So...WHAT IF Journey WERE inducted into the RRHOF?

[nolippin]

It's my understanding that the HOF inducts members individually with each member having to qualify under the 25 year since first recording requirement. I have read that somewhere, but have never been able to get confirmation from the HOF.

Under that rule Augeri, Castronovo and Soto would all be excluded, and, IMO, should be excluded.

I have to respectfully disagree. It wouldn't matter if Steve and Deen had been in the band for 20 years, they are touring on of material they had NOTHING TO DO WITH.

And JSS does??

Just my point. Put JSS in there if you are going to put Augeri and Castronovo in there.

Thanks for agreeing with me.

[A Fire Inside]

Journey won't get in. They've screwed themselves over at this point, and Neal will keep touring them into the ground until he dies. It's too late for them, IMO.

IF they did, though, I'd like to see ALL musicians past and present on the bill. Including Randy Jackson, Mike Baird, JSS, and Augeri.

[atthistime]

Ok, I'm a dreamer. I want to see Steve Perry get into the R&RHOF on his own. If there is a God, this will happen.

[mnmsjrny]

It's my understanding that the HOF inducts members individually with each member having to qualify under the 25 year since first recording requirement. I have read that somewhere, but have never been able to get confirmation from the HOF.

Under that rule Augeri, Castronovo and Soto would all be excluded, and, IMO, should be excluded.

Not quite... it's usually members who have had the most impact and/or longevity with the band. For example, Fleetwood Mac was inducted in 1998 -- less than 25 years after Lindsey Buckingham & Stevie Nicks joined the band, yet who are included along with founding member Peter Green who left in the early 70s. Flip side of that being that Neal was left out of the lineup of Santana that was inducted -- perhaps because he only played on one of the three albums that version of the band released.

Should Journey get inducted to the R&RHOF the members inducted would likely be Neal, Ross, Gregg, Perry, Jon, Smitty, & Aynsley. George Tickner is a long shot. No one who has been in the band post-1984 will be included.

[mnmsjrny]

Ok, I'm a dreamer. I want to see Steve Perry get into the R&RHOF on his own. If there is a God, this will happen.

On the outside chance that would happen (IMO very unlikely -- not a whole lot of solo material to back it up) he won't be eligible until 2009 -- 25 years after Street Talk was released.

[Marabelle]

Aren't you the Voice of Rational Thought and Commentary! Bummer! Now you've taken away her dreams.

[nolippin]

That would seem appropriate. Basically, it is the classic lineup...along with Gregg and Aynsley...who would be inducted then, and I think that is how it should be.

However, I think they have some damage control to do before they will be considered due to the recent scandal.

It's my understanding that the HOF inducts members individually with each member having to qualify under the 25 year since first recording requirement. I have read that somewhere, but have never been able to get confirmation from the HOF.

Under that rule Augeri, Castronovo and Soto would all be excluded, and, IMO, should be excluded.

Not quite... it's usually members who have had the most impact and/or longevity with the band. For example, Fleetwood Mac was inducted in 1998 -- less than 25 years after Lindsey Buckingham & Stevie Nicks joined the band, yet who are included along with founding member Peter Green who left in the early 70s. Flip side of that being that Neal was left out of the lineup of Santana that was inducted -- perhaps because he only played on one of the three albums that version of the band released.

Should Journey get inducted to the R&RHOF the members inducted would likely be Neal, Ross, Gregg, Perry, Jon, Smitty, & Aynsley. George Tickner is a long shot. No one who has been in the band post-1984 will be included.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

The members that I "bolded" I think would be inducted to the HOF. George and Randy, I'm not sure, questionable to me. I feel this way based on looking at the time-line of Lynyrd Skynyrd which I posted their time line and who was inducted in the hall of fame from that band (below). I had a little Too Much Time On My Hands tonight. LOL


Neal Schon (1973-1987; 1996-present)
Steve Perry (1977-1987; 1996-1997)
Jonathan Cain (1980-1987; 1996-present)
Gregg Rolie (1973-1980)
Ross Valory (1973-1985; 1996-Present)
Steve Smith (1978-1986; 1996-1998)
Aynsley Dunbar (1974-1978)
Jeff Scott Soto (2006-present)
Steve Augeri (1998-2006)
Deen Castronovo (1998-present)
Prairie Prince (1973)
George Tickner (1973-1976)
Randy Jackson (1985-1987)
Robert Fleischman (1977)






The bolded are the ones inducted, the one's in red are not.


