Journey Through Time Release

[Eric]

1). That was after the Lollapoolaza show regarding Marco.

Wrong.
Neal said he realized Marco wasn't a good fit while mixing the IHeartShow.
But let's pretend you're correct, we are expected to believe that Marco's playing suddenly changed from JTT to Lollapalooza? Makes ZERO sense.
And even if it did, was it necessary to publicly diss the guy's playing? Low class.

Okay... so, the iHeart show from 2018? Still has nothing to do with JTT. And Schon never dissed his playing; he said he was a great player. He just said it wasn't a fit and when he told Marco that he didn't get a reaction. Don't you think a JTT show and a Journey show are two completely different beasts? I have to imagine their is a lot more room in JTT than in Journey to be creative, etc.?

Based on your posts, you would enthusiastically support a "Journey" lineup of Neal, Teddy Swims, and Lady M on maracas.

As opposed to you who lurks and is ready to pounce anytime someone is enjoying the music and ignoring the drama, which they have no control over? To answer your question I wouldn't support THAT but I do support a lineup that has DeenO over Smith on account DeenO is a much better fit for Journey and is their longest tenured and most recognizable drummer. As I've said - I'm not musically knowledgeable enough to hear any difference from one bass player to another AND I agree it would be best if Valory as an original member were in the fold, but I also don't miss him and I don't think hardly anyone going to see them (in droves by the way) is aware he's gone.

Again, the whole JTT tour was a shot across the bow by Neal to Journey Official / Nightmare to see what he could get away with. When they (rightfully) tried to reign him in, he fired the rhythm section. Now he's after the keyboardist and sometimes Arnel. Anyone who supports this mess has no shame.

From the other POV, why would anyone care if an original member who the band was created around wanted to stretch out and play old songs the current band won't play? Can't you make an argument that might have appeased him? There are many things I've read about Schon that concern me regarding his behavior but this is at the very bottom. Being against JTT sure as hell didn't help anything either - I would have ignored it.

[George_g888]

This seems like a bizarre thing to release given all the legal issues and the madness that has occurred since.

[Monker]

3). Some of us give none shits about Smith and Valory.

After the Bill Graham tribute concert, Neal said he didn't want their performance to be billed as "Journey". He said it was true that the last people saw them, it was just the three of them (Perry, Cain, Schon during ROR). But, Journey was always Steve Perry, Jonathan Cain, AND Ross Valory, AND Steve Smith.

That is how Neal used to think. Now all Journey is is himself. Quite a huge change and one I'll never support.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Okay... so, the iHeart show from 2018? Still has nothing to do with JTT.

LOL.

It was a lot the same songs - including DSB, SW, AWYWI, Lights, Still They Ride, Faithfully, WIS.
Can Marco play the dirty dozen or not?

He's hand-chosen to play the material for JTT and then suddenly he's axed because he can't play it properly?

Makes zero sense - and I wouldn't be surprised if Neal's story is a complete lie.

And Schon never dissed his playing; he said he was a great player. He just said it wasn't a fit and when he told Marco that he didn't get a reaction.

Riiiiight.

If Paul Rodgers or Waite or Hagar told Rolling Stone that they let Schon go because "it wasn't gelling" and "it wasn't feeling right", what would you say?
It's a diss.

As opposed to you who lurks and is ready to pounce anytime someone is enjoying the music and ignoring the drama, which they have no control over?

The comments in this thread speak for itself. Apparently a lot of "lurkers" and "pouncers."

Keep waving those pom-poms.

[Journey/Survivor]

YUSSSSS!

https://twitter.com/frontiersmusic1/sta ... _62qvrTpfw

Great news!

Not sure what we are celebrating here....

Marco's playing was later criticized by Neal and led to his dismissal from official Journey. Why would I buy a DVD with a bassist who allegedly sucks (according to Neal)? This spin-off band also resulted in the firing of Ross & Smith, after they sided with the rest of the Nightmare board - including Perry and Herbie - to stop Neal from trademarking JTT merchandise. I see this and I just see a very dark troubled chapter of the band.

