Saint John's Review Of Eclipse

[Melissa]

You just ain't right. An anomaly, maybe?

Lol, nah not an anomaly, I can think of at least a few other MR ladies that share the same more male sense of humour.

Yep . What's most fun to me, being able to appreciate guy humor, is how it bothers other females That just makes me up it even more

[Art Vandelay]

I find it hysterical (and a little disturbing, too) that there are people who have followed Journey hardcore throughout their lives and have discussed Eclipse for hours and hours but won't spend $8 on it.

Why is that disturbing? If someone doesn't like something, they should go out and spend their hard earned money on it anyway? That's hysterical and disturbing.

Yeah...just discuss it more for hours and hours. That makes sense. Tell us how much you don't like something you haven't really listened to.

Ok, let's do that. First of all, having no interest doesn't mean disliking. And just so you know, I have heard the samples on Amazon. I don't think it's bad at all. Is it the Journey that I prefer? No. So why would I spend money on something that I have no interest in? It just means I'd rather invest in other types of music at this point. However I have never criticized their new direction in music. I said yesterday (in my discussion about the marketing, not the music), that I'm all for a grass roots effort.

[Eric]

I find it hysterical (and a little disturbing, too) that there are people who have followed Journey hardcore throughout their lives and have discussed Eclipse for hours and hours but won't spend $8 on it.

Why is that disturbing? If someone doesn't like something, they should go out and spend their hard earned money on it anyway? That's hysterical and disturbing.

Yeah...just discuss it more for hours and hours. That makes sense. Tell us how much you don't like something you haven't really listened to.

Ok, let's do that. First of all, having no interest doesn't mean disliking. And just so you know, I have heard the samples on Amazon. I don't think it's bad at all. Is it the Journey that I prefer? No. So why would I spend money on something that I have no interest in? It just means I'd rather invest in other types of music at this point. However I have never criticized their new direction in music. I said yesterday (in my discussion about the marketing, not the music), that I'm all for a grass roots effort.

I just don't get being on a message board talking about something you won't spend $8 on? Whether you like it or hate it or in-between is irrelevant. And when you listen to it in full trust me - its Journey. I promise. I understand a casual fan picking it up, spinning, not getting and saying it wasn't what they expected...and even reviewing it as such. But for us hardcore who talk about this several times a week...I mean...its $8?

[steveo777]

The beginning of She's a Mystery reminds me of another song from the 70's/80's and I can't place it???

There are parts of the guitar rhythm in there that remind me of Listen To The Music by the Doobie Brothers. Anyone else hear this?

[Abitaman]

I find it hysterical (and a little disturbing, too) that there are people who have followed Journey hardcore throughout their lives and have discussed Eclipse for hours and hours but won't spend $8 on it.

On their facebook account people are talking about how bad the cd is. I have asked if the listened to it...typical answers have been
1) Steve Perry is not in the band so it sucks
2) I listened to the first song on two and didn't like it so didn't go any further (meaning #1)
3) I listened to the 30 sec clips and didn't like it, (see # 1). That is like watching a movie trailer and saying the movie sucks without seeing the whole thing.

I do not mind people not likeing the cd, if they have listened to the whole thing. Then you have a right to say it is good or bad.

[brywool]

Lastly, did anyone else notice that Arnel says "Tantra," "Tontra" and "Tuntra" during various parts of the song? Weird, but I like it!

YES!

[Greg]

I find it hysterical (and a little disturbing, too) that there are people who have followed Journey hardcore throughout their lives and have discussed Eclipse for hours and hours but won't spend $8 on it.

Why is that disturbing? If someone doesn't like something, they should go out and spend their hard earned money on it anyway? That's hysterical and disturbing.

Yeah...just discuss it more for hours and hours. That makes sense. Tell us how much you don't like something you haven't really listened to.

Ok, let's do that. First of all, having no interest doesn't mean disliking. And just so you know, I have heard the samples on Amazon. I don't think it's bad at all. Is it the Journey that I prefer? No. So why would I spend money on something that I have no interest in? It just means I'd rather invest in other types of music at this point. However I have never criticized their new direction in music. I said yesterday (in my discussion about the marketing, not the music), that I'm all for a grass roots effort.

