Tired of Waiting...

[Matthew]

I disagree, Matty. Perry was a crucial ingredient, no doubt. And the Perry/Schon combo was a hit, no doubt.
But the final ingredient and true catalyst that sent this band to superstardom
was the addition of none other than the man you are currently displaying in your Avatar.

As much as I love E5C4P3 and Frontiers, I wish Rolie would have stayed in the band. I think we would have had more music out of them, assuming Rolie and Perry could have gotten along.

EDIT: And I don't think the band would have gotten the rep as a sissy band if Rolie had stayed. The ballads with Rolie are better than the ones with Friga, albeit not as commercially successful.

Except my half-brother's girlfriend recently told me that Journey were "totally gay" after she heard Anyway You Want It on the Charlie's Angel 2 soundtrack. So it isn't just Cain's ballads which give the band its sissy reputation.

[heardonthestreet]

I totally agree that Journey would have been bigger if Gregg had stayed. Sure we might not have had some of the big hits but I think that we would have had some just as great or greater with Gregg. The sound of the backup vocals took a big hit when he left. We'll never know. I don't think that there would have been as many complaints about sappy ballads either as we might have gotten more soul and drama, with some of the songs maybe a bit more risque like AYWI.

[Matthew]

And I also doubt Journey would have made it either without him. It seems to me that Perry and Herbie/Neal saved each other from failure and obscurity.

I disagree. Journey were actively seeking a vocalist. If Perry declined, they would have found some one else.
They had already started changing their sound with Fleischman. They probably wouldn't have had the same success as with Perry and later Jonathan, as Carl stated, but they wouldn't have failed. Herbie would have found a way.

I say this as a fan at the time. I think it's hard for those who weren't around at the time to understand the situation.
Hindsight is 20/20.

Anyway, I'm glad Perry said yes, which is what really matters. Schon + Perry = magic.

With respect to your veteran status, Jrnyjunky - but why would being there at the time give one a better perspective on Journey's chances without Perry? I mean...I was around in the 1980s...and does that make me better qualified to speculate on 'what might have been' in Journey's career than - say - posters such as CR who are only 20 years old? I'm not sure that it does.

Anyway, I take your point about Herbie's obsessive drive to make it. Yes, he probably would have found a way to succeed at least on some relatively mediocre level...but his will to win and his entrepreneurial spirit alone wouldn't have been enough to launch Journey into superstardom and timelessness had he not had the extraordinary good fortune of a) hearing Perry's demo tape and b) Perry and Schon hitting it off.

And if anyone thinks Herbie and Schon could have done just as well with another singer...well, they didn't. And Schon - for all his gifts - has never come close to achieving the same artistic and commercial magic with any other singer than he did with Perry.

So there's little evidence to suggest that Herbert and Schon were destined for greatness with or without Perry.

[Matthew]

I totally agree that Journey would have been bigger if Gregg had stayed. Sure we might not have had some of the big hits but I think that we would have had some just as great or greater with Gregg. The sound of the backup vocals took a big hit when he left. We'll never know. I don't think that there would have been as many complaints about sappy ballads either as we might have gotten more soul and drama, with some of the songs maybe a bit more risque like AYWI.

Hots - I usually agree with you - but on this I definitely don't! I reckon Journey would have stagnated had Rolie stayed. That era of the band was all played out.

Also - it's a total myth that Cain wussified the band after the supposedly macho influence of Rolie ( ). Escape and Frontiers are MUCH heavier than anything Journey had recorded previously. Less bluesy to be sure but tougher nonetheless.

As for soul and drama...well, in Mother, Father there's more soul and drama in that one track than Evolution has in its entirety.

And Rolie's voice! Sorry - but I'm just not getting it.....and do you know what? Oh...I'm going to stop there because I gave up smoking yesterday and I'm getting ratty and.....I'M DYING FOR A CIGARETTE!

So let's agree to differ and I'll go off and chew some more of these horrible nicorette gum things.

[Soto All The Way]

And I also doubt Journey would have made it either without him. It seems to me that Perry and Herbie/Neal saved each other from failure and obscurity.

I disagree. Journey were actively seeking a vocalist. If Perry declined, they would have found some one else.
They had already started changing their sound with Fleischman. They probably wouldn't have had the same success as with Perry and later Jonathan, as Carl stated, but they wouldn't have failed. Herbie would have found a way.

I say this as a fan at the time. I think it's hard for those who weren't around at the time to understand the situation.
Hindsight is 20/20.

Anyway, I'm glad Perry said yes, which is what really matters. Schon + Perry = magic.

