ECLIPSE - Who wants to go on record?

[Jana]

1) 9/10 - I love what I hear so far. The 5 songs I have heard sound like deeper classic Journey cuts, and yes they have hooks and keys! I'll bet there will even be 1 song on the CD that is a semi- rocker ballad, we have yet to hear 7 songs.

2) I think most the hardcore fans will love this CD, it sounds to me like the one a good number of the hardcore fans were clamoring for with JSS, although some of these same fans are not happy now.. go figure.
3) Casual fans may not like it much... the band is not concerned with the casual fan this time around and neither am I, who cares.

The reason is that there was nothing wrong with JSS. Neal said he didn't like the Journey sound/DIRECTION with him. He wanted to still embrace that legacy sound....so he got the poor man's doppelganger, and cut Revelation.....NOW all of a sudden he wants to go harder edge - had that with JSS. I know exactly how it went down. Neal wanted to cut a legacy album with the new singer, and once the fans were hooked on Arnel and his sob story - neal knew they would already be invested in Arnel and his Philipino entourage - thus ensuring the embrace of the new, harder album.

Jeff got the last laugh anyway, because the W.E.T. album is better than both J-Boyz albums combined....

I think his decision had more to do with touring. I think he wanted a tenor who could sing their catalogue closer to how it was originated for their touring and not be so terriby different in new music. Arnel has a powerful tenor voice. New albums aren't their bread and butter. They went harder this time, but Arnel still is a tenor. It still doesn't affect the fact that Arnel shines on most of the older catalogue while still being able to go harder on the new album. Touring is really where they make their money.

[S2M]

1) 9/10 - I love what I hear so far. The 5 songs I have heard sound like deeper classic Journey cuts, and yes they have hooks and keys! I'll bet there will even be 1 song on the CD that is a semi- rocker ballad, we have yet to hear 7 songs.

2) I think most the hardcore fans will love this CD, it sounds to me like the one a good number of the hardcore fans were clamoring for with JSS, although some of these same fans are not happy now.. go figure.
3) Casual fans may not like it much... the band is not concerned with the casual fan this time around and neither am I, who cares.

The reason is that there was nothing wrong with JSS. Neal said he didn't like the Journey sound/DIRECTION with him. He wanted to still embrace that legacy sound....so he got the poor man's doppelganger, and cut Revelation.....NOW all of a sudden he wants to go harder edge - had that with JSS. I know exactly how it went down. Neal wanted to cut a legacy album with the new singer, and once the fans were hooked on Arnel and his sob story - neal knew they would already be invested in Arnel and his Philipino entourage - thus ensuring the embrace of the new, harder album.

Jeff got the last laugh anyway, because the W.E.T. album is better than both J-Boyz albums combined....

I think his decision had more to do with touring. I think he wanted a tenor who could sing their catalogue closer to how it was originated for their touring and not be so terriby different in new music. Arnel has a powerful tenor voice. New albums aren't their bread and butter. They went harder this time, but Arnel still is a tenor. It still doesn't affect the fact that Arnel shines on most of the older catalogue while still being able to go harder on the new album. Touring is really where they make their money.

Obviously you've never heard Believe in Me...cause that is classic Journey. And the melodic Neal that is missing now.

[Saint John]

S2M, the "direction" that Neal was referring to had a little bit to do with voice and a lot to do with antics/personality. It was simply time to shut the circus down and let him go. And they did. Journey is far better off now and Soto is ... doing well, too.

Sorry, Dan....not buying it. If that was the case, Eclipse would have been the first record recorded. Besides, Jeremey was basically 'in the fold' when Jeff got the axe, so voice/style was the concern. Neal wanted legacy. He put out a legacy release to pad the fanbase, now wants to cut a harder album. One in which he abandons all melody for his new found inner Vinnie Vincent....you are right about one thing though - Jeff is better off.

Incorrect again! Jon wanted Jeremey and Neal didn't. In the end, Neal put his foot down and deep-sixed the idea of hiring Jeremey. Neal liked Arnel, Jon didn't. Neal won.

