hello

[donnaplease]

BTW, you never saw Steve Augeri Lip Synch anywhere. That, sir, is a fact. Even if you believe the rumors, the person that is responsible for the claims never said Steve was lip synching. They said he was singing to a pre-recorded tape of his own vocals.

Sorry, I don't see a difference here. Slice it anyway you want it is an embarrassment.

And...SA has never denied it...

Why would he? Double

Ummm... because it's ruined his reputation, maybe?? I don't know, just a thought, but if people were calling me a fraud, I'd want to SOMEHOW get my side of the story out there.

All I know about this whole thing, I've learned here. But, using your 3 examples in the above post, even if he was singing into a dead mic, and the first 3 rows or so were the only ones who heard him, wouldn't that still be lip synching to the other 300 rows of people who didn't hear him?? What they saw on the screen and heard on the sound system were not the same performance. And that, my friend, is lip synching. Wasn't he 'synching' his 'lips' to the pre-recorded music??? While hiding behing the big fuzzy microphone???

--------The old TRI EYE ROLL ,work it !!

Can't 'one up' me!!!!

[EclipticJourney]

BTW, you never saw Steve Augeri Lip Synch anywhere. That, sir, is a fact. Even if you believe the rumors, the person that is responsible for the claims never said Steve was lip synching. They said he was singing to a pre-recorded tape of his own vocals.

Sorry, I don't see a difference here. Slice it anyway you want it is an embarrassment.

And...SA has never denied it...

Why would he? Double

Ummm... because it's ruined his reputation, maybe?? I don't know, just a thought, but if people were calling me a fraud, I'd want to SOMEHOW get my side of the story out there.

All I know about this whole thing, I've learned here. But, using your 3 examples in the above post, even if he was singing into a dead mic, and the first 3 rows or so were the only ones who heard him, wouldn't that still be lip synching to the other 300 rows of people who didn't hear him?? What they saw on the screen and heard on the sound system were not the same performance. And that, my friend, is lip synching. Wasn't he 'synching' his 'lips' to the pre-recorded music??? While hiding behing the big fuzzy microphone???

How has it ruined his reputation? I know there was a huge campaign to ruin his reputation, but it was based on 'he said she said' principles. Not one solid fact.

As I said before, I've heard all sides of the story. I've heard Dean's and those that believe him and I've heard others that say they heard Steve singing plain as day from their vantage point. Who's telling the truth? I'm sure they all believe they are, but only one story can be the absolute truth.

I've heard people say he's been lip synching for 2 or 3 years now. Then how do you explain the voice on the studio recording done just last year? I've attended shows from 2001 to 2005 and have never heard anything but Steve's true voice, faults and all. Are you going to tell me I'm full of shit?

From the way I'm looking at it, people will believe what they want to believe. It's hard to take the choir that insists Steve was lip synching seriously, with all of the contradictory voices out there and with all of the hate speech that has come with the claims. I do, however, believe Steve was struggling and had a severe problem with his vocal cords. That is the only point that has probably been proven out of this whole thing.

Sometimes silence is the best way to respond to ignorance and personal attacks. Why play into someone's fantasy and oh so obvious character assassination plans? It only empowers those with an agenda.

[duke22]

Sorry everyone. I did not mean to stir this pot again. Not my intention.

[ArnelRox]

How has it ruined his reputation?

U think it's good for a singer's rep to have Rolling Stone say u lipped to tape?

I know there was a huge campaign to ruin his reputation, but it was based on 'he said she said' principles. Not one solid fact.

No campaign. People just wanted the tapes to stop & Journey to go live. That was all. If that hurt SA's rep in the process, well it needed to be done. But u seem to ignore the fact that the rumors were rampant in the music biz LONG before anyone here said anything about it. I heard them in 2004. How is that a campaign to ruin SA's rep?

There WERE plenty of facts. Just listen to some boots. That's all it takes. Vox sound identical nite after nite after nite. Every once in a while, he went live for part of a show & then realized how bad he sounded. Jeremey has posted clips that demonstrate this, Dean has posted clips, AR has posted video. How much more facts do u really need? Did he need to wear a shirt that said "I'm singing, but what u are hearing is coming from a tape?"

As I said before, I've heard all sides of the story. I've heard Dean's and those that believe him and I've heard others that say they heard Steve singing plain as day from their vantage point. Who's telling the truth? I'm sure they all believe they are, but only one story can be the absolute truth.

The people who claim they heard him saw a man actually singing on stage into a big mic. However the voice going out to the crowd came from a tape.

I've heard people say he's been lip synching for 2 or 3 years now.

