ceedj wrote:As a guitarist who owes his musical existence to Journey (Infinity, Evolution and Captured LP's got worn out when I was a youngster), I have to go with Neal. I think EVH became a way better songwriter after Sammy arrived, but Neal was a more well-rounded player from the 70s through the 90s, up to TBF. Nowadays though, I really have a hard time listening to his endless noodling and 8 miles of delay repeats; Eclipse would get listened to a lot more if he had just SLOWED THE FUCK DOWN.
And I will laugh about CC right along with you guys, but Flesh and Blood was a great album front to back, and about the only real good thing CC ever did IMHO. Imagine my disappointment when Swallow This Live came out and he sucked giant donkey balls. Ugh, what a letdown.
What a great reply! Sometimes, people can say what they want, and never make it across. But other times, people say exactly what they mean, and it comes across effortlessly. And you did just that.
But allow me to expand, and offer.
Schon's genetic heritage of just knowing music is what gives him the feel. His Dad gave him all the concert symphonic exposure, and education, that we only dream about. People say that tone and meter comes from the finger tips, and just knowing the caress of the instrument. And while that does publish inherent 'soul', there's still an underlying hunger to stretch-out of what you know. You try and try, and most times it doesn't work. But the few times that it does work, makes you a God...within certain genres. Schon talks about wanting to rock, but he doesn't really shine without Cain's ballads, or without Perry's R&B. There's much to be said about having writing partners. Journey's premier albums were all about collaboration. Ted Nugent once said that Schon wrote a 'masterpiece' for one his records. Piranha Blues is absolutely amazing, but perhaps not without the other players. Having said that, Journey's Eclipse record is too much Schon. And I agree with you - too much noodling, too much wanking, too much 'hey look at me' crap. But that's what he wanted, and he was able, finally, to do it. So good for him.
There are a few great songs on Eclipse. But for the average listener, it's all way too thick. I'll add that most of the songs should be anchors on other albums. In other words, all of these songs shouldn't be on the same record. It's like Schon put this together based on the things he's always wanted to do, but rather than selectively infuse them into other records, he piled them all on top of each other on the same album. Thus, eliciting the 'slow down' reaction.
Now then, EVH. Is he also more talented than most others? Oh yeah, without a doubt. He plays piano, has heritage outside of American rock-n-roll, and has delved into other genres too. He did the Michael Jackson thing, remember? And as the story goes, he & Alex got into each other's instruments early on. But let's look at VH in general. They played covers on their first albums, but in a way that make them their own. In fact, they did it often. They proved that they're better musicians than just doing VH original. Right or wrong, subjective. Who knows.
Perhaps it's all a popularity contest. VH in all their big hair, MTV crap, and notoriety, makes them appear more talented...Eddie VanHalen being the root of it all. After several years, Sammy Hagar, who has always been a friend to Neal Schon, came aboard to VH. Did he elevate EVH as a musician? Probably so. But so did Jon Cain & Steve Perry to Neal Schon.
I guess, there'a whole lot I'm missing here, since I'm just a general consumer, and not anyone who really knows anything. But I don't wanna be bias toward NS because this is a Journey forum. But having seen Journey & Bad English, and having seen VanHalen several times, I guess it's a toss-up, no?
later~
Bahahaha!
In fact it can be argued that as far as the whole "hammering" and "pull-off" thing goes, if it hadn't been VH it would have been someone else. I wouldn't really agree with that becasue as I stated EVH used it in such an extensive way. But the arguement could be made.
