Freedom out now - thoughts

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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Journey/Survivor » Sun Jul 10, 2022 9:41 am

19td73 wrote:
Journey/Survivor wrote:For those of you who are listening to the album on YouTube, does YT also have the Japanese bonus track on it?

If so, how do any of you like it?

I ordered the CD through CD Japan so I will have the bonus track. I probably won't get my copy until early next week I would guess? :(


Cant find the bonus track on youtube yet. Let us know what you think when you get it. Heck I may order that version also. Cant find the cd around here to pick up. I want the physical copy for my collection. Been able to hear the whole thing from my youtube music trial that runs till August. Sounds good on my bose speaker music system in my truck. To each thier own I guess. Cheers buddy, hope you enjoy it!


Thanks for the response to my question!

I have a friend who orders from CD Japan on a regular basis, so I asked him to put in the order for me, and I'll pay him for the CD when I get my copy.

He decided to order himself five other CDs from several different bands and have them all shipped at the same time to his house. There is a delay on one of the CDs, so that's probably going to make it a few extra days before he gets the CDs. And then I'll have to drive over to his house to pick up my copy of Freedom.



It's cool to hear from a fellow North East Ohioan!
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby 19td73 » Sun Jul 10, 2022 9:30 pm

Journey/Survivor wrote:
19td73 wrote:
Journey/Survivor wrote:For those of you who are listening to the album on YouTube, does YT also have the Japanese bonus track on it?

If so, how do any of you like it?

I ordered the CD through CD Japan so I will have the bonus track. I probably won't get my copy until early next week I would guess? :(


Cant find the bonus track on youtube yet. Let us know what you think when you get it. Heck I may order that version also. Cant find the cd around here to pick up. I want the physical copy for my collection. Been able to hear the whole thing from my youtube music trial that runs till August. Sounds good on my bose speaker music system in my truck. To each thier own I guess. Cheers buddy, hope you enjoy it!


Thanks for the response to my question!

I have a friend who orders from CD Japan on a regular basis, so I asked him to put in the order for me, and I'll pay him for the CD when I get my copy.

He decided to order himself five other CDs from several different bands and have them all shipped at the same time to his house. There is a delay on one of the CDs, so that's probably going to make it a few extra days before he gets the CDs. And then I'll have to drive over to his house to pick up my copy of Freedom.



It's cool to hear from a fellow North East Ohioan!


No problem bro! Guard the land! :) lol. Take care
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby danielb » Mon Jul 11, 2022 3:16 am

From being more than underwhelmed with the album at first, I am now loving it.

It's diverse and very reminiscent of Arrival in places, in terms of melodies and atmosphere. An album that I also love. Contender for strongest track on the album is After Glow. Deen knows his Trial By Fire well and the second part where he goes "head to head" with Neal is just glorious. I am glad they stretch out on many of these songs and don't cut them short.

After Glow is then followed by the weakest track on the album, the bastard child that is Let it Rain. Tedious for the most part, but also slightly charming given it's off the wall nature. I don't mind it too much now from hating it at first.

Testament to the strength of the album is that 75 mins goes by fairly quickly. Once it's come to an end I am ready to play it again. There are many highligts here. I love the thick background vocals on United We Stand. Arnel's lead vocal on the same song. Neal's guitar solo in Don't Go - vintage Schon. His blues licks in the outro to The Way We Used To Be. So unmistakingly him and the kind of stuff that you don't really hear in other rock bands today. The list goes on. Beautiful as you Are is a dignified mini epic, which closes out the album in style.

What also strikes me is how these songs would actually stand up to the dirty dozen in concert. How about that? That's saying something. I really hope they take the chance to play a lot of the album live. It deserves it. Together We Run *needs* to open the show.

Stars of the show: Narada Michael Walden with his orchestral drumming (Don't Give Up On Us!), Arnel and Schon. Probably Cain too. Something tells me has quite a big hand in the songwriting and choice of vocal melodies. Many of these lines could have been sung by Augeri on Arrival. This is a compliment.

I think they have found the right team. Walden and Jackson in the studio, Deen live. But don't forget to utilize Deen's vocals in the studio should there be any additional albums.

This is the first Arnel release I am enjoying big time but maybe I should give the older ones a chance again now.

One last thing, the mix. I don't have anything bad to say about it anymore. It sounds great in my car. I love how it favours the drums, which actually sound like real drums (a rarity in productions these days). I have to mention Narada's performance on Don't Give Up On Us again. Beautiful As You Are... Which starts as a ballad but turns into a live jam with a mini drum solo to Won't Get Fooled Again power chords, before it becomes a ballad again and ends that way. And it all makes perfect sense. This is the range I am talking about :)
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby danielb » Mon Jul 11, 2022 3:32 am

I forgot to mention Still Believe In Love. A modern day Journey classic :)
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby brywool » Mon Jul 11, 2022 11:36 am

"Come Away With Me", "Let it Rain", "Holdin' On", and "Life Rolls On" FTW.
Arnel's vocals on the 1st 3 tracks listed- holy sh*t! He's killing it here. LRO sounds like a Departure outtake, thank goodness.