Schon didn't say that Mendoza sucks as a bass player. He said that Mendoza was overplaying or adding in extra bass to the Journey songs when playing live. Schon then told Mendoza to stop doing that, and Mendoza's response was that he'd think about it. So at that point Schon figured that if Mendoza was taking the attitude that he would only give it some thought, and not that he would just stop doing it from that point on, that then he (Mendoza) had to go.
Completely understandable from Schon's point of view.

Mendoza is a skilled bassist, he just was overplaying live similar to how Dunbar was doing on the Infinity tour.

I love Smith's drumming. He's my all time favorite drummer. And it sucks that he's not still in the band. But if there's any truth to the claim that Smith didn't want to record a new album, then Smith had to go too?!?!

I like Valory's bass playing, and wish that he was still in the band. But again, if there's any truth to some of the claims about him voting to not record a new album, or to keep Rolie out of the Hall Of Fame performance, or to try to keep Rolie from touring with Journey, then screw Valory, he would deserve to be fired at that point?!?!

[Journey/Survivor]

1). That was after the Lollapoolaza show regarding Marco.

Wrong.

Neal said he realized Marco wasn't a good fit while mixing the IHeartShow.
But let's pretend you're correct, we are expected to believe that Marco's playing suddenly changed from JTT to Lollapalooza? Makes ZERO sense.

And even if it did, was it necessary to publicly diss the guy's playing? Low class.

2). The show sounds great and we get to hear a unique setlist sung by DeenO and Rolie.

Trial By Fire sounds great too. Doesn't mean I celebrate it or promote it. In fact, many fans on here would point out how it was an attempt by Perry to kill the Chalfant lineup in its tracks and to further stall/kill the band with the "hip excuse." Shady bullshit like that gets called out - not celebrated.

3). Some of us give none shits about Smith and Valory.

Based on your posts, you would enthusiastically support a "Journey" lineup of Neal, Teddy Swims, and Lady M on maracas.

4). The drama off stage doesn’t impact the performance on stage.

Again, the whole JTT tour was a shot across the bow by Neal to Journey Official / Nightmare to see what he could get away with. When they (rightfully) tried to reign him in, he fired the rhythm section. Now he's after the keyboardist and sometimes Arnel. Anyone who supports this mess has no shame.

I too am disgusted by the whole soap opera crap that's going on with Journey right now. I'm sick of all of the drama, whether it's legit or just publicity crap. Schon needs to focus on music and not all of that other garbage. And Schon needs to lay off of Pineda. Pineda doesn't deserve any of the BS that Schon is spouting off about him lately!

However, I have every reason to believe that the reason that Schon did the Journey Through Time thing is because he wanted to be able to perform a lot of the material from the first 3 Journey albums. That wasn't going to happen with Cain or Azoff making the decisions. For that matter Journey weren't going to be performing very much material from the Infinity through Departure era either with Cain and Azoff running things. It's completely understandable that Schon would be sick of playing virtually nothing but the dirty dozen night after night year after year. But Cain and Azoff just couldn't bare the thought of mixing up the set list to throw in any of the Progressive era tracks, or to allow the band to play much along the lines of new songs.
And Cain kept more or less refusing to work on any new songs for an album. Cain's only in it for the money anymore. Schon's the one who still has musical integrity at this point and doesn't want Journey to just be a live Juke Box band.

Also, again, Schon wasn't "dissing" Mendoza in a low class way. Schon was explaining why Mendoza was no longer in the band. Because he (Mendoza) was taking it upon himself to throw in extra parts that shouldn't be there in the songs.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Schon didn't say that Mendoza sucks as a bass player. He said that Mendoza was overplaying or adding in extra bass to the Journey songs when playing live. Schon then told Mendoza to stop doing that, and Mendoza's response was that he'd think about it. So at that point Schon figured that if Mendoza was taking the attitude that he would only give it some thought, and not that he would just stop doing it from that point on, that then he (Mendoza) had to go.
Completely understandable from Schon's point of view.

The only thing worse than getting fired is having your boss run to the media about why you were fired and saying you couldn't cut it. You can attempt to fansplain it to me any way you want. That what's happened and it was shitty.

Here's a guy that played with Neal and Deen on Sirkus, So U, JTT, and then - suddenly - we're told he didn't have "the right chemistry, to fit with Deen. " Huh?