I just don't get being on a message board talking about something you won't spend $8 on? Whether you like it or hate it or in-between is irrelevant. And when you listen to it in full trust me - its Journey. I promise. I understand a casual fan picking it up, spinning, not getting and saying it wasn't what they expected...and even reviewing it as such. But for us hardcore who talk about this several times a week...I mean...its $8?

Whoa, first of all, don't be a douche. Just because someone doesn't want to run out and throw down their hard earned cash for this doesn't mean they don't have access to listening to it in its entirety. Heck, the full album is being streamed online. Secondly, you're assuming I didn't listen to this album or that I didn't purchase this album. You know what they say about assumptions? I happened to have listened to this album several times during the week of its release. Enough times to make a pretty good judgment on my likes and dislikes of the album. Sorry to say, it's not my cup of tea, and I am going to continue discussing it in as unbiased and sane was as I normally do, without being like a fanboy cheerleading twerp. So, if you can't stand the fact that there are going to be opposing negative statements to balance the super-hero worship posts, then move along and start Backtalk II where you can ban anyone who shows the least little bit of negativity toward the band.

[Art Vandelay]

I find it hysterical (and a little disturbing, too) that there are people who have followed Journey hardcore throughout their lives and have discussed Eclipse for hours and hours but won't spend $8 on it.

Why is that disturbing? If someone doesn't like something, they should go out and spend their hard earned money on it anyway? That's hysterical and disturbing.

Yeah...just discuss it more for hours and hours. That makes sense. Tell us how much you don't like something you haven't really listened to.

Ok, let's do that. First of all, having no interest doesn't mean disliking. And just so you know, I have heard the samples on Amazon. I don't think it's bad at all. Is it the Journey that I prefer? No. So why would I spend money on something that I have no interest in? It just means I'd rather invest in other types of music at this point. However I have never criticized their new direction in music. I said yesterday (in my discussion about the marketing, not the music), that I'm all for a grass roots effort.

I just don't get being on a message board talking about something you won't spend $8 on? Whether you like it or hate it or in-between is irrelevant. And when you listen to it in full trust me - its Journey. I promise. I understand a casual fan picking it up, spinning, not getting and saying it wasn't what they expected...and even reviewing it as such. But for us hardcore who talk about this several times a week...I mean...its $8?

I'll be honest with you, Eric...I couldn't tell you the last classic rock CD (new material) that I've purchased. It could very well have been TBF. I've moved on to other styles and genres of music that work for me now (classic jazz, classic r&b, and downtempo jazz/pop fusion). Would I be listening to a Perry fronted Journey? Yes, but that's because I enjoy his particular style and what he brought to the band. I liked the mature R&B influence that he brought to TBF. What brings me to this board is my interest in the classic Journey that I grew up with. The stories, politics and classic songs are way more interesting to me than the new material. Is that really a fault?

[Eric]

Whoa, first of all, don't be a douche. Just because someone doesn't want to run out and throw down their hard earned cash for this doesn't mean they don't have access to listening to it in its entirety. Heck, the full album is being streamed online. Secondly, you're assuming I didn't listen to this album or that I didn't purchase this album. You know what they say about assumptions? I happened to have listened to this album several times during the week of its release. Enough times to make a pretty good judgment on my likes and dislikes of the album. Sorry to say, it's not my cup of tea, and I am going to continue discussing it in as unbiased and sane was as I normally do, without being like a fanboy cheerleading twerp. So, if you can't stand the fact that there are going to be opposing negative statements to balance the super-hero worship posts, then move along and start Backtalk II where you can ban anyone who shows the least little bit of negativity toward the band.

Lets KEEEEEEP talking about an album you won't spend $8 on. And read my review..its not all positive, so you can shove the backtalk comment up your ass.

[Eric]

I'll be honest with you, Eric...I couldn't tell you the last classic rock CD (new material) that I've purchased. It could very well have been TBF. I've moved on to other styles and genres of music that work for me now (classic jazz, classic r&b, and downtempo jazz/pop fusion). Would I be listening to a Perry fronted Journey? Yes, but that's because I enjoy his particular style and what he brought to the band. I liked the mature R&B influence that he brought to TBF. What brings me to this board is my interest in the classic Journey that I grew up with. The stories, politics and classic songs are way more interesting to me than the new material. Is that really a fault?

