from about half the songs-- sorry, couldn't resist), was that it was absolutely impossible to find anywhere in the U.S. I would imagine Frankie wants to avoid that happening again.

I bought REACH at NEHRecords.com. They are in the US. I never found finding the album at problem at all. You couldn't have said it better about selling out arena's etc. The band should have been bigger plain and simple. They ran circles around some who made it bigger. I blame it on bad promotion and also bad timing with Scotti Brothers etc. Let's not rehash that. I considered Survivor maybe the best opening MR act ever. That's not mean as an insult. It's just unfortunate.

[Red13JoePa]

Survivor is long past its heyday, and even in its prime, it wasn't rivaling the real powerhitters of melodic rock. I mean, they weren't selling out arenas and stadiums even at the pinnacle of their career.
Maybe it has more to do with distribution rights. One thing that really sucked about "Reach" (aside from about half the songs-- sorry, couldn't resist), was that it was absolutely impossible to find anywhere in the U.S. I would imagine Frankie wants to avoid that happening again.

I bought REACH at NEHRecords.com. They are in the US. I never found finding the album at problem at all. You couldn't have said it better about selling out arena's etc. The band should have been bigger plain and simple. They ran circles around some who made it bigger. I blame it on bad promotion and also bad timing with Scotti Brothers etc. Let's not rehash that. I considered Survivor maybe the best opening MR act ever. That's not mean as an insult. It's just unfortunate.

Your first 2 sentances I have major problems with and agree with David on. You could not, and cannot buy Reach REATIL OVER THE COUNTER IN THE UNITED STATES.
The last parts of your post are dead on, Survivor is certainly equal in talent and material to the headling arena rock bands of the late '70s and '80s.

[DavidWT]

Exactly, Red. It was (and is) impossible to go into a store and buy Reach. That's just really, really bad distribution. Good luck getting any impulses purchases that way. Getting "Reach" is pretty much on par with getting a bootleg recording-- you have to first be a fan of the band, know that the album exists, and then hunt it down online.

[Joe Vana]

Exactly, Red. It was (and is) impossible to go into a store and buy Reach. That's just really, really bad distribution. Good luck getting any impulses purchases that way. Getting "Reach" is pretty much on par with getting a bootleg recording-- you have to first be a fan of the band, know that the album exists, and then hunt it down online.

The distribution does not "REACH" very far.....

[Slander]

[ You could not, and cannot buy Reach REATIL OVER THE COUNTER IN THE UNITED STATES.

Why is this so important in the digital age? Also I bought my copy of REACH from a company in Colorado. It only took 3 days, and I didn't have to deal with the normal Target or Walmart bullshit.

[axecrew]

[ You could not, and cannot buy Reach REATIL OVER THE COUNTER IN THE UNITED STATES.

Why is this so important in the digital age? Also I bought my copy of REACH from a company in Colorado. It only took 3 days, and I didn't have to deal with the normal Target or Walmart bullshit.

I'm gonna break my self imposed to answer this......because the hard core fans will buy it in any media form. They(bands) don't give 2 shits about the hard core fans, they'll buy it no matter what, but how does the casual or on the fence fan buy the album if they can't walk into a store and see it? They want that sale...they don't give a shit about your sale, they already have that.

[Slander]

I'm gonna break my self imposed to answer this.......

Did you mean self-imposed silence? If you did, it lasted what? all of two days? I'm just glad you didn't name drop again or I think we would have all vomited. I'm going to say this one more time. It's the digital age. If you were not going to buy REACH right away I doubt four years later some music fan walking through Wal-Mart is going to say "Look Dear, it's a Survivor album, let's buy it." Even so, what does the band care. Are they going to really make money from the occasional impulse buy from the non die hard fan? Seriously. I hear a lot of people whining about this issue. Once again, I got my record here in the fucking United States!

[Red13JoePa]

[ You could not, and cannot buy Reach REATIL OVER THE COUNTER IN THE UNITED STATES.

Why is this so important in the digital age? Also I bought my copy of REACH from a company in Colorado. It only took 3 days, and I didn't have to deal with the normal Target or Walmart bullshit.

Hm.
Good point. Walking into a store buying a new album and walking out IS bullshit, who needs that hassel?
I rather pay for it first, then wait at least 3 days for it to come in the mail.

[Eyeof]

yes, that's after you have to do a google seach and then hope the company you are laying down your credit car number to is legit...

Slander you are sensible enough to realize that you are going to sell a hell of a lot more albums at Wal-Mart than some company online...it's a fact. If it were not so, the 'big' bands would not do it.

