How You Feel About Journey In Three Words Or Less

by **Glenn** » Thu Nov 26, 2009 12:55 pm

portland wrote:Perry 2010

is he running for office ?

by **portland** » Thu Nov 26, 2009 12:58 pm

ha ha ha!! :wink:

by **Saint John** » Thu Nov 26, 2009 2:37 pm

JSS Rocks! wrote:
portland wrote:Perry 2010

is he running for office ?

Mayor Of Doucheville

by **portland** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:36 am

Dan loves Perry :lol:

by **SherriBerry** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 7:04 pm

portland wrote:Dan loves Perry

Love Turns Bitter :wink:

Reading Dan's SP comments is like listening to my friends and coworkers (both men and women) talk about their ex's! :lol:

by **Author2** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 11:08 am

brywool wrote:
portland wrote:
brywool wrote:
Abitaman wrote:
portland wrote:Perry Pitch Perfect

In the studio

Don't agree.

Perry had GREAT live pitch.

Arnel's is pretty good too, but I've heard him off pitch early on. I don't hear it these days though.

Augeri unfortunately never had great live pitch.

WOW WE AGREE!!!

Portland- I never diss Perry's talent as a vocalist and what he brought to Journey. I never minimize his contribution. I personally doubt that he'll ever be what he was and the people saying that he will return to form without a doubt amaze me. The blind legion that follows him without putting his actions into perspective bugs the crap out of me. The fact that they slam Arnel every chance they get because it somehow threatens Perry's memory (which it does not do) amazes me. I DO slam him for the crap that he put the band through and the constant teasing of the fans. I tell it like it is rather than putting him through some kind of "messiah-filter" (sans my av!). I love the guy's voice, but the fact that he's been sitting on his ass after screwing the band over doesn't sit well with me. The fact that he was paid as an equal member during the Augeri years while he sat home also doesn't sit well with me. It was a shitty thing for him to do. First he sticks the band by not promoting or touring with TBF (like he agreed), then when they move on (after YEARS of waiting for him), he sticks it to them again. THAT is not the doings of a guy that's "good people". When he's great, I will say so. When he's a douche, I will say so. Happy Thanksgiving.

Thought this was a fun thread. You had to go off cue didn't you?

I take it you represented the band? As a fan equipped with common sense, I don't hold to any of your mumbo/jumbo above nor will I blame him for what you call teasing. I see more Perry slamming than Arnel and quite a bit being from you. I tell you with fans like some of you guys, who needs enemies?

They were all adults, but if you slam - I slam the band for what they did to him, excessive touring then bashing him for not continuing, being musicians and knowing what it did to his voice. Perry toured for what almost ten years on cue and I am happy for whatever good deal he may have gotten because he truly lost the MOST for he could very well be eating out of a trash can. And, the way the touring demons would have humiliated him by having him "sit on a stool."

But all in all we probably can't tell it like it is because doubtfully any of us were privy to what went on with the guys. So I look at what happened with Perry, Steve A, JSS and all the accommodations to save Arnel and (forgive me here) count NS' wives (that count somewhat coincides with lead singers) to come to a conclusion. Judging from your "facts" Neal and the rest were complete morons, unable to make any decisions, huh? In that case, perhaps you are like they, unable to accept responsibility for their own actions or lack thereof, but would rather blame it on others.

We all have our ticks, huh? I guess "good people" are the ones who try to fool the fans by lipping, discharge singers without notice or terminate singers while on sick-leave or the ones who mock their idols "note for note."

Carry on!!

by **parfait** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 12:10 pm

Author2 wrote:
brywool wrote:
portland wrote:
brywool wrote:
Abitaman wrote:
portland wrote:Perry Pitch Perfect

In the studio

Don't agree.

Perry had GREAT live pitch.

Arnel's is pretty good too, but I've heard him off pitch early on. I don't hear it these days though.

Augeri unfortunately never had great live pitch.

WOW WE AGREE!!!

Portland- I never diss Perry's talent as a vocalist and what he brought to Journey. I never minimize his contribution. I personally doubt that he'll ever be what he was and the people saying that he will return to form without a doubt amaze me. The blind legion that follows him without putting his actions into perspective bugs the crap out of me. The fact that they slam Arnel every chance they get because it somehow threatens Perry's memory (which it does not do) amazes me. I DO slam him for the crap that he put the band through and the constant teasing of the fans. I tell it like it is rather than putting him through some kind of "messiah-filter" (sans my av!). I love the guy's voice, but the fact that he's been sitting on his ass after screwing the band over doesn't sit well with me. The fact that he was paid as an equal member during the Augeri years while he sat home also doesn't sit well with me. It was a shitty thing for him to do. First he sticks the band by not promoting or touring with TBF (like he agreed), then when they move on (after YEARS of waiting for him), he sticks it to them again. THAT is not the doings of a guy that's "good people". When he's great, I will say so. When he's a douche, I will say so. Happy Thanksgiving.

