OT: ohsherrie

[Rockindeano]

Was it "Soviet" of us to do the same thing to Japan after WWII? We imposed democracy on them, didn't we?

Come on Dave, you are smarter than this.

The Japs attacked America ON A,erican soil. They had that one coming. Besides, it is signed in the agreement of Churchill and Roosevelt in Germany that Japan would not be allowed to have a military. Hell, that was the best news for Japan. They could just move on with life and kick the USA's ass in free trade, all the while America defends Japan. Japan came out smelling like a rose didn't they?

A WWII joke, to stir up the thread a little.

What was the temperature when the Americans dropped the bomb at Nagasaki?



Answer- A little Nippy

[conversationpc]

Come on Dave, you are smarter than this.

The Japs attacked America ON A,erican soil. They had that one coming. Besides, it is signed in the agreement of Churchill and Roosevelt in Germany that Japan would not be allowed to have a military. Hell, that was the best news for Japan. They could just move on with life and kick the USA's ass in free trade, all the while America defends Japan. Japan came out smelling like a rose didn't they?

I realize that and I would never connect the events surrounding WWII with the war in Iraq but the fact that we imposed democracy on Japan like we are attempting to do in Iraq IS comparable because many at the time also thought that it wouldn't work there, either.

[conversationpc]

Gotta call it a night, folks. It's been real.

Please don't lay waste to the forum whilst I sleep.

[Blueskies]

Saddam was not a threat to us, just his own people. He could have cared less about any" cause" .....just his own egomaniacal power trip. The dude was not religious and didnt have that kind of agenda. He was money and power hungry. He didnt have any connections to the terrorists, in fact he would have nothing to do with Bin Laden. He wouldnt want someone coming into his country that the people might like and follow more than him. We went into Irag because George wanted to look good...like he was doing something about 9-11 and to one- up daddy. ...and to line the pockets of his cronies. Good reasons for this country to invade another? Not to me! Iraq didnt hold the threat. It was in Afganistan...and within Saudi Arabia. ...but we wouldnt go there would we? The Bush and Saudi families are too tight. ....and Afganistan didnt have the resources we would be interested in.....oil they have opium though...if Bush was still partying maybe we would have done the job right and kept the force there.

[Rockindeano]

Just where is good ol Osama? I thought our fearless leader was "gonna smoke him out of his hole and bring him to justice?"

He has got more problems at home than he knows what to do with.

Now Karl Rove is under investigation. Front page, CNN.com.

It just gets uglier and uglier for Bush.

[Blueskies]

Bush and friends are all criminals.

[squirt1]

Lord,I don't know where to start. Amen The way I remember there were shananigans trying to block the military vote and we all know how the soldiers vote. Gore would have won if he carried his own state. Evidently the people of Tenn. spoke . Both parties pander for votes while Rome burns. We really are fighting Russia and China and their puppet states. While the Dems block us from drilling in the Gulf etc, China is. How much do you want to pay $ 6-7 like the Euro's? Neither party closes the border hoping to get more votes and cheap labor. Saddam was paying terrorists families 25,000 if their terrorist died and had AlQueda in his country. He got into it with Abu Nidal and shot him point blank. What do you people think WMD is? He killed 300,000 Kurds with WMD and had Russian special ops helpng him with more and launching systems to hit Israel and then maybe on a boat to hit the US off our shores. When we went in from the south a convoy was shown on TV (55 tractor trailers) heading out to Syria. The Israelis and us watched by satillite and it got buried in the Beccka Valley where terrorists abound. As far as Osama , we know he is at about 5-6 thousand feet with the tribes in a mountainous section of Pakistan. Mushariff has to balance the factions in his country to stay in power. Who cares where he is anymore. Amen

[Rockindeano]

Lord,I don't know where to start. Amen The way I remember there were shananigans trying to block the military vote and we all know how the soldiers vote. Gore would have won if he carried his own state. Evidently the people of Tenn. spoke .

I love how the republicans put this out there.

Tennessee is an old school state. Biggots, and old time dems, which are now republicans. he had no shot to win Tennessee.

Edwards didn't carry NC. Big deal?

Want to bet Guiliani won't carry his own state in 08? I KNOW he won't, if a certain woman is the Dem nominee.