I have to say, when I first played the album, it felt 'too by the numbers' for me (other than those songs). However, after 3 listens, it's cemented itself and it's a cool album. it's very "reverb heavy" and lyrically cliche' album in spots- I wish it wasn't, but I still like it. I think Eclipse is the better album, but I still like this. As much as I like Neal's playing, I think he shoulda been reigned in a bit. "Beautiful As You Are" ... man, I WISH they'd left it short like, say "Good Morning, Girl". The rest of it, while cool doesn't make sense with the rest of the song.They shoulda just made the middle part a separate track, IMO. If it was shorter, with just the acoustic part and some of the reverb stripped away, I woulda loved it. I think Arnel shines on this album. One thing I am missing are the upper harmonies. I hear a lot of lower ones ala Boston's "Corporate America" (not a fan). I definitely miss the upper harmonies on a few songs. I'm a harmony guy, so....
NO. He's NOT Steve F'ing Perry. But he's Arnel F'ing Pineda and I'm okay with that.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby JourneyHard » Mon Jul 11, 2022 1:50 pm

I am loving the new CD. Freedom has the energy of Van Halen. I don't know how else to describe it. Revelations and Eclipse were great, but Freedom has an energy those two albums were missing. I think the credit has to go to Narada on drums. Ask Steve Perry or anybody in the business and they will tell you a great drummer can turn a good band into a great band, and a good drummer can make a great band into only a good band. Nothing against Deen, but the proof is on the CDs. Freedom is exciting from start to finish. Of course, it could be Narada's influence in the song-writing that helped the most. Maybe that is the real reason Freedom is so awesome.
If you don't like a song, just wait a minute and the next song is totally different style. I love all the songs. I was worried about 15 songs, but with this kind of diversity, you can have 15 songs and keep things exciting the whole time.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Journey/Survivor » Mon Jul 11, 2022 3:10 pm

I ordered Freedom from CD Japan so I will have the bonus track. I haven't received my copy yet, but a friend of mine who is a Journey fan, but nowhere nearly as big of a fan as I am, let me borrow his domestic copy that he bought.

So I have now finished listening to it one time through.

Here are my initial thoughts.......


My biggest complaint after one listen is the production.
Neal wanted it to sound like they are playing live in an arena, and they accomplished that.

The problem with that to me is that I want albums to sound like they were masterfully recorded in a studio by a great producer like a Ron Nevison or a Frank Filipetti.

This isn't intended as a criticism of Michael Walden or Bob Clearmountain. They were probably just doing what Neal asked them to do? But in terms of sound quality no band is going to sound as good live as on a well-produced album.

Obviously I love concerts, with Journey being as high on my list of bands to see live as any other band.But when I see Journey in concert, I'm going to hear them do live individual solos and extended jams that aren't on the albums. I'm not there to hear a big overly loud and echoey performance that is not very clear to hear. Those are the negatives about live concerts, poor sound quality. (Not to mention certain jackass people who may be around you at the show)

Journey did go for a live sound to a certain extent on their Departure album. But the results were much better that time.

With that said, even though I'm not thrilled with the production after only one listen, I don't think that it is as bad as what some people were saying it was when they were listening to the singles from the album on the internet. Please note, I know that some of you who were criticizing the mix after hearing the singles are now saying that you don't dislike it as much now that you're hearing the album. So I'm certainly not trying to knock any of you for your opinions!

Also, I may adjust to the mix better after I get to know the album better?


My number one favorite thing about Freedom after only one listen is that they took chances in the style of songs that they recorded for the album. They shook things up by writing and recording many songs that are unlike anything that was on past Journey albums. Yes, there are bits and pieces of songs that are similar to past Journey songs. Obviously the recycling of "Separate Ways" on" Don't Give Up On Us" as one example. But the songs are all still new and unique.

I love that they did songs like "Let It Rain" and "Holdin On" that are hard Rockers and way different than anything from past Journey albums.

I wish that they would have gone more guitar heavy on the album, though! Cain has nothing to complain about with this album in terms of it being too guitar dominant. It needs more cowbell, I mean guitar. :wink: But seriously, I wish it had more guitar!

I love the chorus on "You Got The Best Of Me." It stuck in my head after I saw them perform it live in Cleveland, and it was sticking in my head after I listened to it tonight.