Thought this was a fun thread. You had to go off cue didn't you?

I take it you represented the band? As a fan equipped with common sense, I don't hold to any of your mumbo/jumbo above nor will I blame him for what you call teasing. I see more Perry slamming than Arnel and quite a bit being from you. I tell you with fans like some of you guys, who needs enemies?

They were all adults, but if you slam - I slam the band for what they did to him, excessive touring then bashing him for not continuing, being musicians and knowing what it did to his voice. Perry toured for what almost ten years on cue and I am happy for whatever good deal he may have gotten because he truly lost the MOST for he could very well be eating out of a trash can. And, the way the touring demons would have humiliated him by having him "sit on a stool."

But all in all we probably can't tell it like it is because doubtfully any of us were privy to what went on with the guys. So I look at what happened with Perry, Steve A, JSS and all the accommodations to save Arnel and (forgive me here) count NS' wives (that count somewhat coincides with lead singers) to come to a conclusion. Judging from your "facts" Neal and the rest were complete morons, unable to make any decisions, huh? In that case, perhaps you are like they, unable to accept responsibility for their own actions or lack thereof, but would rather blame it on others.

We all have our ticks, huh? I guess "good people" are the ones who try to fool the fans by lipping, discharge singers without notice or terminate singers while on sick-leave or the ones who mock their idols "note for note."

Carry on!!

No need to get fiesty, Sherminator. Brywool here came up with a good (and true) argument, and you, as the loonietoon you are, regurgitates the same old crap.

Everyone knows that the J-boyz should have done a lot of stuff different, that's a given. But let's dish out some facts:

- Perry himself said that the band didn't push him to do anything - they were on "a mission together". Brothers in music, and all that.

- Who the fuck cares how many wives Neal have had?

You really should get your head out of Perry's huge nostril, cause you really need to see things from both sides (and I'm talking to everyone of you loons :wink:

). Perry wasn't the only one being burned out during the RoR tour - Neal lost his father around the same time as Perry lost his mom. But people are different, so it's Perry's prerogative to call it quits if he's toast. But then he held back the band for almost ten years - Journey were on "hold" cause of Perry. When TBF finally came, he didn't even tour - and put Journey on old once more.

But Neal and Cain wanted to tour, they wanted to play the Journey music to their own fanbase - cause that's what real musicians do. So Perry coughed up some litter sand, and told 'em not to crack the stone - which is the most egotistical shit ever. He was afraid that someone was going to diminish his talent (Journey was Perry's band around RoR, there's no denying it), so he wanted Neal and Cain to basically quit something they was as much part of as Perry. Mr. Kittens screwed Journey, end of story.

But that really doesn't matter anymore. Nostrilus screwed Journey, and Journey screwed JSS - get over it. The fact remains that Neal and Cain are the one keeping the Journey name alive; they keep on touring, and thus more people listens to Journey with Perry as a result. Neal and Cain says that they are honoring the magic the three created together. Perry should be damn grateful for that. Instead he chooses to tease about his "work" every year, just to keep himself in the spotlight.

Mr. Kittens is the best vocalist, ever. Journey created magic back then, but Perry chooses to work against what Neal and Cain are doing; keeping JOURNEY alive!

It's perfectly okay to get your panties in a twirl after watching Still They Ride, but try to see things from Neal and Cain's side. Give respect were respect is due

by **Don** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 12:34 pm

I'm not going to quote everything above me, but when it comes to the money issue, one point I want to make is:

Roger Waters was a founding member of Pink Floyd.

Dennis DeYoung was a founding member of Styx.

Both tried to block their former band mates from using the band's name.

BOTH LOST.

If Journey signed an agreement which let Perry get paid as a six member, that's on Neal.
If you're mad at Perry about that then you should be mad at Neal also for agreeing to it.

Perry is not an original member of the band, no way he stops them from touring under the Journey name, nor would he be able to tie them up for years in court. If Waters and DeYoung couldn't do it, no way a third vocalist could.

You want to be pissed at Perry, fine but Herbie didn't just say Neal wasn't the sharpest tool in the shed for nothing.
If Frig and Fro signed off on the agreement without a fight, they don't have any room to complain about it 8+ years down the road.