No, not at all...but where I'm confused is when the Perry era interest finds it way consistently into a thread/discussion about, say, Eclipse. See where I'm coming from?

I'm just looking for honest reviews is all.

[Art Vandelay]

I'll be honest with you, Eric...I couldn't tell you the last classic rock CD (new material) that I've purchased. It could very well have been TBF. I've moved on to other styles and genres of music that work for me now (classic jazz, classic r&b, and downtempo jazz/pop fusion). Would I be listening to a Perry fronted Journey? Yes, but that's because I enjoy his particular style and what he brought to the band. I liked the mature R&B influence that he brought to TBF. What brings me to this board is my interest in the classic Journey that I grew up with. The stories, politics and classic songs are way more interesting to me than the new material. Is that really a fault?

No, not at all...but where I'm confused is when the Perry era interest finds it way consistently into a thread/discussion about, say, Eclipse. See where I'm coming from?

I'm just looking for honest reviews is all.

I'm with ya. I don't believe in critiquing something that you never heard, seen, read or tasted...again which is why I never critiqued the post '96 music.

[Eric]

I'll be honest with you, Eric...I couldn't tell you the last classic rock CD (new material) that I've purchased. It could very well have been TBF. I've moved on to other styles and genres of music that work for me now (classic jazz, classic r&b, and downtempo jazz/pop fusion). Would I be listening to a Perry fronted Journey? Yes, but that's because I enjoy his particular style and what he brought to the band. I liked the mature R&B influence that he brought to TBF. What brings me to this board is my interest in the classic Journey that I grew up with. The stories, politics and classic songs are way more interesting to me than the new material. Is that really a fault?

No, not at all...but where I'm confused is when the Perry era interest finds it way consistently into a thread/discussion about, say, Eclipse. See where I'm coming from?

I'm just looking for honest reviews is all.

I'm with ya. I don't believe in critiquing something that you never heard, seen, read or tasted...again which is why I never critiqued the post '96 music.

And I hate for a Journey fan like you not to be on board....because I can still feel the Journey vibe in their new music, but I do understand your position.

[Greg]

Whoa, first of all, don't be a douche. Just because someone doesn't want to run out and throw down their hard earned cash for this doesn't mean they don't have access to listening to it in its entirety. Heck, the full album is being streamed online. Secondly, you're assuming I didn't listen to this album or that I didn't purchase this album. You know what they say about assumptions? I happened to have listened to this album several times during the week of its release. Enough times to make a pretty good judgment on my likes and dislikes of the album. Sorry to say, it's not my cup of tea, and I am going to continue discussing it in as unbiased and sane was as I normally do, without being like a fanboy cheerleading twerp. So, if you can't stand the fact that there are going to be opposing negative statements to balance the super-hero worship posts, then move along and start Backtalk II where you can ban anyone who shows the least little bit of negativity toward the band.

Lets KEEEEEEP talking about an album you won't spend $8 on. And read my review..its not all positive, so you can shove the backtalk comment up your ass.

And you take your $8 CD, turn it sideways and shove it up your monkey ass.

[S2M]

I find it hysterical (and a little disturbing, too) that there are people who have followed Journey hardcore throughout their lives and have discussed Eclipse for hours and hours but won't spend $8 on it.

On their facebook account people are talking about how bad the cd is. I have asked if the listened to it...typical answers have been
1) Steve Perry is not in the band so it sucks
2) I listened to the first song on two and didn't like it so didn't go any further (meaning #1)
3) I listened to the 30 sec clips and didn't like it, (see # 1). That is like watching a movie trailer and saying the movie sucks without seeing the whole thing.
I do not mind people not likeing the cd, if they have listened to the whole thing. Then you have a right to say it is good or bad.

Ever go to a movie based on a, supposed, awesome trailer....only to be disappointed? Works both ways. It amazes me that the rose-coloreds just won't see this logic.