Lynyrd Skynyrd:
Inductees: Ronnie Van Zant (vocals; born January 15, 1949, died October 20, 1977), Allen Collins (guitar; born July 19, 1952, died January 23, 1990), Steve Gaines (guitar; born September 14, 1949, died October 20, 1977), Ed King (guitar; born September 14, 1949), Gary Rossington (guitar; born December 4, 1951), Billy Powell (keyboards; born June 3, 1952), Leon Wilkeson (bass; born April 2, 1952, died July 27, 2001), Bob Burns (drums; born November 24, 1950), Artimus Pyle (drums; born July 15, 1948)

1970
Roadie Billy Powell joins the band as keyboardist.

1971
Bob Burns leaves the band and is replaced by Rickey Medlocke. In January Lynyrd Skynyrd record their demo album at Quinvy Studios in Muscle Shoals.

1972
Rickey Medlocke leaves the band and Bob Burns returns.
Leon Wilkeson replaces Larry Junstrom.

1973
Rickey Medlocke rejoins the band giving them two drummers, but leaves the band soon after.
Leon Wilkeson leaves the band but soon rejoins.
Ed King joins the band as bass player but later switches to guitar.

1975
Bob Burns leaves the band.
Ed King leaves the band.
Artimus Pyle joins the band.
The Honkettes, comprised of Leslie Hawkins, JoJo Billingsley and Cassie Gaines become a part of the band

1976
Steve Gaines joins the band.

1987
A new Lynyrd Skynyrd is formed in September comprising Rossington, Powell, Pyle, Wilkeson, King, Johnny Van Zant (vocals), Randall Hall ( a long-time friend of the band and member of The Allen Collins Band), along with Dale Krantz Rossington and Carol Bristow on background vocals. The band makes their first public appearance at the Charlie Daniel's Volunteer Jam XIII and will eventually perform more than 30 dates on a reunion tour, marking the tenth anniversary of the fatal plane crash.

1992
Artimus Pyle leaves the band, citing personal differences.

Kurt Custer joins the band as drummer.

Leon's good friend and former bassist of The Rossington Band, Timmy Lindsey, stood in for Leon from June thru the end of that year, during the Last Rebel Tour. Leon was unable to be with the band for health reasons during that time.

1995
Ed King becomes ill with congestive heart failure and leaves the band.

1996
The band signs a multi-album agreement with CMC International Records.
Rickey Medlocke of Blackfoot rejoins the band, this time as guitarist.
Hughie Thomasson of the Outlaws is also added as guitarist.

1998
Michael Cartellone replaces Owen Hale as drummer.

2001
Ean Evans, a long time friend of the band, joins as the new bass player.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

Oh, what the hell I'm on a roll with this.

Would any "arena" bands make it to the HOF? I don't think so, not for quite a while. Van Halen should make it within 2 years, they influenced a lot of bands, especially all the "hair" bands after them.

Here's from the Hall of Fame:

Leaders in the music industry joined together in 1983 to establish the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Foundation. One of the Foundation’s many functions is to recognize the contributions of those who have had a significant impact on the evolution, development and perpetuation of rock and roll by inducting them into the Hall of Fame.

How did Journey and their music have a significant impact on the evolution, development and perpetuation of rock and roll?


Performers
Artists become eligible for induction 25 years after the release of their first record. Criteria include the influence and significance of the artist’s contributions to the development and perpetuation of rock and roll.

Yes, they would be eligible. But do they have the criteria?

The Foundation’s nominating committee, composed of rock and roll historians, selects nominees each year in the Performer category. Ballots are then sent to an international voting body of about 1,000 rock experts. Those performers who receive the highest number of votes, and more than 50 percent of the vote, are inducted. The Foundation generally inducts five to seven performers each year.

[Milos]

It's my understanding that the HOF inducts members individually with each member having to qualify under the 25 year since first recording requirement. I have read that somewhere, but have never been able to get confirmation from the HOF.

Under that rule Augeri, Castronovo and Soto would all be excluded, and, IMO, should be excluded.

I really don’t think that Randy Jackson or Mike Baird will be getting inducted into the RRHOF with Journey, and I don’t necessarily think they deserve to. I don’t think Mike Baird even played on the ROR album. I think he was just a hired gun for the tour. All the songs on ROR were written by Perry, Neal, and Jon. Yes, Randy Jackson did play on the album and toured in support of it, but he wasn’t really an official member of Journey. These guys were both hired guns.

I do think that both Augeri and Castronovo deserve to be included because they both are/were “official” members of the band for eight years. Augeri has writing credits on three Journey CDs and Dean is not only the drummer, but also a featured lead singer at times. How can these guys not be considered?

I suppose if what nolippin states is true, then they might not get in on a technicality, but that would be a shame because of all their hard work and dedication to the band over the past eight years. Now, if they had just joined the band I might feel differently, but they've been official members for almost a decade now.