In 2004, I know his voice was suffering. That's when he started doing the thing above his head & his voice would get turned down in the mix. Or, he would pass the mic to Deen. Later that yr when I saw him again, I believe he was augmented for parts of songs.

Then how do you explain the voice on the studio recording done just last year?

Read my lips. Pro Tools.

I've attended shows from 2001 to 2005 and have never heard anything but Steve's true voice, faults and all. Are you going to tell me I'm full of shit?

If u went last yr, & went to an early show where he actually sang, u heard his voice. However, there were several that he didn't sing the majority of stuff. What we think we hear at a concert isn't necessarily what is going on. That's not saying ur full of shit. It's saying the excitement keeps us going. Listen to several boots. Have u even done that?

From the way I'm looking at it, people will believe what they want to believe. It's hard to take the choir that insists Steve was lip synching seriously, with all of the contradictory voices out there and with all of the hate speech that has come with the claims.

Yes there has been a lot of hate speech. But this is our favorite band. It's an emotional thing. To find out the truth for urself, get a few boots from last yr & listen to them. Just listen to one song over & over. U will hear it.

I do, however, believe Steve was struggling and had a severe problem with his vocal cords. That is the only point that has probably been proven out of this whole thing.

He did. But he had it for a long time & it didn't get better. Obviously Journey gave him 2 yrs to get it together. They let him keep working, making money, seeing a coach & they played tapes on the hard parts in 2004 & for most of the songs in 2005 & 2006. But it didn't get better. That's sad, but IMHO, he should have stepped down. If he had stepped down last yr, this never would have happened. We'd all think good things about him, even if we didn't like him in the 1st place. We'd all say what a gracious man he was & wish him well. He brought this hatred on himself by agreeing to do what he did.

Sometimes silence is the best way to respond to ignorance and personal attacks. Why play into someone's fantasy and oh so obvious character assassination plans? It only empowers those with an agenda.

Maybe I should have stayed silent here. U certainly appear to have an agenda when u post here, don't u? That is not an attack on u btw. It's just a statement of fact.

[bublhed]

Excellent break down. Eloquently put.

[donnaplease]

Ummm... because it's ruined his reputation, maybe?? I don't know, just a thought, but if people were calling me a fraud, I'd want to SOMEHOW get my side of the story out there.

All I know about this whole thing, I've learned here. But, using your 3 examples in the above post, even if he was singing into a dead mic, and the first 3 rows or so were the only ones who heard him, wouldn't that still be lip synching to the other 300 rows of people who didn't hear him?? What they saw on the screen and heard on the sound system were not the same performance. And that, my friend, is lip synching. Wasn't he 'synching' his 'lips' to the pre-recorded music??? While hiding behing the big fuzzy microphone???

How has it ruined his reputation? I know there was a huge campaign to ruin his reputation, but it was based on 'he said she said' principles. Not one solid fact.

As I said before, I've heard all sides of the story. I've heard Dean's and those that believe him and I've heard others that say they heard Steve singing plain as day from their vantage point. Who's telling the truth? I'm sure they all believe they are, but only one story can be the absolute truth.

I've heard people say he's been lip synching for 2 or 3 years now. Then how do you explain the voice on the studio recording done just last year? I've attended shows from 2001 to 2005 and have never heard anything but Steve's true voice, faults and all. Are you going to tell me I'm full of shit?

From the way I'm looking at it, people will believe what they want to believe. It's hard to take the choir that insists Steve was lip synching seriously, with all of the contradictory voices out there and with all of the hate speech that has come with the claims. I do, however, believe Steve was struggling and had a severe problem with his vocal cords. That is the only point that has probably been proven out of this whole thing.

Sometimes silence is the best way to respond to ignorance and personal attacks. Why play into someone's fantasy and oh so obvious character assassination plans? It only empowers those with an agenda.

IMO, reputations are rarely built on 'facts'. They are built on people's beliefs about the character of an individual. Given the position that this guy has been in, I believe that some form of denial would be warranted, if in fact he denies this. We don't know whether or not he will deny it, cause we've not heard anything from him. Believe it or not, I'm not really on any side of this fence, I don't care if he did it or not. What I AM saying is that the old adage 'innocent until proven guilty' only works in a court of law (and sometimes not even there). Yes, sometimes silence is the best way to respond to ignorance and personal attacks. This is not one of those times. HIS silence has said a lot to me. It's not what Dean and others have said, it's what Steve Augeri hasn't said...

I can't explain anything about his singing. And no, I'm not gonna tell you you're full of shit. There's lots of other people here that will, though. But I will ask you this: if the people in row 3 actually heard him singing and those folks in row 33 heard a taped version of some prior performance, then what do you call that???