With respect to your veteran status, Jrnyjunky - but why would being there at the time give one a better perspective on Journey's chances without Perry? I mean...I was around in the 1980s...and does that make me better qualified to speculate on 'what might have been' in Journey's career than - say - posters such as CR who are only 20 years old? I'm not sure that it does.

Anyway, I take your point about Herbie's obsessive drive to make it. Yes, he probably would have found a way to succeed at least on some relatively mediocre level...but his will to win and his entrepreneurial spirit alone wouldn't have been enough to launch Journey into superstardom and timelessness had he not had the extraordinary good fortune of a) hearing Perry's demo tape and b) Perry and Schon hitting it off.

And if anyone thinks Herbie and Schon could have done just as well with another singer...well, they didn't. And Schon - for all his gifts - has never come close to achieving the same artistic and commercial magic with any other singer than he did with Perry.

So there's little evidence to suggest that Herbert and Schon were destined for greatness with or without Perry.

I think your way off....Shon+Cain+Perry= MAGIC.....Rolie would have held the band back...he didn't want to be there......PERIOD.


e-

[Matthew]

I think your way off....Shon+Cain+Perry= MAGIC.....Rolie would have held the band back...he didn't want to be there......PERIOD.


e-

Why are you telling me this SATW? I agree with you!

[Blueskies]

Be ratty, Matt. Thats great that you took the step to quit. Keep resisting, it will get a little easier after the first week. Hang in there.

[Matthew]

Be ratty, Matt. Thats great that you took the step to quit. Keep resisting, it will get a little easier after the first week. Hang in there.

Thanks TVL....I'll do my best! It's so weird...I feel completely fine for about twenty minutes and then I go totally off-key for about five minutes! And then the cycle starts again....

Anyway...one day at a time, etc.

[Blueskies]

Be ratty, Matt. Thats great that you took the step to quit. Keep resisting, it will get a little easier after the first week. Hang in there.

Thanks TVL....I'll do my best! It's so weird...I feel completely fine for about twenty minutes and then I go totally off-key for about five minutes! And then the cycle starts again....



Anyway...one day at a time, etc.

Yep, one day....and remember your not alone, you have us to support you and the board to vent on. I can start a fight with you if you need to get rid of anxiety or maybe Dean can come on.

[lights1961]

If the thread title fits!

Neal is MR. Creative and with Sotto and Cain AND the new energy, I would've thought they'd have something in the can by now, even if it's wiping previously "in the can" stuff's vocals and adding Jeff's.
I dunno, don't ya ever get tired of waiting on your favorite bands for something new? I'm just wanting something new.

WHY the impatient attitude??? good work takes a good amount of time---they were on the road until just 5weeks ago---JSS is getting ready to tour with tailsman and Journey is playing this week in Virginia.

my response to brywool, get a new life---dont sweat this stuff---A release of new material will happen, when its ready to go and not on your time table...

PROBLEM WITH BABY BOOMERS... want it yesterday...

Rick

Rick

[ohsherrie]

This has become an interesting thread and I'd like to contribute more but Matt's already said everything I would so I'll just say Ditto Matt.


The smoking thing Matt, been there done that a few times. If you can use the patches they help tremendously. I've quit five times over the last 30 yrs. There were two times that it lasted at least 2 yrs. Then when life threw me a curve I would grab a cig from one of the smokers around me. Now I've quit again for several months and most of the smokers around me have too. I'm thinking it will stick this time.

Hang in there it can be done. My husband quit with me about 15 yrs ago and was a heavier smoker than I was. He hasn't smoked one since. (Of course he drove me back to it twice since. j/k )

[Deb]

Be ratty, Matt. Thats great that you took the step to quit. Keep resisting, it will get a little easier after the first week. Hang in there.

Good on ya Matt. I quit cold turkey about 7 years ago, and she's right the first week is the worst. If you can get through the first week without ripping somebodies head off ya got it made. They say the first 3 days are the hardest (the actual addiction) after that it's the habit. Good luck!

[Aja]

Right on Matt!! You can do it. Very, very cool.

[Soto All The Way]

I think your way off....Shon+Cain+Perry= MAGIC.....Rolie would have held the band back...he didn't want to be there......PERIOD.


e-

Why are you telling me this SATW? I agree with you!

Wrong quote bracket brother....sorry.


e-

[junky]

And I also doubt Journey would have made it either without him. It seems to me that Perry and Herbie/Neal saved each other from failure and obscurity.

