City of Hope single to be released April 4th??

[Andrew]

What it's worth, I think JSS and Arnel are very similar. Both are outstanding vocalists and both have a chameleon like taken to adapt to perform whatever is needed.
JSS via all his many styles and passions and projects and Arnel via all those amazing YouTube covers.

[SYNCH]

What it's worth, I think JSS and Arnel are very similar. Both are outstanding vocalists and both have a chameleon like taken to adapt to perform whatever is needed.
JSS via all his many styles and passions and projects and Arnel via all those amazing YouTube covers.

That's I believe is the perfect word to describe Arnel and all other singers given the job. No way they are going to sing the classics differently, hell Bon Jovi tried doing it differently and it's awful. That's even with the same singer. Steve Perry is probably on the same page, he just can't take it himself, he feels guilt singing the songs he sang flawlessly.

[Ritchie]

Rather then Revelation where he was "Thrown into the band / an Album" to sing mostly Steve Perry Classics, Eclipse is the 1st album, coming from a place where Arnel is "IN the Band" -
Folks on here can criticize his voice, and thats fine if it's not your ball of wax... but this really, sounds like "Arnel's record" / Voice on a production, and musical style that has evolved for Journey themselves, combined, and Gelled with Arnel's tone, to create a sound, WITH Journey.

Totally agree with this.
In hindsight Revelation will probably be looked at as a transition album.
Revelation had some great new songs with some great vocals from Arnel but including remakes of the greatest hits somewhat sidelined and subdued Arnels own identity,on Eclipse Pineda will have a more profound own vocal identity.
I totally don`t agree with people who label Pineda as just a Perry imitator..the fact that Pineda can cover everything from A to Z means that there is some huge potential.
And this potential will be heard on Eclipse!

[The_Noble_Cause]

Arnel is emulating Perry pretty hard on 'Sunshower', other than that, he sounds like himself to me.

[jrny10]

Another question. Seriously, what happened with the production on Revelation? How could they have signed off on that one? The lack of power, the cardboard sounding drums... what where they thinking? It's hard to listen to the album because of it, in my opinion. And after listening to the sample from Eclipse, it seems that album is going to sound similar to Revelation from a production standpoint...

[The_Noble_Cause]

Arrival sounds muddy...I think Revelation sounds great.

[steveo777]

Another question. Seriously, what happened with the production on Revelation? How could they have signed off on that one? The lack of power, the cardboard sounding drums... what where they thinking? It's hard to listen to the album because of it, in my opinion. And after listening to the sample from Eclipse, it seems that album is going to sound similar to Revelation from a production standpoint...

Why not just wait for the album? I believe Andrew will tell you the album sounds better than Revelation's production, and probably by a long shot.

[superreverb]

Another question. Seriously, what happened with the production on Revelation? How could they have signed off on that one? The lack of power, the cardboard sounding drums... what where they thinking? It's hard to listen to the album because of it, in my opinion. And after listening to the sample from Eclipse, it seems that album is going to sound similar to Revelation from a production standpoint...

Neal has gone on record in the past about disappointments in sounds, recording. But not on this one, he's stated that he is in love with this record in all aspects. I think everyone, including KS, brought their A game in on this one.

I also think a bigger part the "production", or even how Revelation "Was recorded", is how it was Mixed. These new clips to me, sound completely night and day, to Revelation - Huge drums, not cardboard, great quality on Arnels vocal, Jon's keys sound big and fat, bass, there's actually bottom end on these clips.

I think this is the result of Neal & Jon taking this, and mixing it in Nashville, so far, from what i've heard, the 2 little clips of COH and the production, with wide layered guitars and vocals, with great effects, and melodies, I'm not expecting anything like revelation personally. The second I heard the new clip, that was alleviated for me.

I think perhaps some of the seeming conflict between KS and Neal, brought the best of Kevin's production, recording, and ideas to the Table, and Neal & Jon mixing this themselves, to get it to a sonic place where they wanted it, all made a very big difference in the sound of this record.

