Perry's voice on David Pack's new song.......SAD

by **Red13JoePa** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 3:27 am

Couldn't agree more, NealGod. Given that choice I'd take the current lineup any day of the week and twice on Sunday. And I own all of Perry's solo stuff and will buy a rock album should he put it out in the future which I hope he does. I think that since the advent of the current lineup they quite simply rock more now. Ballad-heavy though it may be, Arrival makes TBF look like "Meet Me Halfway, And 14 Other Tearjerkers" by Loggins.
And the touring, Jesus it's so prolific now. When the old steveo called all the shots, they didn;t tour for 11 stinking years. Now they're out there every damn summer.
The sad part is I think we got the minority opinion on that. The happy part is, it ain't gonna matter b/c both entities are done with the other. Just don't lose Augeri.

by **jrnyman28** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:04 am

NealIsGod wrote:If I had a choice of Perry coming back to Journey, or keeping Journey the way it is, I would DEFINITELY keep them the way they are. I hate TBF, and I don't think Perry fits with Neal anymore.

I agree.
I would love to hear more Perry music...but not at Journey's expense.

And NiG, I cannot see anything wrong with your quotes. But the last one you tried had an extra [/quote] at the end. Maybe that screwed it up. Maybe you should just manually quote using the buttons in your "Post a reply" screen. Are you forgetting to remove the end [/quote] when you are only quoting a portion of a post? Do you delete the rest that you do not want quoted?

by **NealIsGod** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:21 am

[quote="jrnyman28"][quote="NealIsGod"]If I had a choice of Perry coming back to Journey, or keeping Journey the way it is, I would DEFINITELY keep them the way they are. I hate TBF, and I don't think Perry fits with Neal anymore.[/quote]

I agree.
I would love to hear more Perry music...but not at Journey's expense.

And NiG, I cannot see anything wrong with your quotes. But the last one you tried had an extra [/quote] at the end. Maybe that screwed it up. Maybe you should just manually quote using the buttons in your "Post a reply" screen. Are you forgetting to remove the end [/quote] when you are only quoting a portion of a post? Do you delete the rest that you do not want quoted?[/quote]

All I did here is click the "quote" button on jrnyman28's post, then I typed this at the end of the message. Shouldn't it look right?

by **jrnyman28** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 5:07 am

NealIsGod wrote:
jrnyman28 wrote:
NealIsGod wrote:If I had a choice of Perry coming back to Journey, or keeping Journey the way it is, I would DEFINITELY keep them the way they are. I hate TBF, and I don't think Perry fits with Neal anymore.

I agree.
I would love to hear more Perry music...but not at Journey's expense.

And NiG, I cannot see anything wrong with your quotes. But the last one you tried had an extra
at the end. Maybe that screwed it up. Maybe you should just manually quote using the buttons in your "Post a reply" screen. Are you forgetting to remove the end

when you are only quoting a portion of a post? Do you delete the rest that you do not want quoted?[/quote]

All I did here is click the "quote" button on jrnyman28's post, then I typed this at the end of the message. Shouldn't it look right?[/quote]

Should look right, I can't see anything wrong with the [quote]s. And all I did was hit the quote button on your post...but maybe all my [quote] boxes messed it up, because it is not all correct in my post.
It's a mystery to me...

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 5:12 am

Rock'ndeano wrote:Perry flatout sucked on TBF.. Those songs where you could here him gasping for air was embarrassing.. Please just be honest.

You're going overboard, Deano.
A tad raspy? Sure.
But the man wasn't weezing or gasping for dear life.
What is this, the death bed recording sessions?

Any time Perry used an exhalation of air was intentional and for dramatic effect. In fact, doesn't "Still She Cries" start off precisely that way, with Perry giving off a mournful, reflective little *sigh*.

Its meant to be one of those trademark little vocal flourishes.
If it was an accident, then it would've been erased in the studio.

Rock'ndeano wrote:Most of those songs were not that hard to sing.

Then why don't YOU try singing them (with maybe the exception of the TBF title track and "Baby I'm a Leavin You") and see just how well you sound. I posit that those songs remain tough for any mere mortal to pull off. Perry's voice might have changed for the worse, but those songs still remain quite a formidable challenge for MANY other singers.

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 5:23 am

Andrew wrote:
mamos wrote:He does sound good on the track as we would expect. And it's really good to hear his voice again.

But hasn't he been singing well within his range for years now. Not really anything challenging on 'Strange Medicine or TBF either.