Waters Vs Gilmour had already set the precedent years before in which direction the court was inclined to go. If you want to hate Perry for screwing the band, knock yourself out but from the financial aspect of it, they were all adults. If you loved something so much as Neal proclaims to love Journey, wouldn't you go to court and prepare for a very winnable case, rather than give Perry a free 10 year paycheck.

by **Michigan Girl** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 2:42 pm

Gunbot wrote:I'm not going to quote everything above me, but when it comes to the money issue, one point I want to make is:

Roger Waters was a founding member of Pink Floyd.

Dennis DeYoung was a founding member of Styx.

Both tried to block their former band mates from using the band's name.

BOTH LOST.

If Journey signed an agreement which let Perry get paid as a six member, that's on Neal.
If you're mad at Perry about that then you should be mad at Neal also for agreeing to it.

Perry is not an original member of the band, no way he stops them from touring under the Journey name, nor would he be able to tie them up for years in court. If Waters and DeYoung couldn't do it, no way a third vocalist could.

You want to be pissed at Perry, fine but Herbie didn't just say Neal wasn't the sharpest tool in the shed for nothing.
If Frig and Fro signed off on the agreement without a fight, they don't have any room to complain about it 8+ years down the road.

Waters Vs Gilmour had already set the precedent years before in which direction the court was inclined to go. If you want to hate Perry for screwing the band, knock yourself out but from the financial aspect of it, they were all adults. If you loved something so much as Neal proclaims to love Journey, wouldn't you go to court and prepare for a very winnable case, rather than give Perry a free 10 year paycheck.

You're good!!! :wink:

by **SherriBerry** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 8:10 pm

No need to get fiesty, Sherminator. Brywool here came up with a good (and true) argument, and you, as the loonietoon you are, regurgitates the same old crap.

Everyone knows that the J-boyz should have done a lot of stuff different, that's a given. But let's dish out some facts:

You really should get your head out of Perry's huge nostril, cause you really need to see things from both sides (and I'm talking to everyone of you loons ). Perry wasn't the only one being burned out during the RoR tour - Neal lost his father around the same time as Perry lost his mom. But people are different, so it's Perry's prerogative to call it quits if he's toast. But then he held back the band for almost ten years - Journey were on "hold" cause of Perry. When TBF finally came, he didn't even tour - and put Journey on old once more.

Insulting someone as a "loonietoon" does not strengthen your arguments but rather weakens your position before you start. When SP said he was toast, he meant it and if Neal wanted to believe he would be back in a few months, that was his erroneous hope or assumption. But in no interview I ever read in print or watched on screen has any member of Journey ever said that at the end of the ROR tour Steve Perry told them he was only taking a break and would be back! He said he was done. The band could have waited as little or as long as they wanted before deciding whether to go on without him. If they chose to wait rather than try to replace SP after a year or two, that was their choice and no one held a bloody gun to their heads. If their other projects like Bad English had produced a fraction of the success they had with SP and Journey, Journey would not have reformed.

But Neal and Cain wanted to tour, they wanted to play the Journey music to their own fanbase - cause that's what real musicians do. So Perry coughed up some litter sand, and told 'em not to crack the stone - which is the most egotistical shit ever. He was afraid that someone was going to diminish his talent (Journey was Perry's band around RoR, there's no denying it), so he wanted Neal and Cain to basically quit something they was as much part of as Perry. Mr. Kittens screwed Journey, end of story.

Tapegate, JSS firing, SuperBowl '09 and the assertion by many (not me) that Journey has become its own tribute band. SP wanted Journey's legacy to remain intact and now they are on their 6th lead singer who moonlights in the off season as a rock music impersonator. A little Van Halen anyone?

But that really doesn't matter anymore. Nostrilus screwed Journey, and Journey screwed JSS - get over it. The fact remains that Neal and Cain are the one keeping the Journey name alive; they keep on touring, and thus more people listens to Journey with Perry as a result. Neal and Cain says that they are honoring the magic the three created together. Perry should be damn grateful for that. Instead he chooses to tease about his "work" every year, just to keep himself in the spotlight.

Until the publicity from Arnel, most people did not realize Journey was still touring! Journey's Greatest Hits being played on classic rock stations and used in movies and popular TV shows has done more for keeping Journey's music alive in popular culture, and the music they use features Steve Perry's vocals. He also does not need to do anything to keep himself in the spotlight - the spotlight finds him, usually at a ballgame minding his own business. If he were looking for attention, he would at least have a website or Twitter account like the hundreds of millions of people who endlessly blog and no one cares.