As for the Walmart release, their hands were tied and it was waay too good of an offer to turn down. They needed the exposure that the exclusive would give them and parlayed it quite well. Walmart and management picked the existing songs Cain already had, the ones that sounded the most Journey-like, and that's what they went with. Now they have a rejuvenated fan base and a new following because of Arnel and, because of that, they are able to choose their direction a lot more with this album. Everyone here predicted that they would play it safe and keep releasing sappy and retreaded material and low and behold, they're being creative and rocking. People here just refuse to say they were wrong. But it doesn't mean they weren't!

PS Believe In Me was a mediocre song ... at best. Soto just can't soar like the song needs him to.

[S2M]

Ok Dan...when you are done double-fisting Arnel's and Neal's cocks - maybe you can go buy a clue.

Calling Believe in Me mediocre shows how little you know about music.

[Jana]

1) 9/10 - I love what I hear so far. The 5 songs I have heard sound like deeper classic Journey cuts, and yes they have hooks and keys! I'll bet there will even be 1 song on the CD that is a semi- rocker ballad, we have yet to hear 7 songs.

2) I think most the hardcore fans will love this CD, it sounds to me like the one a good number of the hardcore fans were clamoring for with JSS, although some of these same fans are not happy now.. go figure.
3) Casual fans may not like it much... the band is not concerned with the casual fan this time around and neither am I, who cares.

The reason is that there was nothing wrong with JSS. Neal said he didn't like the Journey sound/DIRECTION with him. He wanted to still embrace that legacy sound....so he got the poor man's doppelganger, and cut Revelation.....NOW all of a sudden he wants to go harder edge - had that with JSS. I know exactly how it went down. Neal wanted to cut a legacy album with the new singer, and once the fans were hooked on Arnel and his sob story - neal knew they would already be invested in Arnel and his Philipino entourage - thus ensuring the embrace of the new, harder album.

Jeff got the last laugh anyway, because the W.E.T. album is better than both J-Boyz albums combined....

I think his decision had more to do with touring. I think he wanted a tenor who could sing their catalogue closer to how it was originated for their touring and not be so terriby different in new music. Arnel has a powerful tenor voice. New albums aren't their bread and butter. They went harder this time, but Arnel still is a tenor. It still doesn't affect the fact that Arnel shines on most of the older catalogue while still being able to go harder on the new album. Touring is really where they make their money.

Obviously you've never heard Believe in Me...cause that is classic Journey. And the melodic Neal that is missing now.

The vocals do nothing for me on that song. Neal sounds just fine in the new stuff imo. But I get that it's all subjective. Everyone will have their opinion on the new album when it comes out/the singers they've had over the years as far as favs/Neal's playing.

[Saint John]

Calling Believe in Me mediocre shows how little you know about music.

Ok ... that's why the world immediately noticed Arnel and no one noticed Soto ... in 25 years. And Believe In Me is just a vocally challenged song that goes nowhere. Neal's soaring while Soto stays grounded, and that makes the song awkward. And mediocre.

[S2M]

Calling Believe in Me mediocre shows how little you know about music.

Ok ... that's why the world immediately noticed Arnel and no one noticed Soto ... in 25 years. And Believe In Me is just a vocally challenged song that goes nowhere. Neal's soaring while Soto stays grounded, and that makes the song awkward. And mediocre.

Dude, just knock it off. really....a song should based on more than whether a singer 'soars'....Arnel is just lucky Neal was trolling youtube. Jeff's been in the business for close to 30 years. Arnel will be a footnote in 5 years.

[Rick]

Calling Believe in Me mediocre shows how little you know about music.

Ok ... that's why the world immediately noticed Arnel and no one noticed Soto ... in 25 years. And Believe In Me is just a vocally challenged song that goes nowhere. Neal's soaring while Soto stays grounded, and that makes the song awkward. And mediocre.

Oh, man, do we disagree here. I think Believe In Me is excellent, all the way around. Jeff shined big time on that one. I said this a few years ago, but that's what a Journey record with Jeff would sound like, and I was all in for that. And could you imagine the route they would have taken with a rock voice like that? I think it would have been a great album. Sadly, we'll never know.

