Why never JSS??

[LazzMan]

Does anyone know why they never, ever say anything about Jeff being in the band? He was in the band for a year and the "official" lead singer from Dec. '06 through June of '07 (or something close to that). Yet, in band bio's and interviews they always go from Fleishman to Perry to Augeri to AP.

Is it a legal thing or are they just a bunch of pricks? Maybe both. But, IMO, JSS was the best thing they had going after Perry. I saw them in concert with him twice and it was way better than anything I have seen/heard with AP. So...it wasn't the exact original sound. Who cares? It was fucking great!!! He covered the old stuff and I can only assume that anything new they might have written together would have been awesome.

Oh well...what might have been.

[S2M]

Does anyone know why they never, ever say anything about Jeff being in the band? He was in the band for a year and the "official" lead singer from Dec. '06 through June of '07 (or something close to that). Yet, in band bio's and interviews they always go from Fleishman to Perry to Augeri to AP.

Is it a legal thing or are they just a bunch of pricks? Maybe both. But, IMO, JSS was the best thing they had going after Perry. I saw them in concert with him twice and it was way better than anything I have seen/heard with AP. So...it wasn't the exact original sound. Who cares? It was fucking great!!! He covered the old stuff and I can only assume that anything new they might have written together would have been awesome.

Oh well...what might have been.

Don't expect an answer, and if you do happen to get one - it'll be laced with condescending platitudes. Everyone here prays at the altar of AP.

I, however, will echo your sentiments....Jeff would have been great. They wanted the legacy sound. And all you get are lies from the J-camp...they should have been blacklisted after tapegate. Jeff bailed them out, and got fucked....

[Saint John]

Cain mentioned him in one of his latest interviews and summed up his time in the band quite well.

[Rick]

Does anyone know why they never, ever say anything about Jeff being in the band? He was in the band for a year and the "official" lead singer from Dec. '06 through June of '07 (or something close to that). Yet, in band bio's and interviews they always go from Fleishman to Perry to Augeri to AP.

Is it a legal thing or are they just a bunch of pricks? Maybe both. But, IMO, JSS was the best thing they had going after Perry. I saw them in concert with him twice and it was way better than anything I have seen/heard with AP. So...it wasn't the exact original sound. Who cares? It was fucking great!!! He covered the old stuff and I can only assume that anything new they might have written together would have been awesome.

Oh well...what might have been.

I was all geared for them to do an album and a tour with Soto. I still would have loved to have seen that. But, for whatever reason, it didn't happen. Arnel is doing a great job though. I'm just glad the band is still making music.

[jestor92]

I'll give it a shot.

The story as far as I'm aware goes something like:

JSS was named lead vocalist, they recorded Winds Of Freedom. The song wasn't all that good and supposedly JSS didn't have good writing chemistry with Schon and Cain and wanted a vocalist that had more of the legacy Journey sound. So without saying a word Schon and Cain started looking for a new vocalist while JSS was touring with Talisman and found Jeremy and then once again changed their mind and ditched him and went with Arnel. All this while JSS didnt know they were looking for a replacement.

There have been numerous rumors as to why he was let go, but as the most logical is what I've wrote above. Although I would believe some of the rumors swirling around. Also JSS according to a recent interview with Castronovo "wanted a law suit" against the band, but lost. JSS denied that. It's really an unforunate mess (no pun intended from JSS's last solo album), but it's what happens. IMO it's for the better for music lovers of JSS because I think he'd have blown his voice out a lot quicker than Arnie will because on the Reno boot that was put up a lil while back JSS seemed to be straining a bit on some of the songs they were performing.

[Journey/Survivor]

Cain mentioned him in one of his latest interviews and summed up his time in the band quite well.

What did Cain say?

[Journey/Survivor]

Does anyone know why they never, ever say anything about Jeff being in the band? He was in the band for a year and the "official" lead singer from Dec. '06 through June of '07 (or something close to that). Yet, in band bio's and interviews they always go from Fleishman to Perry to Augeri to AP.

Is it a legal thing or are they just a bunch of pricks? Maybe both. But, IMO, JSS was the best thing they had going after Perry. I saw them in concert with him twice and it was way better than anything I have seen/heard with AP. So...it wasn't the exact original sound. Who cares? It was fucking great!!! He covered the old stuff and I can only assume that anything new they might have written together would have been awesome.