Quite correct.

I think many tracks on FTLOSM were challenging. The only one that is arguably unchallenging is "Anyway" and even that throws in a high note at the tail end of it.

Andrew you don't think "You Better Wait" or "Young Hearts Forever" are vocally challenging songs?
I implore you to give the album another listen, or better yet, try singing them yourself.

by **Rockindeano** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 5:30 am

TNC - I guess you have made the transition to the Perry corner.

Look, I should have been more micro analytical-

I didn't mean he was literally "gasping for air" but he definately overuses the dramatics on some tunes.

You should know what I think of Perry..I have always maintained he was and always be the best vocalist in music history. But the pieces to the puzzle seem to fit, with the argument that the voice was in decline. You can definately hear the Escape-Frontiers-ROR-TBF declination in pitch, and holds... and yes he does get raspy, whicj isn't a bad thing btw.

I hope the voice is still great, and I have heard the new pack song in its entirety. He sounds better than Pack does, but I still feel like he has declined a bit.

How is that for being objectionable yet respectful?

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 5:46 am

Rock'ndeano wrote:TNC - I guess you have made the transition to the Perry corner.

I haven't made any transition to any corner. I just would prefer people to be honest about the music (Perry or Augeri).
It's just not true to say that Perry sounded bad on TBF.
He's yet to sound bad on any recording.
His voice changed, yes, but he didn't lose the ability to sing.
Let's try not to conflate the two.

You saying 'Perry sounds bad on TBF" is just as disingenuous and hyperbolic as when the Perryheads decry 'without Perry Journey has forgotten how to write music'..both are lies and both do nothing but add to the already polemically-inclined, caustic atmosphere around here.

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 5:59 am

Rock'ndeano wrote: But the pieces to the puzzle seem to fit, with the argument that the voice was in decline. You can definately hear the Escape-Frontiers-ROR-TBF declination in pitch, and holds... and yes he does get raspy, whicj isn't a bad thing btw.

I never contested that.
I agree, I personally think the reason he no longer sings is because he holds his voice to be a shadow of it's former self.
I have bootlegs that lend credence to this.

However, I just don't think its accurate to call his vocal performances on TBF or FTLOSM as outright defecient.
They are both pretty impressive, I feel.

Even at his worst, he's better than some other so-called singers out there.
Just take a look at Rod Stewart, for example or, on second thought, rather, don't.

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:01 am

Rock'ndeano wrote:Lying to yourself makes one at peace one's self?

Perry flatout sucked on TBF.. Those songs where you could here him gasping for air was embarrassing.. Please just be honest. Most of those songs were not that hard to sing. Deen could nail all them, and sound much better doing it.

You hated WYLAW??

So now we have moved on from just "range" to "how hard" a song is to sing? Like...what is that? How many hoops here? Rock honey, you should take a lesson from Kaj about FEEL (and take Monker with you. He is all about how many writers are on a song now.) It is called DIGGING, desperate DIGGING.

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:04 am

perryfaithful wrote:So now we have moved on from just "range" to "how hard" a song is to sing? Like...what is that? How many hoops here? Rock honey, you should take a lesson from Kaj (and take Monker with you. He is all about how many writers are on a song now.) It is called DIGGING, desperate DIGGING.[/color]

Monker's right, and so is Deano to a degree.
Deano just needs to qualify his statement that while the songs on TBF & FTLOSM might not be very hard for Steve Perry circa 1979, they are still hard for many other singers out there.

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:05 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
Rock'ndeano wrote: But the pieces to the puzzle seem to fit, with the argument that the voice was in decline. You can definately hear the Escape-Frontiers-ROR-TBF declination in pitch, and holds... and yes he does get raspy, whicj isn't a bad thing btw.

Even at his worst, he's better than some other so-called singers out there.
Just take a look at Rod Stewart, for example or, on second thought, rather, don't.

HAve you seen Rod in concert? It is more than the voice that makes him a star

by **NealIsGod** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:07 am

It's just hard for people to realize the Perry voice from 1977-1982 is gone forever. The guy can still sing, it is just different. Still great, just different.

Now, let's listen to our boy Augeri...

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:07 am

Rock'ndeano wrote: and I have heard the new pack song in its entirety.

HOW did you do that??

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:08 am

perryfaithful wrote:HAve you seen Rod in concert? It is more than the voice that makes him a star

Some would say the same thing about Steve Augeri and the current incarnation of Journey.