Mr. Kittens is the best vocalist, ever. Journey created magic back then, but Perry chooses to work against what Neal and Cain are doing; keeping JOURNEY alive!

Steve Perry was the one who went into the studio and engineered the enhanced releases of Journey's albums and DVD, so your assertion that he is working against Neal and Jon's efforts to keep Journey's music alive is utter bullshit. Touring as Journey is about revenue and SP would have preferred not to get paid if it meant they didn't tour with a new singer.

It's perfectly okay to get your panties in a twirl after watching Still They Ride, but try to see things from Neal and Cain's side. Give respect were respect is due

If you want to give respect where it is due, leave some for Steve Perry. If it weren't for him, Journey's legacy would have been flushed down the toilet, as the others would have allowed the songs to be used in any commercial from deodorant to tampons. SP is also the reason Herbie does not own Journey - otherwise it would have been Herbie getting paid like a MF all of these years and he didn't write or sing anything.

by **SherriBerry** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 8:13 pm

(And now we resume our previously scheduled program... :wink:

)

So Patiently

by **portland** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 10:08 pm

SherriBerry wrote:(And now we resume our previously scheduled program... )

So Patiently

That was well said^^^^^^^^ :wink:

by **Chubby321** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:51 am

Fans always arguing. :lol:

by **Voyager** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 4:12 am

Chubby321 wrote:Fans always arguing.

Keeps Forum Busy

:lol:

by **Chubby321** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 4:20 am

Voyager wrote:
Chubby321 wrote:Fans always arguing.

Keeps Forum Busy

True true true . :lol:

Website · by **steveo777** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 4:33 am

Bullshit never rests

by **Voyager** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:05 am

Rust Never Sleeps

by **Don** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 7:55 am

Dogs Never Lie

by **portland** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 7:58 am

best days over

Website · by **steveo777** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 7:58 am

Dogs hump legs

by **portland** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:00 am

^^^^ has to do with Journey how???

by **Jana** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:12 am

portland wrote:best days over

fantastic days ahead

by **Escape81** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:30 am

SherriBerry wrote:Insulting someone as a "loonietoon" does not strengthen your arguments but rather weakens your position before you start.

You say insult, I say observation. As far as insults go, “loonietoon” is pretty tame, so just let it go.

SherriBerry wrote:When SP said he was toast, he meant it and if Neal wanted to believe he would be back in a few months, that was his erroneous hope or assumption. But in no interview I ever read in print or watched on screen has any member of Journey ever said that at the end of the ROR tour Steve Perry told them he was only taking a break and would be back! He said he was done. The band could have waited as little or as long as they wanted before deciding whether to go on without him. If they chose to wait rather than try to replace SP after a year or two, that was their choice and no one held a bloody gun to their heads.

They must have been confused when Toast made his transformation back into a delicious slice of Whole Wheat for the purposes of recording a second solo album approximately two years later. Unfortunately, it seemed as though no one cared about a Journeyless Steve Perry and the album was pimpsmacked into the fiery gates of Corporate Hell.

Karma’s a bitch, Steve!

SherriBerry wrote:If their other projects like Bad English had produced a fraction of the success they had with SP and Journey, Journey would not have reformed.

Where exactly was this said by someone credible? Bad English was a three year project that landed a platinum album and a number one hit. Neither Journey nor Perry solo yielded a number one hit, which is an impressive accomplishment. And this was done when the epoch of glam/hair rock was on its way out. Nicely done, gentlemen.

SherriBerry wrote:Tapegate,

“Tapegate” was an example of unethical conduct and deceit. The band and its management deserve all the flak they get. It’s high time Neal understands that his workaholic nature has consequences for everyone else. They’re not all superhuman like he is.

SherriBerry wrote:JSS firing,

If Soto’s account is completely accurate, then—like Tapegate—Journey deserves all of the flak they get and then some. They had no obligation to keep him as the vocalist, but they should have treated him far more openly than that.

SherriBerry wrote:SuperBowl '09 and the assertion by many (not me) that Journey has become its own tribute band.

This is where you and I deviate. A lackluster performance is not a sign of compromised legacy or integrity. If that’s the case, none of Journey’s members—not even the great Perry himself—qualify as persons of integrity. They’ve all had major suck-ass moments: see Perry at the Bill Graham Memorial or White Sox rally for demonstration that even the Voice is fallible.

And the tribute band remarks have no merit.

SherriBerry wrote:SP wanted Journey's legacy to remain intact and now they are on their 6th lead singer who moonlights in the off season as a rock music impersonator. A little Van Halen anyone?

