HELP ME UNDERSTAND?

[brywool]

i have to say i really liked them when JSS was with them.

Yeah, because you heard some epic original material from him. Or was it the massacred baritone renditions of most of the classics?

No because i enjoy his music & that of Mr P.

Yeah, Mr. Pineda's doing a great job. Knew you'd come around BB.
WHY did people dig the JSS stuff so much? I never got it at all- AND what was there to get? He did half a tour...

[S2M]

i have to say i really liked them when JSS was with them.

Yeah, because you heard some epic original material from him. Or was it the massacred baritone renditions of most of the classics?

No because i enjoy his music & that of Mr P.

Yeah, Mr. Pineda's doing a great job. Knew you'd come around BB.
WHY did people dig the JSS stuff so much? I never got it at all- AND what was there to get? He did half a tour...

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

[brywool]

i have to say i really liked them when JSS was with them.

Yeah, because you heard some epic original material from him. Or was it the massacred baritone renditions of most of the classics?

No because i enjoy his music & that of Mr P.

Yeah, Mr. Pineda's doing a great job. Knew you'd come around BB.
WHY did people dig the JSS stuff so much? I never got it at all- AND what was there to get? He did half a tour...

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

Not even. JSS had a very low range comparatively speaking. Listen to the boots of him with Journey, they were not good. He did great on IBAWY, but other than that, I wasn't impressed at all- apparently, the band felt likewise. He's great at what he does, but with Journey it wasn't nearly the fit that Pineda is and I don't see how people that are into the Journey sound can see it otherwise. But hey, different strokes.

[Saint John]

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

There's really no comparison between the two. Arnel can sing circles around Soto. He's more powerful, has better range, can do the older songs justice and has so much more to offer in terms of potential. Soto is an average professional singer. He has a strong voice and has been in the business for a lot of years because he takes pretty good care of himself, but he's not major league material. There are literally hundreds, if not thousands of singers that can do anything Soto can do. The same simply cannot be said about Pineda. There are a few, but not many. 25 years in the business for Soto with no hits, no well sold albums that he fronted on and being a narrator for an orchestra tells you pretty much everything you need to know. He's the Julio Franco of the music world, while Pineda is the Ichiro Suzuki.

[S2M]

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

There's really no comparison between the two. Arnel can sing circles around Soto. He's more powerful, has better range, can do the older songs justice and has so much more to offer in terms of potential. Soto is an average professional singer. He has a strong voice and has been in the business for a lot of years because he takes pretty good care of himself, but he's not major league material. There are literally hundreds, if not thousands of singers that can do anything Soto can do. The same simply cannot be said about Pineda. There are a few, but not many. 25 years in the business for Soto with no hits, no well sold albums that he fronted on and being a narrator for an orchestra tells you pretty much everything you need to know. He's the Julio Franco of the music world, while Pineda is the Ichiro Suzuki.

Seriously, Zdeno.....Arnel has a hit because he's IN Journey...not of anything HE'S done individually. And having a 'hit' song isn't the end all be all. And Arnel doesn't have some once-in-a-lifetime voice/talent either....I can name 50 singers better than Arnel - without even looking them up on google...

You are a fanboy, admit it. Arnel can do no wrong. Fanboy(your new name)...

Arnel is more like Hidecki 'Upper Decki' Irabu....

[SF-Dano]

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

There's really no comparison between the two. Arnel can sing circles around Soto. He's more powerful, has better range, can do the older songs justice and has so much more to offer in terms of potential. Soto is an average professional singer. He has a strong voice and has been in the business for a lot of years because he takes pretty good care of himself, but he's not major league material. There are literally hundreds, if not thousands of singers that can do anything Soto can do. The same simply cannot be said about Pineda. There are a few, but not many. 25 years in the business for Soto with no hits, no well sold albums that he fronted on and being a narrator for an orchestra tells you pretty much everything you need to know. He's the Julio Franco of the music world, while Pineda is the Ichiro Suzuki.

In all fairness to JSS, I believe the first two Yngwie albums sold fairly well. But I understand the point you are trying to make.

[Saint John]

Seriously, Zdeno.....Arnel has a hit because he's IN Journey...not of anything HE'S done individually. And having a 'hit' song isn't the end all be all. And Arnel doesn't have some once-in-a-lifetime voice/talent either....I can name 50 singers better than Arnel - without even looking them up on google...

You are a fanboy, admit it. Arnel can do no wrong. Fanboy(your new name)...

Arnel is more like Hidecki 'Upper Decki' Irabu....

