Total Bullshit

[NealIsGod]

So, RVR, that underlying vocal wouldn't be Augie's actual singing, and the "top" vocal couldn't be the vocals played by the engineer at the show? How do you know it was added later?

Just asking!

[Rockindeano]

Stuart, you sure seem to have BT in your corner.

There isn't a truth to this Stuart. You know that if you present this as "doctored" or not the same, you will then have slandered me. Consider yourself an invitee to court if this goes.

I already had all the songs mixed and compared. There is no question I am correct.

[ohsherrie]

You know this subject is being discussed in places other than here and Dean's blog. There are other people who have bootlegs that Dean has never touched. They have made their own comparisons and come to the same conclusion Dean did. Some of them with the kind of equipment and ability to make a pretty sophisticated analysis.

Coming here trying to discredit Dean or getting this board shut down isn't going to stop this. It's too late for that. Some people are hearing about it on the radio. Why don't you just accept it and support your guy anyway if you're that enamored?

[RossValoryRocks]

So, RVR, that underlying vocal wouldn't be Augie's actual singing, and the "top" vocal couldn't be the vocals played by the engineer at the show? How do you know it was added later?

Just asking!

If this weren't doctored there is no way in packed show anyone would pickup BOTH vocals unless plugged into the actual mixing board, they are not going to put both through the PA.

[NealIsGod]

You know this subject is being discussed in places other than here and Dean's blog. There are other people who have bootlegs that Dean has never touched. They have made their own comparisons and come to the same conclusion Dean did. Some of them with the kind of equipment and ability to make a pretty sophisticated analysis.

Coming here trying to discredit Dean or getting this board shut down isn't going to stop this. It's too late for that. Some people are hearing about it on the radio. Why don't you just accept it and support your guy anyway if you're that enamored?

Care to share some links?

[RossValoryRocks]

Stuart, you sure seem to have BT in your corner.

There isn't a truth to this Stuart. You know that if you present this as "doctored" or not the same, you will then have slandered me. Consider yourself an invitee to court if this goes.

I already had all the songs mixed and compared. There is no question I am correct.

Hehehe...invite me...
Good.
I like that.

[NealIsGod]

Someone grab their balls and sue someone already! Enough bluster!

[ohsherrie]

You know this subject is being discussed in places other than here and Dean's blog. There are other people who have bootlegs that Dean has never touched. They have made their own comparisons and come to the same conclusion Dean did. Some of them with the kind of equipment and ability to make a pretty sophisticated analysis.

Coming here trying to discredit Dean or getting this board shut down isn't going to stop this. It's too late for that. Some people are hearing about it on the radio. Why don't you just accept it and support your guy anyway if you're that enamored?

Care to share some links?

I would like to NIG, I really would, but the people I'm talking about don't want to get involved with all this mud slinging and some of the places are private. I don't expect anyone to take my word for it though. I was just trying to point out how senseless this attack on Dean and MR is.

[Liz22562]

Yep, and if we are lucky, it will be on Court TV.

[NealIsGod]

I would like to NIG, I really would, but the people I'm talking about don't want to get involved with all this mud slinging and some of the places are private. I don't expect anyone to take my word for it though. I was just trying to point out how senseless this attack on Dean and MR is.

I thought as much. Anyplace besides Perryville?

[RossValoryRocks]

Stuart, you sure seem to have BT in your corner.

There isn't a truth to this Stuart. You know that if you present this as "doctored" or not the same, you will then have slandered me. Consider yourself an invitee to court if this goes.

I already had all the songs mixed and compared. There is no question I am correct.

I am not slandering you, I am slandering whomever doctored the bootleg, or rather exposing them.

Just because you believe they are not doctored doesn't make it so. I believe you THINK you are correct and that is fine. I don't. It just that simple, no animosity toward you or anything. Just a difference of opinion after weighing all the facts and examining the evidence.

Unless of course you are now admitting to being the one doctoring the bootleg with this admission. You say you already had the the all the songs mixed, Freudian slip perhaps?

Either way it doesn't matter Dean. This will probably never go to court, because it's just not worth Journey's time to do so when using easily obtained software ANYONE can poke a whole in your argument.

[cetera]

Someone grab their balls and sue someone already! Enough bluster!

Exactly, I've lurked and watched this cr*p for how long(?).... a month or more... and so far it's ALL talk and no action....