Oh well...what might have been.

Don't expect an answer, and if you do happen to get one - it'll be laced with condescending platitudes. Everyone here prays at the altar of AP.

I, however, will echo your sentiments....Jeff would have been great. They wanted the legacy sound. And all you get are lies from the J-camp...they should have been blacklisted after tapegate. Jeff bailed them out, and got fucked....

This site is also loaded with people who worship JSS. And also loaded with people who are racist and rip on AP because of his nationality. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad over what I just said, I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't like AP is a racist. But many people rip on the guy because of his nationality.
Also, there are many people that rip on AP because their pissed that Perry's not in the band anymore, or Augeri's not in the band anymore, or JSS isn't in the band anymore.

[Deb]

This site is also loaded with people who worship JSS. And also loaded with people who are racist and rip on AP because of his nationality. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad over what I just said, I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't like AP is a racist. But many people rip on the guy because of his nationality.
Also, there are many people that rip on AP because their pissed that Perry's not in the band anymore, or Augeri's not in the band anymore, or JSS isn't in the band anymore.

For starters how about some of us just simply prefer Jeff's pipes over Arnels. Doesn't mean I dislike Arnel (or am racist) or worship JSS. By all accounts Arnel is a stellar human being and yes I do think he is a good singer and have NEVER ripped on him. But for me there is just something missing in his delivery that JSS has. And to be honest I find it hard to get back into a band ( for a 3rd time) that I don't have much respect for as people (except for Arnel) for numerous reasons. For those that say, "nope not me, it's strictly just about the music".....good for them, but that's just not me. I'm a very passionate and feeling person and can't support or enjoy the music as much when I don't respect the people making it. And yes, if The Bigs ended up pulling half the crap the J boys have I would lose respect with them too and wouldn't be able to listen with the same passion I once did. But, I'm pretty sure I won't have to worry about that.....cuz for some bands it isn't JUST about the money.

And Jester92, I don't believe the 3 ever actually wrote together (JSS, NS, JC). Winds of Freedom was written by Cain and Schon alone and Jeff added his vocals once he got back from doing his Talisman Farewell tour.

[steveo777]

Does anyone know why they never, ever say anything about Jeff being in the band? He was in the band for a year and the "official" lead singer from Dec. '06 through June of '07 (or something close to that). Yet, in band bio's and interviews they always go from Fleishman to Perry to Augeri to AP.

Is it a legal thing or are they just a bunch of pricks? Maybe both. But, IMO, JSS was the best thing they had going after Perry. I saw them in concert with him twice and it was way better than anything I have seen/heard with AP. So...it wasn't the exact original sound. Who cares? It was fucking great!!! He covered the old stuff and I can only assume that anything new they might have written together would have been awesome.

Oh well...what might have been.

Don't expect an answer, and if you do happen to get one - it'll be laced with condescending platitudes. Everyone here prays at the altar of AP.

I, however, will echo your sentiments....Jeff would have been great. They wanted the legacy sound. And all you get are lies from the J-camp...they should have been blacklisted after tapegate. Jeff bailed them out, and got fucked....

This site is also loaded with people who worship JSS. And also loaded with people who are racist and rip on AP because of his nationality. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad over what I just said, I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't like AP is a racist. But many people rip on the guy because of his nationality.
Also, there are many people that rip on AP because their pissed that Perry's not in the band anymore, or Augeri's not in the band anymore, or JSS isn't in the band anymore.

Maybe some of that is true by some people, but you find some of that everywhere you go. I don't dislike JSS, but I certainly don't worship him. He's a great singer, but he doesn't fit Journey for me. People think that just because he stepped in and saved the tour he should be afforded the kind of respect that the rest of the band garners. I don't see it that way. Not enough tenure, not the right guy for the job, etc. I can't credit him for anything remotely close to helping the resurgence of Journey, as I can with SA and AP. Was he properly let go? Probably not, but I also understand how at will employment agreements work these days and when something isn't gonna work out, tis better not to prolong the situation. Sounds to me like he didn't fit the sound they were looking for and it also sounds like his personality didn't meld well with the rest of the band. That, really, is nobody's fault. The people who think JSS should be in the band wouldn't fill a good sized lounge.