[Jana]

Arrival sounds muddy...I think Revelation sounds great.

I agree, my one complaint with Arrival is, I don't know how to say it, but it isn't crisp sounding. Revelation always sound fine to me in sound production, but I'm not savvy enough to know the difference.

[Red13JoePa]

Arrival sounds muddy...I think Revelation sounds great.

I agree, my one complaint with Arrival is, I don't know how to say it, but it isn't crisp sounding. Revelation always sound fine to me in sound production, but I'm not savvy enough to know the difference.

Me neither, I never get the bitching about Revelation's sound but I am FAR from a techno geek along those lines.

The muddy tag on Arrival, does fit in many places though, even I can hear that. World Gone Wild being the main offender. Still a great great tune but could SOUND better/clearer.

[slucero]

Another question. Seriously, what happened with the production on Revelation? How could they have signed off on that one? The lack of power, the cardboard sounding drums... what where they thinking? It's hard to listen to the album because of it, in my opinion. And after listening to the sample from Eclipse, it seems that album is going to sound similar to Revelation from a production standpoint...

Neal has gone on record in the past about disappointments in sounds, recording. But not on this one, he's stated that he is in love with this record in all aspects. I think everyone, including KS, brought their A game in on this one.

I also think a bigger part the "production", or even how Revelation "Was recorded", is how it was Mixed. These new clips to me, sound completely night and day, to Revelation - Huge drums, not cardboard, great quality on Arnels vocal, Jon's keys sound big and fat, bass, there's actually bottom end on these clips.

I think this is the result of Neal & Jon taking this, and mixing it in Nashville, so far, from what i've heard, the 2 little clips of COH and the production, with wide layered guitars and vocals, with great effects, and melodies, I'm not expecting anything like revelation personally. The second I heard the new clip, that was alleviated for me.

I think perhaps some of the seeming conflict between KS and Neal, brought the best of Kevin's production, recording, and ideas to the Table, and Neal & Jon mixing this themselves, to get it to a sonic place where they wanted it, all made a very big difference in the sound of this record.

Sonically - the sound of this will have more to do with David Kalmusjy than Neal & Jon... you don't hire a David Kalmusky (has enough of a track record that I'm sure he commands a good fee...) only to mix it yourself...

David Kalmusky is a pretty well respected mixer in Nashville. He's also a fairly respected guitarist... he's even got his own guitar amp line.. I bet thats what sold Neal on him...

Most likely Jon & Neal were present for mixing and remixing, and (along with KS) had to approve the edits - but no mixer of note would completely give up the engineering of a mix if his/her name was going to be be credited for it.... There's a reason musicians have a saying "yer only as good as yer last gig"

[Arkansas]

Arrival sounds muddy...I think Revelation sounds great.

I agree, my one complaint with Arrival is, I don't know how to say it, but it isn't crisp sounding. Revelation always sound fine to me in sound production, but I'm not savvy enough to know the difference.

Yep, Arrival seemed over-produced & processed, in that they tried too hard to put too much of 'everything/whatever' into it. The bass wasn't expansive, the drums were thin or cardboardy, and there was too much reliance on the keys/guitars to carry it back to the 'classic' sound. There are a lot of great songs on that album that got lost in the overall flavour. And, unfortunately, perhaps the converse, Augeri's vocals were too raw & not layered enough, which led to a certain thin'ness. Hard to explain my ears.

Revelation had a better sonic, but it was almost as if they hurried through it...just to get it & the covers on the WM shelves. I mean, while it's good, perhaps it was produced/engineered too loosely. There's a fine line between manufactured & live, and I wish they'd have gone the route of a layered wall of sound, rather than a raw mix, just not over-produce it. Again, hard to explain my ears.


