ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE RELEASED TO AC!!!!

[Saint John]

is this single version out? has anyone heard it on the radio?

Going by this chart, it's only been played 69 times for the week and that's spread out on only 15 stations. If you get to hear it, it will be purely by chance.

Rome wasn't built in a day, Don.

[Don]

is this single version out? has anyone heard it on the radio?

Going by this chart, it's only been played 69 times for the week and that's spread out on only 15 stations. If you get to hear it, it will be purely by chance.

Rome wasn't built in a day, Don.

Well, as long as Nero Schon doesn't burn it down before it's complete.

[Toph]

is this single version out? has anyone heard it on the radio?

Going by this chart, it's only been played 69 times for the week and that's spread out on only 15 stations. If you get to hear it, it will be purely by chance.

Rome wasn't built in a day, Don.

I know. Why is Don so damn negative?!?!?!?! We got a single that is moving up a chart - yes, it might not be Billboard, but it is some chart that measures singles and airplay. Let's start a calling tree to AC stations!

[Don]

is this single version out? has anyone heard it on the radio?

Going by this chart, it's only been played 69 times for the week and that's spread out on only 15 stations. If you get to hear it, it will be purely by chance.

Rome wasn't built in a day, Don.

I know. Why is Don so damn negative?!?!?!?! We got a single that is moving up a chart - yes, it might not be Billboard, but it is some chart that measures singles and airplay. Let's start a calling tree to AC stations!

Dude, the A/C stations need the song sent to them by the label. That's Nomota's job, not ours.

[Argus]

is this single version out? has anyone heard it on the radio?

Going by this chart, it's only been played 69 times for the week and that's spread out on only 15 stations. If you get to hear it, it will be purely by chance.

Rome wasn't built in a day, Don.

I know. Why is Don so damn negative?!?!?!?! We got a single that is moving up a chart - yes, it might not be Billboard, but it is some chart that measures singles and airplay. Let's start a calling tree to AC stations!

Dude, the A/C stations need the song sent to them by the label. That's Nomota's job, not ours.

mhm yanno looking back, it seems that even though most hated the Back Talk Forum and the way the website was, it did a pretty good job organizing fans on the net. Street Teams, Radio call-ins, Content, clips, interviews. photos etc etc. Oh well

[Jeremey]

Radio is nothing like what it was even 6-7 years ago. It would cost Journey upwards of a million dollars to put a proper radio campaign behind even one single. And that would be a huge gamble & something catalog artists just don't do in this environment. Payola is alive and well in 2011, just under a different name. Instead of promoting single radio plays, it's under the guise of regional record promoters to form "lasting relationships" with the radio people. With a deal at Wal Mart and a major worldwide tour, as well as their name and history to rely on, the LAST thing Journey needs is to hemorrhage money on a radio promotion. That is not the Billboard chart, it's an independent chart catering to specific stations. Billboard chart positions are the only real indicator of radio play.

[Arkansas]

Interesting. A dozen 'classic-a/c' radio stations here in the OKC/LR/Memphis area, and it doesn't matter what is released or whatevered. We still hear Perry Journey daily. And that's not a bad thing. It's just that it'd take a lot of payola to get new Journey played...and even then, that probably wouldn't equate into Eclipse sales. It is what it is. Period.

Does 'payola' exist in the new digital markets? And would that make those markets buy Eclipse? Probably not.


later~

[jrny84]

Up to #26 this week.

[Saint John]

Up to #26 this week.

Whatever the chart, it is moving up quite nicely. Good to see the band supporting it in concert.

[Argus]

Interesting. A dozen 'classic-a/c' radio stations here in the OKC/LR/Memphis area, and it doesn't matter what is released or whatevered. We still hear Perry Journey daily. And that's not a bad thing. It's just that it'd take a lot of payola to get new Journey played...and even then, that probably wouldn't equate into Eclipse sales. It is what it is. Period.

Does 'payola' exist in the new digital markets? And would that make those markets buy Eclipse? Probably not.


later~

Playola digital is not happening. Social media viral is where it is at and getting a tune added to a commercial or TV soundtrack helps too.

[Greg]

I am now thoroughly convinced that they wouldn't have gotten anywhere without Herbie - Cain or no Cain, Perry or no Perry.

I agree with this. Herbie was in control from the beginning through Frontiers. When he lost control around 1985 the numbers speak for themselves. ROR was a failure, TBF was a failure, Arrival was a failure. The lone success since 1983 has been Revelation. One truly, and relative to the times, successful album in 28 years. Yeah, I'd say Herbie is sorely missed.