[CatEyes]

Oh, what the hell I'm on a roll with this.

Would any "arena" bands make it to the HOF? I don't think so, not for quite a while. Van Halen should make it within 2 years, they influenced a lot of bands, especially all the "hair" bands after them.

Here's from the Hall of Fame:

Leaders in the music industry joined together in 1983 to establish the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Foundation. One of the Foundation’s many functions is to recognize the contributions of those who have had a significant impact on the evolution, development and perpetuation of rock and roll by inducting them into the Hall of Fame.

How did Journey and their music have a significant impact on the evolution, development and perpetuation of rock and roll?


Artists become eligible for induction 25 years after the release of their first record. Criteria include the influence and significance of the artist’s contributions to the development and perpetuation of rock and roll.

Yes, they would be eligible. But do they have the criteria?

The Foundation’s nominating committee, composed of rock and roll historians, selects nominees each year in the Performer category. Ballots are then sent to an international voting body of about 1,000 rock experts. Those performers who receive the highest number of votes, and more than 50 percent of the vote, are inducted. The Foundation generally inducts five to seven performers each year.

You can find information on both questions on our J2TH website- www.journeytothehalloffame.com - click on "research" on the nav bar. The info was there for anyone to use in their letters they might write. We also sent additional information to the major players of the NomCom Committee in a packet.


We have taken a lot of steps toward this endeavor. I hope for a positive announcement mid-September.

Cat

[conversationpc]

It's my understanding that the HOF inducts members individually with each member having to qualify under the 25 year since first recording requirement. I have read that somewhere, but have never been able to get confirmation from the HOF.

Under that rule Augeri, Castronovo and Soto would all be excluded, and, IMO, should be excluded.

Didn't Brian Johnson get inducted along with the other guys in AC/DC? He joined the band in 1980 and AC/DC was inducted in 2003.

[yogi]

If Journey gets in it is 100% on the strength of 'The Perry Years'. They get in because of the albums Infinity - Raised On Radio.

The band members that 'tour' as Journey' should NOT be included.

Are they damn good???? Hell yes. Are they keeping the name out there & alive?? Hell Yes!!! BUTTTTTTTTTT.....

98% of the material that 95% of the people come to see live are from the albums stated above. Steve A. Jeff Soto & Deen are all touring Journey. They have NOTHING to do with their REAL success.

[NoMoreTails]

Its undoubted up to the band as to who they include. Supposedly Neal was to go in with Santana but Carlos said no.

[CatEyes]

Its undoubted up to the band as to who they include. Supposedly Neal was to go in with Santana but Carlos said no.

I also heard that it was a HOF deciision based on information given to them:

According to Santana's website http://www.santana.com Gregg Rollie was with the group from 1966 to 1972. Four albums were released (I believe all went gold - which was major back then) and Rollie produced 3 of them

According to the same site, Neal Schon was with Santana 1971-1972. I believe he started late in 1971, so that would be a total period of 6 months to a year.

It seems that the overall contribution was a factor. I still cannot get a clear statement as to who made the final decision.

Cat

[squirt1]

Yogi- You hit it !!!! May I add- 75% left when Perry left. Therefore stadium dates and record sales are GONE !!! So are the hits. The writing ability of Perry Schon and Cain , the concert sales and album sales should have put them in already. Could someone post where we can read some of the one hits that are in already? I have no admiration for the RnRHOF. They are musically political and it should be a fan issue.

[Foolish Heart]

I have to respectfully disagree. It wouldn't mater if Steve and Deen had been in the band for 20 years, they are touring on of material they had NOTHING TO DO WITH.

1 or 2 songs each concert from Augeri/Castronovo material, zero hits, pathetic album sales, zero name recognition does not equate them with the likes of Dunbar, Smith, Rolie, Cain, Valory, Schon, and Perry. The hits, the PUBLIC RECOGNITION was from Infinity to ROR.


But to think that those two had ANYTHING to do with the success of Journey is foolish thinking.


Respectfully,





While I edited your original post, these comments say it all. I agree with you 100%!!!!!!!!!!

Knox[/quote]

[conversationpc]

According to the same site, Neal Schon was with Santana 1971-1972. I believe he started late in 1971, so that would be a total period of 6 months to a year.

Isn't it well-known that Schon actually played on the "Abraxas" album but was not listed in the liner notes? That would put his time in the band from 1970-72, which includes their most well-known album from that period.

[WalrusOct9]

The RaR HOF doesn't have to induct all members of a band...Neal was a member of Santana but only the original lineup was inducted...Crespo and Dufay didn't get in with Aerosmith, etc.