[Journey/Survivor]

This site is also loaded with people who worship JSS. And also loaded with people who are racist and rip on AP because of his nationality. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad over what I just said, I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't like AP is a racist. But many people rip on the guy because of his nationality.
Also, there are many people that rip on AP because their pissed that Perry's not in the band anymore, or Augeri's not in the band anymore, or JSS isn't in the band anymore.

For starters how about some of us just simply prefer Jeff's pipes over Arnels. Doesn't mean I dislike Arnel (or am racist) or worship JSS.

My comments certainly weren't directed at you, Deb.

And I was trying to make it clear that I wasn't saying that everyone that likes JSS better than AP, or that just plain dislikes AP, is a racist.

I'm sure that there are some people on here that for whatever reason just don't care for AP's voice. But it seems to me that the bigger majority of people that bash AP do so because of a racist agenda, or because their pissed that their guy isn't in Journey anymore.

[Journey/Survivor]

Does anyone know why they never, ever say anything about Jeff being in the band? He was in the band for a year and the "official" lead singer from Dec. '06 through June of '07 (or something close to that). Yet, in band bio's and interviews they always go from Fleishman to Perry to Augeri to AP.

Is it a legal thing or are they just a bunch of pricks? Maybe both. But, IMO, JSS was the best thing they had going after Perry. I saw them in concert with him twice and it was way better than anything I have seen/heard with AP. So...it wasn't the exact original sound. Who cares? It was fucking great!!! He covered the old stuff and I can only assume that anything new they might have written together would have been awesome.

Oh well...what might have been.

Don't expect an answer, and if you do happen to get one - it'll be laced with condescending platitudes. Everyone here prays at the altar of AP.

I, however, will echo your sentiments....Jeff would have been great. They wanted the legacy sound. And all you get are lies from the J-camp...they should have been blacklisted after tapegate. Jeff bailed them out, and got fucked....

This site is also loaded with people who worship JSS. And also loaded with people who are racist and rip on AP because of his nationality. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad over what I just said, I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't like AP is a racist. But many people rip on the guy because of his nationality.
Also, there are many people that rip on AP because their pissed that Perry's not in the band anymore, or Augeri's not in the band anymore, or JSS isn't in the band anymore.

Maybe some of that is true by some people, but you find some of that everywhere you go. I don't dislike JSS, but I certainly don't worship him. He's a great singer, but he doesn't fit Journey for me. People think that just because he stepped in and saved the tour he should be afforded the kind of respect that the rest of the band garners. I don't see it that way. Not enough tenure, not the right guy for the job, etc. I can't credit him for anything remotely close to helping the resurgence of Journey, as I can with SA and AP. Was he properly let go? Probably not, but I also understand how at will employment agreements work these days and when something isn't gonna work out, tis better not to prolong the situation. Sounds to me like he didn't fit the sound they were looking for and it also sounds like his personality didn't meld well with the rest of the band. That, really, is nobody's fault. The people who think JSS should be in the band wouldn't fill a good sized lounge.

It's a little similar to Robin McAuley in Survivor.

McAuley is a great singer. But he's just not a good fit for Survivor. I'll take Survivor fronted by Robin McAuley over no Survivor at all. But he in no-way fits in Survivor the way that Bickler and Jamison do.

I love JSS on the Soul Sirkus CD, and I'm sure he does a great job on his solo albums. But he just wasn't a good fit for Journey.

After hearing JSS on the SS song "Coming Home" and a few of his covers of Journey songs, I thought he might work-out alright in Journey. But then I started hearing him on the boots of Journey shows, and it was atrocious. The same thing when I saw him in person with Journey.

[Deb]

This site is also loaded with people who worship JSS. And also loaded with people who are racist and rip on AP because of his nationality. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad over what I just said, I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't like AP is a racist. But many people rip on the guy because of his nationality.
Also, there are many people that rip on AP because their pissed that Perry's not in the band anymore, or Augeri's not in the band anymore, or JSS isn't in the band anymore.

For starters how about some of us just simply prefer Jeff's pipes over Arnels. Doesn't mean I dislike Arnel (or am racist) or worship JSS.

My comments certainly weren't directed at you, Deb.

And I was trying to make it clear that I wasn't saying that everyone that likes JSS better than AP, or that just plain dislikes AP, is a racist.

I'm sure that there are some people on here that for whatever reason just don't care for AP's voice. But it seems to me that the bigger majority of people that bash AP do so because of a racist agenda, or because their pissed that their guy isn't in Journey anymore.

No problem, sorry..........Steveo was calling JSS fans 'organisms' yesterday......and was thinking sheesh, now we're 'racists' today?

[steveo777]

This site is also loaded with people who worship JSS. And also loaded with people who are racist and rip on AP because of his nationality. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad over what I just said, I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't like AP is a racist. But many people rip on the guy because of his nationality.
Also, there are many people that rip on AP because their pissed that Perry's not in the band anymore, or Augeri's not in the band anymore, or JSS isn't in the band anymore.

For starters how about some of us just simply prefer Jeff's pipes over Arnels. Doesn't mean I dislike Arnel (or am racist) or worship JSS.

My comments certainly weren't directed at you, Deb.

And I was trying to make it clear that I wasn't saying that everyone that likes JSS better than AP, or that just plain dislikes AP, is a racist.

I'm sure that there are some people on here that for whatever reason just don't care for AP's voice. But it seems to me that the bigger majority of people that bash AP do so because of a racist agenda, or because their pissed that their guy isn't in Journey anymore.

No problem, sorry..........Steveo was calling JSS fans 'organisms' yesterday......and was thinking sheesh, now we're 'racists' today?

Deb, organisms was a term used in jest, as I knew the kind of effect it would have on the locals.
It was a cheap troll on my part. I apologize, but hey, we all know how that goes around here.

[Journey/Survivor]

This site is also loaded with people who worship JSS. And also loaded with people who are racist and rip on AP because of his nationality. Before anyone gets their panties in a wad over what I just said, I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't like AP is a racist. But many people rip on the guy because of his nationality.
Also, there are many people that rip on AP because their pissed that Perry's not in the band anymore, or Augeri's not in the band anymore, or JSS isn't in the band anymore.

For starters how about some of us just simply prefer Jeff's pipes over Arnels. Doesn't mean I dislike Arnel (or am racist) or worship JSS.

My comments certainly weren't directed at you, Deb.

And I was trying to make it clear that I wasn't saying that everyone that likes JSS better than AP, or that just plain dislikes AP, is a racist.

I'm sure that there are some people on here that for whatever reason just don't care for AP's voice. But it seems to me that the bigger majority of people that bash AP do so because of a racist agenda, or because their pissed that their guy isn't in Journey anymore.

No problem, sorry..........Steveo was calling JSS fans 'organisms' yesterday......and was thinking sheesh, now we're 'racists' today?

No, I definitely was not saying that JSS fans are racists. My "racists" comment didn't have anything to do with JSS fans, Perry fans, or Augeri fans. It's just that IMHO a lot of the bashing that AP receives on here is because of a racist agenda. I was in no way trying to knock JSS or his fans!

[Deb]

And I was trying to make it clear that I wasn't saying that everyone that likes JSS better than AP, or that just plain dislikes AP, is a racist.

I'm sure that there are some people on here that for whatever reason just don't care for AP's voice. But it seems to me that the bigger majority of people that bash AP do so because of a racist agenda, or because their pissed that their guy isn't in Journey anymore.

No problem, sorry..........Steveo was calling JSS fans 'organisms' yesterday......and was thinking sheesh, now we're 'racists' today?

Deb, organisms was a term used in jest, as I knew the kind of effect it would have on the locals.
It was a cheap troll on my part. I apologize, but hey, we all know how that goes around here.

Apology accepted. Anyway, I just thought it was a spelling error......

[The_Noble_Cause]

JSS, like Foreigner's Kelly Hansen, can sing and is a frontman that kicks the rest of the band into high gear. Arnel is a tremendous singer and little else.

[Deb]

JSS, like Foreigner's Kelly Hansen, can sing and is a frontman that kicks the rest of the band into high gear. Arnel is a tremendous singer and little else.

My thoughts exactly. Brought this major Perry fan back around to the Journey fold again.......very captivating frontman. And hadn't heard this kind of delivery since Perry........ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGE3wNjNE4k

[Gideon]

For those that say, "nope not me, it's strictly just about the music".....good for them, but that's just not me. I'm a very passionate and feeling person and can't support or enjoy the music as much when I don't respect the people making it.

My respect for you knows no bounds, Deb, but I don't think I'll ever understand this.

[Infinity Vocalist 2010]

For those that say, "nope not me, it's strictly just about the music".....good for them, but that's just not me. I'm a very passionate and feeling person and can't support or enjoy the music as much when I don't respect the people making it.

My respect for you knows no bounds, Deb, but I don't think I'll ever understand this.

Me neither.

Though I come from the mindset where I'd have to KNOW these people to truly "respect" them. I can say I like these dudes from what I see of their personalities when they make appearances, but I can't respect them as people if I don't know them. As musicians, definitely. As people, well, I can't make that call. Unless I meet them.

Though I am rambling, and delusional so don't listen to me.

[Deb]

For those that say, "nope not me, it's strictly just about the music".....good for them, but that's just not me. I'm a very passionate and feeling person and can't support or enjoy the music as much when I don't respect the people making it.

My respect for you knows no bounds, Deb, but I don't think I'll ever understand this.

Really? Just for example, so if one of your favorite artists, say, went out and killed somebody that wouldn't affect what you thought or felt about them or their music? LOL actually nevermind, might be more of chick thing (mars/venus)........we tend to feel the music more than our male counterparts do. Thus, the terms.......emote, soul, etc.

[Gideon]

For those that say, "nope not me, it's strictly just about the music".....good for them, but that's just not me. I'm a very passionate and feeling person and can't support or enjoy the music as much when I don't respect the people making it.

My respect for you knows no bounds, Deb, but I don't think I'll ever understand this.

Really? For example, so if one of your favorite artists, say, went out and killed somebody that wouldn't affect what you thought or felt about them or their music? LOL actually nevermind, might be more of chick thing (mars/venus)........we tend to feel the music more than our male counterparts do. Thus, the terms.......emote, soul, etc.

That's just it, if you were feeling the music, then shouldn't it stop there? I think there's ample evidence to indicate that Steve Perry was once the reigning king of assholes but why should that have an impact on my opinion of his voice? Are you telling me that because Neal is an ass that he can't play the guitar as well or so forth?

[Deb]

For those that say, "nope not me, it's strictly just about the music".....good for them, but that's just not me. I'm a very passionate and feeling person and can't support or enjoy the music as much when I don't respect the people making it.

My respect for you knows no bounds, Deb, but I don't think I'll ever understand this.

Me neither.

Though I come from the mindset where I'd have to KNOW these people to truly "respect" them. I can say I like these dudes from what I see of their personalities when they make appearances, but I can't respect them as people if I don't know them. As musicians, definitely. As people, well, I can't make that call. Unless I meet them.

Though I am rambling, and delusional so don't listen to me.

Guess that's where we differ. I can respect most people until they give me reason not to.

[Deb]

For those that say, "nope not me, it's strictly just about the music".....good for them, but that's just not me. I'm a very passionate and feeling person and can't support or enjoy the music as much when I don't respect the people making it.

My respect for you knows no bounds, Deb, but I don't think I'll ever understand this.

Really? For example, so if one of your favorite artists, say, went out and killed somebody that wouldn't affect what you thought or felt about them or their music? LOL actually nevermind, might be more of chick thing (mars/venus)........we tend to feel the music more than our male counterparts do. Thus, the terms.......emote, soul, etc.

That's just it, if you were feeling the music, then shouldn't it stop there? I think there's ample evidence to indicate that Steve Perry was once the reigning king of assholes but why should that have an impact on my opinion of his voice? Are you telling me that because Neal is an ass that he can't play the guitar as well or so forth?

Not saying that at all, the person's talent doesn't disappear, just my opinion of them as a person which effects my enjoyment of their music. Sorry, but I can not completely 100% separate the two.

[Gideon]

For what it's worth, I don't think it's an issue of whether or not we have an attachment but rather it's an issue of what we're attached to. I'm not personally attached to Perry, Cain, or Schon as individuals because I don't know them. I know some things about them that have both pleased and displeased me, but that doesn't make them any less of a singer, songwriter/keyboardist, or guitarist.

I'm attached to the music. That's why we're all here or, at least, why we all came here initially. It's about the art, not the artist. It's why the capitalist in me can still enjoy the works of Karl Marx, why the Christian in me can appreciate the words of Richard Dawkins, why the Democrat in me can listen to Glenn Beck, etc. and so forth.

[Deb]

For what it's worth, I don't think it's an issue of whether or not we have an attachment but rather it's an issue of what we're attached to. I'm not personally attached to Perry, Cain, or Schon as individuals because I don't know them. I know some things about them that have both pleased and displeased me, but that doesn't make them any less of a singer, songwriter/keyboardist, or guitarist.

I'm attached to the music. That's why we're all here or, at least, why we all came here initially. It's about the art, not the artist. It's why the capitalist in me can still enjoy the works of Karl Marx, why the Christian in me can appreciate the words of Richard Dawkins, why the Democrat in me can listen to Glenn Beck, etc. and so forth.

LOL, I'm not personally attached to any of them either.....but I will concede, yes, for me for the most part it's all about the vocals, and I can get a little protective of my favorite singers when I think somebody is posting crap about them.

[Behshad]

I'll give it a shot.

The story as far as I'm aware goes something like:

JSS was named lead vocalist, they recorded Winds Of Freedom. The song wasn't all that good and supposedly JSS didn't have good writing chemistry with Schon and Cain and wanted a vocalist that had more of the legacy Journey sound. So without saying a word Schon and Cain started looking for a new vocalist while JSS was touring with Talisman and found Jeremy and then once again changed their mind and ditched him and went with Arnel. All this while JSS didnt know they were looking for a replacement.

There have been numerous rumors as to why he was let go, but as the most logical is what I've wrote above. Although I would believe some of the rumors swirling around. Also JSS according to a recent interview with Castronovo "wanted a law suit" against the band, but lost. JSS denied that. It's really an unforunate mess (no pun intended from JSS's last solo album), but it's what happens. IMO it's for the better for music lovers of JSS because I think he'd have blown his voice out a lot quicker than Arnie will because on the Reno boot that was put up a lil while back JSS seemed to be straining a bit on some of the songs they were performing.

Describe the song-writting chemistry between Arnel and Neal/Friga , please
And Why would they want to have a singer that have more of legacy sound, when they wanted to get away from the legacy sound and create something different ?

[Behshad]

For what it's worth, I don't think it's an issue of whether or not we have an attachment but rather it's an issue of what we're attached to. I'm not personally attached to Perry, Cain, or Schon as individuals because I don't know them. I know some things about them that have both pleased and displeased me, but that doesn't make them any less of a singer, songwriter/keyboardist, or guitarist.

I'm attached to the music. That's why we're all here or, at least, why we all came here initially. It's about the art, not the artist. It's why the capitalist in me can still enjoy the works of Karl Marx, why the Christian in me can appreciate the words of Richard Dawkins, why the Democrat in me can listen to Glenn Beck, etc. and so forth.

Amen!

[Behshad]

Doesn't mean I worship JSS.

[Greg]

No, I definitely was not saying that JSS fans are racists. My "racists" comment didn't have anything to do with JSS fans, Perry fans, or Augeri fans. It's just that IMHO a lot of the bashing that AP receives on here is because of a racist agenda. I was in no way trying to knock JSS or his fans!

Whoaa...I think you need to be careful about throwing out the racist card toward the "majority" of folks here who are not Arnel fans. I don't see any evidence of this being true for that "majority". Consider me not so much an Arnel fan, but believe me when I say it has nothing to do with his race/nationality. Quite frankly, I find such a statement very offensive in itself.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I' The song wasn't all that good and supposedly JSS didn't have good writing chemistry with Schon and Cain and wanted a vocalist that had more of the legacy Journey sound.

I thought that song was 100% Cain.