Dude, Raised on Radio wasn't a failure. Sure, it didn't sell like Escape and Frontiers, but it was far from being a failure. Four top 20 singles and the album reaching #4 on billboard, and going twice multi-platinum is hardly what I'd consider a failure. Come on. sure, it's not my favorite Journey album either and I recognize that it wasn't as successful as the two albums before it, but you're kind of making it sound like it was a complete flop, and that's completely false.

Now, Trial By Fire is only considered a failure because of the events which lead to the album going away. Even you yourself said a long time ago that if it wasn't for Perry's unwillingness to tour, that album would have been huge. Neither one of those albums are clear indicators of an inability to market successful albums.

Unfortunately, everything after Perry, save for Revelation, is a clear indicator as to a band's inability to market albums. And we all have our different opinions on how Revelation got its success...no need to go down that road again. We can simply point to Eclipse, and album that has really good music on it, and the countless threads where people are complaining over the marketing of that album, and we can see there is a failure there. I, too agree, that with Herbie at the helm, the Post Journey stuff would probably have gotten more success than what it has. How much more? Well, being realistic, I don't even think Herbie himself could have duplicated the 80's success he had with the classic line up in today's music biz. No matter the relationship, or lack of, that Herbie has with Perry today, I betcha even he would admit that there was something special with Journey when Perry, Schon, and Cain were all together writing music.

[Saint John]

Dude, Raised on Radio wasn't a failure.

When you see a 70% decline in sales from your previous album and see Bon Jovi and Def Leppard release 10 million+ selling albums (and 20+ million worldwide) with the type of music you defined, but abandoned, it's a failure.

Now, Trial By Fire is only considered a failure because of the events which lead to the album going away. Even you yourself said a long time ago that if it wasn't for Perry's unwillingness to tour, that album would have been huge. Neither one of those albums are clear indicators of an inability to market successful albums.

I agree with what you said, but it's still a failure. One million albums sold for one of the most anticipated reunions ever is a failure.

Unfortunately, everything after Perry, save for Revelation, is a clear indicator as to a band's inability to market albums.

Agreed.

We can simply point to Eclipse, an album that has really good music on it, and the countless threads where people are complaining over the marketing of that album, and we can see there is a failure there.

I'm not even willing to call their marketing a "failure." It was more a case of completely absent! Just a colossal fuck up of epic proportions. To think that a band releases a product every 3 or so years and that they put their product in that packaging. Eclipse is the poorest release in modern history. The combination of absent management, an indifferent band and a total lack of being on the same page has made them reap what they've sewn. You plant shit and you harvest shit.

I, too agree, that with Herbie at the helm, the Post Journey stuff would probably have gotten more success than what it has.

Nostrildamus also knew that and that's exactly why he was the first to go. He knew that Irving Azoff wouldn't give 2 shits about resurrecting a 25 year old band, and that his focus would be on touring, not new music and progression. And he was right.

No matter the relationship, or lack of, that Herbie has with Perry today, I betcha even he would admit that there was something special with Journey when Perry, Schon, and Cain were all together writing music.

I think everyone could admit that.

[Argus]

Eclipse release was poor timing, period. GaGa Eclipsed Everyone, not just JRNY Nobody has ever seen a marketing blitz like Born This Way executed. Why the release date was not changed is beyond me. Know thy market and cater to it or create your market and nourish it.

[Don]

Eclipse release was poor timing, period. GaGa Eclipsed Everyone, not just JRNY Nobody has ever seen a marketing blitz like Born This Way executed. Why the release date was not changed is beyond me. Know thy market and cater to it or create your market and nourish it.

Yet Brad Paisley survived the onslaught and is still averaging over 10k a week in sales two months later. Journey just didn't have the promo NOR the product this time around that would make people sit up and take notice. Even the packaging was a downer. Two subdued colors on a cardboard sleeve, nothing to really jump off the shelf at you.

[Argus]

Eclipse release was poor timing, period. GaGa Eclipsed Everyone, not just JRNY Nobody has ever seen a marketing blitz like Born This Way executed. Why the release date was not changed is beyond me. Know thy market and cater to it or create your market and nourish it.

Yet Brad Paisley survived the onslaught and is still averaging over 10k a week in sales two months later. Journey just didn't have the promo NOR the product this time around that would make people sit up and take notice. Even the packaging was a downer. Two subdued colors on a cardboard sleeve, nothing to really jump off the shelf at you.

Point taken, Don. Just did not want to critique too much I'll let you guys shoot those sitting ducks.