There are a few comparisons that I will make from some of the songs on Freedom to past Journey songs, but like I said earlier, no one song seems like a complete recycling of any past Journey song, only bits and pieces of songs.

It's an album that I consider to be very good after one listen. And hopefully I will think that it's a great album after more listens.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Journey/Survivor » Mon Jul 11, 2022 3:36 pm

schonfan wrote:I think the entire album except TWWUTB is hot dog shit.


After one listen I'm definitely liking the album a lot better than you do. But I agree with you on TWWUTB being a great song.
I love the pulse of that song.

Based on a lot of the comments about the song when it was first released to the internet, I was expecting to be disappointed in it. But it's great.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Monker » Tue Jul 12, 2022 3:12 am

In past release we knew the weekly sales number. Does anybody have a way to show the weekly sales for Freedom?
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Journey/Survivor » Tue Jul 12, 2022 7:09 am

Here's a suggestion that I want to make....

My first time through the album I was listening to it at a fairly loud volume. Not blaring, but loud overall.

I went back and listened to the album all of the way through for the second time and listened to it at a very low volume. Not a whisper, but not much above a whisper. And I sat dead center in the middle of my 4 large stereo speakers. One speaker in front of me on my left, one speaker in front of me to my right, one speaker behind me on my left, one speaker behind me on my right.

If you do that at least one time through the album it will probably make it easier to clearly make out what Arnel is singing. And it will allow you to hear a lot of the stereo mix of the album.

Try it once.

You don't need to have 4 speakers to do it. But try to sit dead center between the two speakers if you don't use 4 speakers.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Loneman1 » Tue Jul 12, 2022 8:54 am

I'm on my third playthrough so far (only listened to it in my car as of right now), and the album is solid!! I was definitely one that was critical of the mix and production from the streaming singles, and while its still a sort of different listening experience, once my ears got used to the mix a bit more on the physical release, I'm really diggin' it!! The songs are solid, and while I haven't really gotten familiar with the song titles yet, its a great album to just throw on and drive. I have a feeling this is gonna get quite a bit of play over the next few months.

I have to admit I'm getting a little more excited about the band again, more than I thought I would after all the behind the scenes stuff and revolving door of bass players. I do hope someday we might see Randy Jackson out there playing shows, but thats probably a pipe dream now. Not to take anything away from Narada, but I'm so glad Deeno is back.......that dude is the best kept secret in music, and I'm glad he's finally looking like he's getting more much deserved attention!!
Rock on,
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Monker » Tue Jul 12, 2022 12:05 pm

For those who wanted the import version. It is on Amazon, just way expensive:
https://www.amazon.com/Revelation-Journ ... 116&sr=8-1
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Journey/Survivor » Tue Jul 12, 2022 12:14 pm

Monker wrote:For those who wanted the import version. It is on Amazon, just way expensive:
https://www.amazon.com/Revelation-Journ ... 116&sr=8-1


For any of you who might be Amazon Prime members, July 12th and 13th are Amazon Prime day (Days) and the import of Freedom might be a little cheaper on those days?
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby jrnyman28 » Tue Jul 12, 2022 1:15 pm

Monker wrote:In past release we knew the weekly sales number. Does anybody have a way to show the weekly sales for Freedom?


With Journey releasing the entire album to YouTube no one is worried about sales numbers…
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby jestor92 » Tue Jul 12, 2022 2:11 pm

I’ve only heard the album once. A few thoughts.

1. Who mixed the album? Throughout the entire thing various instruments sounded like they were buried in the mix with the exception of the drums.
2. Narada did a very good job on the drums.
3. Only the song with Castronovo caught my attention on the first listen. The rest of the album didn’t hook me in or make me want to hear it again. Conversely my wife bought Gavin DeGraw’s latest and I liked and I kind of want to hear it again and that surprised me.
4. I like that they didn’t have Arnel trying to sound like Perry as much on the album. He sounded more like he was singing in a comfortable range and sounded a lot better than he did on Eclipse and Revelation.
5. Why did they bury Randy Jackson in the mix so much? He was inaudible on some tracks.
6. How much was Cain involved in the recording? I don’t recall all that many keyboard parts.
7. Wonder why they recycled a Soul SirkUS riff for the album.

Finally the album on my initial listen I want to say sounds like a Neal Schon solo album, but some songs off So U like Serenity and Love Finds A Way are so much better than Freedom. It sounds like a bunch of throw away tracks from a Neal Schon led Journey album.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Monker » Wed Jul 13, 2022 1:13 am

jrnyman28 wrote:
Monker wrote:In past release we knew the weekly sales number. Does anybody have a way to show the weekly sales for Freedom?