Made no sense then and still doesn't. Like so much of Journey, I think there's more to the story than we're being told.

I love Smith's drumming. He's my all time favorite drummer. And it sucks that he's not still in the band. But if there's any truth to the claim that Smith didn't want to record a new album, then Smith had to go too?!?!

Firstly, that claim only comes from Neal, who lies about mostly everything.
Secondly, they could have recorded without Smitty. That's basically what ended up happening any way. They recorded with Walden but toured with Deen.

I like Valory's bass playing, and wish that he was still in the band. But again, if there's any truth to some of the claims about him voting to not record a new album, or to keep Rolie out of the Hall Of Fame performance, or to try to keep Rolie from touring with Journey, then screw Valory, he would deserve to be fired at that point?!?!

Let me know when you have sources for these claims outside of the NSTNN (Neal Schon Twitter News Network). Otherwise, they are basically worthless.

[JourneyHard]

Neal isn't allowed to tell anybody he is a founder of Journey without getting sued? That is wild and wacky!

[Monker]

I too am disgusted by the whole soap opera crap that's going on with Journey right now. I'm sick of all of the drama, whether it's legit or just publicity crap. Schon needs to focus on music and not all of that other garbage. And Schon needs to lay off of Pineda. Pineda doesn't deserve any of the BS that Schon is spouting off about him lately!

However, I have every reason to believe that the reason that Schon did the Journey Through Time thing is because he wanted to be able to perform a lot of the material from the first 3 Journey albums. That wasn't going to happen with Cain or Azoff making the decisions. For that matter Journey weren't going to be performing very much material from the Infinity through Departure era either with Cain and Azoff running things. It's completely understandable that Schon would be sick of playing virtually nothing but the dirty dozen night after night year after year. But Cain and Azoff just couldn't bare the thought of mixing up the set list to throw in any of the Progressive era tracks, or to allow the band to play much along the lines of new songs.
And Cain kept more or less refusing to work on any new songs for an album. Cain's only in it for the money anymore. Schon's the one who still has musical integrity at this point and doesn't want Journey to just be a live Juke Box band.

Also, again, Schon wasn't "dissing" Mendoza in a low class way. Schon was explaining why Mendoza was no longer in the band. Because he (Mendoza) was taking it upon himself to throw in extra parts that shouldn't be there in the songs.

I just don't understand any of this. Where has it ever been said that Azoff controlled the set list? What I understood is the audience did not know what to do with the obscure stuff, especially the pre-Perry set during Augeri's anniversary tour. It seems to me you are just inventing this Cain/Azoff conspiracy.

Cain refusing to make an album was for the same reason JY of Styx did not want to do a new Styx album...nobody wants to buy an album. And, judging by the reception of Freedom, he was right...Styx first "comeback" album "The Mission" charted higher than Freedom. There is no point making an album that nobody will buy and everybody loses money on, The difference is Styx made two great albums that their current fanbase accepted and they sold well enough for the label to ask for a third. "Freedom" was not released well with the first single released a year before the album and tour, and the album was not accepted nearly as well. The way it was recorded and released was very amateurish...and the album is completely forgettable. Has BMG been asking for a follow up? I doubt it. Tommy Shaw proved JY wrong. Jonathan was proved right, by Neal's crazy decisions tanking the album.

You are using a bad comparison by bringing up Aynsley. According to Herbie, he fired Aynsley because he was completely unreliable and just didn't care. At that time, the pre-Perry albums and recording Infinity, he could make more money by being a session drummer and working with other bands. He treated Journey like a lessor paying side gig...which Herbie felt was completely unprofessional and did not show much dedication to the band. Then there were his teenage girlfriends. The "overplaying" was just an excuse to cover Herbie's real reasoning. The same could be true with Marco and we just don't know the real reason he was fired.

So, Neal doesn't want Journey to be a "live Jukebox band"? That is exactly what they are doing right now. What Neal wants is control...he has explicitly expressed that...and I am sure he wants money, too...which, IMO, is implied.

[danielb]

Check out Styx's recent setlists. That's the way to go about it. A lot more exciting than what JRNY is doing. Styx plays material from their latest albums.