[Greg]

When you see a 70% decline in sales from your previous album and see Bon Jovi and Def Leppard release 10 million+ selling albums (and 20+ million worldwide) with the type of music you defined, but abandoned, it's a failure.

Firstly, Journey didn't define pop metal. I would put them in the genre with Loverboy, REO Speedwagon, and Styx, but not Bon Jovi or Def Leppard (despite Journey touring with Leppard a few years back.) Secondly, you could use anything that has sold more records than Raised on Radio, compare the two and say that ROR was a failure. But, looking at ROR on its own merit and accomplishments, the album was not a failure. By your standards, Revelation would be considered a worse failure, because it didn't have as many top 20 singles as ROR and it only went platinum.

I agree with what you said, but it's still a failure. One million albums sold for one of the most anticipated reunions ever is a failure.

Definitely not arguing that it was a missed opportunity, but again, it failed based on the fact that there was no support for the album based on Perry's inability to tour, not so much the marketing of the album itself.

I'm not even willing to call their marketing a "failure." It was more a case of completely absent! Just a colossal fuck up of epic proportions. To think that a band releases a product every 3 or so years and that they put their product in that packaging. Eclipse is the poorest release in modern history. The combination of absent management, an indifferent band and a total lack of being on the same page has made them reap what they've sewn. You plant shit and you harvest shit.

I agree that the packaging is horrible and looks cheap. However, the Revelation package is made out of the same stuff, it just seemed better because it was a three disc package. If Revelation was only one disc, you would have probably gotten the same thing unfortunately.

Nostrildamus also knew that and that's exactly why he was the first to go. He knew that Irving Azoff wouldn't give 2 shits about resurrecting a 25 year old band, and that his focus would be on touring, not new music and progression. And he was right.

That's a lot of assumption and really makes no sense considering it was Perry who wanted Azoff in the first place. Why would he want something he never intended to stick with? We can argue about that until the cows come home, but the assumptions that people throw around about Perry makes no sense when we put all the facts together (things we know ARE facts and not just facts we dream up.) Until Perry says himself that he never intended to follow through with Trial By Fire promotions, or the band itself, then I'd have to conclude that all this other stuff is a bunch of bull. And as for Azoff, he's smart enough to know putting money behind promotion of radio is like pissing in the wind. In this day and age, it is fiscally irresponsible for an 80's band manager to put their capital behind that when the promotion can be focused more on touring and other means of getting that new disc out there. Heck, the fact that Trial By Fire got the radio play that it did (and the Grammy nomination) is quite an amazing feat in itself.

[Saint John]

Firstly, Journey didn't define pop metal. I would put them in the genre with Loverboy, REO Speedwagon, and Styx, but not Bon Jovi or Def Leppard

Hysteria and Slippery When Wet were no harder than Frontiers. Those 2 albums were as commercial pop rock as there's ever been. Those bands basically copied Journey's formula of rockers, mid-tempo numbers and ballads and reaped a huge windfall. Journey, on the other hand, stepped back 10-20 years and played outdated Motown and 70's sounds that charted because of who they were, but didn't sell because what played over the airwaves simply didn't compel people to buy the album.

By your standards, Revelation would be considered a worse failure, because it didn't have as many top 20 singles as ROR and it only went platinum.

The standard is albums sold. Who cares if you have 4 Top 40 songs if you only move 2 million albums? On the other hand, you can be like Zep or Floyd and have no real radio hits yet still move a mountain of albums. Besides, by oyur logic, you're saying that Escape and ROR had the same amount of success because each had 4 charting songs. I believe selling records puts more money in your pocket. Regardless, I'd bet the amount of albums that went Platinum the year Revelation went Platinum is less than the amount of of albums that went Double Platinum the year ROR was released, making it, relatively speaking, more successful.

That's a lot of assumption and really makes no sense considering it was Perry who wanted Azoff in the first place.

He knew Herbie would reload and get another singer and work his butt off to make it work, especially to stick it up Perry's ass. Azoff, on the other hand, has a stable of artists that make him millions. He has no interest in anything other than filling sheds. Herbie knew there was never going to be a tour, told Neal as much, and was right.

We can argue about that until the cows come home, but the assumptions that people throw around about Perry makes no sense when we put all the facts together (things we know ARE facts and not just facts we dream up.)

Well, I don't know "for a fact" that Steve Smith wasn't the main reason Journey sold out stadiums in the 80's, but I can make a logical assumption that he wasn't. I can also make a logical assumption that Nostrildamus had no intention of touring in 1996, considering the "fact" that he's played zero shows since.