First off, these guys were on different playing fields. Arnel didn't spend the last 25 years in the U.S. Soto did and enjoyed average success ... which is about right for an average professional singer. Arnel's popularity is because he's in Journey (though the success is because of his immense talents)but, unlike Soto, I bet he would remain successful here as a solo artist. Nobody was talking about Soto's voice when he was in Journey as being "special" but everyone, upon first listen, did so with Pineda. You can chalk it up to the "story" but I was at shows, many shows on the Revelation tour, and people were all asking who he was. The only people that tooted Soto's horns were doing so with back stage passes in hand. Soto's 25 years and stints in Journey, movies, Yngwie and a whole host of other projects netted him an average of about 20 fans per solo show a few years back. And that's just not the sign of someone people give a shit about.

[S2M]

Seriously, Zdeno.....Arnel has a hit because he's IN Journey...not of anything HE'S done individually. And having a 'hit' song isn't the end all be all. And Arnel doesn't have some once-in-a-lifetime voice/talent either....I can name 50 singers better than Arnel - without even looking them up on google...

You are a fanboy, admit it. Arnel can do no wrong. Fanboy(your new name)...

Arnel is more like Hidecki 'Upper Decki' Irabu....

First off, these guys were on different playing fields. Arnel didn't spend the last 25 years in the U.S. Soto did and enjoyed average success ... which is about right for an average professional singer. Arnel's popularity is because he's in Journey (though the success is because of his immense talents)but, unlike Soto, I bet he would remain successful here as a solo artist. Nobody was talking about Soto's voice when he was in Journey as being "special" but everyone, upon first listen, did so with Pineda. You can chalk it up to the "story" but I was at shows, many shows on the Revelation tour, and people were all asking who he was. The only people that tooted Soto's horns were doing so with back stage passes in hand. Soto's 25 years and stints in Journey, movies, Yngwie and a whole host of other projects netted him an average of about 20 fans per solo show a few years back. And that's just not the sign of someone people give a shit about.

Lest you forget - people were asking who SA was too. a mere 5% knew about Tall Stories and Tyketto. I equate this with the difference between people who clamor about Transformers, and those who like to watch movies like Memento, or Memoirs of a Geisha. One is easily distracted by the whole pomp and circumstance surrounding it, and the other likes the stripped down, bare bones talent of a non-mainstream film/artist. You can keep your Transformers.....

[Saint John]

Lest you forget - people were asking who SA was too. a mere 5% knew about Tall Stories and Tyketto. I equate this with the difference between people who clamor about Transformers, and those who like to watch movies like Memento, or Memoirs of a Geisha. One is easily distracted by the whole pomp and circumstance surrounding it, and the other likes the stripped down, bare bones talent of a non-mainstream film/artist. You can keep your Transformers.....

Hard for me to comment as I haven't seen any of those movies. But I can say that I think all of those Batman (saw 1 of them with Nicholson, perhaps the first, and it blew), Spiderman (saw the first one ... terrible, except for Kirsten being in it), Marvel Comics and Transformers movies are fucking gay ... so maybe I'd like the 2 movies you suggested!

[Ehwmatt]

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

There's really no comparison between the two. Arnel can sing circles around Soto. He's more powerful, has better range, can do the older songs justice and has so much more to offer in terms of potential. Soto is an average professional singer. He has a strong voice and has been in the business for a lot of years because he takes pretty good care of himself, but he's not major league material. There are literally hundreds, if not thousands of singers that can do anything Soto can do. The same simply cannot be said about Pineda. There are a few, but not many. 25 years in the business for Soto with no hits, no well sold albums that he fronted on and being a narrator for an orchestra tells you pretty much everything you need to know. He's the Julio Franco of the music world, while Pineda is the Ichiro Suzuki.

Hey, Julio Franco resents this comparison.

[Journey/Survivor]

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

There's really no comparison between the two. Arnel can sing circles around Soto. He's more powerful, has better range, can do the older songs justice and has so much more to offer in terms of potential. Soto is an average professional singer. He has a strong voice and has been in the business for a lot of years because he takes pretty good care of himself, but he's not major league material. There are literally hundreds, if not thousands of singers that can do anything Soto can do. The same simply cannot be said about Pineda. There are a few, but not many. 25 years in the business for Soto with no hits, no well sold albums that he fronted on and being a narrator for an orchestra tells you pretty much everything you need to know. He's the Julio Franco of the music world, while Pineda is the Ichiro Suzuki.

Hey, Julio Franco resents this comparison.

And so do I.