[kgdjpubs]

Calling Believe in Me mediocre shows how little you know about music.

Ok ... that's why the world immediately noticed Arnel and no one noticed Soto ... in 25 years. And Believe In Me is just a vocally challenged song that goes nowhere. Neal's soaring while Soto stays grounded, and that makes the song awkward. And mediocre.

Oh, man, do we disagree here. I think Believe In Me is excellent, all the way around. Jeff shined big time on that one. I said this a few years ago, but that's what a Journey record with Jeff would sound like, and I was all in for that. And could you imagine the route they would have taken with a rock voice like that? I think it would have been a great album. Sadly, we'll never know.

I think JSS sounds great on the song, but the song itself goes nowhere. Always thought the chorus was very flat. JSS can sing circles around a lot of singers, and WET's If I Fall is probably better than any Journey anthem song since the ROR album. Never cared for Believe in Me then or now however. Some of the stuff on Prism was far superior.

Honestly, I don't think Revelation would have been that much different with JSS on vocals. Would have probably been a few co-writes, and his vocal style would have been stamped on the album, but I think you still would have After All These Years and stuff on there--the voice would just be different.

[kgdjpubs]

1) 9/10 - I love what I hear so far. The 5 songs I have heard sound like deeper classic Journey cuts, and yes they have hooks and keys! I'll bet there will even be 1 song on the CD that is a semi- rocker ballad, we have yet to hear 7 songs.

2) I think most the hardcore fans will love this CD, it sounds to me like the one a good number of the hardcore fans were clamoring for with JSS, although some of these same fans are not happy now.. go figure.
3) Casual fans may not like it much... the band is not concerned with the casual fan this time around and neither am I, who cares.

The reason is that there was nothing wrong with JSS. Neal said he didn't like the Journey sound/DIRECTION with him. He wanted to still embrace that legacy sound....so he got the poor man's doppelganger, and cut Revelation.....NOW all of a sudden he wants to go harder edge - had that with JSS. I know exactly how it went down. Neal wanted to cut a legacy album with the new singer, and once the fans were hooked on Arnel and his sob story - neal knew they would already be invested in Arnel and his Philipino entourage - thus ensuring the embrace of the new, harder album.

Jeff got the last laugh anyway, because the W.E.T. album is better than both J-Boyz albums combined....

I think his decision had more to do with touring. I think he wanted a tenor who could sing their catalogue closer to how it was originated for their touring and not be so terriby different in new music. Arnel has a powerful tenor voice. New albums aren't their bread and butter. They went harder this time, but Arnel still is a tenor. It still doesn't affect the fact that Arnel shines on most of the older catalogue while still being able to go harder on the new album. Touring is really where they make their money.

Obviously you've never heard Believe in Me...cause that is classic Journey. And the melodic Neal that is missing now.

You're missing the point. Even though JSS could generally cover the catalog, and the Sam Cooke influence is very strong in his voice on that type of material, I'm not surprised he was let go simply because of the fundamental differences in vocal tone. No amount of touring or anything else will change that. The approach was similar to Perry, but he never even came close to sounding like Perry on the songs--he was just hitting the same notes with a very similar background of vocal stylings. If you wanted the vocalist to have more of a Perry-ish (read: pure tenor) tone, you had to change singers, since the real money is to be made on touring--not new material. JSS was never going to give you that.

Hindsight being 20/20, the band would have been better off never naming JSS lead singer if all they were going to do is find someone else six months later. It would have saved everyone a lot of confusion and headache.

[Saint John]

a song should based on more than whether a singer 'soars'

I agree. The song you referenced called for the song to soar ... and he didn't.

Arnel is just lucky Neal was trolling youtube.

The guy got his break, like Soto did about 5 times, and took full advantage of it. That's the difference between a major leaguer and a minor leaguer. Soto has proven for 25+ years that he's not frotman material for a big league band. He's a great pinch hitter and role player ... like he was for Yngwie, the Queen convention, Rockstar, the Journey fill-in role and the TSO narrator. The proof is in the pudding.