With Journey releasing the entire album to YouTube no one is worried about sales numbers…


Frontiers and BMG care. If the band doesn't care about selling the CD, then why even release it? Just sell it as a digital download. They care.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Journey/Survivor » Wed Jul 13, 2022 1:57 pm

Monker wrote:
jrnyman28 wrote:
Monker wrote:In past release we knew the weekly sales number. Does anybody have a way to show the weekly sales for Freedom?


With Journey releasing the entire album to YouTube no one is worried about sales numbers…


Frontiers and BMG care. If the band doesn't care about selling the CD, then why even release it? Just sell it as a digital download. They care.


I'm definitely glad that they did release it on CD, and I'm sure that a lot of other Journey fans are happy that they did as well.

So many of us own the whole Journey catalog on CD and want to continue on with all new and future Journey album releases.

Plus, It can be a pain in the ass to someone like me to have to ask friends to download stuff for me all of the time.

I agree with you though that BMG and Frontiers certainly care if Neal/Journey post the album online for free.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby JourneyHard » Thu Jul 14, 2022 1:10 pm

Together We Run reminds me of Damn Yankees with the woah woah woah part. Did Jack Blades help write that song?

I have the whole album playing in my head as the first album earworm I have ever had in my life. Is this a good sign that all the songs on the album are catchy?

Journey should record a concert where they do only Journey songs from the Arnel era and release it next year with the bonus track they released in Japan. I can wait a year to hear the bonus track.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Gideon » Fri Jul 15, 2022 1:41 am

Together We Run - unconventional album opener, but for some reason it conjures impressions of Billy Joel or Bruce Springsteen with its piano intro, references to running and New York dreamers and regressively small towns. I generally like it when Journey spreads its wings. B+

Don't Give Up On Us - this one didn't do much for me at first. I loved the SW-style opening and modern synths (I wish ECL1P53 had had more synths at the forefront). But the song reminds me too much of SW, MoL, and more closely, the relatively mediocre Where Did I Lose Your Love. But the chorus is catchy and I appreciate the high harmonies, which are relatively sparse here. C+

Still Believe In Love - reminds me of Kiss Me Softly after a Faith in the Heartland style synth wave. AP sounds great but there are times when the post-production effects are a bit too strong on his voice. This ballad's more sensual and R&B-influenced than the standard Journey fare, which is nice. A-

You Got the Best of Me - still my favorite of the singles. Erratically mixed, unfortunately. But I like the tempo, the synths, the chugging rhythm guitar, AP's Bryan Adams style vocals and affectations. A+

Live to Love Again - this ballad starts out as a fine but creatively disappointing boilerplate Journey ballad... but gets much better starting with the solo. AP sounds great, nice hook, and a truly stellar guitar solo from Neal which is arguably his best on the album. B+

The Way We Used to Be - was very surprised by this single when it launched. I loved the punchy synths, chugging rhythm guitar, a stomper chorus. I don't listen to it much now because I wore it the fuck out last year, but that's no reflection on the song's quality. B+

Come Away With Me - sounds like a cut from Neal's SO U album. I like the energy, rhythm, and AP's performance but, once again, his vocals are overprocessed in post-production. B-

After Glow - stellar vocals by Deen, deviates from the standard Journey ballad formula, moody, great tempo changes as the song progresses. A-

Let It Rain - yuck. I like the synths, that's it. The guitar riff blows. Reminds me too much of an inferior Rockin' Horse from Bad English. F

Holdin' On - another song that sounds like a cut from Neal's So U album. Very similar to Come Away With Me in energy, rhythm, and overprocessed AP vocals. But the chorus sounds more like Journey, with piano tinkling and relatively high harmonies. B+

All Day and All Night - love the funky bass line from Randy. That's the strut Neal mentioned but has proven to be so relatively elusive on this album. Great vocals from AP, high harmonies, great rhythm and energy. A+

Don't Go - cheesy, but I love the synths, AP's vocals, the chorus, chugging rhythm guitar from Neal, and the fast tempo. A+

United We Stand - reminds me too much of Don't Give Up On Us. The album only needed one of them. C-

Life Rolls On - superb track. Reminds me of Boston. The hammond organ, high vocals and harmonies, great rhythm guitar. A+

Beautiful As You Are - a cool 7 minute music suite. Sometimes overwrought, but not bad at all. B+
'Nothing was bigger for Journey than 1981’s “Escape” album. “I have to attribute that to Jonathan coming in and joining the writing team,” Steve Perry (Feb 2012).'
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Eric » Fri Jul 15, 2022 5:31 am

This is an ambitious, diverse dive into this new era of Journey. They keep one foot in what they are and another in new territory and it works very well. It’s been far too long since we got new music from them and this was worth the wait. Still…. I’m ready for a quicker follow-up. I hope Narda continues to be part of the band.