[Journey/Survivor]

My honest opinion of JSS's singing.....

He's great on things like the Soul Sirkus CD. That's what he's best suited for.

He nailed the Steve Perryisms on "Coming Home."

But he just doesn't have the range to sing the young-Steve-Perry songs.
He really sounded horrible on some of the bootlegs, and was fair at best when I saw him in person at the Cleveland show.

I would say that JSS is probably better suited for a band like Soul Sirkus than AP is? But I would take AP on vocals in almost all other cases.

I'm not saying this to argue or piss anyone else off! But I can't understand how there are so many people on here that were excited about JSS in Journey? He couldn't do the back catalog any justice. He was IMO the least qualified singer that Journey ever had.

[S2M]

My honest opinion of JSS's singing.....

He's great on things like the Soul Sirkus CD. That's what he's best suited for.

He nailed the Steve Perryisms on "Coming Home."

But he just doesn't have the range to sing the young-Steve-Perry songs.
He really sounded horrible on some of the bootlegs, and was fair at best when I saw him in person at the Cleveland show.

I would say that JSS is probably better suited for a band like Soul Sirkus than AP is? But I would take AP on vocals in almost all other cases.

I'm not saying this to argue or piss anyone else off! But I can't understand how there are so many people on here that were excited about JSS in Journey? He couldn't do the back catalog any justice. He was IMO the least qualified singer that Journey ever had.

Least qualified to sing the Journey catalog, yes.....anything else is just plain preference, and idol worship...

[steveo777]

My honest opinion of JSS's singing.....

He's great on things like the Soul Sirkus CD. That's what he's best suited for.

He nailed the Steve Perryisms on "Coming Home."

But he just doesn't have the range to sing the young-Steve-Perry songs.
He really sounded horrible on some of the bootlegs, and was fair at best when I saw him in person at the Cleveland show.

I would say that JSS is probably better suited for a band like Soul Sirkus than AP is? But I would take AP on vocals in almost all other cases.

I'm not saying this to argue or piss anyone else off! But I can't understand how there are so many people on here that were excited about JSS in Journey? He couldn't do the back catalog any justice. He was IMO the least qualified singer that Journey ever had.

No need for people to question his short tenure with the band. Your statement gives a pretty simplistic reason for his departure. Nuf said.
That said, a guy can have plenty of vocal talent but simply cannot handle the duration. While I believe he could "stretch" to cover the
catalog, touring would exploit the weaknesses pretty fast and did.

[Monker]

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

There's really no comparison between the two. Arnel can sing circles around Soto. He's more powerful, has better range, can do the older songs justice and has so much more to offer in terms of potential. Soto is an average professional singer. He has a strong voice and has been in the business for a lot of years because he takes pretty good care of himself, but he's not major league material. There are literally hundreds, if not thousands of singers that can do anything Soto can do. The same simply cannot be said about Pineda. There are a few, but not many. 25 years in the business for Soto with no hits, no well sold albums that he fronted on and being a narrator for an orchestra tells you pretty much everything you need to know. He's the Julio Franco of the music world, while Pineda is the Ichiro Suzuki.

Oh, please...this is just ridiculous. The only claim to fame that Arnel has is that he can sing like Steve Perry. That's it. Not very impressive, IMO. He is not his own man. He is a pretend Perry...or whoever else he is imitating when he does his solo shows off the mainland, since he has no solo 'hits' of his own. Journey can do whatever they want, with whoever they want, but I think it's a sad thing that they can't leave Steve Perry in the past. Perry is a flea in Neal Schon's afro that he'll never get rid of....Nowadays, I think Neal has an attitude of "Fuck it, I'm an old man....I don't give a damn if I have fleas...as long as I can play and people will give me their money.

It is also pathetic that you make this "average voice" argument about Soto. But, even if that is true...which, IMO, it isn't...at least he is not making a living by reminding people of somebody else. True, I don't think he was the right person for Journey....but even I recognize that the guy has immense talent. Belittling Soto to prop up Arnel only makes you look like an idiot, IMO.

[Saint John]

The only claim to fame that Arnel has is that he can sing like Steve Perry.

Incorrect, but even if it was correct, that would be a leg up on any of Journey's prior post-Perry singers. The guy is one released album into his tenure and he's made quite a name for himself already. I suspect that will only grow after Eclipse hits the market.

but I think it's a sad thing that they can't leave Steve Perry in the past.

Steve Perry has left himself in the past. He quit on Journey in 1987, in 1994 when he toured alone (doing exactly what they're doing now ... singing a few new songs and the rest Journey ... even though he wasn't with Journey) and then again in 1996. As for the guys still playing Journey songs, they don't have to bury their history because one guy decided to quit.