[Rick]

Calling Believe in Me mediocre shows how little you know about music.

Ok ... that's why the world immediately noticed Arnel and no one noticed Soto ... in 25 years. And Believe In Me is just a vocally challenged song that goes nowhere. Neal's soaring while Soto stays grounded, and that makes the song awkward. And mediocre.

Oh, man, do we disagree here. I think Believe In Me is excellent, all the way around. Jeff shined big time on that one. I said this a few years ago, but that's what a Journey record with Jeff would sound like, and I was all in for that. And could you imagine the route they would have taken with a rock voice like that? I think it would have been a great album. Sadly, we'll never know.

I think JSS sounds great on the song, but the song itself goes nowhere. Always thought the chorus was very flat. JSS can sing circles around a lot of singers, and WET's If I Fall is probably better than any Journey anthem song since the ROR album. Never cared for Believe in Me then or now however. Some of the stuff on Prism was far superior.

Honestly, I don't think Revelation would have been that much different with JSS on vocals. Would have probably been a few co-writes, and his vocal style would have been stamped on the album, but I think you still would have After All These Years and stuff on there--the voice would just be different.

Really? I love that song. It has great energy. I'm not so sure they would have written the same album with Soto. I really think they would have written one more tailored to his voice. But that's just a guess. All speculation, to be sure, but it would have been very interesting.

Overall, I think they're doing what they should have and needed to do for the band. Arnel is a great fit, vocally, and while I'm not really sure what I think of the new songs, Arnel sounded fantastic in the clips I've seen from the Vegas show. He sings the songs very well.

[kgdjpubs]

Calling Believe in Me mediocre shows how little you know about music.

Ok ... that's why the world immediately noticed Arnel and no one noticed Soto ... in 25 years. And Believe In Me is just a vocally challenged song that goes nowhere. Neal's soaring while Soto stays grounded, and that makes the song awkward. And mediocre.

Oh, man, do we disagree here. I think Believe In Me is excellent, all the way around. Jeff shined big time on that one. I said this a few years ago, but that's what a Journey record with Jeff would sound like, and I was all in for that. And could you imagine the route they would have taken with a rock voice like that? I think it would have been a great album. Sadly, we'll never know.

I think JSS sounds great on the song, but the song itself goes nowhere. Always thought the chorus was very flat. JSS can sing circles around a lot of singers, and WET's If I Fall is probably better than any Journey anthem song since the ROR album. Never cared for Believe in Me then or now however. Some of the stuff on Prism was far superior.

Honestly, I don't think Revelation would have been that much different with JSS on vocals. Would have probably been a few co-writes, and his vocal style would have been stamped on the album, but I think you still would have After All These Years and stuff on there--the voice would just be different.

Really? I love that song. It has great energy. I'm not so sure they would have written the same album with Soto. I really think they would have written one more tailored to his voice. But that's just a guess. All speculation, to be sure, but it would have been very interesting.

I like the verse, but I think the chorus goes nowhere. Very wordy without a real hook to it. Same feelings with Higher Place off Arrival for that matter.

As far as the "JSS album", I think some would be different, and some would be the same. I think a lot of it would be pretty similar, discounting whatever vocal melody changes JSS would bring in.

[S2M]

Dan, I initially joined MR on the day everyone found out, or the actual day JSS got canned back in '07. And although I've been here off and on since - i really have never been given the 'official' version of why Jeff was canned....I always assumed it was a style issue, and still do to some extent. But i can totally see that it could be a personality conflict between jeff an Neal....Neal has to be the BMOC. Arnel probably kowtows to Neal....I'm sure Jeff wouldn't.

[Rick]

Calling Believe in Me mediocre shows how little you know about music.

Ok ... that's why the world immediately noticed Arnel and no one noticed Soto ... in 25 years. And Believe In Me is just a vocally challenged song that goes nowhere. Neal's soaring while Soto stays grounded, and that makes the song awkward. And mediocre.