This argument is retarded.

[ohsherrie]

I'm sorry but your hatred makes you friggin' blind.

I'm sorry, but do you know how completely stupid that comment is? How do you suppose I came to hate the SOB so much? It sure as hell wasn't because he did anything to impress me. If I was blind I wouldn't see what a totally worthless disaster he is.

Well gee, now that I think about it, that sounds a lot like you doesn't it?

But then anyone who thinks vouchers are the way to solve this country's education problems probably won't get that.

[RedWingFan]

But then anyone who thinks vouchers are the way to solve this country's education problems probably won't get that.

Being the liberal you are I know your big new idea is to throw even more money at the problem!

[conversationpc]

But then anyone who thinks vouchers are the way to solve this country's education problems probably won't get that.

They aren't the solution but they're a step in the right direction, in my opinion.

[ohsherrie]

But then anyone who thinks vouchers are the way to solve this country's education problems probably won't get that.

Being the liberal you are I know your big new idea is to throw even more money at the problem!

If I had the answer I'd solve the problem, but I know that giving vouchers to people who can afford to put the rest of the private tuition with it isn't the answer. SOLs and "No Child Left Behind" aren't the answer either. The children aren't learning RWF. They are just memorizing the right answers to tests questions. That isn't learning.

Giving $1000 vouchers to well-to-do and upper middle class parents so their kids can get a decent education while the fastest growing segment of our society, the lower middle and poor segment, does without is so absurd I can't see how any intelligent human being can possible think it makes any sense at all. All that will do is further broaden the ever widening income gap.

[Blueskies]

But then anyone who thinks vouchers are the way to solve this country's education problems probably won't get that.

Being the liberal you are I know your big new idea is to throw even more money at the problem!

If I had the answer I'd solve the problem, but I know that giving vouchers to people who can afford to put the rest of the private tuition with it isn't the answer. SOLs and "No Child Left Behind" aren't the answer either. The children aren't learning RWF. They are just memorizing the right answers to tests questions. That isn't learning.

Giving $1000 vouchers to well-to-do and upper middle class parents so their kids can get a decent education while the fastest growing segment of our society, the lower middle and poor segment, does without is so absurd I can't see how any intelligent human being can possible think it makes any sense at all. All that will do is further broaden the ever widening income gap.

right on, sister!

[RedWingFan]

Giving $1000 vouchers to well-to-do and upper middle class parents so their kids can get a decent education while the fastest growing segment of our society, the lower middle and poor segment, does without is so absurd I can't see how any intelligent human being can possible think it makes any sense at all. All that will do is further broaden the ever widening income gap.

How can you not realize that hitting the school system in the pocketbook will motivate them to compete with private schools. Lets use another field, I don't care cable companies or lawn care service. The gov't forces you to pay the company whether you use their service or not. They have no incentive to make you happy with good service. You're still free to fork over additional money to get better service from another company but you still have to pay the gov't company every red cent! Where's the incentive to keep the customer/parents happy???

[conversationpc]

Giving $1000 vouchers to well-to-do and upper middle class parents so their kids can get a decent education while the fastest growing segment of our society, the lower middle and poor segment, does without is so absurd I can't see how any intelligent human being can possible think it makes any sense at all. All that will do is further broaden the ever widening income gap.

Well-to-do and upper middle class parents can ALREADY afford them. I can't see how any intelligent human being can possibly think it makes any sense at all that it would help regular middle class folks afford better education for their children. My wife and I are firmly ensconced in the middle class and have no delusions of being rich any time in the near future and it would certainly help us afford better education. Meanwhile, my wife and I are scuttling along, trying to pay off debts while the government eats our well-earned tax dollars, spending it on public schools that have little or no chance of properly educating children.

To be fair, I like my daughter's public school and they provide services that the government pays for but if I could afford a good private school, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

[ohsherrie]

How the hell is the public school system supposed to compete with private schools? Even suggesting something that absurd is pure Republican ignorance of the realities that most working class people in this country face. The public schools are not a for profit organization. What would they be competing for? What would they have to gain?

If vouchers were given, not more than a third of the parents of the kids that go to my grandson's elementary school would be able to take advantage of them. I also know that to be the case for the school my younger sister's kids attend in Nebraska and the school in my mom's hometown in Iowa. So I guess all you Republicans are willing to throw all those other kids under the bus so you can send yours to a private school. But then that's the Republican way isn't it?