It is also pathetic that you make this "average voice" argument about Soto.

This is where your incredibly low IQ tends to make you look even dumber than you are. I said "average professional singer." That's like me saying that Jay Cutler is an average pro quarterback and you comparing him to people off the street. It makes you a moron. Put Soto in a room with 50 other professional singers and I would guess that the vast majority of them could anything he could vocally. If he was as good as you and a lot of others around here say think he is, he wouldn't be a narrator for a rock orchestra. He'd be fronting a band.

at least he is not making a living by reminding people of somebody else.

Arnel Pineda is reminding people just how good Journey music is ... old and new. The popularity and momentum the band has gained lies in the fact that he's the first post-Perry singer able to nail the old songs and provide new songs with those same monster vocals.

Belittling Soto

I have never done that. Not ever. I provide respectful opinions and back it up with logical arguments and facts. But if calling the guy and "average professional singer" is belittling, then I'm guilty.

[Monker]

Incorrect, but even if it was correct, that would be a leg up on any of Journey's prior post-Perry singers. The guy is one released album into his tenure and he's made quite a name for himself already. I suspect that will only grow after Eclipse hits the market.

Arnel is no better off right now then where Augeri was after Arrival was released.

You don't 'suspect' it will grow after Eclipse, you EXPECT it to...and you will say it did whether it is true or not.

but I think it's a sad thing that they can't leave Steve Perry in the past.

Steve Perry has left himself in the past. He quit on Journey in 1987, in 1994 when he toured alone (doing exactly what they're doing now ... singing a few new songs and the rest Journey ... even though he wasn't with Journey) and then again in 1996. As for the guys still playing Journey songs, they don't have to bury their history because one guy decided to quit.
[/quote[

Blah, blah, blah. I was arguing that before Augeri was even in the band. That is NOT what I was saying with my statement above.

NEAL SCHON and Journey have not let go of Perry. They have used the popularity of his time in the band to get attention from nostalgic hungry people who either want to relive those days, or wish they had lived in those days. They, the band, explicitly said so. That is why Arnel was brought into the band...because Neal saw his Perry imitation on YouTube.. What was their other near choice? Jeremy, a tribute band singer. Those are simple FACTS - get over it.

I said "average professional singer."

Oh, wow, :"professional" singer. That just makes such a huge difference.

Whatever.

Put Soto in a room with 50 other professional singers and I would guess that the vast majority of them could anything he could vocally.

So what. You could say the same thing about %90 of all rock singers. Comparing somebody like Sammy Hagar ito Steve Perry is ridiculously lame and stupid...and that IS what you are doing. What you are basically saying is Josh Ramos is this awesome guitarist because he can sound like Neal Schon...But BB King is mediocre because Josh can do things BB can't. It's fucking stupid and makes you look like a 16yr old fanboy in some awestruck daze over Arnel.

[steveo777]

Sure easy to spot the hate posts that come from the butt hurt Perry fans and denyers.

They sure are childish.

[portland]

Sure easy to spot the hate posts that come from the butt hurt Perry fans and denyers.

They sure are childish.

Same could be said for the ones that blast Perry and claim AP to be the king....just sayin.

[Don]

Sure easy to spot the hate posts that come from the butt hurt Perry fans and denyers.

They sure are childish.

This has to be one of your worse posts ever., you sound like you're 12 years old.

[steveo777]

Sure easy to spot the hate posts that come from the butt hurt Perry fans and denyers.

They sure are childish.

This has to be one of your worse posts ever., you sound like you're 12 years old.

Sometimes you have to adjust yourself to the levels of others in order to communicate.

[Michigan Girl]

Sure easy to spot the hate posts that come from the butt hurt Perry fans and denyers.

They sure are childish.

This has to be one of your worse posts ever., you sound like you're 12 years old.

Sometimes you have to adjust yourself to the levels of others in order to communicate.

Just don't forget to adjust back up when you sit at the big people table ...we don't understand
whining and we don't like to hear it ...we'll send you back to Journeyland/your room/the little kid table until
you can behave properly!!

[steveo777]

Sure easy to spot the hate posts that come from the butt hurt Perry fans and denyers.

They sure are childish.

This has to be one of your worse posts ever., you sound like you're 12 years old.

Sometimes you have to adjust yourself to the levels of others in order to communicate.