Monker's right, contradiction after contradiction after contradiction etc.

by **heardonthestreet** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:21 am

What's not to like about Rod? You guys are just jealous. He makes those moves that it takes a women to appreciate.
I can't believe the material that he has out and it keeps on coming.

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:21 am

NealIsGod wrote:
Now, let's listen to our boy Augeri...

What I think I am hearing is that Deen is THE ONE folks are loving on vocals

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:24 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:
perryfaithful wrote:HAve you seen Rod in concert? It is more than the voice that makes him a star

Some would say the same thing about Steve Augeri .

What are you talkin about Man?? Steve Augeri is NOT a star....sorry

by **jrnyman28** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:41 am

NealIsGod wrote:It's just hard for people to realize the Perry voice from 1977-1982 is gone forever. The guy can still sing, it is just different. Still great, just different.

Now, let's listen to our boy Augeri...

Absolutely, no one can emote like Perry. What he lost in range he gained in feeling. And his voice seems better suited to soft songs. He is not a rocker anymore. "One More" is a good example. His voice breaks in the middle of the song. It works, but can you imagine him trying to sing that song on tour? I do not care for TBF, but Perry does what he does very well on it. FTLOSM has it's moments as well. but it seems obvious to me that Perry and "rock" do not go together.

by **heardonthestreet** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:56 am

His voice breaks at the end of "Happy Birthday Brian." It's an applied science and he has it nailed, imo. :wink:

by **Monker** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:59 am

So now we have moved on from just "range" to "how hard" a song is to sing? Like...what is that? How many hoops here? Rock honey, you should take a lesson from Kaj about FEEL (and take Monker with you. He is all about how many writers are on a song now.) It is called DIGGING, desperate DIGGING.

No, I'm not 'all about' how many writer's there are. All I am saying is that YBW is not a "Perry song", like "Lights", or LTS, or "Walks Like a Lady". YBW is the best, among a lot of mediocre junk, song on TBF - AND IT HAS A HALF DOZEN PEOPLE WRITING THE SONG. That says a lot about Perry's songwriting in the final years of his career. When was the last great rock song he had a major hand in? "Be Good To Youreslf" from ROR in 1985? IMO, calling that one 'great' is debatable too and that was [bold]TWENTY YEARS AGO[/bold]. Prior to that, it would go back to Frontiers, since Street Talk was a pop album with very little rock on it.

Perry is not about rock songs, like YBW. He's a pop writer with a lot of R&B influence. That is where he has always been, even while he was in Journey. He should have dropped the pop influence and went straight to the heart of who he is by writing and performing R&B, but he never did. That was a mistake, and a huge waste of a solo career.

And, I find your words very hypocritical. You accept Perry's current vocal limitations and simply brush them off...But, if we were talking about Augeri, I know you would be right there throwing out the critique, even if it wasn't deserved. But, whatever, it's just a waste of time writing about it.

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 7:24 am

Monker wrote:
So now we have moved on from just "range" to "how hard" a song is to sing? Like...what is that? How many hoops here? Rock honey, you should take a lesson from Kaj about FEEL (and take Monker with you. He is all about how many writers are on a song now.) It is called DIGGING, desperate DIGGING.

No, I'm not 'all about' how many writer's there are. All I am saying is that YBW is not a "Perry song", like "Lights", or LTS, or "Walks Like a Lady". YBW is the best, among a lot of mediocre junk, song on TBF - AND IT HAS A HALF DOZEN PEOPLE WRITING THE SONG. That says a lot about Perry's songwriting in the final years of his career. When was the last great rock song he had a major hand in? "Be Good To Youreslf" from ROR in 1985? IMO, calling that one 'great' is debatable too and that was [bold]TWENTY YEARS AGO[/bold]. Prior to that, it would go back to Frontiers, since Street Talk was a pop album with very little rock on it.

Perry is not about rock songs, like YBW. He's a pop writer with a lot of R&B influence. That is where he has always been, even while he was in Journey. He should have dropped the pop influence and went straight to the heart of who he is by writing and performing R&B, but he never did. That was a mistake, and a huge waste of a solo career.