[RedWingFan]

How the hell is the public school system supposed to compete with private schools? Even suggesting something that absurd is pure Republican ignorance of the realities that most working class people in this country face. The public schools are not a for profit organization.

Oh some make a profit. I wouldn't call it an organization but a MONOPOLY!!!!!

What would they be competing for? What would they have to gain?

Oh I don't know a safe environment that kids actually learn in?

If vouchers were given, not more than a third of the parents of the kids that go to my grandson's elementary school would be able to take advantage of them. I also know that to be the case for the school my younger sister's kids attend in Nebraska and the school in my mom's hometown in Iowa. So I guess all you Republicans are willing to throw all those other kids under the bus so you can send yours to a private school. But then that's the Republican way isn't it?

I might as well be talking to this wall right here Don't you realize that the ones who use the vouchers aren't the only ones that benefit. The public schools would be forced to improve to keep customers, which would make a better product for those that continue in public schools Like companies in the private sector are forced to do every day. Never had a business course huh?

[ohsherrie]

RWF, there's obviously no point in talking to you about this. That's the kindest way I know to put it. Saying what I really think right now would be breaking Andrew's rules, so I'll just leave you to your delusions.

[RedWingFan]

RWF, there's obviously no point in talking to you about this. That's the kindest way I know to put it. Saying what I really think right now would be breaking Andrew's rules, so I'll just leave you to your delusions.

I know! Typically when some are confronted with known facts and common sense thinking, instead of feeling. Libs tend to erupt into name calling and such. I'm done if you are Have a nice day!

[conversationpc]

RWF, there's obviously no point in talking to you about this. That's the kindest way I know to put it. Saying what I really think right now would be breaking Andrew's rules, so I'll just leave you to your delusions.

Sherry, if that's the way you feel then think about how your own posts sound when WE read them. You sound the exact same way that you say we sound when responding to you. It cuts both ways, you know.

[RedWingFan]

RWF, there's obviously no point in talking to you about this. That's the kindest way I know to put it. Saying what I really think right now would be breaking Andrew's rules, so I'll just leave you to your delusions.

Sherry, if that's the way you feel then think about how your own posts sound when WE read them. You sound the exact same way that you say we sound when responding to you. It cuts both ways, you know.

Not me CPC, it's just funny and sad that some people who benefit from the free market every day, can't see how our kids would benefit by cracking that monopoly.

[ohsherrie]

Well then Dave and RWF, I guess there's just no hope for your enlightenment. Only a fool argues with ignorance. I'm no fool and I'm not ignorant.

[conversationpc]

How the hell is the public school system supposed to compete with private schools? Even suggesting something that absurd is pure Republican ignorance of the realities that most working class people in this country face. The public schools are not a for profit organization. What would they be competing for? What would they have to gain?

What would they have to gain? Better education. More competent administrators. Budgets without so much wasted money (as most government programs usually have). Easier firing of unqualified teachers. The list goes on and on.

If vouchers were given, not more than a third of the parents of the kids that go to my grandson's elementary school would be able to take advantage of them. I also know that to be the case for the school my younger sister's kids attend in Nebraska and the school in my mom's hometown in Iowa. So I guess all you Republicans are willing to throw all those other kids under the bus so you can send yours to a private school. But then that's the Republican way isn't it?

Correct me if I'm mistaken but couldn't vouchers also be used for tutoring or other educational programs outside of the normal school hours? My wife and I have done that out of our own pockets and it's well worth it even while our daughter is still in public school.

And lastly, don't give me that crap about "throwing other kids under the bus". That's one of the biggest and most favorite Democratic lies out there right now. Those nasty, evil conservatives just want to waste your kids, don't they?

[conversationpc]

Well then Dave and RWF, I guess there's just no hope for your enlightenment. Only a fool argues with ignorance. I'm no fool and I'm not ignorant.

Prime example of what I just posted about previously.