[ArnelRox]

I can't explain anything about his singing. And no, I'm not gonna tell you you're full of shit. There's lots of other people here that will, though. But I will ask you this: if the people in row 3 actually heard him singing and those folks in row 33 heard a taped version of some prior performance, then what do you call that???

It's technically not lipping I guess if u are singing to a tape of ur own voice. But it takes a hell of a lot more time to type out something like "SA was singing but the vocals he was singing were mixed down low & a tape was being played alongside them turned up loud so what the crowd actually heard was almost predominantly the tape". Sheesh who has time to type that out every time? So we say "lipping" to be brief. Get it?

I'm sure someone like Jeremy could demo this for us by taking 2 voices singing the same song, turning one waaaaay down & the other waaaay up in the mix.

[EclipticJourney]

How has it ruined his reputation?

U think it's good for a singer's rep to have Rolling Stone say u lipped to tape?

It doesn't surprise me that a rag like Rolling Stone, who has gone out of it's way to dismiss Journey repeatedly in the past, would sign on to the Conspiracy Theory.

[donnaplease]

It's technically not lipping I guess if u are singing to a tape of ur own voice.

So what was Ashley Simpson doing on SNL???? She got busted too.

[ArnelRox]

How has it ruined his reputation?

U think it's good for a singer's rep to have Rolling Stone say u lipped to tape?

It doesn't surprise me that a rag like Rolling Stone, who has gone out of it's way to dismiss Journey repeatedly in the past, would sign on to the Conspiracy Theory.

That's the ONLY one of my points u answer. I guess that's a concession that I'm right on my other points, then.
& for the record, u answered a different question, not the one I posed. Whether or not Rolling Stone likes Journey or liked them in the past, my question was whether or not the story they ran was good for a singer's rep?

Try reading what I write Rich & answering accordingly next time, ok?

Oh & btw, what about Mark & Brian & all the other radio shows that went w/the story? Did they go out of their way to dismiss Journey repeatedly in the past too?

[ArnelRox]

It's technically not lipping I guess if u are singing to a tape of ur own voice.

So what was Ashley Simpson doing on SNL???? She got busted too.

Well I don't think she was even singing along, was she? She was just making the lip movements.

[JeremyP]

From the way I'm looking at it, people will believe what they want to believe. It's hard to take the choir that insists Steve was lip synching seriously, with all of the contradictory voices out there and with all of the hate speech that has come with the claims.

I just wanted to say that I think you shouldn't let anyone else make up your mind for you. You should use your ears, review the boots, and come to your own conclusions.

As I've said on this board a few times, I became a fan because of the Augeri lineup. That was my Journey and I didn't know of or want any other. That's where I'm coming from when I say that I personally believe the lip synch thing happened.

I don't base that on reading anyone else's opinion or letting anyone tell me what I should think, I just gave the bootlegs an honest listen, and heard the same exact vocal perfomance with the same exact intonation and nuances as on the Vegas dvd on song after song from several different bootlegs. I also have bootlegs where he's clearly not lip synching and the vocal mannerisms are different from show to show.

That's what I base my opinion on. I went and did the research on my own, and I think that's what it's gonna take for you to form a solid belief about what went down.

I think the hate speech is immature, but it doesn't really affect anything. There's hate speech about Perry, Augeri, Neal, Herbie, and just about everyone else associated with Journey and it happens with all other bands as well.

All I'm saying is, I get where you're coming from and I encourage you to look into the matter yourself and see what you find.

[ArnelRox]

I just wanted to say that I think you shouldn't let anyone else make up your mind for you. You should use your ears, review the boots, and come to your own conclusions.

As I've said on this board a few times, I became a fan because of the Augeri lineup. That was my Journey and I didn't know of or want any other. That's where I'm coming from when I say that I personally believe the lip synch thing happened.

I don't base that on reading anyone else's opinion or letting anyone tell me what I should think, I just gave the bootlegs an honest listen, and heard the same exact vocal perfomance with the same exact intonation and nuances as on the Vegas dvd on song after song from several different bootlegs. I also have bootlegs where he's clearly not lip synching and the vocal mannerisms are different from show to show.

That's what I base my opinion on. I went and did the research on my own, and I think that's what it's gonna take for you to form a solid belief about what went down.

I think the hate speech is immature, but it doesn't really affect anything. There's hate speech about Perry, Augeri, Neal, Herbie, and just about everyone else associated with Journey and it happens with all other bands as well.

All I'm saying is, I get where you're coming from and I encourage you to look into the matter yourself and see what you find.

Good post Jeremy.

[JeremyP]

Good post Jeremy.

Thanks Susie.

[Lula]

Susie, YOU ROCK!!!

Excellent responses, points, etc...