And, I find your words very hypocritical. You accept Perry's current vocal limitations and simply brush them off...But, if we were talking about Augeri, I know you would be right there throwing out the critique, even if it wasn't deserved. But, whatever, it's just a waste of time writing about it.

what is this vocal limitation shit Monker? What.....do you have some 10 part vocal test you put EVERY singer thru? Or is it just Perry caused you are pissed at him? I do NOT find him "limited"

by **Monker** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 7:57 am

what is this vocal limitation shit Monker? What.....do you have some 10 part vocal test you put EVERY singer thru? Or is it just Perry caused you are pissed at him? I do NOT find him "limited"

It's a simple fact that he has not sang Journey songs in the correct register since the very beginning of the ROR tour. He also has not recorded his higher register since the ROR album.

You may not find him limited, but that's only because you refuse to see it.

I have no reason to be 'pissed' at Perry. He's out of Journey, never to return again...and that is just as I want it.

by **jrnyman28** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 8:00 am

perryfaithful wrote:what is this vocal limitation shit Monker?... I do NOT find him "limited"

Can Perry sing the high stuff like he did in 1978, 1979, 1980, 1981? NO!

Therefore, his voice is limited....

Maybe that is too much logic for you.

by **NealIsGod** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 8:03 am

It's apparent to anyone who can hear. C'mon, PF, if you can't admit that, you have zero credibility.

by **Rockindeano** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 8:11 am

heardonthestreet wrote:What's not to like about Rod? You guys are just jealous. He makes those moves that it takes a women to appreciate.
I can't believe the material that he has out and it keeps on coming.

Everything. If you like 62 year old guys shaking 62 yr old asses, I'm sure you ran out and bought his latest elevator music too, didn't you?

Oh, and currently, Steve Perry IS NOT a star. He is a retiree.

Steve Augeri, maybe not a star, but he is performing to thousands nightly, rather than "performing for 30 seconds, in the background of a song in which most people will never ever hear.

PF- I got connections...I know someone who knows someone, etc. Trust me, it ain't all that.

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 8:19 am

jrnyman28 wrote:
perryfaithful wrote:what is this vocal limitation shit Monker?... I do NOT find him "limited"

Can Perry sing the high stuff like he did in 1978, 1979, 1980, 1981? NO!

Therefore, his voice is limited....

Maybe that is too much logic for you.

Then your idea of "limited" is a change of range. Be specific! I love the way the little group here keeps worrying about range as if that was all that made a singer a star''And actually? Who has heard him sing any of those songs needing "range" lately? to know if he really can't do it? You know, the SONGS you all say you are sick of and want replaced with new Journey stuff. Oh....so now why is Perry's "range" important?

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 8:22 am

Rock'ndeano wrote:Steve Augeri, maybe not a star, but he is performing to thousands nightly

that makes him a regular working stiff

by **Rockindeano** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 8:22 am

perryfaithful wrote:
jrnyman28 wrote:
perryfaithful wrote:what is this vocal limitation shit Monker?... I do NOT find him "limited"

Can Perry sing the high stuff like he did in 1978, 1979, 1980, 1981? NO!

Therefore, his voice is limited....

Maybe that is too much logic for you.

Then your idea of "limited" is a change of range. Be specific! I love the way the little group here keeps worrying about range as if that was all that made a singer a star''And actually? Who has heard him sing any of those songs needing "range" lately? to know if he really can't do it? You know, the SONGS you all say you are sick of and want replaced with new Journey stuff. Oh....so now why is Perry's "range" important?

Keep lying to yourself, or for better words, keep turning your head. At the Bill Graham ceromony in the Bay Area, I remember Perry had to have the band turn down Don't Stop Believin' 2 full registers.. And THAT is a song EVERYONE wants heard.

Right now, Steve Perry Could not physically tour with Journey. It's that simple! He just cannot.

by **perryfaithful** » Sat Jul 09, 2005 8:24 am

Rock'ndeano wrote:
heardonthestreet wrote:What's not to like about Rod? You guys are just jealous. He makes those moves that it takes a women to appreciate.
I can't believe the material that he has out and it keeps on coming.

Everything. If you like 62 year old guys shaking 62 yr old asses, I'm sure you ran out and bought his latest elevator music too, didn't you?

Oh, and currently, Steve Perry IS NOT a star. He is a retiree.

Steve Augeri, maybe not a star, but he is performing to thousands nightly, rather than "performing for 30 seconds, in the background of a song in which most people will never ever hear.

PF- I got connections...I know someone who knows someone, etc. Trust me, it ain't all that.

I hope your ass looks that good at 62 Rock.....

Oh, but you have connections! Show me

MR

Perry's voice on David Pack's new song.......SAD

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