[George_g888]

Schon didn't say that Mendoza sucks as a bass player. He said that Mendoza was overplaying or adding in extra bass to the Journey songs when playing live. Schon then told Mendoza to stop doing that, and Mendoza's response was that he'd think about it. So at that point Schon figured that if Mendoza was taking the attitude that he would only give it some thought, and not that he would just stop doing it from that point on, that then he (Mendoza) had to go.
Completely understandable from Schon's point of view.

The only thing worse than getting fired is having your boss run to the media about why you were fired and saying you couldn't cut it. You can attempt to fansplain it to me any way you want. That what's happened and it was shitty.

Here's a guy that played with Neal and Deen on Sirkus, So U, JTT, and then - suddenly - we're told he didn't have "the right chemistry, to fit with Deen. " Huh?

Made no sense then and still doesn't. Like so much of Journey, I think there's more to the story than we're being told.

I love Smith's drumming. He's my all time favorite drummer. And it sucks that he's not still in the band. But if there's any truth to the claim that Smith didn't want to record a new album, then Smith had to go too?!?!

Firstly, that claim only comes from Neal, who lies about mostly everything.
Secondly, they could have recorded without Smitty. That's basically what ended up happening any way. They recorded with Walden but toured with Deen.

I like Valory's bass playing, and wish that he was still in the band. But again, if there's any truth to some of the claims about him voting to not record a new album, or to keep Rolie out of the Hall Of Fame performance, or to try to keep Rolie from touring with Journey, then screw Valory, he would deserve to be fired at that point?!?!

Let me know when you have sources for these claims outside of the NSTNN (Neal Schon Twitter News Network). Otherwise, they are basically worthless.

The Neal Schon Twitter News Network.. Thats actually hilarious, TNC. But it is true. He goes on all these social media platforms and spews propaganda and creates false narratives regarding one thing or another. It's a tired act at this point.

[JourneyHard]

Steve Augeri tours as "Steve Augeri former lead singer of Journey." Nobody can sue him for that. Thus, Neal could tour as "Neal Schon founding member of Journey." Nobody can sue Neal for that. Nobody.

[brywool]

Neal needing to play those first 4 Journey album songs is just silly. It's such a small number of people that want to hear those songs that it makes JTT a small theatre kind of thing. Great that you want to get your ya yas out and play those songs, but if people run for the beer line when they hear stuff off of Arrival, Revelation, Eclipse, Freedom, Generations, and Red 13- I can imagine that more are doing that during those first 4 obscure album tracks. NOT that I just wanna hear LTS or DSB all the time, but geez, support the new sh*t (JON) too. What does it say about a band that doesn't support their NEW music. Styx was brought up above. Their new stuff is GREAT and they are supporting it by playing it live. They are truly looking ahead. Their last 2 albums (and Cyclorama, which I know a lotta people don't care for) were great albums to me. They played stuff from all those albums, at least for a time. Journey plays one or two songs from Freedom (maybe) and nothing from the other post-Perry records. I can remember bootlegs of those really long shows with Augeri where they'd play the stuff from the first 4, and you could hear people in the audience bitching about it. AND- imagine how AP and JC are taking this whole thing? Whatta crappy thing to do.

Just cuz ya can, doesn't mean that ya should.

[Monker]

Steve Augeri tours as "Steve Augeri former lead singer of Journey." Nobody can sue him for that. Thus, Neal could tour as "Neal Schon founding member of Journey." Nobody can sue Neal for that. Nobody.

You're wrong. Nightmare can, or whoever owns the Trademark. The three former lead singers for Little River Band were sued over an ALBUM COVER because "former voices of The Little River Band" was in the same sized font as the rest of the text on a FAKE Marquee. So, Augeri would need to get permission from Nightmare to tour under that name legally, and so would Neal Schon...which is part of the reason a trademark complaint was filed for "JOURNEY Through Time".

[Hollywood]

The release is coming out under the artist name Neal Schon and titled Journey Through Time. That is how they are getting around the trademark. It is coming out as a 3CD/DVD package. Blu-ray that is sold separately.

As far as Marco, I don't see it as a diss. He was a good fit for the looser/jammy JTT, but the mothership Journey needs a locked in pocket player. When I saw he was taking over for Randy Jackson I thought it was a bad fit, and I love Marco and his playing.