Oh, man, do we disagree here. I think Believe In Me is excellent, all the way around. Jeff shined big time on that one. I said this a few years ago, but that's what a Journey record with Jeff would sound like, and I was all in for that. And could you imagine the route they would have taken with a rock voice like that? I think it would have been a great album. Sadly, we'll never know.

I think JSS sounds great on the song, but the song itself goes nowhere. Always thought the chorus was very flat. JSS can sing circles around a lot of singers, and WET's If I Fall is probably better than any Journey anthem song since the ROR album. Never cared for Believe in Me then or now however. Some of the stuff on Prism was far superior.

Honestly, I don't think Revelation would have been that much different with JSS on vocals. Would have probably been a few co-writes, and his vocal style would have been stamped on the album, but I think you still would have After All These Years and stuff on there--the voice would just be different.

Really? I love that song. It has great energy. I'm not so sure they would have written the same album with Soto. I really think they would have written one more tailored to his voice. But that's just a guess. All speculation, to be sure, but it would have been very interesting.

I like the verse, but I think the chorus goes nowhere. Very wordy without a real hook to it. Same feelings with Higher Place off Arrival for that matter.

As far as the "JSS album", I think some would be different, and some would be the same. I think a lot of it would be pretty similar, discounting whatever vocal melody changes JSS would bring in.

And therein lies the difference. What JSS would bring to it. That's what I would have loved to have heard.

Whether you agree or not, in my estimation, JSS is one of those David Lee Roth sort of front men, with a better voice. Although, admittedly is not exactly what Journey is. But it would have been fun to watch.

[Saint John]

Dan, I initially joined MR on the day everyone found out, or the actual day JSS got canned back in '07. And although I've been here off and on since - i really have never been given the 'official' version of why Jeff was canned....I always assumed it was a style issue, and still do to some extent. But i can totally see that it could be a personality conflict between jeff an Neal....Neal has to be the BMOC. Arnel probably kowtows to Neal....I'm sure Jeff wouldn't.

Some things are best left unsaid and both Neal and Soto did some dumb things. What can be said, because it was here for the world to see, was that things were leaking onto here on an almost daily basis. Most of it was innocent like set lists and songs they were working on, but some of it was not so innocent like the very personal issues of a member or two. And that's when a certain someone was alienated and ultimately removed.

As for Neal being the "BMOC," I don't think that's true. Neal, by all accounts, drank his way through a large part of the last decade and only sobered up around the time Arnel joined the band. I know you'll find this to be "ball washer" material, but I really think he heard and felt something in Arnel's voice that he hadn't heard since Perry around the time of Frontiers, and he knew it was time to end the wrecklessness. But I don't think Anel and Soto differ in how much they would have brought to the band from an "alpha male" perspective. Neither carry much relative weight in a room with Jonathan Cain and Neal Schon. Nor should they.

[slucero]

AP's forte is "power"... and he's got it to spare... he also has no control over his very strong vibrato, no nuance or subtlety to his vocal timbre... and there's nothing wrong with that.. it's just how he sings...

JSS forte is more "power with funk"... Jeff has great tone and vibrato control and understands the craft of singing VERY WELL.

SP had incredible tone and timbre, would tailor his vibrato and phrasing to the lyric, and in his heyday could deliver power with finesse... and finesse with delicacy, hence the reason he was called "The Voice" and is REVERED by vocalists all over the world... for what he did.. NOT just by pushing air past his vocal chords... but by SINGING... he is the standard...

Perry is/was a "once in a lifetime" voice... AP and JSS are "once in a couple generation or so" voices... not to demean either of their voices.... as the both are very good at what they do...

Perry was a technical master and just better at all of it...

[RPM]

"PS Believe In Me was a mediocre song ... at best. Soto just can't soar like the song needs him to"


Your wrong...and right..

Its a really good tune, and Jeff does a good job with it, but your correct that
he doesnt have the upper range to take off with it....SP... would have killed on that tune!

[kgdjpubs]

As far as the "JSS album", I think some would be different, and some would be the same. I think a lot of it would be pretty similar, discounting whatever vocal melody changes JSS would bring in.