Until Perry says himself that he never intended to follow through with Trial By Fire promotions, or the band itself, then I'd have to conclude that all this other stuff is a bunch of bull.

Yeah, keep waiting for that to happen! I just can't logically assume that those gag orders were put in place at that time to protect anyone but Nostrildamus. He demanded them and he got them. Those were to protect his ass. I just can't believe that Neal and Jon were giant dicks and Nostrildamus wanted that to be protected! I also can't believe that anyone would take a guy seriously when, after waiting for 2 years to make a decision on hip surgery, he tells you he still doesn't have any time table. Then, after playing the victim and acting like he was fired, he doesn't perform one time after that. That's simply the same amount of times he would have performed had they waited for him. He knows it, Herbie knew it, and the band moved on when he quit on them ... again.

[S2M]

Interesting read....should be in the religion thread. Greg is a believer, and Dan is a non-believer.

[Greg]

Hysteria and Slippery When Wet were no harder than Frontiers. Those 2 albums were as commercial pop rock as there's ever been. Those bands basically copied Journey's formula of rockers, mid-tempo numbers and ballads and reaped a huge windfall. Journey, on the other hand, stepped back 10-20 years and played outdated Motown and 70's sounds that charted because of who they were, but didn't sell because what played over the airwaves simply didn't compel people to buy the album.

Again, how did it not sell? It reached 2 x multiplatinum. Anyways, you're adverting from the main point, one in which you have failed to recognize. Based on the album's merit itself and not based on any other albums before it, Raised on Radio had success. You specifically said it was a failure, and I disagree. Was it as much of a success as Frontiers? Of course not. It's just the simple case of one looking at things with glass half full and the other glass half empty.

The standard is albums sold. Who cares if you have 4 Top 40 songs if you only move 2 million albums? On the other hand, you can be like Zep or Floyd and have no real radio hits yet still move a mountain of albums. Besides, by oyur logic, you're saying that Escape and ROR had the same amount of success because each had 4 charting songs. I believe selling records puts more money in your pocket. Regardless, I'd bet the amount of albums that went Platinum the year Revelation went Platinum is less than the amount of of albums that went Double Platinum the year ROR was released, making it, relatively speaking, more successful.

No, you're obviously having tunnel vision and not paying attention to everything I'm saying. I'm saying in addition to having four top 20 hits, Raised on Radio went 2 X multiplatinum - which means obviously the album had to have sold enough to have that certification. If I'm not mistaken, for an album to go multiplatinum, it would have to sell 2 million units. So if it went 2 x multiplatinum, then it would have had to have sold around 4 million units. So, if this is correct, then an album that sold 4 million units at least cannot be considered a failure. This is not fuzzy math certification like they did with Revelation. This was one album, one disc, cassette, record, however it was purchased. I'm not necessarily defending the album - hey I don't like it near as much as Escape and Frontiers, but I'm just point out that you're simply wrong in saying that particular album was a failure.

He knew Herbie would reload and get another singer and work his butt off to make it work, especially to stick it up Perry's ass. Azoff, on the other hand, has a stable of artists that make him millions. He has no interest in anything other than filling sheds. Herbie knew there was never going to be a tour, told Neal as much, and was right.

And again, maybe so, maybe not. I don't believe everything I hear or read, so when one person is speaking what he perceives as "fact" about someone else, I treat it as BS until that said person comes out and admits it himself or unless I witness it first hand.

Well, I don't know "for a fact" that Steve Smith wasn't the main reason Journey sold out stadiums in the 80's, but I can make a logical assumption that he wasn't. I can also make a logical assumption that Nostrildamus had no intention of touring in 1996, considering the "fact" that he's played zero shows since.

Well, you're still making assumptions and passing them off as fact. I don't assume Perry would have or wouldn't have toured with Journey if the hip problem hadn't occurred. I don't know the man. I don't know HH. I don't know what type of man he is. I don't know what type of man Schon or Cain is. I don't see the purpose or point in being so vehemently against someone like Steve Perry, when you don't know that guy. Just because he hasn't played in shows doesn't mean he doesn't want to. Or, maybe it does. In the grand scheme of things, what does it really matter to you or to me? My life still goes on despite never seeing Perry in concert. I'm still happy. I just get these vibes that you feel you need to discredit anything you can with Perry in order to justify Arnel Pineda. Look, as much crap that has obviously went on between Neal, Jon, and Steve, all three are moving on with their lives and are apparently very happy with where they are. I don't blame any of them for moving on in the directions they want to move on to. I'm not an Arnel Pineda fan as stated before, but he's obviously doing a great job in Journey and the J-boys are very happy with him in the band. That should be enough to recognize without having to continuously take a dump on Steve Perry, Steve Augeri, and Jeff Scott Soto like you have been doing here. Just let it go man. Celebrate the past accomplishments the band did have, listen to your favorite J songs, go and see them in concert and just be content.