[Journey/Survivor]

Neal needing to play those first 4 Journey album songs is just silly. It's such a small number of people that want to hear those songs that it makes JTT a small theatre kind of thing. Great that you want to get your ya yas out and play those songs, but if people run for the beer line when they hear stuff off of Arrival, Revelation, Eclipse, Freedom, Generations, and Red 13- I can imagine that more are doing that during those first 4 obscure album tracks. NOT that I just wanna hear LTS or DSB all the time, but geez, support the new sh*t (JON) too. What does it say about a band that doesn't support their NEW music. Styx was brought up above. Their new stuff is GREAT and they are supporting it by playing it live. They are truly looking ahead. Their last 2 albums (and Cyclorama, which I know a lotta people don't care for) were great albums to me. They played stuff from all those albums, at least for a time. Journey plays one or two songs from Freedom (maybe) and nothing from the other post-Perry records. I can remember bootlegs of those really long shows with Augeri where they'd play the stuff from the first 4, and you could hear people in the audience bitching about it. AND- imagine how AP and JC are taking this whole thing? Whatta crappy thing to do.

Just cuz ya can, doesn't mean that ya should.

I could never understand Cain's complaint about people going to the bathroom or to get a beer during certain songs?

#1 The audience has already paid for the their tickets, the band has already made their money.

#2 the audience is going to go to the bathroom or to buy a beer at some point during the show, anyway. They're especially going to go to the bathroom because they're drinking so damn much beer. Who cares if they go to the bathroom during Dead Or Alive as opposed to Open Arms? They're going to go do those things at some point during the show.

I'm to the point now that I've seen Journey so many times, and seen them play the Greatest Hits so many times that I can't justify spending those insanely high ticket prices for the same old (Boring by Journey standards) show.
If they aren't going to play deep cuts, new songs and perform concert solos, then I have no reason to pay those prices when I could just sit at home for free and listen to the Greatest Hits Live CD or the Captured CD.

Trying to always make the casual fans happy at all Journey concerts is like giving favoritism to fair weather fans at a sporting event. Play more to the true fans. The die hards.

[jestor92]

I’ll pick this up because I think it’ll be fun to hear some of these songs “live”. You never know what is doctored up in the studio for these things. Plus I love Castronovo’s voice.

[jrnyman28]

It’s funny, but the JTT idea goes all the way back to the Under The Radar/Red13 tour. Neal suggested playing some smaller venues in the same towns and maybe promote it as JRNY to differentiate from the hit list of Journey. Obviously some members were against this. So Neal finally sorta gets his way with the Anniversary tour. If not for the vocal issues it was a great show for longtime fans but didn’t work for the casual. Maybe the band shoulda done it like Def Leppard did. Billed as an opening act (Ded Flatbird) Journey coulda opened for themselves and then the casual fans would know to come later for the hits.

As for the Neal Schon JTT CD/DVD package: timing is bad. 5 years ago, 4, 3, maybe even 2 years ago it was an amazing package. Now it feels like bad taste. I am still very interested in this set, the show sounded amazing. Gregg back, Deen singing, rare live tracks. All good.

It still makes sense to me that Marco was great to work with in all the other iterations but not Journey. True that Neal didn’t need to drag him but it’s par for the course. Ask JSS.

[brywool]

I could never understand Cain's complaint about people going to the bathroom or to get a beer during certain songs?

#1 The audience has already paid for the their tickets, the band has already made their money.

#2 the audience is going to go to the bathroom or to buy a beer at some point during the show, anyway. They're especially going to go to the bathroom because they're drinking so damn much beer. Who cares if they go to the bathroom during Dead Or Alive as opposed to Open Arms? They're going to go do those things at some point during the show.

Never been in a band, have ya? There is nothing worse for an entertainer than to see people walking out en masse. - Actually there is: Peeps plugging their ears. McCartney has a great way of saying it "When I play all of my real well known songs, or some Wings or Beatles stuff, the phones all go up and it looks like a galaxy. As soon as I play something new, it's like starring into a black hole"

Trying to always make the casual fans happy at all Journey concerts is like giving favoritism to fair weather fans at a sporting event. Play more to the true fans. The die hards.