1. Together we run – Terrific album opener and at the time of this writing my favorite track on the album. It’s like “Only the Young” meets Damn Yankees. It’s really the perfect example to show someone the “New Journey”. This would have been my choice for a single. The re-listen value is very high with this and it could really work well in TV/movies. Everyone sounds really great on this – terrific harmonies. It’s knocking around in my head all day.

2. Don’t give up on us – The Separate Ways feel is only a small part of this. Its very catchy and well done. It doesn’t possess the re-listen value of the opener, but it works very well in the #2 slot. Arnel and Narda seem to work well on this together. Neal’s best work is at the end where so don’t skip out at the end!

3. Still believe in love – Hauntingly catchy. Different… yet has a “Kiss me Softly” vibe. Arnel even has some Augeri going. I’d get this out there hard around Valentines Day. It’s like the best of Cain’s and Schon’s solo work is brought into Journey - and then elevated. It’s really quite beautiful. More great harmonies.

4. You got the best of me – My favorite of the singles and really kicked ass live when I saw them in the Spring. It’s a classic Journey tune and works in their live set. It’s cousin is “Change for the Better”, which might be my favorite Arnel track. I DO keep wanting to sing You want it, You need it, You got the best of me.

5. Live to love again – A more mature Journey ballad with a great Schon solo. Cain’s standout on the record. Other than “Kiss me Softly” this is better than any of the bubblegummers on Arrival (although Schon always tried to make them respectable). I don’t see a place for this live but it certainly works on this album. It WOULD work with an orchestra and they have that opportunity coming up, though. It’s cousin is “Send her my Love”.

6. The way we used to be - Almost feels old now! This really captured the pandemic vibe in the summer of 2020, which is when it was written I believe? Schon’s guitar mimics the desperate and lonely feel of the era. The beginning is classic Journey. It has a different groove and like most Journey songs sounds better live. I really enjoyed the video, too.

7. Come away with me – Maybe a first listen might have you thinking Schon solo – but it grows as a Journey song. And it could be cool sneak into “an evening with” show. The abrupt ending works here.

8. After glow – A beautiful tune with Deen-O on lead vocals. Has a TBF feel. I dare a Perry fan to not like this.

9. Let it rain – An odd choice for a single and while not one of my favorites – it’s a really cool album track. On its own its maybe its not going to end up on a GH, but it’s another piece of this diverse collection of songs called the Freedom Album.

10. Holdin’ on – Really marries well with the prior track. Unlike Let it Rain, however, I’m humming this after it stops.

11. All day all night – When we talk about a new strut THIS IS IT! Arnel really is a chameleon on this track; perhaps his finest vocal work? Its cool as shit. And I need this live. This rocks out but is still total Journey. This is the sound and rounds out a trio of experimental tracks.

12. Don’t Go – Arnel’s lone writing credit. This is a fun summer track. It’s nice placement between experimenting and the ending. Distant cousin of “Be Good to Yourself”! Another where the harmony is strong. Schon’s work at the end is very strong and a little surprising initially considering the lightness of the track.

13. United we stand – Very Journey-esque and was a good choice for a 4th of July release. I don’t love it as it doesn’t grow as much as I want (or think I want). I think I want a little more urgency. Neal’s solo is the highlight.

14. Life Rolls on – Faith in the Heartland, She’s a Mystery and the Departure album had a baby and named it Life Rolls on. Another Arnel standout. I’m loving the sweet feel.

15. Beautiful as you are – I’d love to hear the long(er) version Schon has referenced. Its an epic song. It demands to be listened to in its entirety. I have this song stuck in my head. It’s an absolute showcase of all things Schon and Narda. I want this live, too.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby JourneyHard » Fri Jul 15, 2022 9:42 am

I am loving the new album Freedom. I wonder if Neal Schon was thinking after he completed the album with Santana in 2016, (wow! It has been six years!) why can't we have a Journey album like this? Well, they have one now with Freedom!!! It is so cool from start to finish and changes styles and grooves so often. You will never get bored with this album.

If Jonathan wants to, he could release a piano-instrumental with all these new songs. I am NOT saying to do it, but if he wanted, he could do it. I can picture in my mind piano versions of all these songs. Or maybe in the next tour in 2023 if Journey doesn't have time to play any of these songs in their entirety, Jon can do a Freedom medley on piano to give fans a little taste of all these songs.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Monker » Sat Jul 16, 2022 2:32 am

Journey/Survivor wrote:
Monker wrote:For those who wanted the import version. It is on Amazon, just way expensive:
https://www.amazon.com/Revelation-Journ ... 116&sr=8-1


For any of you who might be Amazon Prime members, July 12th and 13th are Amazon Prime day (Days) and the import of Freedom might be a little cheaper on those days?