Yeah, keep waiting for that to happen! I just can't logically assume that those gag orders were put in place at that time to protect anyone but Nostrildamus. He demanded them and he got them. Those were to protect his ass. I just can't believe that Neal and Jon were giant dicks and Nostrildamus wanted that to be protected! I also can't believe that anyone would take a guy seriously when, after waiting for 2 years to make a decision on hip surgery, he tells you he still doesn't have any time table. Then, after playing the victim and acting like he was fired, he doesn't perform one time after that. That's simply the same amount of times he would have performed had they waited for him. He knows it, Herbie knew it, and the band moved on when he quit on them ... again.

And the gag orders against Jeff Scott Soto are not to project Neal and company? Please. I really need to understand where all of this hate of Steve Perry is coming from, because you have been spewing a lot of venom toward the guy for the past couple of years now - especially since before you were pretty much riding his jock. I have no idea why you turned on the guy, but geez, you really do have a personal vendetta against him for some reason. Why is this?

[Eric]

I think the thing with ROR is it SHOULD HAVE sold more being that Journey hadn't really gone away yet and their music was still "in". You put any post-Perry album in its place in 1986 and I think it does as well if not better.

I think TBF is the number shipped. Didn't Herbie laugh about that? I'm not sure that album really pushed any more units than Revelation did.

I think its not "anger" towards Perry but more "frustration". He seems anti Journey 2.0, but he doesn't do anything - he's retired....so I wonder what the point is then?

[Saint John]

Again, how did it not sell? It reached 2 x multiplatinum. Aspeaking, more successful.


No, you're obviously having tunnel vision and not paying attention to everything I'm saying. I'm saying in addition to having four top 20 hits, Raised on Radio went 2 X multiplatinum - which means obviously the album had to have sold enough to have that certification. If I'm not mistaken, for an album to go multiplatinum, it would have to sell 2 million units. So if it went 2 x multiplatinum, then it would have had to have sold around 4 million units.

Greg, ROR is a multi-platinum album, but it is certified at 2 million, not 4. You have the terms confused. I see what you're looking at, though. But, for that to be true, GH would have to have sold 30 million because it is "15X Multi Platinum" and that's not the case. Also, ROR was certified 2X platinum in 1989 and nothing has changed in 22 years. Virtually every other Journey album since Jon Cain came on board did, except for ROR and TBF ... the 2 albums that Perry decided to take virtually total control of. The guy wrestled away power from Herbie and ran the band into the ground.

And the gag orders against Jeff Scott Soto are not to project Neal and company? Please.

Where did I say they weren't? They absolutely, 100% are. To hide the shame of less than fully live concerts.

I really need to understand where all of this hate of Steve Perry is coming from, because you have been spewing a lot of venom toward the guy for the past couple of years now - especially since before you were pretty much riding his jock. I have no idea why you turned on the guy, but geez, you really do have a personal vendetta against him for some reason. Why is this?

It's a message board and place to discuss the band and their history. I was no less vindictive of Tapegate and absolutely creamed Schon, Cain and Augeri for what I have long termed the darkest black eye in the band's history.

As for the other dude ... I just think the guy deserves to be shit on. He played God by firing long-standing tenured members for no reason, he was afforded the luxury of the band waiting for him for almost a decade after his breakup and mother's passing, and rewarded them by touring with others, he mandated the firing of their manager (the old 'he goes or I do' tantrum) and he broke up the Rolie/Chalfant lineup with no intentions of ever touring. He then played the shameless victim after fucking around for 2 years without giving the band a decision. He basically robbed the remaining band members, their manager and their fans of about 12 years. For that, I think the guy is a first class deplorable prick, a liar and I think his seemingly lonely and friendless life is fitting of the type of person he truly is.

PS I have never "dumped on Jeff Scott Soto." Never called the man one name and only offered opinions about what I perceived to be his many shortcomings while lead singer. And I personally apologized to Steve Augeri's face at Journey To The Cure. The other guy? Like Neal said ... fuck him!