And therein lies the difference. What JSS would bring to it. That's what I would have loved to have heard.

Whether you agree or not, in my estimation, JSS is one of those David Lee Roth sort of front men, with a better voice. Although, admittedly is not exactly what Journey is. But it would have been fun to watch.

I think a JSS-fronted Journey album would sound very good. He's proved he can do the Perryish melodic vocal very good when he wants to. He's very underrated as a vocalist. I just don't think the songs would have been that different--at least on album #1. #2 may well have taken a change, but I still think you would have had JSS singing After All These Years.

re: frontmen....yea, I can see that. I think he toned it down a bit with Journey, but he's definitely in that style. Certainly a very dynamic stage presence.

[Melissa]

1. Can't really put a number on that yet with only hearing about half the album I'm guessing, and only in youtube form, which never gives justice to how something really sounds, and doesn't even sound the same from actually being there too. So far, personally, nothing has grabbed my attention and made me anticipate the album more. I actually anticipated it more before the youtubes, just based on the hard rock description it's supposedly going to take, but I'm just not feeling that from those 5 songs so far. I listen to some stuff that's pretty hard rock though, so maybe that's why, and maybe it's harder for Journey, but doesn't sound too hard rock to me so far. Shredding does not make a hard rock album. Have to wait and see obviously. It'll be interesting to me also to see how many people actually like the album versions after listening to the youtubes only over and over and that's their first impression of the song.

2. By hardcore fans I think it will be received good. Although if it's truly a hard rock album, maybe not. Hard to tell. I think some will just love it, and some will not, and the rest will just be indifferent, knowing that most of the "legacy" stuff is what will be played live anyway. Like already mentioned, I think it might do better outside the U.S.

3. By casuals, I don't think it will be received too well. The casuals are who love the "legacy" stuff, and who make up MOST of the live audience too. We saw it with the last tour during Rev songs, people sat or took off for the bathroom and beer.

I just don't get this "new direction" thing now when they had that potential back with JSS, and all of you JSS-haters, save it ... he is an incredible and powerful vocalist, and THE way to go if they wanted to TRULY take a hard rock direction. Journey needs to realize that there will never be anyone who can fill SP's shoes, so trying to mold any singer into that is never going to work without killing that singer's voice over time, as has already been shown. They need to stop trying to get a singer to mold to them, and learn they now need to mold around their singer. IF they want to keep it up that is. And if that means changing up some of the "legacy" stuff a little to fit around that singer, so be it. People need to stop being so stinking picky about that. If you want to hear the album versions of those "legacy" songs, go listen to the albums and leave those concert seats free for people like me and others who know how to appreciate live music and aren't stuck back in 1986.

I hope the album truly is a hard rock album like has been mentioned over and over, and I truly hope I like it.

[Saint John]

Fair post, Mel, and you made a lot of good points. I would just add that the main vocal reason I would say Soto was let go was that he sounded ridiculous on a good portion of the older material. He'd arguably be the better choice for a new band going in a harder rock direction, but for a band that has to play the back catalog and move into that new direction, Pineda is a far better choice.

[Rip Rokken]

.Arnel is just lucky Neal was trolling youtube. Jeff's been in the business for close to 30 years.

Neal was reading MelodicRock and saw Nora's video of AP (confirmed by Jeremey). She really gets the credit for AP being discovered by Neal on YouTube.

Arnel will be a footnote in 5 years.

Whether Journey is still active or not, Arnel has a future and won't be forgotten.

[Rip Rokken]

The guy got his break, like Soto did about 5 times, and took full advantage of it. That's the difference between a major leaguer and a minor leaguer. Soto has proven for 25+ years that he's not frotman material for a big league band. He's a great pinch hitter and role player ... like he was for Yngwie, the Queen convention, Rockstar, the Journey fill-in role and the TSO narrator. The proof is in the pudding.

I've seen Jeff with TSO 3 years in a row now, and they keep expanding his role. They really spotlighted him last year, and watching their show it's becoming obvious he's the leading horse at the gate for them. He's also a huge hit with the audience -- probably gets the loudest applause.