The US version was down to $12 on Amazon...pretty cheap. The vinyl was cut, too.
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=journey+free ... _sb_noss_1
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Monker » Sat Jul 16, 2022 5:47 pm

[quote="JourneyHard"]Together We Run reminds me of Damn Yankees with the woah woah woah part. Did Jack Blades help write that song? [/quote[

Uh, no, he didn't.

Also, nothing on here sounds like DY to me. DY had attitude, and I think that may be what I am missing on these songs...attitude. Neal also said Narada was going to bring groove, or funk, or whatever...other than the Hawaiian noises and him banging on his bongos, or whatever, on that one song intro, I don't think he brought anything unique that Steve Smith or Deen couldn't bring. He is good....but it didn't live up to the hype that was posted here.

DY had attitude to spare, and they brought a lot of groove. "Come Again", which I assume is the song where you pick up on the "Whoah, oh, whoah" has always seemed like a Tommy song to me, not Jack.

Regardless, DY and Journey are from two different worlds, it seems to me. I spose Neal/Ted are at the same level...but Journey doesn't have a second guitarist like Tommy...who keeps up with Ted, and on songs like "Come Again", sounds better than Ted, IMO. Journey also does not have two vocalists that harmonize nearly as well as Tommy and Jack. They are so good that Alpha Dog Ted Nugent put himself in the background vocally.

I was expecting groove like this from Journey...and just for something DY that many may not have heard:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BJLVq2 ... droPaulino
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby JourneyHard » Sun Jul 17, 2022 4:37 am

Narada and Jackson were on the album, but didn't tour. Freedom has set the precedent for Journey to have a recording band and a touring band. Perry has no excuse now. Perry can record his parts from his own home studio, and he doesn't have to tour. So, the only reason Perry won't be on a future Journey album is Perry doesn't want to do it. There is no other excuse in this day and age. It is so damn easy. Perry just hops out of bed and records his part and hops back in bed. There's nothing easier in the world. And then he stays home and collects money as Journey tours. It is no brainer.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby leftovertu » Sun Jul 17, 2022 9:32 am

Perry hasn’t been in Journey for a quarter of a century because he doesn’t want to be. He doesn’t spend his days going “gosh, I wish these guys didn’t want to tour so I could rejoin the band.” He’s been done with Journey, (Neal and Jon) for decades, since they told him they were going to go on the road without him.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Monker » Mon Jul 18, 2022 1:04 pm

Ok, I'll give my review, since I know everybody is waiting for it. Well, maybe not, but I'll give it anyway since I heard the CD.

First, I don't think the CD vs YouTube makes that much difference. The over all sound is better, clearer, sharper. But, it doesn't really change the issues with the mix. There are some songs where the bass and drums are so loud in the mix that they are very near "booming" and they roll over Arnel's vocals. Most of the songs have "background" vocals louder than Arnel's LEAD vocal...which is annoying. Some songs are hard to hear Arnel's vocals well enough to really understand the lyrics, which is also annoying.

So, song by song:
Together We Run: Good intro with the piano and Arnel's vocal. Then the chorus hits and the chorus is impossible to really understand. The high "run, run, run" doesn't work well for me. The rest of the song is sorta rinse and repeat. It's a pretty good song, except the chorus being messed up. Neal sounds good.

Don't Give Up On Us: Already commented a lot on this. The Separate Ways intro just feels out of place. The bass/drums are too loud and almost booming. The guitar solo is pretty generic. The end with Arnel doing his adlib high notes over the guitar doesn't sound good. It drags on too long, too...it should be at least 30sec shorter. It's a good song that suffers from bad mix and production.

Still Believe In Love: A pretty boring ballad. I think I can hear Arnel being tuned, but not often. Good Neal solo. This almost sounds like a Neal solo where they slammed lyrics on top of it. I would rather have heard it as a Neal instrumental...the lyrics and vocals are extremely boring for me.

You Got the Best of Me : Already talked about this. Bass/drums are to loud and almost booming. Background vocals are in front of Arnel's lead during the chorus making it hard to understand Arnel. Again, it's a good song but misses the mark due to the mix/production.

Learn to Love Again: A ballad...Jon keyboard intro, Arnel's vocal sounds good. This is the first Journey song I can honestly say sounds like an Air Supply song. Not sure how I feel about that, but it's true. It's an OK ballad and they did a lot of things right here...not over complicating things, the bass/drums are not too loud, Arnel sounds good, Neal restrains and has a good solo but doesn't dominate things. There's a lot of room for everybody to have some space. The only other complaint is that it is about 1min too long.