So called evidence gets blown out of the water.... no mainstream media coverage.... no reply from Journey/Mgmt..... no legal action on either side....seems noone REALLY cares eh?!

[Red13JoePa]

After I initially listned I have to admit it looked bad for the Journey boys.

But then I took the discrete sounds out of phase on the supposed bootleg. I stretched the sounds and slowed them down and then searched for other hidden discrete sounds, and I found it right before Steve's vocals start.

On the supposed Manchester bootleg I found where someone added the DVD vocals over the original vocal Steve Augeri sang, AFTER the original bootleg had been made. Under the overdub you can hear, very faintly, the original vocal done in Manchester.

This if flat out, stone cold BAD. A new low. Not surprising, though.

[ohsherrie]

I would like to NIG, I really would, but the people I'm talking about don't want to get involved with all this mud slinging and some of the places are private. I don't expect anyone to take my word for it though. I was just trying to point out how senseless this attack on Dean and MR is.

I thought as much. Anyplace besides Perryville?

Actually I don't know what going on at Perryville.

[NealIsGod]

This is being tried right here, right now. That's as close to court as this will get.

[augeri1]

Great. I would love to hear every show from last year. However, I am the only one providing anything to listen to.

Doctored tapes? Haha. They are changing their argument from "No way he lips" to "So what if he does" to "docored tapes." Sounds desperae to me.

I haven't changed my argument one iota.

Who's changing their argument? What you are doing is accusing someone based on your own personal opinion..no PROVEN facts..STILL no proven facts after a month of BS...therefore it reaks of libel and slander..you really do need to read up on the meaning of these two words before you go before the judge and jury. Keep reaching, same goes to all the phead followers too. Seem's your attempt to derail a successful summer tour has backfired...an "in your face" backfire..those are the worst kind, you all like egg, right?

[ohsherrie]

Keep reaching, same goes to all the phead followers too.

It's remarks like that that expose your desperation and discredit you. If you knew anything about us or this board you'd know that Dean is the last person who would have Perry fan followers. He doesn't like us and we don't generally like him. Those of us who support his cause are doing so because it's so very obviously the truth and we don't like seeing what this fraudulence is doing to the musical legacy and reputation as a great LIVE band that Steve Perry helped Journey establish.

[Eric]

ohsherrie:

Are you reading what RVR is writing?

Please don't believe this rumour just because you want to.

Eric

[*Laura]

Are you reading what RVR is writing?

"writing"? How about "proving"?A much more credible word,don't you think so?

[NealIsGod]

Are you reading what RVR is writing?

"writing"? How about "proving"?A much more credible word,don't you think so?

No one has proved anything to my ears yet.

[cetera]

Are you reading what RVR is writing?

"writing"? How about "proving"?A much more credible word,don't you think so?

What, like Deano is?!?!

[Jeremey]

I can tell you straight up a few pertinent facts, without listening to the recording, doing spectral analysis or any other audio wizardry. I'm not posting my opinion on this at all. But here are some FACTS, completely unrelated to whether or not Steve Augeri is lip synching his performances. Any other industry professionals care to verify what I am saying, please do.

• If what Stuart is saying is true, that the bootleg recordings of the Manchester show on dimeadozen.com have actually been doctored to include the layered audio from the Sony release Journey Live In Vegas 2001, than this is truly a serious allegation. Because for this to be true, you must understand that very few people actually have access to the original multitrack recording of the Vegas 2001 DVD. I would say, only people working for Sony, and people working for Journey. So let me make this as clear as I can:

Someone with access to the original multitrack recordings of the Vegas 2001 DVD would have had to acquired the bootleg of the Manchester show, stripped out Steve Augeri's vocal from the Vegas multitrack, and synched it up with the exact tempo of the live performance from the Manchester recording, then posted this on dimeadozen.com and/or got this information to Deano with the specific intent of perpetrating a hoax.... Who within Sony and/or the Journey organization would have benefitted from this? I'm just throwing out possibilities here people....It's important to look at all possible situations. Again, I am not forming an opinion either way - Only pointing out certain things that MUST have taken place for this to be true.