[Saint John]

The guy got his break, like Soto did about 5 times, and took full advantage of it. That's the difference between a major leaguer and a minor leaguer. Soto has proven for 25+ years that he's not frotman material for a big league band. He's a great pinch hitter and role player ... like he was for Yngwie, the Queen convention, Rockstar, the Journey fill-in role and the TSO narrator. The proof is in the pudding.

I've seen Jeff with TSO 3 years in a row now, and they keep expanding his role. They really spotlighted him last year, and watching their show it's becoming obvious he's the leading horse at the gate for them. He's also a huge hit with the audience -- probably gets the loudest applause.

I can see that, and that's great for Soto, but TSO will always be a rock orchestral music act and light show, first. The vast majority of people go for the incredible music, lights and pyro show. Soto is a complimentary piece, and he probably doesn't put more than a handful of asses in seats ... if that. But that doesn't mean he's not doing a good job and growing each year, though.

[Rip Rokken]

Perry is/was a "once in a lifetime" voice... AP and JSS are "once in a couple generation or so" voices... not to demean either of their voices.... as the both are very good at what they do...

In the Bible, a generation is 40 years. "A generation or so" might be 80 years. I can agree with you on this... voices like AP and JSS only come around every 80 years or so.... (or does that now make it up to 160 years?)

[Rip Rokken]

Fair post, Mel, and you made a lot of good points. I would just add that the main vocal reason I would say Soto was let go was that he sounded ridiculous on a good portion of the older material. He'd arguably be the better choice for a new band going in a harder rock direction, but for a band that has to play the back catalog and move into that new direction, Pineda is a far better choice.

The first time I ever saw JSS live was with Journey and Def Leppard, and in the live environment with big audio, I could have closed my eyes and imagined Perry was singing. The audience was very receptive to him, and his presence as frontman was great. A friend I was with commented that the band seemed "re-energized" with him on stage, and I've read that elsewhere as well. I've heard some different opinions about the first few shows, but that's to be expected when you have so little time to learn so many songs. This show wasn't disappointing in the least.

[Ritchie]

1)Can I give an 11
I really dig the songs I`ve heard thus far and I believe if the other songs are just as strong and the recording quality is stellar this album is going to be another milestone in Journey`s history,we`ll have to wait and see.

2)Well I hope good but as I said we`ll have to wait.

3)A lot of casuals could be in a state of shock when they hear the new album and maybe some of those people wìll discard it,but if a lot of hard rock minded people hear of this album they will like it and buy it!

[strangegrey]

Listen....I hate to be a fucking DickSnot...and no offense to Rip.
But this whole thread is dogshit...

All three questions are asking people to provide a completely speculative answer. Again, no offense to Rip, but I couldn't judge the quality of the music by the youtubes from vegas at all...and no one else can either. There just wasnt enough there to give anyone a clear indication. That's the only fact being discussed right now.

We all hear the power players chiming in...claiming this album is going to be a game changer and Neal's ripping left and right on this thing. But seriously, there's alot of posturing and positioning around this band...there always was and there always will be. Again, no offense to those that have piped in who have actually heard tracks, but we've been here before. We've heard the "this is our best album" horsecrap from every artist that releases a new record.

I can see the relevance of this sorta thread AFTER the record is in everyone's hands...because then, and only then, can we judge the music on its merits and say "it's going to be received by hard core fans X and received by casual fans Y"....



I am personally hoping for a killer Journey record. I hope to God that Kevin Shirley's stamp is nowhere on this record. I hope to God that Neal being 'all over this record' doesn't mean that Cain is nowhere on this record. I hope to God that the band doesn't shove the Arnel sob story in our face like last time. I hope to God that this record is a single record so that there's no more double counting bullshit.

I want this band in its current incarnation to be judged fairly and solidly....

So that the fanboi's can shut the fuck up if they fall flat on their face and that the naysayers can do the same if the record kicks ass.


But speculating about specifics without really hearing the music is sorta like wondering whether or not you're gonna get a hard on when you unknowingly start surfing network television. It's pointless....