The Way We Used To Be: Meh, not this song again :) It's OK, a "good enough" song. Bad timing for the single release. It fits in well with the album and the other songs. I just don't hear it as something being above average or special in any way.

Come Away With Me: Meh. I can see where they were going. The album needed a rock song at this point. But, this reminds me of the Babys, TBH. They should have tried again with something else and put this on the back burner. In the end, it's just a song for Neal to rock on.

After Glow: Meh. The background vocals overwhelm the lead vocals again. Booming bass. This song suffers so much from the mix that it is very hard to listen to.

Let It Rain: One of the worst songs Journey has ever released.

Holdin' On: Worst song Journey has ever released. Journey trying to be Led Zepplin, and Arnel trying to sound like Robert Plant. It is horrible, and the mix makes it even worse. My God, give me "Homemade Love" or "Back Talk" instead of this. If I wanted this, I'd listen to Greta Van Fleet, not Journey.

All Day and All Night: A better rocker, but still suffering from booming bass overwhelming Arnel's vocal...which is too bad because he does some unique singing. The background vocals sound like crap here, too...and louder than the "lead" vocal. This is probably the rocker they needed....but the mix destroys it.

Don't Go: Background vocals too loud from the start. Bass and drums too loud. It's an OK song otherwise.

United We Stand: Booming bass...background and lead vocals seems about the same volume, better. Generic guitar by Neal. Arnel sounds better than I remember when I first heard this song.

Life Rolls On: I hate the intro to this song. The bongos, or whatever percussion that is, is fucking annoying and unnecessary...they should have been dropped. Arnel sounds great in the intro though. When Neal kicks in, the song is much better. It should have started that way instead of all of the Hawaiian noises. Other than that, this could be the best song on the album.

Beutiful As You Are: I suppose this is the epic ballad...starts out like an Air Supply song. Then it picks up into a Journey song after that first verse...Unfortunately, it suffers from the mix/production with the booming bass/drums affect the vocals and making it hard to listen to. The background vocals are too loud again...I get tired of it and give up even trying to understand what Arnel is singing. I could do without the showcasing towards the end, too.

Over all, I like this album better than Eclipse and Revalation. I said this before, this should have been the follow up to Revelation. If they could have sat down in the studio recording together and had a real producer, Freedom could have been an epic album. As it is, it gets in its own way far too often. Overall, I'd give it 7.5/10...if production were better, I'd give it 8.5/10, at least.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Andrew » Mon Jul 18, 2022 3:20 pm

Monker wrote:Overall, I'd give it 7.5/10...if production were better, I'd give it 8.5/10, at least.


Your review reads more like a 2/10!
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Journey/Survivor » Mon Jul 18, 2022 3:36 pm

Monker wrote:Ok, I'll give my review, since I know everybody is waiting for it. Well, maybe not, but I'll give it anyway since I heard the CD.

First, I don't think the CD vs YouTube makes that much difference. The over all sound is better, clearer, sharper. But, it doesn't really change the issues with the mix. There are some songs where the bass and drums are so loud in the mix that they are very near "booming" and they roll over Arnel's vocals. Most of the songs have "background" vocals louder than Arnel's LEAD vocal...which is annoying. Some songs are hard to hear Arnel's vocals well enough to really understand the lyrics, which is also annoying.

So, song by song:
Together We Run: Good intro with the piano and Arnel's vocal. Then the chorus hits and the chorus is impossible to really understand. The high "run, run, run" doesn't work well for me. The rest of the song is sorta rinse and repeat. It's a pretty good song, except the chorus being messed up. Neal sounds good.

Don't Give Up On Us: Already commented a lot on this. The Separate Ways intro just feels out of place. The bass/drums are too loud and almost booming. The guitar solo is pretty generic. The end with Arnel doing his adlib high notes over the guitar doesn't sound good. It drags on too long, too...it should be at least 30sec shorter. It's a good song that suffers from bad mix and production.

Still Believe In Love: A pretty boring ballad. I think I can hear Arnel being tuned, but not often. Good Neal solo. This almost sounds like a Neal solo where they slammed lyrics on top of it. I would rather have heard it as a Neal instrumental...the lyrics and vocals are extremely boring for me.

You Got the Best of Me : Already talked about this. Bass/drums are to loud and almost booming. Background vocals are in front of Arnel's lead during the chorus making it hard to understand Arnel. Again, it's a good song but misses the mark due to the mix/production.

Learn to Love Again: A ballad...Jon keyboard intro, Arnel's vocal sounds good. This is the first Journey song I can honestly say sounds like an Air Supply song. Not sure how I feel about that, but it's true. It's an OK ballad and they did a lot of things right here...not over complicating things, the bass/drums are not too loud, Arnel sounds good, Neal restrains and has a good solo but doesn't dominate things. There's a lot of room for everybody to have some space. The only other complaint is that it is about 1min too long.