[Greg]

Greg, ROR is a multi-platinum album, but it is certified at 2 million, not 4. You have the terms confused. I see what you're looking at, though. But, for that to be true, GH would have to have sold 30 million because it is "15X Multi Platinum" and that's not the case. Also, ROR was certified 2X platinum in 1989 and nothing has changed in 22 years. Virtually every other Journey album since Jon Cain came on board did, except for ROR and TBF ... the 2 albums that Perry decided to take virtually total control of. The guy wrestled away power from Herbie and ran the band into the ground.

Fair enough. I saw it posted as 2 X multiplatinum, which could possibly be a misprint. It still supports what I said in that the album itself was not a failure. In my opinion, an album is a failure when it fails to reach any gold, platinum, diamond status at all, and does not have any songs to chart. This isn't the case with Raised on Radio, although it definitely wasn't nearly as successful as the two albums that preceded it.

Where did I say they weren't? They absolutely, 100% are. To hide the shame of less than fully live concerts.

Glad you feel that way, but you've seemed to overlook it now. I guess I'm not sure why you can't just do the same for Perry as well.

It's a message board and place to discuss the band and their history. I was no less vindictive of Tapegate and absolutely creamed Schon, Cain and Augeri for what I have long termed the darkest black eye in the band's history.

Like I said, you've obviously let that go since you're still a huge supporter of the band. I just can't understand why you can't just do the same for all members, past and present and move on.

As for the other dude ... I just think the guy deserves to be shit on. He played God by firing long-standing tenured members for no reason, he was afforded the luxury of the band waiting for him for almost a decade after his breakup and mother's passing, and rewarded them by touring with others, he mandated the firing of their manager (the old 'he goes or I do' tantrum) and he broke up the Rolie/Chalfant lineup with no intentions of ever touring. He then played the shameless victim after fucking around for 2 years without giving the band a decision. He basically robbed the remaining band members, their manager and their fans of about 12 years. For that, I think the guy is a first class deplorable prick, a liar and I think his seemingly lonely and friendless life is fitting of the type of person he truly is.

And the "other dude" publicly admitted it was the wrong thing to do. If Schon and Cain admitted to Tapegate, it was just because they got caught (and I'm not so sure they even admitted to TapeGate.) Secondly, none of these reasons you have stated are first hand "facts". These are things you have dreamed up in your head to fuel your rage against the guy. Sorry you feel robbed, but that to me is the most absurd thing to feel from a rock band that has no investment in you whatsoever other than for you to pay them money for their music and go to their concerts. If you died in a car crash tomorrow, they would not blink an eye. I seriously doubt the other band members honestly feel robbed. They still made music, they still got money, except for Ross - but that was his own fault. The band continued on without him and Perry seems happy where he is at. He owes you nor I a thing. I happen to think the way the band kicked Jeff out was pretty deplorable - but that's in large part of how it appears to me from the little knowledge that is fed to the public. None of us here have any inside info on that except for those closely associated with the band and with Jeff. So, with that said, I don't hold any ill will toward the band. I have obviously still supported them by buying their music and going to a concert. I don't sit here on a message board and spill venom. Yes, I've said some things to make fun of Neal, but it's nothing personal or vile. And if I had ever said anything of such, I definitely apologize to Neal and or Jon for such statements. If I knew the inner business of the band, I might have a completely different outlook, but I don't and I'm not going to waste my time havering ill will when I don't know the whole story being told to me, straight from the horse's mouth. But, like you said, it's a message board. So, if you feel happy and dignified by shitting on Steve Perry, by all means, here's the Milk of Magnesia! I personally think it's a waste of time, and some things you state are completely false, but that's just my opinion here since it is, again, a message board.

PS I have never "dumped on Jeff Scott Soto." Never called the man one name and only offered opinions about what I perceived to be his many shortcomings while lead singer. And I personally apologized to Steve Augeri's face at Journey To The Cure. The other guy? Like Neal said ... fuck him!

[Saint John]

Greg, believe me, I don't get worked up at all while posting. In fact, most of the time I'm chuckling at how it will upset the sycophants in particular camps. I couldn't give two fucks about any of these guys, aside from their music. I appreciate all of their contributions, some just more than others.

[Greg]

Greg, believe me, I don't get worked up at all while posting. In fact, most of the time I'm chuckling at how it will upset the sycophants in particular camps. I couldn't give two fucks about any of these guys, aside from their music. I appreciate all of their contributions, some just more than others.

I hope this is true man. In the end, I just like what I like from the band, musically, let the rest of the chips fall where they may so to speak!