My guess is if they somehow got in, they might all be there but they won't perform....they'll get someone else to sing as a one-off, like when the Doors (Eddie Vedder) or Queen (Dave Grohl) were inducted.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

Okay, this is who I think would be inducted for Journey. I was looking at the history of the other bands that were inducted and the history of each band. I won't post each band - LOL

The bolded ones would be inducted, IMO.

It's going to be years for them to be nominated. Once those nominating members are gone and more members are "our" age that are in, they'll have a better chance, IMO

Neal Schon (1973-1987; 1996-present)
Steve Perry (1977-1987; 1996-1997)
Jonathan Cain (1980-1987; 1996-present)
Gregg Rolie (1973-1980)
Ross Valory (1973-1985; 1996-Present)
Steve Smith (1978-1986; 1996-1998)
Aynsley Dunbar (1974-1978)
Jeff Scott Soto (2006-present)
Steve Augeri (1998-2006)
Deen Castronovo (1998-present)
Prairie Prince (1973)
George Tickner (1973-1976)
Randy Jackson (1985-1987)
Robert Fleischman (1977)

[yogi]

Suite,

Minus the Tinker guy, I agree with you 100%!!!!

[conversationpc]

Okay, this is who I think would be inducted for Journey. I was looking at the history of the other bands that were inducted and the history of each band. I won't post each band - LOL

The bolded ones would be inducted, IMO.

It's going to be years for them to be nominated. Once those nominating members are gone and more members are "our" age that are in, they'll have a better chance, IMO

Neal Schon (1973-1987; 1996-present)
Steve Perry (1977-1987; 1996-1997)
Jonathan Cain (1980-1987; 1996-present)
Gregg Rolie (1973-1980)
Ross Valory (1973-1985; 1996-Present)
Steve Smith (1978-1986; 1996-1998)
Aynsley Dunbar (1974-1978)
Jeff Scott Soto (2006-present)
Steve Augeri (1998-2006)
Deen Castronovo (1998-present)
Prairie Prince (1973)
George Tickner (1973-1976)
Randy Jackson (1985-1987)
Robert Fleischman (1977)

Interesting take. I think I'd take Dunbar and Tickner out, though. Tickner was only a member through the first album and Aynsley really only played on one successful album, though I do really like the pre-Perry stuff.

[X factor]

Okay, this is who I think would be inducted for Journey. I was looking at the history of the other bands that were inducted and the history of each band. I won't post each band - LOL

The bolded ones would be inducted, IMO.

It's going to be years for them to be nominated. Once those nominating members are gone and more members are "our" age that are in, they'll have a better chance, IMO

Neal Schon (1973-1987; 1996-present)
Steve Perry (1977-1987; 1996-1997)
Jonathan Cain (1980-1987; 1996-present)
Gregg Rolie (1973-1980)
Ross Valory (1973-1985; 1996-Present)
Steve Smith (1978-1986; 1996-1998)
Aynsley Dunbar (1974-1978)
Jeff Scott Soto (2006-present)
Steve Augeri (1998-2006)
Deen Castronovo (1998-present)
Prairie Prince (1973)
George Tickner (1973-1976)
Randy Jackson (1985-1987)
Robert Fleischman (1977)

Interesting take. I think I'd take Dunbar and Tickner out, though. Tickner was only a member through the first album and Aynsley really only played on one successful album, though I do really like the pre-Perry stuff.

Ah, but go back to Skynyrd. Bob Burns only really played on one album, and he was there. Artimus, while not the "original" drummer, was nevertheless considered to be the drummer from the "classic" Skynyrd lineup. Kinda like earlier how someone brought up Nicks and Buckingham for FM- even though they weren;t originals, they WERE Fleetwood Mac, to most fans.
As far as who plays, thats really up to who pulls the strings in the band. Michael Cartelone didn't play at the induction- he stepped aside so Burns and Pyle could play, yet the same year when Blondie went in, Debby Harry refused to let two of her old band members (Nigel Harris was one, I believe) play onstage with her current lineup.
Interesting stuff. I think when they get inducted, and I do believe it's a WHEN not an if, SMB has the right line up.
Robert Fleishman won't go in until 2230, when they finally induct the VINNIE VINCENT INVASION...

[yulog]

i think the present controversy could easily hurt their chances of getting in the hall of fame they are having a hard enough time without all the crap thats going on

[CatEyes]

According to the same site, Neal Schon was with Santana 1971-1972. I believe he started late in 1971, so that would be a total period of 6 months to a year.

Isn't it well-known that Schon actually played on the "Abraxas" album but was not listed in the liner notes? That would put his time in the band from 1970-72, which includes their most well-known album from that period.

I have never heard it. Maybe someone should let them know so the site can be accurate.

Cat