OK, fucking rant over...I just think this sorta shit is stupid until we have solid studio sound samples.....until then, if you're gushing about this record before then, you just expose yourself as a judgementally challenged fanboi.

[Jana]

I am impressed by most of the clips. And two songs really grabbed me immediately (yes, even from youtube clips), sexy songs with hooks, Resonate and Chain of Love, with Edge of the Moment really piqueing my interest, but need the album to hear more. I am not a hard rock person, save a few bands like the Stones, etc., but like the sound of what I've heard so far, progressive rock on a few songs. I can't give a rating, because since I'm not hard rock, there may be only a certain number of songs on here I love. We'll see.

Re how well it sells to which fanbase, hardcore, casual, who knows. It's an older band. It could be a fantastic album and still not sell well. I do believe it goes Gold or close to it. But only a guess. Some of my favorite bands put out music later and it doesn't sell well (Raoul & The Kings of Spain '96 (tho, way, way down the road it eventually sold 750,000) and Everybody Loves a Happy Ending 2004), yet I love both albums and feel they are quality music. So although, I hope for success for the album since I'm a fan of Journey, the most important thing is that I love it. It may be a grower for me, like Arrival was for me, which I adore that album.

[superreverb]

Listen....I hate to be a fucking DickSnot...and no offense to Rip.
But this whole thread is dogshit...

All three questions are asking people to provide a completely speculative answer. Again, no offense to Rip, but I couldn't judge the quality of the music by the youtubes from vegas at all...and no one else can either. There just wasnt enough there to give anyone a clear indication. That's the only fact being discussed right now.

We all hear the power players chiming in...claiming this album is going to be a game changer and Neal's ripping left and right on this thing. But seriously, there's alot of posturing and positioning around this band...there always was and there always will be. Again, no offense to those that have piped in who have actually heard tracks, but we've been here before. We've heard the "this is our best album" horsecrap from every artist that releases a new record.

I can see the relevance of this sorta thread AFTER the record is in everyone's hands...because then, and only then, can we judge the music on its merits and say "it's going to be received by hard core fans X and received by casual fans Y"....



I am personally hoping for a killer Journey record. I hope to God that Kevin Shirley's stamp is nowhere on this record. I hope to God that Neal being 'all over this record' doesn't mean that Cain is nowhere on this record. I hope to God that the band doesn't shove the Arnel sob story in our face like last time. I hope to God that this record is a single record so that there's no more double counting bullshit.

I want this band in its current incarnation to be judged fairly and solidly....

So that the fanboi's can shut the fuck up if they fall flat on their face and that the naysayers can do the same if the record kicks ass.


But speculating about specifics without really hearing the music is sorta like wondering whether or not you're gonna get a hard on when you unknowingly start surfing network television. It's pointless....


OK, fucking rant over...I just think this sorta shit is stupid until we have solid studio sound samples.....until then, if you're gushing about this record before then, you just expose yourself as a judgementally challenged fanboi.

For as harsh as this post is, in bits... it's pretty Spot on. I "WANT" this record to be great, Wasn't impressed with KS's contributions to this band sonically, especially Revelation, and it sounds like the band took more control, to make sure the sound quality and production of this record, is a step up from the last one.

Now... is this a Shredder NS Solo Project album? or a "Modern Journey Album?" I really HOPE for the modern journey album. I can't tell by the you tube clips, I'm not completely sold on the songs, as represented on youtube, but I'm not turned off either. Rather intrigued. but I'm going to just have to wait for the album.

It sounds like Cain and Schon DID write most of this album together, which is promising, it also sounds like there are some real "Arnel Moments", that this is really "Arnel's Record" his 1st actual Record with the band... not tied to the Greatest Hits, singing SP Classics, and new songs, Penned, recorded, produced SUNG and Mixed to fit into the "Classic / Journey Sound" -

I HOPE for a Modern, Edgy, new sounding Journey record, that Defines / Starts the "New Journey Sound" - As definitive for the band as a Hagar led Halen (Like it or hate it)

THATS what I'm hoping for this record, and this band - I guess we'll see.