[SF-Dano]

Why is that if someone gives Eclipse a positive review and actually likes it, it is called fan-boy rah rah shit. Why can't we just like the damn record. I seem to see way more "reasons" (backup) given for liking the songs in the positive reviews, than there are reasons given for negative reviews.

[steveo777]

Why is that if someone gives Eclipse a positive review and actually likes it, it is called fan-boy rah rah shit. Why can't we just like the damn record. I seem to see way more "reasons" (backup) given for liking the songs in the positive reviews, than there are reasons given for negative reviews.

Because it is the habit of behavior of a few to trash what appeals to many for the effect of shock and unrest.

[S2M]

Why is that if someone gives Eclipse a positive review and actually likes it, it is called fan-boy rah rah shit. Why can't we just like the damn record. I seem to see way more "reasons" (backup) given for liking the songs in the positive reviews, than there are reasons given for negative reviews.

That's an easy one to answer....because a good majority of people like it JUST because it is Journey....if they had gone to a female singer, some people would have poo-pooed it right off the bat, and then you'd be saying the same thing about THOSE people....

It is as simple as this: I saw(heard) the trailer a month ago....didn't care to see the movie(I did anyway). We do this with movies all the time. Why can't we with music?

[Michigan Girl]

Why is that if someone gives Eclipse a positive review and actually likes it, it is called fan-boy rah rah shit. Why can't we just like the damn record. I seem to see way more "reasons" (backup) given for liking the songs in the positive reviews, than there are reasons given for negative reviews.

You are absolutely correct ...there is a very definite line between fan and
fanboy rah rah status ...I've pretty much figured the who's who and I ignore
the fanboy rah rah crap!! Same holds true for those who hate just to hate ...and that
doesn't mean the folks who dislike this lp. Once everyone has this figured for themselves, they will
know who they are interested in reading and who is a waste of time, for them!! ...
Some folks just won't accept criticism on any level ...problems stemming from childhood
I suppose, jealousy, envy, inability to please?!?! Some folks are never happy ...?!?!?



She's a Mystery ...best song on the lp ...this review is absurd!!!

BTW~Greg, Art, Eric ...very much enjoyed the exchange ...

[DrFU]

Dan-O, how are you going to reconcile the fact that you think this is a good album with the fact that the sales numbers are shit?

This isn't the 80's. Having putrid numbers in the 80's, and part of the nineties, virtually always meant your music was shit. That's just not the case these days. And we ain't done counting!

So ... by this logic, Songs from the Sparkle Lounge was good too?

[SF-Dano]

Why is that if someone gives Eclipse a positive review and actually likes it, it is called fan-boy rah rah shit. Why can't we just like the damn record. I seem to see way more "reasons" (backup) given for liking the songs in the positive reviews, than there are reasons given for negative reviews.

That's an easy one to answer....because a good majority of people like it JUST because it is Journey....if they had gone to a female singer, some people would have poo-pooed it right off the bat, and then you'd be saying the same thing about THOSE people....

It is as simple as this: I saw(heard) the trailer a month ago....didn't care to see the movie(I did anyway). We do this with movies all the time. Why can't we with music?

I really don't care if someone doesn't like the record. That is their choice. But to label anyone who does like the record as simply spewing fan boy rah rah shit is lame. It is just as lame for someone to dismiss a well stated negative opinion as loonism or trolling.

[Abitaman]

I find it hysterical (and a little disturbing, too) that there are people who have followed Journey hardcore throughout their lives and have discussed Eclipse for hours and hours but won't spend $8 on it.

On their facebook account people are talking about how bad the cd is. I have asked if the listened to it...typical answers have been
1) Steve Perry is not in the band so it sucks
2) I listened to the first song on two and didn't like it so didn't go any further (meaning #1)
3) I listened to the 30 sec clips and didn't like it, (see # 1). That is like watching a movie trailer and saying the movie sucks without seeing the whole thing.
I do not mind people not likeing the cd, if they have listened to the whole thing. Then you have a right to say it is good or bad.

Ever go to a movie based on a, supposed, awesome trailer....only to be disappointed? Works both ways. It amazes me that the rose-coloreds just won't see this logic.