Head’s up: we’re about to deviate some more! This is a suggestion to all those espousing the whole “legacy!” bullshit. Three words: Let. It. Go. Especially you, Sherri. Your sentence directly implies that Journey’s legacy is somewhat compromised. According to whom? You? Perhaps, but not the public. As you say… “Until the publicity from Arnel, most people did not realize Journey was still touring!” That means, to the eyes of the group who really matter—the majority—Journey’s legacy remains intact. They don’t care about Tapegate or Soto or Augeri or their respective departures. They care about a damn good show and the Journey sound, which is what concert goers have been getting in spades. When you turn a blind eye to something, you’re ignorant of its actions. The public didn’t see Soto or Augeri being canned; therefore, they don’t care. No coverage and no curiosity to the band other than an awesome singer who evokes the great Perry in concert. The legacy? It’s fine, contrary to your apocalyptic cynicism.

SherriBerry wrote:Until the publicity from Arnel, most people did not realize Journey was still touring! Journey's Greatest Hits being played on classic rock stations and used in movies and popular TV shows has done more for keeping Journey's music alive in popular culture, and the music they use features Steve Perry's vocals. He also does not need to do anything to keep himself in the spotlight - the spotlight finds him, usually at a ballgame minding his own business. If he were looking for attention, he would at least have a website or Twitter account like the hundreds of millions of people who endlessly blog and no one cares.

Agreed here; Perry doesn’t care about the attention.

SherriBerry wrote:Steve Perry was the one who went into the studio and engineered the enhanced releases of Journey's albums and DVD, so your assertion that he is working against Neal and Jon's efforts to keep Journey's music alive is utter bullshit. Touring as Journey is about revenue and SP would have preferred not to get paid if it meant they didn't tour with a new singer.

Could you, like, make something of an effort to avoid double standards? When Steve Perry remarkets and repackages the old material (to make a profit), he’s a saint: the Guardian of Integrity himself! When the rest of the band (three members who were involved in the original works to Perry’s one) attempts to do the exact same thing—with more incentive, I might add, as proof that their new vocalist can honor Perry’s vaunted legacy—they’re reviled and despised. Is a single standard too much to ask from people?

SherriBerry wrote:If you want to give respect where it is due, leave some for Steve Perry.

They all deserve respect—Perry, Schon, Cain, Smith, Valory, Dunbar, Rolie, Castronovo, Soto, Augeri, Pineda, and everyone else—for what they accomplished together and apart. Not one, not a few—ALL of them.

SherriBerry wrote:If it weren't for him, Journey's legacy would have been flushed down the toilet, as the others would have allowed the songs to be used in any commercial from deodorant to tampons.

Seriously, drop the fucking legacy argument. It’s entirely without merit or substance. Do you know what most critics and people believe Journey to be? Corporate rock. Soulless, capitalist corporate rock. They were mainstream. Non-experimental. They adhered to a formula that was only altered to make even MORE mainstream (ROR anyone?). Are they talented? Sure. Are they liked? Absolutely. But they ain’t Led Zeppelin or Queen or the Rolling fucking Stones to the eyes of the public. Journey’s legacy constitutes churning out three minute AOR gems with stunning vocals, melodies, and guitar acrobatics. That’s it. Nowhere will Journey ever be cited as the pinnacle of artistic and musical integrity. But if it helps suit your argument about Perry, by all means…

SherriBerry wrote:SP is also the reason Herbie does not own Journey - otherwise it would have been Herbie getting paid like a MF all of these years and he didn't write or sing anything.

Herbie brought them together and is singlehandedly responsible for Journey’s career. Perry’s, Schon’s, everyone’s. He claims to have more money than all of them; can’t blame him.

by **Don** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:34 am

Escape81 wrote:
Herbie brought them together and is singlehandedly responsible for Journey’s career. Perry’s, Schon’s, everyone’s.

I agree with this.

by **portland** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:34 am

Giddy is that you ^^^^^ :lol:

by **Escape81** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:39 am

Gunbot wrote:
Escape81 wrote:
Herbie brought them together and is singlehandedly responsible for Journey’s career. Perry’s, Schon’s, everyone’s.

I agree with this.

You agree with the whole damn thing, you're just too shy or too stubborn to admit otherwise. But I can see it in your eyes...

by **portland** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:41 am

Escape81 wrote:
Gunbot wrote:
Escape81 wrote:
Herbie brought them together and is singlehandedly responsible for Journey’s career. Perry’s, Schon’s, everyone’s.

I agree with this.

You agree with the whole damn thing, you're just too shy or too stubborn to admit otherwise. But I can see it in your eyes...

Hmmmm GB shy that's a good one!!! :lol: