with Rascal Flatts

[hoagiepete]

Haven't got though all the posts, but just watched a youtube shot off a fricken computer. From that grainy image I saw a couple of bands appearing to be having fun, with a crowd being fully entertained. Awesome!

Course it's not perfect, but I thought it was great. Sometime you just need to enjoy what you got, when you get it and not be so damn critical. Life is too short.

Not only that....it's FFFRRRRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIDAY!

[YoungJRNY]

He didn't forget any words, the song was heavily edited for time constraints to end the show. I mean, the damn credits were listing for Christ sake, haha. The network was pretty much saying "okay, you got 1 minute tops, GO." I honestly don't think this performance was bad whatsoever, this version of DSB sounded the same coming from Arnel's performance than it did when they were getting off the chart reviews his first couple years in the band itself. Ohwell, can't please everybody OR anybody. This is a proven instance of it. That's the Journey fanbase's problem, they always want and need to compare the lead singers performance to something or someone. They won't allow the lead singer to be his own entity and blame the front-man for not living up to their expectations. All I know is, my country buddies, who are hardcore country, let me talk them into buying 2-led Arnel albums because they enjoyed that moment so much and dug Arnel.

Not just a Journey fanbase problem, any band that has changed singers will have the comparisons. And when you have a band that exchanges their singer out to the extend Journey has, well it's just a given there is going to be more to talk about than most bands. Funny, I don't recall ever hearing that comment 'they won't allow the lead singer to be his own entity' when Jeff was fronting the band. Things that make you go, hmmmmm.

IMO the fan base is split in two.........ones that wanted more of a karaoke of Perry vocally to sing those songs and then there is the ones that wanted change. LOL and there are the ones that just don't care anymore. Have to say, I DO like Arnel's tone, but I definitely agree with Matt, right from day one it isn't his diction that bothered me that much it's his delivery. He will extend a word too long or chop it too short and it just doesn't work for me. That would probably be my only crticism of him. And believe me, delivery is a deal breaker for me.

For me, that's why Jeff worked and Arnel doesn't. But it's not just Journey, I have the same opinion when it comes to Foreigner and Boston.......Kelly works and Home Depot guy doesn't. Just my opinion of course.......

Good post and you bring up good & valid points rather than saying one's despicable in talent.

First and foremost, even though I have opinions on singers and what they bring to any band, I will always RESPECT their craft. Respect for talent is big for me and when somebody disrespects Arnel (or anybody for that matter) and call them talentless is when I get edgy in debate.

I've stated NUMEROUS times how I didn't think JSS, in the end, was a good overall fit in the direction of Journey but at the same time, I respected him as his own singer because he's as talented as ANYBODY in the industry. I love JSS as JSS, not fronting Journey.

That said, I think it was too late to go with an all new sound with JSS at the helm. In 1998? Yes, it would have worked and Jeff would of been a fuckin BALLIN' decision if they wanted to go Journey-Hagar on everybody. They didn't. Instead, they kept to their "Perry-Journey sound" and 14 years later, it's WAY too late to watch somebody up there like JSS completely change the culture of Journey when they are literally hanging on their last legs as a band.

Neal isn't dumb (sort of), he knew what he was getting with Arnel from a story standpoint. That is where I disagree with you and why Arnel WORKS and is the best decision the band could have EVER made in the present day. Even though JSS is a great talent, he wouldn't have pulled in the audience that Arnel has for the band.

Maybe a small percentage of his Soul Sirkus crowd and whatever else, but to the mass, noone would of cared he sung in Soul Sirkus. Same with Jeremey. Jeremey would of been viewed as a karoke singer (that's what a tribute band would do) and noone would of cared beyond a certain point.

Arnel's story kind of fit perfectly in the "social networking" world and the Youtubers of the world. It doesn't get bigger than that. That's what I mean when I say how Journey convinced the young crowds. Even in the Augeri-era, you barely saw the young crowd. It wasn't until recently where you saw MASSES of young crowds show up at Journey concerts (even though Arnel wasn't 100% responsible, but he is atleast A percentage of it via Youtube-rags-to-riches story.)

Also, about "selling out stadiums" that's a thing of the past. Hell, even the Chez, who is one of the biggest superstars in the business today, needs a huge billing tour to get himself packed into stadiums. It's just a thing of the past but I'll take Journey anyway I can get them. Their on their last legs, I suggest enjoying them while you can.

Anyway, there's more I can ramble on about but I'll just leave it at that, haha.

[portland]

Actually dude, I'm saying his upbringing makes his vocal capabilities singing English songs that much harder, not better. The dude is Filipino but yet, people have a problem with his diction? Well, no shit, his first language is FAR from English but can go out and do Journey justice. He's been working his balls off to sing the diction better, and for the most part, he has compared to once he first started fronting the band. I have no problem with his diction whatsoever. I really do think Arnel can sing his ass off.

That's just it, he's not doing Journey justice. His enunciation/diction in this performance was not good. Plus, I think he forgot a few words. It was an electrifying performance because of the collaboration and simply the popularity of the song, but Arnel's performance was lacking. I bet the people would've been on their feet for the Glee cast singing it with RF too. For people who would rather have this Journey than no Journey, I guess it's acceptable. I won't pay money to go see it, though. I can spend much less money and go see Frontiers - something that sounds much more like the original. It's easier to replicate a guitar/band sound than it is to replicate a vocalist like Espee.

Anybody else chuckle thinking about the review Deano would give of this performance???

I was just thinking that when I logged on to see what else has been added to this thread!

[portland]

It seemed like the audience was really into the song, though which is cool.

Maybe I focus too much on this..but I guess since I never got to see Journey with Perry and was ridiculed so much in the 90's for liking Journey and melodic rock that a night like this is SO gratifying to me. I feel like screaming SEE! People LOVE Journey...its positive, fun music and it makes people happy!

um that makes me want to scream....that is not the Journey I remember....just sayin!

[The Sushi Hunter]

It seemed like the audience was really into the song, though which is cool.

Maybe I focus too much on this..but I guess since I never got to see Journey with Perry and was ridiculed so much in the 90's for liking Journey and melodic rock that a night like this is SO gratifying to me. I feel like screaming SEE! People LOVE Journey...its positive, fun music and it makes people happy!

um that makes me want to scream....that is not the Journey I remember....just sayin!

That's exactly what I think anytime I see the bands that I grew up listening to (Van Halen, Aerosmith, Motley Crue, etc. etc. etc.). They all got old. If I really want to see and hear what I remember, I tend to just rerun the old vids and spin the original vinyl. That works for me.

[Rick]

Are you kidding me about the Soto comment?

There was more excitement brewing with Soto than this guy has produced.

In niche rock circles (like here on MR.com) there was plenty of buzz about Soto. Arnel's story, as sappy and as overplayed as it is, managed to breach the mainstream. I don't think a JSS or Jeremey-fronted Journey would've been on Oprah or Ellen or caught fire in nearly the same way.

I never thought Jeremy had the chops for Journey, either (sorry dude...)

Soto is the Real Deal.

Knox, I miss seeing you post, because you don't post often, and it's good to see you when you do, but for this, you're a few years late to this party. The Arnel haters, who some are still here, have even grown to accept him, at least to an extent. One example is AR. He hates Journey with a passion, but gives Arnel props. That's fairly huge. My point is, most of us older posters, like you and me would have loved to have seen, or heard what an album with JSS would have been like. I'm sure it would have been everything we could have thought it would have been. We wanted it to happen, but it didn't. Fuck us. But Journey went in the direction they did and we've grown to accept it. Arnel has an excellent voice. and can sing the catalog, and I've been one of the people saying "Yay" because Journey decided on a singer and moved on. I would ultimately have liked to have either JSS or Jeremey, but we got Arnel. That was 5 years ago. Which brings me to my point. He has done an admirable job, and I think I was wowed by his back story and such and I went to a few shows and he did deliver. But 5 years down the road, he's still having enunciation problems? This is where I'm getting tired of Arnel. I listened to the show where Journey and Rascall Flatts sang DSB together, and Arnel is still having diction problems. That's really unacceptable after 5 years.

Anyway, Hi Knox! Good to see you, dude.

[koberry]

I like Arnel and love ECL1P53... but I agree with the original post from Knox - DSB was very poorly enunciated and he wasn't close to the notes. That said, we've seen countless shows and youtubes where he knocks it out of the park. Just an off night. Not really worth arguing about. I did think it was quite cool how much fun the bands seemed to be having, how much respect RF seemed to have for the band and how the countrified folks in the audience all knew the words. Quite cool. I saw Rock of Ages on/off Broadway and hearing the JRNY songs gave me chills cuz it was so cool. Will probably go see the movie next week or whenever it comes out.

[Aaron]

It's possible. I've not seen them since they detuned so I'm running from youtube clips. My references are the original tracks with Perry I listen to often. I think he's getting better.

The other possibility is that your getting used to AP's diction, making it less noticable as time goes by. As I've said before, I don't notice any diction from him and this could possibly be because I'm used to it now because of my exposure to living in the Philippines and Japan for most of my life collectively. I never notice any diction issues when listening to Arnel singing.

Fair enough. I had issues with AP's diction early on. He has improved significantly since he joined the band. I would have liked to see him improve at a faster rate early on. The two things that keep AP in great catagory for me is his lack of emotion (or dynamics) and his over use of vibrato. AP sounds like he runs in chest voice most of the time. This reduces the dynamics in his voice which reduces the emotion conveyed IMO. He sounds like he's yelling a lot. He also uses vibrato extensively. Again this is a personal prefference thing but I don't care for it's over use. It's like Zakk Wylde on guitar using pinch harmonics. He uses pinch harmonics enough you can if it's him playing 2 bars into a song. Some people like it, some don't. I fall in the latter catagory.

Dude, do you think that AP growning up homeless and not having English as his native language makes his vocal talents better today than someone else’s? I think Arnel is a good singer, no doubt. I would suggest that we judge a singer's talent on vocal capability. Suggesting AP's difficult upbringing early in life makes him a better vocal talent is ridiculous.

I don't expect anyone to match 1978 - 81.

But I DO expect a lead singer with some sort of talent.

Take this kid, here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0HGri7RmN4

He has more talent in his finger than Arnel has.

And this guy, Marc Martel:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dREKkAk628I

Arnel can't touch those two in the vocal arena. At All.

Jeff Scott Soto blew Arnel away with the Journey material. I have no "agenda". Arnel is just a hack vocalist and has never impressed me at all.

There are talented vocalists out there. TONS of them. Arenel isn't one of them.

Continue your love fest for Arnel. It doesn't bother me at all. The dude simply can't sing well.

Arnel may not be the GOD of vocalists, but the the dude was homeless at one point of his life, lived in a 3rd world country where English wasn't even his first language. Going from singing in bars, scavenging up .50 cents a night to singing in front of thousands, night in & night out in a foreign country with a MEGA-ROCK LEGEND band like Journey is not made for a "hack vocalist." Sorry, but your "agenda" screams it all when you say Arnel has never impressed you at all and that he "simply" can't sing well.

You don't have to like the guy, but to say Arnel can't sing well is nothing short of blasphemes and he is WELL AWARE of people like you. And for the record, Soto never came remotely close to blowing Arnel away with Journey material. The band didn't even sound like Journey with him at the helm. Arnel is a great direction for the band and does his job well, deal with it. That or stay in 1981 and continue to find the better singers out there than Arnel Pineda. You say it's a love fest when it's clearly a form of trolling HATE for Arnel than anything else. Admit it, you hated the performance before it even began

Actually dude, I'm saying his upbringing makes his vocal capabilities singing English songs that much harder, not better. The dude is Filipino but yet, people have a problem with his diction? Well, no shit, his first language is FAR from English but can go out and do Journey justice. He's been working his balls off to sing the diction better, and for the most part, he has compared to once he first started fronting the band. I have no problem with his diction whatsoever. I really do think Arnel can sing his ass off.

[RocknRoll]

Well just my thoughts...but I've seen Journey quite a few times in the last couple years and the one thing I've noticed is when AP gets nervous (as in a big televised show), he really gets into the moment and his diction suffers! Something he probably needs to work on and probably wouldn't happen at the end of a tour. I guess we'll see this summer.

[Don]

I like Arnel and love ECL1P53... but I agree with the original post from Knox - DSB was very poorly enunciated and he wasn't close to the notes. That said, we've seen countless shows and youtubes where he knocks it out of the park. Just an off night. Not really worth arguing about. I did think it was quite cool how much fun the bands seemed to be having, how much respect RF seemed to have for the band and how the countrified folks in the audience all knew the words. Quite cool. I saw Rock of Ages on/off Broadway and hearing the JRNY songs gave me chills cuz it was so cool. Will probably go see the movie next week or whenever it comes out.

Yeah, it just happens that his two off nights while singing on TV were this and the Superbowl pre-game. Really, I didn't even notice those problems as much as the performance just looked to have been badly rehearsed.
To be honest, I think the best version of DSB I have ever heard from Arnel was from the youtube video that got him discovered.

[knox]

Rick !!! Thanks for the message, my friend.

Don't mean to be a downer. And I really am not trying to be an Arnel Basher. To be quite honest, I don't listen to anything from his Journey Albums. All of my experience with him has been from Youtube.

For all I know, his studio stuff might sound good. But I am not impressed with any Youtube clip.

I will hop of "The Train", and try to be a bit more positive from here on out.

Have a great weekend ! I am not On Call, so no matter WHAT I do this weekend, it will be a good one.

[slucero]

Are you kidding me about the Soto comment?

There was more excitement brewing with Soto than this guy has produced.

In niche rock circles (like here on MR.com) there was plenty of buzz about Soto. Arnel's story, as sappy and as overplayed as it is, managed to breach the mainstream. I don't think a JSS or Jeremey-fronted Journey would've been on Oprah or Ellen or caught fire in nearly the same way.

I never thought Jeremy had the chops for Journey, either (sorry dude...)

Soto is the Real Deal.

Knox, I miss seeing you post, because you don't post often, and it's good to see you when you do, but for this, you're a few years late to this party. The Arnel haters, who some are still here, have even grown to accept him, at least to an extent. One example is AR. He hates Journey with a passion, but gives Arnel props. That's fairly huge. My point is, most of us older posters, like you and me would have loved to have seen, or heard what an album with JSS would have been like. I'm sure it would have been everything we could have thought it would have been. We wanted it to happen, but it didn't. Fuck us. But Journey went in the direction they did and we've grown to accept it. Arnel has an excellent voice. and can sing the catalog, and I've been one of the people saying "Yay" because Journey decided on a singer and moved on. I would ultimately have liked to have either JSS or Jeremey, but we got Arnel. That was 5 years ago. Which brings me to my point. He has done an admirable job, and I think I was wowed by his back story and such and I went to a few shows and he did deliver. But 5 years down the road, he's still having enunciation problems? This is where I'm getting tired of Arnel. I listened to the show where Journey and Rascall Flatts sang DSB together, and Arnel is still having diction problems. That's really unacceptable after 5 years.

Anyway, Hi Knox! Good to see you, dude.

I think his diction is about as good as its gonna get Rick... after all AP doesn't even live in the states..... so in his off-time he's not speaking English at all..

[steveo777]

Are you kidding me about the Soto comment?

There was more excitement brewing with Soto than this guy has produced.

In niche rock circles (like here on MR.com) there was plenty of buzz about Soto. Arnel's story, as sappy and as overplayed as it is, managed to breach the mainstream. I don't think a JSS or Jeremey-fronted Journey would've been on Oprah or Ellen or caught fire in nearly the same way.

I never thought Jeremy had the chops for Journey, either (sorry dude...)

Soto is the Real Deal.

Knox, I miss seeing you post, because you don't post often, and it's good to see you when you do, but for this, you're a few years late to this party. The Arnel haters, who some are still here, have even grown to accept him, at least to an extent. One example is AR. He hates Journey with a passion, but gives Arnel props. That's fairly huge. My point is, most of us older posters, like you and me would have loved to have seen, or heard what an album with JSS would have been like. I'm sure it would have been everything we could have thought it would have been. We wanted it to happen, but it didn't. Fuck us. But Journey went in the direction they did and we've grown to accept it. Arnel has an excellent voice. and can sing the catalog, and I've been one of the people saying "Yay" because Journey decided on a singer and moved on. I would ultimately have liked to have either JSS or Jeremey, but we got Arnel. That was 5 years ago. Which brings me to my point. He has done an admirable job, and I think I was wowed by his back story and such and I went to a few shows and he did deliver. But 5 years down the road, he's still having enunciation problems? This is where I'm getting tired of Arnel. I listened to the show where Journey and Rascall Flatts sang DSB together, and Arnel is still having diction problems. That's really unacceptable after 5 years.

Anyway, Hi Knox! Good to see you, dude.

I think his diction is about as good as its gonna get Rick... after all AP doesn't even live in the states..... so in his off-time he's not speaking English at all..

Part of me says they really need to talk to him about this. Maybe, seeing it from a different view, the band feels they are not going to try and change Arnel. After all, it was them who pulled him out of his natural habitat to "audition for the band". He rocked their world and they rocked his. Maybe that's just good enough for all. As wise as these guys are in their ages and experience, maybe they know that you just don't change people.

[slucero]

Are you kidding me about the Soto comment?

There was more excitement brewing with Soto than this guy has produced.

In niche rock circles (like here on MR.com) there was plenty of buzz about Soto. Arnel's story, as sappy and as overplayed as it is, managed to breach the mainstream. I don't think a JSS or Jeremey-fronted Journey would've been on Oprah or Ellen or caught fire in nearly the same way.

I never thought Jeremy had the chops for Journey, either (sorry dude...)

Soto is the Real Deal.

Knox, I miss seeing you post, because you don't post often, and it's good to see you when you do, but for this, you're a few years late to this party. The Arnel haters, who some are still here, have even grown to accept him, at least to an extent. One example is AR. He hates Journey with a passion, but gives Arnel props. That's fairly huge. My point is, most of us older posters, like you and me would have loved to have seen, or heard what an album with JSS would have been like. I'm sure it would have been everything we could have thought it would have been. We wanted it to happen, but it didn't. Fuck us. But Journey went in the direction they did and we've grown to accept it. Arnel has an excellent voice. and can sing the catalog, and I've been one of the people saying "Yay" because Journey decided on a singer and moved on. I would ultimately have liked to have either JSS or Jeremey, but we got Arnel. That was 5 years ago. Which brings me to my point. He has done an admirable job, and I think I was wowed by his back story and such and I went to a few shows and he did deliver. But 5 years down the road, he's still having enunciation problems? This is where I'm getting tired of Arnel. I listened to the show where Journey and Rascall Flatts sang DSB together, and Arnel is still having diction problems. That's really unacceptable after 5 years.

Anyway, Hi Knox! Good to see you, dude.

I think his diction is about as good as its gonna get Rick... after all AP doesn't even live in the states..... so in his off-time he's not speaking English at all..

Part of me says they really need to talk to him about this. Maybe, seeing it from a different view, the band feels they are not going to try and change Arnel. After all, it was them who pulled him out of his natural habitat to "audition for the band". He rocked their world and they rocked his. Maybe that's just good enough for all. As wise as these guys are in their ages and experience, maybe they know that you just don't change people.

If it was that important (to the band) it would be resolved by now... 5 years in.. maybe they just realize there's no need as this is the "ride into the sunset"...

[donnaplease]

Part of me says they really need to talk to him about this. Maybe, seeing it from a different view, the band feels they are not going to try and change Arnel. After all, it was them who pulled him out of his natural habitat to "audition for the band". He rocked their world and they rocked his. Maybe that's just good enough for all. As wise as these guys are in their ages and experience, maybe they know that you just don't change people.

This was my problem with the whole situation when it occurred. He IS an asian singer who unfortunately does not speak english as his primary language. I always thought that Journey, an AMERICAN band, should have a frontman who could speak english clearly enough that it wouldn't show through in the songs. It was never about racism, although LOTS of people tried to paint me (and others who shared a similar view) with that brush. Had your comment been made back in '07 by someone who wasn't buying into the Arnel story, I can only imagine what would've happened to them. Bottom line is that it was just too much of a leap for me to accept - and after watching the CMA clip it really doesn't seem to be any better 5 years later. Arnel seems like a good guy - NONE of this is his fault and I wish him nothing but the best, I just don't think he's the right guy to carry this band into the sunset, and I can't force myself to try to make the best of it for the sake of the music. Not when I have been blessed with audio and video of the real deal - the original performances.

[Rick]

Part of me says they really need to talk to him about this. Maybe, seeing it from a different view, the band feels they are not going to try and change Arnel. After all, it was them who pulled him out of his natural habitat to "audition for the band". He rocked their world and they rocked his. Maybe that's just good enough for all. As wise as these guys are in their ages and experience, maybe they know that you just don't change people.

This was my problem with the whole situation when it occurred. He IS an asian singer who unfortunately does not speak english as his primary language. I always thought that Journey, an AMERICAN band, should have a frontman who could speak english clearly enough that it wouldn't show through in the songs. It was never about racism, although LOTS of people tried to paint me (and others who shared a similar view) with that brush. Had your comment been made back in '07 by someone who wasn't buying into the Arnel story, I can only imagine what would've happened to them. Bottom line is that it was just too much of a leap for me to accept - and after watching the CMA clip it really doesn't seem to be any better 5 years later. Arnel seems like a good guy - NONE of this is his fault and I wish him nothing but the best, I just don't think he's the right guy to carry this band into the sunset, and I can't force myself to try to make the best of it for the sake of the music. Not when I have been blessed with audio and video of the real deal - the original performances.

Yeah, I was saying they needed an American singer also and heard the racist comments early on. It's not racist to want someone who can connect with songs like Mother, Father, where you have to have lived in the culture to get it, emote it and sing it properly. That's why they give that one to Deen.

[steveo777]

Part of me says they really need to talk to him about this. Maybe, seeing it from a different view, the band feels they are not going to try and change Arnel. After all, it was them who pulled him out of his natural habitat to "audition for the band". He rocked their world and they rocked his. Maybe that's just good enough for all. As wise as these guys are in their ages and experience, maybe they know that you just don't change people.

This was my problem with the whole situation when it occurred. He IS an asian singer who unfortunately does not speak english as his primary language. I always thought that Journey, an AMERICAN band, should have a frontman who could speak english clearly enough that it wouldn't show through in the songs. It was never about racism, although LOTS of people tried to paint me (and others who shared a similar view) with that brush. Had your comment been made back in '07 by someone who wasn't buying into the Arnel story, I can only imagine what would've happened to them. Bottom line is that it was just too much of a leap for me to accept - and after watching the CMA clip it really doesn't seem to be any better 5 years later. Arnel seems like a good guy - NONE of this is his fault and I wish him nothing but the best, I just don't think he's the right guy to carry this band into the sunset, and I can't force myself to try to make the best of it for the sake of the music. Not when I have been blessed with audio and video of the real deal - the original performances.

Yeah, I was saying they needed an American singer also and heard the racist comments early on. It's not racist to want someone who can connect with songs like Mother, Father, where you have to have lived in the culture to get it, emote it and sing it properly. That's why they give that one to Deen.

Still, however, I have to give him kudos for handling himself the way he has under what must be an unbelievable amount of pressure. At least they didn't pull a Tiger out of the jungle and expect it to sleep with puppies. AP doesn't have an ego. Maybe he needs to have more ego.

[slucero]

I feel bad for Arnel in that regard.... so much of his early life was "singing to survive"... that he never really had the opportunity to experience music the same way Perry did.. having that musical history impact and color his vocal development...

In some way this is what Arnel is missing... that musical "language" that would have imprinted on him, in much the same way Perry had his "Cook-isms"... but for Perry they were stylistic references that he incorporated and made his own... I don't hear that in Arnel's vocal style... and more importantly I don't hear it when he sings Journey.

Ironically - I do hear it with Deen....

[mrsp]

The thing that stood out to me was how bad Deen looked. Bad as in not healthy.

[Don]

The thing that stood out to me was how bad Deen looked. Bad as in not healthy.

I didn't even notice Deen except from far off.

[steveo777]

I still think Deen should star in a modern day Dracula movie. Someone with some photo shop skills should create this character.

[The Sushi Hunter]

Part of me says they really need to talk to him about this. Maybe, seeing it from a different view, the band feels they are not going to try and change Arnel. After all, it was them who pulled him out of his natural habitat to "audition for the band". He rocked their world and they rocked his. Maybe that's just good enough for all. As wise as these guys are in their ages and experience, maybe they know that you just don't change people.

This was my problem with the whole situation when it occurred. He IS an asian singer who unfortunately does not speak english as his primary language. I always thought that Journey, an AMERICAN band, should have a frontman who could speak english clearly enough that it wouldn't show through in the songs. It was never about racism, although LOTS of people tried to paint me (and others who shared a similar view) with that brush. Had your comment been made back in '07 by someone who wasn't buying into the Arnel story, I can only imagine what would've happened to them. Bottom line is that it was just too much of a leap for me to accept - and after watching the CMA clip it really doesn't seem to be any better 5 years later. Arnel seems like a good guy - NONE of this is his fault and I wish him nothing but the best, I just don't think he's the right guy to carry this band into the sunset, and I can't force myself to try to make the best of it for the sake of the music. Not when I have been blessed with audio and video of the real deal - the original performances.

Actually he knows English just as well as he does his own native language and he speaks just as much English as he does the other. He just has an accent is all. English is the Philippines second language and he's known English most, if not all of his life.

[Argus]

http://www.cmt.com/videos/misc/788119/banjo-dont-stop-believin-from-the-2012-cmt-music-awards.jhtml

First listen just now. It was fine. ya'll are making a huge deal about it and I can understand your concerns but heck, it was just fine.

This, however was better http://www.cmt.com/videos/misc/788115/tonight-tonight-we-owned-the-night-from-the-2012-cmt-music-awards.jhtml?xrs=share_copy

[steveo777]

http://www.cmt.com/videos/misc/788119/banjo-dont-stop-believin-from-the-2012-cmt-music-awards.jhtml

First listen just now. It was fine. ya'll are making a huge deal about it and I can understand your concerns but heck, it was just fine.

This, however was better http://www.cmt.com/videos/misc/788115/tonight-tonight-we-owned-the-night-from-the-2012-cmt-music-awards.jhtml?xrs=share_copy

Don't be offended, but what happened to Hillary's ass? She was thick, but fine before. How happen?

[donnaplease]

Part of me says they really need to talk to him about this. Maybe, seeing it from a different view, the band feels they are not going to try and change Arnel. After all, it was them who pulled him out of his natural habitat to "audition for the band". He rocked their world and they rocked his. Maybe that's just good enough for all. As wise as these guys are in their ages and experience, maybe they know that you just don't change people.

This was my problem with the whole situation when it occurred. He IS an asian singer who unfortunately does not speak english as his primary language. I always thought that Journey, an AMERICAN band, should have a frontman who could speak english clearly enough that it wouldn't show through in the songs. It was never about racism, although LOTS of people tried to paint me (and others who shared a similar view) with that brush. Had your comment been made back in '07 by someone who wasn't buying into the Arnel story, I can only imagine what would've happened to them. Bottom line is that it was just too much of a leap for me to accept - and after watching the CMA clip it really doesn't seem to be any better 5 years later. Arnel seems like a good guy - NONE of this is his fault and I wish him nothing but the best, I just don't think he's the right guy to carry this band into the sunset, and I can't force myself to try to make the best of it for the sake of the music. Not when I have been blessed with audio and video of the real deal - the original performances.

Actually he knows English just as well as he does his own native language and he speaks just as much English as he does the other. He just has an accent is all. English is the Philippines second language and he's known English most, if not all of his life.

Fair enough. When I lived in San Diego I worked with a lot of Filipinos and in fact my neighbor/baby-sitter was filipino. We spent a lot of time with her and her family/friends, so between them and those that I worked with I get what you're saying. They were able to 'speak' english but it was clearly obvious that it wasn't their primary language. It was also clear that they didn't perceive the nuances of "americanisms" as someone born here did. That's not necessarily a bad thing, it's just easier to 'relate' to folks whose life/cultural experiences are similar. Now, having said that... I live in a rather rural area in the south and I can get a little "redneck" when I want to. It's part of me, and it's something that someone from NYC or LA might not relate to.

Bottom line is that the accent is noticeable and does distract and therefore detract from his performance. I'd be much more accepting if he were a solo singer or a singer from a band that doesn't have such an impact on my youth, because he does have a lot of talent.

[Rick]

Part of me says they really need to talk to him about this. Maybe, seeing it from a different view, the band feels they are not going to try and change Arnel. After all, it was them who pulled him out of his natural habitat to "audition for the band". He rocked their world and they rocked his. Maybe that's just good enough for all. As wise as these guys are in their ages and experience, maybe they know that you just don't change people.

This was my problem with the whole situation when it occurred. He IS an asian singer who unfortunately does not speak english as his primary language. I always thought that Journey, an AMERICAN band, should have a frontman who could speak english clearly enough that it wouldn't show through in the songs. It was never about racism, although LOTS of people tried to paint me (and others who shared a similar view) with that brush. Had your comment been made back in '07 by someone who wasn't buying into the Arnel story, I can only imagine what would've happened to them. Bottom line is that it was just too much of a leap for me to accept - and after watching the CMA clip it really doesn't seem to be any better 5 years later. Arnel seems like a good guy - NONE of this is his fault and I wish him nothing but the best, I just don't think he's the right guy to carry this band into the sunset, and I can't force myself to try to make the best of it for the sake of the music. Not when I have been blessed with audio and video of the real deal - the original performances.

Yeah, I was saying they needed an American singer also and heard the racist comments early on. It's not racist to want someone who can connect with songs like Mother, Father, where you have to have lived in the culture to get it, emote it and sing it properly. That's why they give that one to Deen.

Still, however, I have to give him kudos for handling himself the way he has under what must be an unbelievable amount of pressure. At least they didn't pull a Tiger out of the jungle and expect it to sleep with puppies. AP doesn't have an ego. Maybe he needs to have more ego.

I give him kudos, because he has undertaken a huge task. I know he's dedicated to keeping himself in shape just for the rigors of performing and touring. I'm sure he's doing the best he can. I just wish he or they would get him someone to help him with the diction issues in the songs. They only play about 30 from their catalog. Like in "Lights", he flubs the lyric "There's been mornings, out on the road without you." every time. Someone take him aside and say it's out on the road, not Out of the road.

Little things like that should have been taken care of early on. Once you let it go on for too long, it's much harder to correct. Old habits, ya know?

[Gideon]

Arnel's enduring and obvious diction problems stands testament to Journey's tendency to half ass pretty much everything.

[Don]

Arnel's enduring and obvious diction problems stands testament to Journey's tendency to half ass pretty much everything.

I think it's just Arnel being surrounded by fellow Filipinos all the time, even when he's on the road now. He just doesn't have to speak English other than when he is on stage or rehearsing with his bandmates. He's immersed in his own culture, and as long as people keep going to the shows, there really isn't any motivation for him to try and correct something that only seems detrimental to few people.
Journey really is a part time gig for him if you think about it. When the band isn't touring, It's not like he is going to jump in his car and drive over to Jon's house with some kind of amazing idea for the next album or something.
A hired gun, coming in only when he's called; otherwise, totally off the clock regarding all things Journey.

The typical Journey fan doesn't care enough to buy Eclipse, see's the band once a year and probably sings a long with the songs to the point they don't really hear Arnel's accent anyway.

Journey doesn't have hardcore fans to the point that a lot of of other bands do. They're basically a sugary pop treat that people enjoy once a year and don't think about much after that except for those times when they hear a song playing on the radio or catch the band on TV for a New York minute singing DSB.

[Liam]

My brother loved it. He is now dead to me.

[Argus]

http://www.cmt.com/videos/misc/788119/banjo-dont-stop-believin-from-the-2012-cmt-music-awards.jhtml

First listen just now. It was fine. ya'll are making a huge deal about it and I can understand your concerns but heck, it was just fine.

This, however was better http://www.cmt.com/videos/misc/788115/tonight-tonight-we-owned-the-night-from-the-2012-cmt-music-awards.jhtml?xrs=share_copy

Don't be offended, but what happened to Hillary's ass? She was thick, but fine before. How happen?

Not offended one bit since I never noticed her ass-ets before I just think they kicked off the show perfectly .. I had a similar moment during Bruno Mars rocking number during the Grammys. Award shows just are not very much fun and I like to cite the bright moments.