I really don't see what rose colored glasseshave to do with seeing or hearing the whole thing or seeing or hearing part of it.
To be honest when I first listened to the clips for the cd, I was not looking forward to this cd. Whil 'm being honest the live clips of the songs on you tbe were not theat great. I almost didn't buy it. But I heard City Of Hope on the radio, and decided too. Glad I did.
But the trailer comment...I was saying you can't review amovie if you don't see the whole thing. Would be like someon from Rolling Stone magazine writing a review listening to the clips (sometimes I wonder if they use to listen to the same cd as me?). You can't right a m,ovie review by watching a trailer.
I thought Thor wa oing to be a dog..because of this I did not go see it until this weekend. I was wrong...it was good. But I would not go around saying the movie sucks. Might say it doesn't look good to me. big difference.
Green Lantern, I am looking forward to it, look great, I am going to see it first thingthis weekend. But I d not going around saying it is a great movie, because I have not seen it. it may suck...
As for Eclipse, I do not mind people saying it suck or it was great. Just make sure you listen to it first before you say it is something. If you don't like the clips say you don't like the clips, but to day the cd sucks? My bigget thing is Perryheads (and I am a huge Perry fan) saying the cd sucks and have not listened to the whole thing.
Same if you haven't listened to the cd, don't say it is the best thing in years.

[Greg]

Why is that if someone gives Eclipse a positive review and actually likes it, it is called fan-boy rah rah shit. Why can't we just like the damn record. I seem to see way more "reasons" (backup) given for liking the songs in the positive reviews, than there are reasons given for negative reviews.

Because that hasn't happened. The fan-boy rah rah shit comes when someone ignorantly starts accusing those who don't like the album of only listening to soundbytes of the album and giving their reviews based solely on those soundbytes. I'm sure that has happened, but there those of us who have listened to the album in its entirety, several times, and still didn't find the album to be worth a 100% score.

This is a freakin' Journey forum board folks. All fans, past and present, of all incarnations of this band should be welcomed to talk about any aspect of Journey. Whether if it's past, present, or future. I'm tired of the attitude that if you're not 100% on board with the present band, then you don't belong here. That's exactly how Backtalk was, and I know there are still decent members here who don't want to see this board turn into the same kool-aid drinking cult that backtalk was. I don't believe that is how Andrew intends for this board to be presented as.

[Eric]

Ever go to a movie based on a, supposed, awesome trailer....only to be disappointed? Works both ways. It amazes me that the rose-coloreds just won't see this logic.

Do you see the trailer, not like it, and then spend the rest of the year on IMDB's message boards talking about it, though?

[Don]

You guys are making my Friday work routine very enjoyable. Keep it going.

[S2M]

Ever go to a movie based on a, supposed, awesome trailer....only to be disappointed? Works both ways. It amazes me that the rose-coloreds just won't see this logic.

Do you see the trailer, not like it, and then spend the rest of the year on IMDB's message boards talking about it, though?

Which is different from LIKING it, and spending the rest of the year talking about it - how?

Point is, there is a little psychology thing going on here....people shy away from anything negative, while embracing things that are positive, and that's it....it doesn't matter WHAT is positive, or negative - just the fact that it IS....and that's what's going on.

Moral: You can talk all year about what's great about something you like, but aren't afforded the same courtesy if you do not like something.

[Eric]

Ever go to a movie based on a, supposed, awesome trailer....only to be disappointed? Works both ways. It amazes me that the rose-coloreds just won't see this logic.

Do you see the trailer, not like it, and then spend the rest of the year on IMDB's message boards talking about it, though?

Which is different from LIKING it, and spending the rest of the year talking about it - how?

Point is, there is a little psychology thing going on here....people shy away from anything negative, while embracing things that are positive, and that's it....it doesn't matter WHAT is positive, or negative - just the fact that it IS....and that's what's going on.

Moral: You can talk all year about what's great about something you like, but aren't afforded the same courtesy if you do not like something.