Once again, i also want to make the point that Reach is the ONLY ALBUM I HAVE EVER seen completley dissapear from ITunes after a week...why is that?

[MarcelJordan]

I got my Reach CD Neh Records in 4 days, and I live in Singapore. No way I'll find it at the stores here. Although I got Journey Generations from the store because it was available.

Still, the internet IS the way to go. Most CD shops here are closing down...

MJ

[Red13JoePa]

Once again, i also want to make the point that Reach is the ONLY ALBUM I HAVE EVER seen completley dissapear from ITunes after a week...why is that?

Yes, so even now with Survivor out in front of "the digital age" you cannot get Reach in digital form.
How very modern to have to "send away for it" like a "Little orphan Annie Decoder Pin."

[Slander]

Slander you are sensible enough to realize that you are going to sell a hell of a lot more albums at Wal-Mart than some company online...it's a fact. If it were not so, the 'big' bands would not do it.

Hey Eyeof, I agree with your point ONLY if you are a big enough band like Journey, Foreigner, Kiss to get an exclusive big box retailer who will promote the crap out your album in their music section. Survivor, I fear, is not big enough to warrant such a deal (I wish they were).

[Slander]

[quote="Red13JoePa"][quote="Eyeof"]
Yes, so even now with Survivor out in front of "the digital" you cannot get Reach in digital form.
quote]

I found this in less than 2 minutes of searching:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_nos ... or&x=0&y=0

It's on Amazon!

[Red13JoePa]

Not the point.

[axecrew]

Not the point.

Never is with the jealous and uninformed. Let's play the shell game and divert attention. Never concentrate on the facts, even from multiple sources, just our delusional fantasies.

[Journey/Survivor]

So...over the past 15 years....what do you have to listen to?? Reach???? Oh My.....I went through the old Survivormusic.com posts a while back when it was up....they had FIVE different albums DONE or ALMOST ready for release talked about on there over a period of years....and NOTHING came out.....then Reach came out with JP tunes on it as well when it was touted as a NEW album of ALL NEW songs....

In general I hate to see things like when Journey's "Arrival" album was being downloaded for free against the bands wishes. I certainly want musicians to be able to make money in return for the hard work that goes into writing and recording an album.

But in the case of the "Fire Makes Steel" recordings.....Thank God that those recordings were leaked......Otherwise we would have never gotten to hear any of those songs (not counting the ones that wound up on "Reach") because Frankie sure as hell wasn't going to release those songs to the public.

[MarcelJordan]

So...over the past 15 years....what do you have to listen to?? Reach???? Oh My.....I went through the old Survivormusic.com posts a while back when it was up....they had FIVE different albums DONE or ALMOST ready for release talked about on there over a period of years....and NOTHING came out.....then Reach came out with JP tunes on it as well when it was touted as a NEW album of ALL NEW songs....

In general I hate to see things like when Journey's "Arrival" album was being downloaded for free against the bands wishes. I certainly want musicians to be able to make money in return for the hard work that goes into writing and recording an album.

But in the case of the "Fire Makes Steel" recordings.....Thank God that those recordings were leaked......Otherwise we would have never gotten to hear any of those songs (not counting the ones that wound up on "Reach") because Frankie sure as hell wasn't going to release those songs to the public.

Hi J/S. Interestingly JP plays Survivor songs when he's out there, but not those Fire Makes Steel tunes which he co-wrote. Any idea why not?



MJ

[Journey/Survivor]

So...over the past 15 years....what do you have to listen to?? Reach???? Oh My.....I went through the old Survivormusic.com posts a while back when it was up....they had FIVE different albums DONE or ALMOST ready for release talked about on there over a period of years....and NOTHING came out.....then Reach came out with JP tunes on it as well when it was touted as a NEW album of ALL NEW songs....

In general I hate to see things like when Journey's "Arrival" album was being downloaded for free against the bands wishes. I certainly want musicians to be able to make money in return for the hard work that goes into writing and recording an album.

But in the case of the "Fire Makes Steel" recordings.....Thank God that those recordings were leaked......Otherwise we would have never gotten to hear any of those songs (not counting the ones that wound up on "Reach") because Frankie sure as hell wasn't going to release those songs to the public.

Hi J/S. Interestingly JP plays Survivor songs when he's out there, but not those Fire Makes Steel tunes which he co-wrote. Any idea why not?



MJ

Probably because their not hit songs? He has so many other Survivor, 38 Special, Pride Of Lions, World Stage and Ides Of March songs to chose from. It would be cool to see/hear him perform the song "Fire Makes Steel" sometime.
I did see the Bickler, Sullivan and Peterik led Survivor in Canton, Ohio around 1996 or so, and they did perform the song "Fire Makes Steel" at that show. I was probably the only one in the crowd that knew the song?