Just don't forget to adjust back up when you sit at the big people table ...we don't understand
whining and we don't like to hear it ...we'll send you back to Journeyland/your room/the little kid table until
you can behave properly!!

I'll go if you make the others go too.

[annie89509]

Sure easy to spot the hate posts that come from the butt hurt Perry fans and denyers.

They sure are childish.

S07... this is such a ridiculous statement, even coming from you. Monker has never minced words when being critical about SP and toward SPfans...I expect an equitable perspective when he posts about the rest of the band.

SJ...I like you, but your continuous diatribes in an obvious attempt to play up to Neal & the JBoys is getting annoying. We know Neal and possibly other members of the band read here. Might you be going for brownie points? Same thing you used to call Deano out on with the JSS-fronted Journey.

[marco17]

Just my 2 cents...

SA, JSS, AP... all good singers, some are better at certain aspects then the others, but that's life, so my comments take no shots at any of the post-Perry singers...

Agree in regards to a previous post that Arnel really isn't anywhere beyond where SA was after Arrival. Granted Revelation sold better than anything else post-Perry for various reasons that are debatable, and Journey may not have been touring as much around the world prior to Arnel, though they started to tap into some of those markets near the end of SA's tenure with the band, and they played most of the same venues in the States with SA that they do with Arnel. Arnel may be better suited for the Journey catalog, but I would venture to guess that if DSB wasn't being hyped by everyone and their brother from the Soprano's final episode, resulting in tons of casual fans wanting to know what Journey was up to, and them becoming the flavor of the day, add to that the very media friendly, "Arnel's our new lead singer and his rags to riches sob story," I think Journey would be at the exact same place on people's radar that they were with any other post-Perry vocalist. I am not saying Arnel isn't great, because for what they want him to do, he is, make no mistake about that, but I think there is a lot of artificial hype surrounding just how popular some think Journey is now with Arnel, and how popular they really are. Eclipse will give some indication to the sustainability of this, IMO.

[mistiejourney]

Cause JSS kills Arnel. Period.

There's really no comparison between the two. Arnel can sing circles around Soto. He's more powerful, has better range, can do the older songs justice and has so much more to offer in terms of potential. Soto is an average professional singer. He has a strong voice and has been in the business for a lot of years because he takes pretty good care of himself, but he's not major league material. There are literally hundreds, if not thousands of singers that can do anything Soto can do. The same simply cannot be said about Pineda. There are a few, but not many. 25 years in the business for Soto with no hits, no well sold albums that he fronted on and being a narrator for an orchestra tells you pretty much everything you need to know. He's the Julio Franco of the music world, while Pineda is the Ichiro Suzuki.

OMG - I'm back again! Both men are talented. One is a marathon runner and another is a sprinter. Journey kills its lead singers. No, no, I don't mean literally - constant touring with that catalog seems to take out a guy in about three or four years. Let's see how Arnel does over the long haul.

Can't compare Jeff and Arnel - they have two different styles. Jeff is a fantastic singer. And Arnel can sing, hell, I bought the last Journey CD, but I have to say it did not blow me away. Arnel can hit the notes, but his voice is "cold". It's hard to describe. Instead of "HOLY SHIT THIS GUY IS REALLY GOOD", all I got was "meh".

So...I'm going about my business not paying one iota of attention to Journey AT ALL for about a year and a link for a Boston CD on Amazon has me looking up Boston on Wiki which has me clicking on a link to Neal's website which has me finding out about Eclipse which has me coming here for info AND YOU NEVER REALLY GET AWAY FROM JOURNEY, DO YOU?

LOL! : )

And I thought I was done but part of me really wants to hear what this sounds like. : )

Plus, it's fun to see that everyone is still here and y'all haven't changed a bit! : D

[Michigan Girl]

MISTIE!!!So good to see/read you!!!

[mistiejourney]

MISTIE!!!So good to see/read you!!!

Thanks! It's been awhile!

[Saint John]

SJ...I like you, but your continuous diatribes in an obvious attempt to play up to Neal & the JBoys is getting annoying. We know Neal and possibly other members of the band read here. Might you be going for brownie points? Same thing you used to call Deano out on with the JSS-fronted Journey.

Brownie points? From people I don't know? Fuck you.

[annie89509]

SJ...I like you, but your continuous diatribes in an obvious attempt to play up to Neal & the JBoys is getting annoying. We know Neal and possibly other members of the band read here. Might you be going for brownie points? Same thing you used to call Deano out on with the JSS-fronted Journey.

Brownie points? From people I don't know? Fuck you.

lol... guess I hit a nerve. Not in your wildest dreams, buddy!