Hate to use a Perry reference here, but his style of production had to do with what he called 'love juice'. And I think it was his way of a powdery layering that gave the overall sonic such an enticing sound to it all.


later~

[kgdjpubs]

Rather then Revelation where he was "Thrown into the band / an Album" to sing mostly Steve Perry Classics, Eclipse is the 1st album, coming from a place where Arnel is "IN the Band" -
Folks on here can criticize his voice, and thats fine if it's not your ball of wax... but this really, sounds like "Arnel's record" / Voice on a production, and musical style that has evolved for Journey themselves, combined, and Gelled with Arnel's tone, to create a sound, WITH Journey.

Totally agree with this.
In hindsight Revelation will probably be looked at as a transition album.
Revelation had some great new songs with some great vocals from Arnel but including remakes of the greatest hits somewhat sidelined and subdued Arnels own identity,on Eclipse Pineda will have a more profound own vocal identity.
I totally don`t agree with people who label Pineda as just a Perry imitator..the fact that Pineda can cover everything from A to Z means that there is some huge potential.
And this potential will be heard on Eclipse!

and the other part of this that has been somewhat hinted at....a lot of Revelation was written before they knew who was going to be singing on it. On the new album, they know Arnel's strengths/weaknesses as a singer, and can write to his strengths.

[S2M]

His strength and weakness is the same: sounding like SP.

[steveo777]

His strength and weakness is the same: sounding like SP.

He's an SP emulator, as the job requires, otherwise no. Clean that wax outta ya ears, boy!

[kgdjpubs]

His strength and weakness is the same: sounding like SP.

tone and pitch? yes. Style, phrasing, influences? no.

[Michigan Girl]

His strength and weakness is the same: sounding like SP.

tone and pitch? yes. Style, phrasing, influences? no.

I agree with
this wholeheartedly ...not one single teeny~tiny micro milligram of doubt!! Do I expect/
want him to sound like Perry?!? Nope ...it is impossible and it will never
happen. The closest he can/will ever come, is with the music that has already been
recorded by Perry ...he should continue his Journey drawing from himself!!

[Ritchie]

His strength and weakness is the same: sounding like SP.

tone and pitch? yes. Style, phrasing, influences? no.

Pineda`s timbre is close to Perry`s but he is clearly a different singer,Perry grew up with Motown and probably portuguese fado,Pineda grew up with Streisand and the Carpenters and later on he covered basically white American/Western rock/pop music.
I would say Perry was a white singer with almost a black voice,a soulsinger with a tremendous range(countertenor)who also could sing rock.
Pineda is a rocksinger with also a tremendous range(tenor)and he developed the ability to somehow morph his voice into the famous voices he had to cover when he performed in the Philippines.
Pineda has what it takes to give Journey a voice that sets them apart but still he has the ability to take them back to the Perry style vocals.

[G.I.Jim]

His strength and weakness is the same: sounding like SP.

tone and pitch? yes. Style, phrasing, influences? no.

Pineda`s timbre is close to Perry`s but he is clearly a different singer,Perry grew up with Motown and probably portuguese fado,Pineda grew up with Streisand and the Carpenters and later on he covered basically white American/Western rock/pop music.
I would say Perry was a white singer with almost a black voice,a soulsinger with a tremendous range(countertenor)who also could sing rock.
Pineda is a rocksinger with also a tremendous range(tenor)and he developed the ability to somehow morph his voice into the famous voices he had to cover when he performed in the Philippines.
Pineda has what it takes to give Journey a voice that sets them apart but still he has the ability to take them back to the Perry style vocals.

Great post Ritchie! I hope this new album changes my opinion of him, but I agree with your take on it. He doesn't sound exactly like Perry, and nobody ever will. I think he did an amazing job on "What I Needed", and I can't wait to hear this new album! While I miss the Perry sound, I'm excited by what I hear about the new album. I hope it's 1/2 as good as they say. We'll see shortly.