I disagree. Journey were actively seeking a vocalist. If Perry declined, they would have found some one else.
They had already started changing their sound with Fleischman. They wouldn't have had the same success as with Perry and later Jonathan, as Carl stated, but they wouldn't have failed. Herbie would have found a way.

I say this as a fan at the time. I think it's hard for those who weren't around at the time to understand the situation.
Hindsight is 20/20.

Anyway, I'm glad Perry said yes, which is what really matters. Schon + Perry = magic.

With respect to your veteran status, Jrnyjunky - but why would being there at the time give one a better perspective on Journey's chances without Perry? I mean...I was around in the 1980s...and does that make me better qualified to speculate on 'what might have been' in Journey's career than - say - posters such as CR who are only 20 years old? I'm not sure that it does.

Anyway, I take your point about Herbie's obsessive drive to make it. Yes, he probably would have found a way to succeed at least on some relatively mediocre level...but his will to win and his entrepreneurial spirit alone wouldn't have been enough to launch Journey into superstardom and timelessness had he not had the extraordinary good fortune of a) hearing Perry's demo tape and b) Perry and Schon hitting it off.

And if anyone thinks Herbie and Schon could have done just as well with another singer...well, they didn't. And Schon - for all his gifts - has never come close to achieving the same artistic and commercial magic with any other singer than he did with Perry.

So there's little evidence to suggest that Herbert and Schon were destined for greatness with or without Perry.

Mathew, I only disagreed with your statement that Journey would have completey failed into obscurity if it hadn't been for Perry. They would have had some success. I never said they would have had the same success as with Perry.

They didn't suddenly achieve super stardom when Perry joined. That happened with the Schon/Perry/Cain years. The label didn't think Infinity would be successful at all. There were no top forty hits on that record, yet the promotion was every where. You couldn't go anywhere without seeing a Journey poster, Tower Records was full of Journey promo material. I may be wrong, but I don't think you can fully grasp how much Journey was being jammed down our throats unless you were there. I believe from that observation that Herbie had a great deal to do with their success at the time. He had an amazing product to push with Perry on board, but Perry or not, it was do or die for Herbie. He would have pushed the product with another singer and had some success.

As I said, I'm glad Perry joined Journey, I just wish it would have happened sooner when Herbie first heard of Perry, though, we may not have had Winds Of March or Wheel In The Sky. That first concert in 1978 was pure magic for me.

[NealIsGod]

As much as I love E5C4P3 and Frontiers, I wish Rolie would have stayed in the band. I think we would have had more music out of them, assuming Rolie and Perry could have gotten along.

EDIT: And I don't think the band would have gotten the rep as a sissy band if Rolie had stayed. The ballads with Rolie are better than the ones with Friga, albeit not as commercially successful.

Except my half-brother's girlfriend recently told me that Journey were "totally gay" after she heard Anyway You Want It on the Charlie's Angel 2 soundtrack. So it isn't just Cain's ballads which give the band its sissy reputation.

You sure it wasn't when she saw one of your ROR avs?

[Saint John]

As much as I love E5C4P3 and Frontiers, I wish Rolie would have stayed in the band. I think we would have had more music out of them, assuming Rolie and Perry could have gotten along.

EDIT: And I don't think the band would have gotten the rep as a sissy band if Rolie had stayed. The ballads with Rolie are better than the ones with Friga, albeit not as commercially successful.

Except my half-brother's girlfriend recently told me that Journey were "totally gay" after she heard Anyway You Want It on the Charlie's Angel 2 soundtrack. So it isn't just Cain's ballads which give the band its sissy reputation.

You sure it wasn't when she saw one of your ROR avs?

Watch it, fucker!!!

[Matthew]

As much as I love E5C4P3 and Frontiers, I wish Rolie would have stayed in the band. I think we would have had more music out of them, assuming Rolie and Perry could have gotten along.

EDIT: And I don't think the band would have gotten the rep as a sissy band if Rolie had stayed. The ballads with Rolie are better than the ones with Friga, albeit not as commercially successful.

Except my half-brother's girlfriend recently told me that Journey were "totally gay" after she heard Anyway You Want It on the Charlie's Angel 2 soundtrack. So it isn't just Cain's ballads which give the band its sissy reputation.

You sure it wasn't when she saw one of your ROR avs?

Yes, I'm sure - but she did say something about a homoerotic and quasi-spiritual picture of Neal wearing a vest....

[Matthew]

The label didn't think Infinity would be successful at all. There were no top forty hits on that record, yet the promotion was every where. You couldn't go anywhere without seeing a Journey poster, Tower Records was full of Journey promo material.I may be wrong, but I don't think you can fully grasp how much Journey was being jammed down our throats unless you were there. I believe from that observation that Herbie had a great deal to do with their success at the time. He had an amazing product to push with Perry on board, but Perry or not, it was do or die for Herbie.