No, the issue isn't talking about something you don't like. Just about every review has mentioned something negative. I love the album and said that "City of Hope" was a piss-poor opener. The issue is people who haven't listened to the album spending a lot of time in review threads. I didn't understand why. Art told me why he pops in..I get it. I still think many aren't like Art and have an agenda, though.

[Onestepper]

Ever go to a movie based on a, supposed, awesome trailer....only to be disappointed? Works both ways. It amazes me that the rose-coloreds just won't see this logic.

Do you see the trailer, not like it, and then spend the rest of the year on IMDB's message boards talking about it, though?

Which is different from LIKING it, and spending the rest of the year talking about it - how?

Point is, there is a little psychology thing going on here....people shy away from anything negative, while embracing things that are positive, and that's it....it doesn't matter WHAT is positive, or negative - just the fact that it IS....and that's what's going on.

Moral: You can talk all year about what's great about something you like, but aren't afforded the same courtesy if you do not like something.

No, the issue isn't talking about something you don't like. Just about every review has mentioned something negative. I love the album and said that "City of Hope" was a piss-poor opener. The issue is people who haven't listened to the album spending a lot of time in review threads. I didn't understand why. Art told me why he pops in..I get it. I still think many aren't like Art and have an agenda, though.

Good points. I do think it strange that someone would spend much of their time constantly talking about something that they don't like. Never understood that about message boards in general. I think they just want to be heard. By ANYONE that will read their musings. I don't think it has much to do with the content or issue being discussed in general. More about them wanting to have a voice and to be noticed. I don't say this from a mean perspective. It appears to be rather cerebral in fact. Just something I've noticed.

No as far as S2M's claims that he (or anyone) is not allowed to have a dissenting voice, well yes and no. Obviously he can get on here and say anything he wants (and he does that very well). I've also seen him attacked for expressing an opinion that was not popular. But I don't go much for the victim approach though, so the cries of how this is unfair or that is unfair don't make me very sympathetic to his plight. I get his larger point. I just think it's poorly executed. The worse thing you can do to something or someone that you don't like is to ignore it. And if I really didn't like something, I'd do just that. But again, as I said above, some just need to be heard. It makes sense. Sort of.

[SF-Dano]

Why is that if someone gives Eclipse a positive review and actually likes it, it is called fan-boy rah rah shit. Why can't we just like the damn record. I seem to see way more "reasons" (backup) given for liking the songs in the positive reviews, than there are reasons given for negative reviews.

Because that hasn't happened. The fan-boy rah rah shit comes when someone ignorantly starts accusing those who don't like the album of only listening to soundbytes of the album and giving their reviews based solely on those soundbytes. I'm sure that has happened, but there those of us who have listened to the album in its entirety, several times, and still didn't find the album to be worth a 100% score.

This is a freakin' Journey forum board folks. All fans, past and present, of all incarnations of this band should be welcomed to talk about any aspect of Journey. Whether if it's past, present, or future. I'm tired of the attitude that if you're not 100% on board with the present band, then you don't belong here. That's exactly how Backtalk was, and I know there are still decent members here who don't want to see this board turn into the same kool-aid drinking cult that backtalk was. I don't believe that is how Andrew intends for this board to be presented as.

I really don't see this as the majority of posters here though. There are a few, but it seems as though now, if you just like the album you are lumped in with the rest. I personally don't understand why someone would want to continually (as in multiple times a day, everyday) come here and belittle, argue, rant, etc. about something they don't like and have relatively little interest in. I don't understand it, but as you say, in this forum they have every right. It just seems like people take this shit way t oo personally most of the time. Attacking or defending certain members or eras of the band as if part of their family. It is rock and roll music is all, not politics. Just sayin.........

[Don]

Once you realize that MR hosts not only one of the better known Journey forums on the net but one which also has the double distinction of being one of the best known anti-Journey forums out in cyber space, it will all make sense.

[The_Noble_Cause]

"Human Feel" is a great jam. The free-form interplay between Neal and the rest of the band toward the end reminds me of La Raza Del Sol on the Vegas dvd, with Jon and Neal trading off. I can listen to that and never get bored. Lyrics about dispassionate souless technology set to a tribal primitive drumbeat also makes for a very clever contrast. Def. not one of the album's best tunes, but no turkey either.