Then there's possibility #2

• If what Stuart is saying isn't true, then is it possible that Journey did in fact have access to the multitrack recording of the Journey Live in Vegas 2001 DVD, and is in fact feeding the stripped out audio track of Augeri's vocals along with the timecode click through everyone's in ear monitoring system, and they are indeed using this "guide" vocal throughout the performance to cover up Augeri's vocal issues. If this was the case, then it IS TRUE that Stuart could have run an analysis on the bootleg recording, heard the audio artifacts from the Vegas DVD, because it is ONLY Augeri's vocal that is overlayed there, and picked up the subtle nuances of breathing and expression already recorded in the original multitrack. I suppose this is possible as well..

Either way, if you are on one side or the other on this arguement, you simply have to believe that either (1) OR (2) is true, depending on your opinion....It is possible there are other (unlikely) explanations, and I would like to hear them as well...

[WalrusOct9]

Beyond the Vegas DVD, check out the spot around the 4:55 mark of the Manchester "Faith In The Heartland." Augeri actually sings the middle part in a lower register, and then you can clearly hear where his live vocal fades out and the tape fades back in...it's brief but it's very, very obvious.

[*Laura]

Are you reading what RVR is writing?

"writing"? How about "proving"?A much more credible word,don't you think so?

What, like Deano is?!?!

Between writing about something and actually providing material evidence to back up the idea,there's a big difference,you know?
Meanwhile Dean provided that material evidence.

If RVR saw an UFO,I wanna see the ship.
And no,don't tell me to follow RVR's advice and download some let's-play-doctor software.He is the one "writing" about that.
I don't have time to chase UFOs.

Oh,btw...Since RVR is such an expert in analysing and isolating sound tracks(especially vocals),how do we know he didn't worked them up and added a "faint" vocal track to make it look like there is another vocal track underneath the Vegas one?Hm?

[cetera]

[Between writing about something and actually providing material evidence to back up the idea,there's a big difference,you know?

No evidence seen from Deano..... just a lot of hot air and inconclusive bootlegs....

[If RVR saw an UFO,I wanna see the ship.
And no,don't tell me to follow RVR's advice and download some let's-play-doctor software.He is the one "writing" about that.
I don't have time to chase UFOs.

He's providing you with the chance to review the evidence yet you won't do so... but you believe Deano....

Say no more.....

[Red13JoePa]

Wait, J.
I have the audio track as do at least a handful here of the Vegas DVD fried to a cd.
Can't that have been used?

[Monker]

If you knew anything about us or this board you'd know that Dean is the last person who would have Perry fan followers. He doesn't like us and we don't generally like him. Those of us who support his cause are doing so because it's so very obviously the truth and we don't like seeing what this fraudulence is doing to the musical legacy and reputation as a great LIVE band that Steve Perry helped Journey establish.

And, of course, the FACT that Dean made a post a few weeks ago BEGGING Steve Perry to rejoin the band has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Riiiight.

[*Laura]

He's providing you with the chance to review the evidence yet you won't do so... but you believe Deano....

You are missing the point.This is not about WHO I believe or not.I only believe what I hear.For the time being I have listened to the,I repeat,material evidence provided by Deano.
If RVR wants to prove something,he will have to come up with facts and provide them.
Again,it is not my job to dowload stuff and do the job RVR is supposed to do.All I am willing to do is listen.
So please,stop rolling your eyes and spare me.

[Eric]

You have a point Shania...I mean every bit of evidence essentially has the potential to be "doctored".

HOWEVER, since there is evidence of doctoring, and logically this whole thing doesn't make sense (by that I mean Journey wouldn't do this, couldn't pull it off, and would just replace Augeri if they replaced Perry)

I'm on RVR's bandwagon.

[ohsherrie]

If you knew anything about us or this board you'd know that Dean is the last person who would have Perry fan followers. He doesn't like us and we don't generally like him. Those of us who support his cause are doing so because it's so very obviously the truth and we don't like seeing what this fraudulence is doing to the musical legacy and reputation as a great LIVE band that Steve Perry helped Journey establish.

And, of course, the FACT that Dean made a post a few weeks ago BEGGING Steve Perry to rejoin the band has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Riiiight.

Well, I really don't remember that post by Dean. It must have been while I was away for a while. That's irrelevant though. You of all people should know that I've always said I don't want Steve Perry back with Journey. I still don't. My only interest in all of this is just what I said, nothing more, nothing less.

When this turns out to be true, if it's ever allowed to come out, can you honestly say you won't be disgusted by what it says about the integrity of Journey? If you can then you're not the Monker that I thought I sort of knew and even respected.