[kgdjpubs]

His strength and weakness is the same: sounding like SP.

tone and pitch? yes. Style, phrasing, influences? no.

Pineda`s timbre is close to Perry`s but he is clearly a different singer,Perry grew up with Motown and probably portuguese fado,Pineda grew up with Streisand and the Carpenters and later on he covered basically white American/Western rock/pop music.
I would say Perry was a white singer with almost a black voice,a soulsinger with a tremendous range(countertenor)who also could sing rock.
Pineda is a rocksinger with also a tremendous range(tenor)and he developed the ability to somehow morph his voice into the famous voices he had to cover when he performed in the Philippines.
Pineda has what it takes to give Journey a voice that sets them apart but still he has the ability to take them back to the Perry style vocals.

pretty much, yes. Ironically, the only singer Journey has had with similar influences to Perry was the one who sounded the least like him--Jeff Scott Soto.

[Andrew]

Another question. Seriously, what happened with the production on Revelation? How could they have signed off on that one? The lack of power, the cardboard sounding drums... what where they thinking? It's hard to listen to the album because of it, in my opinion. And after listening to the sample from Eclipse, it seems that album is going to sound similar to Revelation from a production standpoint...

All albums sound a little different and may not suit 100% of listeners, but to my ears Revelation sounds killer.

[Eric]

pretty much, yes. Ironically, the only singer Journey has had with similar influences to Perry was the one who sounded the least like him--Jeff Scott Soto.

That's a great observation.

[Eric]

Another question. Seriously, what happened with the production on Revelation? How could they have signed off on that one? The lack of power, the cardboard sounding drums... what where they thinking? It's hard to listen to the album because of it, in my opinion. And after listening to the sample from Eclipse, it seems that album is going to sound similar to Revelation from a production standpoint...

All albums sound a little different and may not suit 100% of listeners, but to my ears Revelation sounds killer.

After Never Walk Away I agree with you. The opening track had that similar muddy sound as Arrival did. I wouldn't mind someday a GH II of the post-Perry era with Arnel singing a remastered version of songs like Remember Me, Higher Place, etc. I supported the hell out of Augeri, but with the benefit of hindsight I can see what Arnel brings to the table and even what the kick in the ass JSS gave to the group did to energize things. If the original hiring of Augeri wasn't a mistake, it sure was one keeping him for 3 years after he blew out his voice at that rodeo before the Main Event Tour.

[steveo777]

Another question. Seriously, what happened with the production on Revelation? How could they have signed off on that one? The lack of power, the cardboard sounding drums... what where they thinking? It's hard to listen to the album because of it, in my opinion. And after listening to the sample from Eclipse, it seems that album is going to sound similar to Revelation from a production standpoint...

All albums sound a little different and may not suit 100% of listeners, but to my ears Revelation sounds killer.

After Never Walk Away I agree with you. The opening track had that similar muddy sound as Arrival did. I wouldn't mind someday a GH II of the post-Perry era with Arnel singing a remastered version of songs like Remember Me, Higher Place, etc. I supported the hell out of Augeri, but with the benefit of hindsight I can see what Arnel brings to the table and even what the kick in the ass JSS gave to the group did to energize things. If the original hiring of Augeri wasn't a mistake, it sure was one keeping him for 3 years after he blew out his voice at that rodeo before the Main Event Tour.

Arnel's only percieved fault is that his accent and diction hasn't been up to par, for the most part, while his on stage antics are a subjective matter. That is the price of being born in a different country. Younger Filipinos learn English and proper diction, as I'm told. For older ones, it's OJT (On the Job Training). I've gotta give props to him, for despite the adversity, and I'm sure he feels it, he's done a hell of a job. The man has heart, he has emotion and he most certainly has conviction to his purpose. I admire his efforts to make the world a better place for the people he can touch. I'm proud of him, really proud. What he does in Journey, or any other band, just is a vehicle to help him become a larger heart so he can give more to the world. I can get behind that.