Yup, but gaining and keeping new casual fans is how a band can still sell tickets. It's not just aged rockers going to shows. So it's tough to watch peeps bail to get a beer or whatever.

[Journey/Survivor]

It’s funny, but the JTT idea goes all the way back to the Under The Radar/Red13 tour. Neal suggested playing some smaller venues in the same towns and maybe promote it as JRNY to differentiate from the hit list of Journey. Obviously some members were against this. So Neal finally sorta gets his way with the Anniversary tour. If not for the vocal issues it was a great show for longtime fans but didn’t work for the casual. Maybe the band shoulda done it like Def Leppard did. Billed as an opening act (Ded Flatbird) Journey coulda opened for themselves and then the casual fans would know to come later for the hits.

Great post!

Schon doing JTT never had anything to do with him wanting "Power" or "Control." It was about him wanting to get to flex his musical muscles and play something different for a change.

He may be trying to gain more power or control in Journey in recent years? But JTT had nothing to do with that in the slightest.

Funny thing is that maybe six months before any announcements had been made at all about the forming of JTT, I posted here on the forum that I would love for Schon to get Rolie and Castronovo and to do a side band with Rolie and Castronovo sharing the lead vocals. It may have been pure coincidence that shortly after I posted that that Schon formed JTT? Or there's a slight possibility that he read my comment and he liked the idea?

JTT playing in some two thousand seat venues playing the Progressive Rock era stuff was of absolutely no threat to Journey. And if anyone was trying to sue or otherwise stop Schon from doing JTT, then they sure were childish and insecure!

[The_Noble_Cause]

Schon doing JTT never had anything to do with him wanting "Power" or "Control." It was about him wanting to get to flex his musical muscles and play something different for a change.

So why use the word "Journey" and why play the hits (including SW, AWYWI, DSB etc)? Just go out as Neal Schon.

JTT playing in some two thousand seat venues playing the Progressive Rock era stuff was of absolutely no threat to Journey. And if anyone was trying to sue or otherwise stop Schon from doing JTT, then they sure were childish and insecure!

Trademarking JTT merchandise - which featured the infinity symbol, a winged heart (instead of a scarab), and the word Journey was always poking the bear. There was never ANY doubt that the bear (aka Journey's attorneys) would sue to stop it. It was just a matter of when.

[Memorex]

Heard Lights from Neal Schon's Journey Through Time on Spotify. It was fine.

[Lerxst101]

I went on Apple Music this morning and discovered that Just the Same Way is available as well. It sounds really wonderful — much better than Lights. Looking forward to the entire release.

[artinis1]

I’ve been jamming this since Thursday night, Just The Same Way, Lovin’ You is Easy and Lady Luck are incredible.
I’m nitpicking, but it would have been nice to have a few more songs pre Escape. I’m thinking, People and Places,
Precious Time, City of the Angels, Too Late, oh well still really good.

[Eric]

Loving it! Review to come…

[Journey/Survivor]

I've watched a little more than the first half of it tonight. I'll resume the rest of the show on Saturday.

[Journey/Survivor]

I used to have a phenomenal memory, but these days my short term memory sucks. I can't remember, has there been anything said recently about Schon releasing any of the songs that JTT supposedly wrote/recorded for the planned album?

[Loneman1]

I used to have a phenomenal memory, but these days my short term memory sucks. I can't remember, has there been anything said recently about Schon releasing any of the songs that JTT supposedly wrote/recorded for the planned album?

I do remember rumblings about that from some interview Neal did (Maybe Deen?), but I don't remember hearing if it actually got off the ground or not. I'd imagine once the legal back and forth started if anything did get recorded it got shelved, but now that this concert saw the light of day with an actual release maybe we'll hear new material after all if they got that far into the process.

[Gideon]

Watched it, it was excellent, unlike Lollapalooza which was fucked by a shitty frame rate.

[Art Vandelay]

I listened to it on Amazon Prime. I thought it was fun, for what it was. I really enjoyed hearing the pre-Perry stuff that you're not going to hear Journey play these days. Some of the deeper Perry-era cuts were cool to hear, the bigger hits didn't do anything for me.

The medley of Patiently/Trial By Fire /Stay Awhile was by far my most favorite track. That'll easily become part of my regular rotation.