[Slander]

Not the point.

Never is with the jealous and uninformed. Let's play the shell game and divert attention. Never concentrate on the facts, even from multiple sources, just our delusional fantasies.

Who is Jealous?

How are we uniformed on the bb?

Facts?

Axe fill us in oh great one with on your insight? We bow down to your access Please educate us kind sir with more nuggets of your wisdom.

[Joe Vana]

Not the point.

Never is with the jealous and uninformed. Let's play the shell game and divert attention. Never concentrate on the facts, even from multiple sources, just our delusional fantasies.

Who is Jealous?

How are we uniformed on the bb?

Facts?

Axe fill us in oh great one with on your insight? We bow down to your access Please educate us kind sir with more nuggets of your wisdom.

Slander....

Posts like these are a BIG part of the problem on this board....re-read it and see if it sounds like a pissed off high schooler baiting someone else....

Man...I know you are better than this...

JV

[Slander]

Not the point.

Never is with the jealous and uninformed. Let's play the shell game and divert attention. Never concentrate on the facts, even from multiple sources, just our delusional fantasies.

Who is Jealous?

How are we uniformed on the bb?

Facts?

Axe fill us in oh great one with on your insight? We bow down to your access Please educate us kind sir with more nuggets of your wisdom.

Slander....

Posts like these are a BIG part of the problem on this board....re-read it and see if it sounds like a pissed off high schooler baiting someone else....

Man...I know you are better than this...

JV

JV, you are right about my post and I am better than this, but calling some of us delusional, uniformed, and jealous is hardly constructive. Once again, this goes back to my original contention. Look at the subject line of this post. I made a simple post in regards to concert date and it turns into this thread turned into a runaway train of negativity.

[MarcelJordan]

Let's remain positive here (and that's hard I can understand that), BUT if we're going to doubt Frankie's word and believe he could do better, we must let him know and bombard him with contructive q's about the new record? He does have his website and what's wrong with asking him?

MJ

[axecrew]

Ty.....you asked a simple question and I gave you an honest benign answer with no malice or anything...just straight forward whatever.....you came back with that crap filled bullshit about name dropping and whatever the rest of that shit was.
I comment on another post from someone else and again I get some junior high crapfest directed towards me....funny I didn't name anyones name but You didnt let that stop you from singling me out in your latest shitfest.
As for whom I do or don't know.......PM Joe Vana and ask him if I'm full of shit or not concerning who I do or don't know.

Joe......please feel free to answer his questions.......should he have the balls to actually pm you about it.

[Joe Vana]

Ty.....you asked a simple question and I gave you an honest benign answer with no malice or anything...just straight forward whatever.....you came back with that crap filled bullshit about name dropping and whatever the rest of that shit was.
I comment on another post from someone else and again I get some junior high crapfest directed towards me....funny I didn't name anyones name but You didnt let that stop you from singling me out in your latest shitfest.
As for whom I do or don't know.......PM Joe Vana and ask him if I'm full of shit or not concerning who I do or don't know.

Joe......please feel free to answer his questions.......should he have the balls to actually pm you about it.

I always answer PM's.....

I think in the end it's about whats "constructive"...and not "destructive"....we can all argue that point....but....in the end:

1 - Survivor puts out a great album
2 - Survivor puts out a shit album full of cliche's and weak tunes
3 - Survivor puts out a song at a time on Itunes....and we all shake our heads in dismay....
4 - Survivor reunites with its main songwriter and we all have a heart attack...mainly me hahahahah....
5 - JJ comes back
6 - DB comes back
7 - Pigs fly out of my #$%

I know there are more, but I am tired hahahahha......fill in the blanks your self......
JV

[axecrew]

And chances are in order....

1...20%
2...90%
3...90%
4...5%
5...3%
6...0%
7...never know

You did forget one tho......#8...The album comes out 1 song at a time and is a shit album

[Slander]

.PM Joe Vana and ask him if I'm full of shit or not concerning who I do or don't know.

First of all I could careless about who you are and what you do. Let's get that straight. That doesn't make your opinion any more valuable than others. Secondly, it doesn't dispute the fact and I do mean fact that most of your posts are negative in nature about FS and the current state of Survivor. Am I right or wrong here? Lastly, I don't need to PM JV. I have done it in the past and am happy that he takes time to answer the questions that he can. I don't need to PM JV to validate who you are. It's just not that important.