I see what you mean now, Jrnyjunky. Fair enough.

As I said, I'm glad Perry joined Journey, I just wish it would have happened sooner when Herbie first heard of Perry, though, we may not have had Winds Of March or Wheel In The Sky. That first concert in 1978 was pure magic for me.

You went to Perry's first Journey concert?

[Matthew]

Be ratty, Matt. Thats great that you took the step to quit. Keep resisting, it will get a little easier after the first week. Hang in there.

Good on ya Matt. I quit cold turkey about 7 years ago, and she's right the first week is the worst. If you can get through the first week without ripping somebodies head off ya got it made. They say the first 3 days are the hardest (the actual addiction) after that it's the habit. Good luck!

Thanks Deb - and Sherrie, TVL and Aja too!

Christ, I just managed to virtually slice my finger off with a knife while I was making lunch...since Tuesday I've totally lost my ability to concentrate...but luckily no-one was around while I was screaming abuse at the...er, knife, the loaf of bread, my lame vice-free life, etc....

And this is with nicotine gum. I considered going cold turkey and I know it's the quickest way to beat the addiction...but I thought I'd tackle the habit first.

Sherrie - I haven't tried the patches - mainly because you can't put them in your mouth! I've got the gum...I've got a bag of carrots...Hula Hoops....it's like I'm some baby pulled too early from his mother's tit...it's pathetic. I guess this is what they mean by 'oral fixation'...

Anyway...just wanted to say thanks for the supportive posts...so I'll stop there before I become a smoking bore.

[Saint John]

TVL, what's your fuckin' excuse for not going to Virginia? You're another one that needs to get your ass up there. In the end, we're all friends in life. I only have "enemies" on the boards. Except for Reardon.....i could see me kicking the guys ass, no problem.

[Blueskies]

TVL, what's your fuckin' excuse for not going to Virginia? You're another one that needs to get your ass up there. In the end, we're all friends in life. I only have "enemies" on the boards. Except for Reardon.....i could see me kicking the guys ass, no problem.

Been talking to an old boyfriend. He wants to see me so he's coming down from Michigan this weekend and we're heading to Key West. Would love to go to the concert but certain things do take priority over Journey. I have no enemies, all friends here. Hopefully I'll see y'all when they tour again.

[Red13JoePa]

Been talking to an old boyfriend. He wants to see me so he's coming down from Michigan this weekend

Give him the Regan face, he'll turn and bolt, then you're free to roll to VA and mingle.

[NealIsGod]

Been talking to an old boyfriend. He wants to see me so he's coming down from Michigan this weekend

Give him the Regan face, he'll turn and bolt, then you're free to roll to VA and mingle.

[Blueskies]

It's the same guy who took that picture, Red, so I dont think that will work.

[Red13JoePa]

It's the same guy who took that picture, Red, so I dont think that will work.

You did say "ex," right?

Worked the first time.

[Blueskies]

It's the same guy who took that picture, Red, so I dont think that will work.

You did say "ex," right?

Worked the first time.

No, it didnt. I broke up with him.

[junky]

The label didn't think Infinity would be successful at all. There were no top forty hits on that record, yet the promotion was every where. You couldn't go anywhere without seeing a Journey poster, Tower Records was full of Journey promo material.I may be wrong, but I don't think you can fully grasp how much Journey was being jammed down our throats unless you were there. I believe from that observation that Herbie had a great deal to do with their success at the time. He had an amazing product to push with Perry on board, but Perry or not, it was do or die for Herbie.

I see what you mean now, Jrnyjunky. Fair enough.

As I said, I'm glad Perry joined Journey, I just wish it would have happened sooner when Herbie first heard of Perry, though, we may not have had Winds Of March or Wheel In The Sky. That first concert in 1978 was pure magic for me.

You went to Perry's first Journey concert?

I wish, no it was my first Journey show.

Oh, and good one on the quitting smoking thing. You are braver than I.

[Red13JoePa]

True, Lights, Wheel and to a lesser extent Feeling That Way/Anytime became big radio ratation hits only after Lights and Wheel didn't totally detonate on the charts.

[NoMoreTails]

Except my half-brother's girlfriend recently told me that Journey were "totally gay" after she heard Anyway You Want It on the Charlie's Angel 2 soundtrack.

If she said this specifically about AWYWI she could have only been referring to Perry's voice.