[conversationpc]

I've been thinking about this thread today and want to apologize for my part in any name-calling. I'm really tired of not being able to discuss a topic in this forum without it degenerating into a liberal this or that or conservatives are idiots type of stuff. It doesn't serve for any decent dialogue and no one wants to admit they're wrong when that kind of thing starts up. Neither side are idiots. It's just differences of opinion, for the most part. If anyone wants to calmly discuss these kinds of topics in the future, I'm all for it. Of course, I realize that emotions can get the best of us at times so a gentle reminder occasionally when I or others get out of line would serve everyone well. If we can't abide by that, I wouldn't be averse to dropping political discussions altogether.

[RedWingFan]

I've been thinking about this thread today and want to apologize for my part in any name-calling. I'm really tired of not being able to discuss a topic in this forum without it degenerating into a liberal this or that or conservatives are idiots type of stuff. It doesn't serve for any decent dialogue and no one wants to admit they're wrong when that kind of thing starts up. Neither side are idiots. It's just differences of opinion, for the most part. If anyone wants to calmly discuss these kinds of topics in the future, I'm all for it. Of course, I realize that emotions can get the best of us at times so a gentle reminder occasionally when I or others get out of line would serve everyone well. If we can't abide by that, I wouldn't be averse to dropping political discussions altogether.

I didn't realize you called anyone names.

[conversationpc]

I've been thinking about this thread today and want to apologize for my part in any name-calling. I'm really tired of not being able to discuss a topic in this forum without it degenerating into a liberal this or that or conservatives are idiots type of stuff. It doesn't serve for any decent dialogue and no one wants to admit they're wrong when that kind of thing starts up. Neither side are idiots. It's just differences of opinion, for the most part. If anyone wants to calmly discuss these kinds of topics in the future, I'm all for it. Of course, I realize that emotions can get the best of us at times so a gentle reminder occasionally when I or others get out of line would serve everyone well. If we can't abide by that, I wouldn't be averse to dropping political discussions altogether.

I didn't realize you called anyone names.

Perhaps not in this thread but I've slipped up on occasion in the past. I'm just really sick of it on both sides. Hannity does it on his show. Talk show hosts on Air America do the same. It's gotten rather annoying and I've started to understand recently how people feel who've gotten sick of politics. I have too much other stress in my life to waste on name-calling and being called names.

[Blueskies]

I've been thinking about this thread today and want to apologize for my part in any name-calling. I'm really tired of not being able to discuss a topic in this forum without it degenerating into a liberal this or that or conservatives are idiots type of stuff. It doesn't serve for any decent dialogue and no one wants to admit they're wrong when that kind of thing starts up. Neither side are idiots. It's just differences of opinion, for the most part. If anyone wants to calmly discuss these kinds of topics in the future, I'm all for it. Of course, I realize that emotions can get the best of us at times so a gentle reminder occasionally when I or others get out of line would serve everyone well. If we can't abide by that, I wouldn't be averse to dropping political discussions altogether.

I didn't realize you called anyone names.

Perhaps not in this thread but I've slipped up on occasion in the past. I'm just really sick of it on both sides. Hannity does it on his show. Talk show hosts on Air America do the same. It's gotten rather annoying and I've started to understand recently how people feel who've gotten sick of politics. I have too much other stress in my life to waste on name-calling and being called names.

I agree with you. When people just start labeling someone on their views or name calling, the listening and dialog has stopped and no one hears. They become too defensive of their opinion and the dialog has ceased and sits spinning its wheels. People are coming from many different life experiences, either by things they have or are going through themselves or by things they have observed others go through, that make up their own value systems and that they form their own opinions by. Everyone's experience and their contribution of their knowledge from that experience can be of value if we allow ourselves to be more open and listen to what the other "side" is saying and take it into consideration. Changes and solutions to problems will never be achieved if there is no one listening and everyone wants to remain firmly planted in their own views and are not willing to budge, not willing to listen as well as state what their opinion is. We must always remember that we are forever students and dont know everything, there is much to continue to learn. We can only learn from each other if we can keep a more open mind to opposing views. Yes, issues have to be hashed out and even argued but what is the point to it all if everyone remains closed to the "opposition" and only talk and do not listen. Resolution to issues cannot be achieved if no one budges, will not hear and will not make compromises. When you close off from opposing views you will remain closed. We have to be more diplomatic and work together not against each other for any solutions to be reached, put into action and achieved.