The Way We Used To Be: Meh, not this song again :) It's OK, a "good enough" song. Bad timing for the single release. It fits in well with the album and the other songs. I just don't hear it as something being above average or special in any way.

Come Away With Me: Meh. I can see where they were going. The album needed a rock song at this point. But, this reminds me of the Babys, TBH. They should have tried again with something else and put this on the back burner. In the end, it's just a song for Neal to rock on.

After Glow: Meh. The background vocals overwhelm the lead vocals again. Booming bass. This song suffers so much from the mix that it is very hard to listen to.

Let It Rain: One of the worst songs Journey has ever released.

Holdin' On: Worst song Journey has ever released. Journey trying to be Led Zepplin, and Arnel trying to sound like Robert Plant. It is horrible, and the mix makes it even worse. My God, give me "Homemade Love" or "Back Talk" instead of this. If I wanted this, I'd listen to Greta Van Fleet, not Journey.

All Day and All Night: A better rocker, but still suffering from booming bass overwhelming Arnel's vocal...which is too bad because he does some unique singing. The background vocals sound like crap here, too...and louder than the "lead" vocal. This is probably the rocker they needed....but the mix destroys it.

Don't Go: Background vocals too loud from the start. Bass and drums too loud. It's an OK song otherwise.

United We Stand: Booming bass...background and lead vocals seems about the same volume, better. Generic guitar by Neal. Arnel sounds better than I remember when I first heard this song.

Life Rolls On: I hate the intro to this song. The bongos, or whatever percussion that is, is fucking annoying and unnecessary...they should have been dropped. Arnel sounds great in the intro though. When Neal kicks in, the song is much better. It should have started that way instead of all of the Hawaiian noises. Other than that, this could be the best song on the album.

Beutiful As You Are: I suppose this is the epic ballad...starts out like an Air Supply song. Then it picks up into a Journey song after that first verse...Unfortunately, it suffers from the mix/production with the booming bass/drums affect the vocals and making it hard to listen to. The background vocals are too loud again...I get tired of it and give up even trying to understand what Arnel is singing. I could do without the showcasing towards the end, too.

Over all, I like this album better than Eclipse and Revalation. I said this before, this should have been the follow up to Revelation. If they could have sat down in the studio recording together and had a real producer, Freedom could have been an epic album. As it is, it gets in its own way far too often. Overall, I'd give it 7.5/10...if production were better, I'd give it 8.5/10, at least.


I definitely do agree with you on some of your criticisms of the production. Although, I'm not as bothered by it as you are in general.

I haven't seen anyone mention this. Every time I listen to the album in exact order, which is most of the time, but not always, it seems to me like "Don't Give Up On Us" is way quieter than the other songs on the album from a production standpoint.
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Gideon » Tue Jul 19, 2022 12:56 am

Andrew wrote:
Monker wrote:Overall, I'd give it 7.5/10...if production were better, I'd give it 8.5/10, at least.


Your review reads more like a 2/10!


The 2 is generous lmao. If this is a review for a high C/low B album, imagine how Monker would review an F album. :lol: :lol: :lol:
'Nothing was bigger for Journey than 1981’s “Escape” album. “I have to attribute that to Jonathan coming in and joining the writing team,” Steve Perry (Feb 2012).'
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Re: Freedom out now - thoughts

Postby Monker » Tue Jul 19, 2022 1:45 am

Gideon wrote:
Andrew wrote:
Monker wrote:Overall, I'd give it 7.5/10...if production were better, I'd give it 8.5/10, at least.


Your review reads more like a 2/10!


The 2 is generous lmao. If this is a review for a high C/low B album, imagine how Monker would review an F album. :lol: :lol: :lol:


Yeah, I know. A lot of it is repeating the same critique over and over again...and a couple of those songs I simply do not like at all. BUT, if they could have fixed the production and maybe even removed a few songs, then it could be an outstanding album. Maybe make it 12 songs. On those other songs, the songwriting is pretty good...and it SOUNDS like Journey, unlike Eclipse. It is also not a complete throwback sound, like Revelation, either. So, yeah, a C is where I put it as is...definitely not a low b. If things were as they should be sound wise, yeah, a B or even B+.

I think this is what you get when you let Neal and Jonathan completely have their way. They need somebody to tell them 'no', this isn't a good idea, this song is too long - cut some of the repetition...and they all should have used the same studio to record so it would be easier to mix and get a good sound. So, it's all a bunch critique that isn't so much about the songwriting but about getting the best song and sound possible...they completely missed the mark on those things.
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