Herbie re-interviewed!

[Red13JoePa]

Oh, I see now. It WAS Me who was responsible for the closure of the Journey Forum? Got it.

No problem.

Yea. Kinda like it me and NealIsGod who forced you at gunpoint to empty a goddamn howtizer magazine on the loons at the beginning of the end a few weeks back.


This material just goes in circles and circles and circles.....I can set my watch by the point in which you trot the above post out.

[Big J]

Good lord guys. Personally, I'd like to have a Journey forum on this site.

Dean, all due respect (and plenty) from someone who ISN'T against you...you're going nuts here for no reason. Chill. You werent the whole reason for Andrew shutting it down last time, though you were part of it...and if he shuts it down today you'll be it alone.

Fucking chill.

Now I'm off to read the HH interview. For some reason I was more interested in reading the reactions first.

Wow...brutal interview. And while there's some pretty heavy stuff here, I don't really see a reason why the guy wouldn't be telling the truth. What does he have to gain by throwing the guys under the bus?

What's the deal witgh Robert Fleischmann? Guy's never been able to keep a gig for more than 5 minutes. When even Vinnie Vincent doesnt wanna play with you...you've got issues.

[Big J]

Hey guys...

What's the Freedom album...what was this gonna be?

[Marabelle]

Not against you Dean. Herbie can say whatever he wants to say; to me it just seems he wants the attention and it's just seems to be sour grapes at this point. What else can he say about a band he managed over a decade ago that would draw attention but to criticize each band member in order to get a rise. I value your argument; I just don't like a blowhard (HH)coming out and saying mean things just to get attention. So what if Mr. Espee did blow and all the other things and so what he wouldn't put him out if he was on fire; that's him; just bitter and mean. I guess that is what happens when you get old and nobody needs you any more. I think at the time he was a great manager; but now that he's not needed; he's just mean and ugly and hateful.

[*Laura]

What's the Freedom album...what was this gonna be?

Freedom became ROR.Change of the 'one word'-named albums and change of artwork.

[Big J]

What's the Freedom album...what was this gonna be?

Freedom became ROR.Change of the 'one word'-named albums and change of artwork.

So...how much was ready to go, was there alternate album artwork, were the songs different...etc?

[*Laura]

What's the Freedom album...what was this gonna be?

Freedom became ROR.Change of the 'one word'-named albums and change of artwork.

So...how much was ready to go, was there alternate album artwork, were the songs different...etc?

HH:"They just wanted to change everything. They wanted to change the album art. They didn’t want to use Kelly and Mouse all of a sudden. They wanted to do anything to change my formula. Instead of the Freedom album, they made Raised on Radio."

They didn`t want to use that Elmo face from the Frontiers cover.Instead,Perry came up with the image of a radio station from Hanford.As for the songs...I guess we`ll never know how many were initially written for Freedom,IF there were any...

[NealIsGod]

Have Neal or Jon ever commented on this?

[The_Noble_Cause]

I guess that is what happens when you get old and nobody needs you any more. I think at the time he was a great manager; but now that he's not needed; he's just mean and ugly and hateful.

So that's why Neal and Jon begged for Herbie to take them back after TBF fell thru?

[*Laura]

Have Neal or Jon ever commented on this?

I don`t think Neal liked that very much...tee-hee

Q:- The album title, "ARRIVAL" seems to have a connection with the sequence of the previous titles such as "Infinity", "Departure" or "Escape".
Neal:"Not only the title, but the art work does. I didn't want the one like "Raised On Radio". I don't like neither the title nor the art work. It must be the one identifies the album as Journey's at a glance. That's why I like the one word album title."

http://www.cavemanproductions.com/REVS/neal.html

[Liz22562]

Deano, I absolutely NEVER SAID that you were FOS!

The board went in a direction that our mighty leader has respectfully requested not go. I happen to enjoy this particular message board and do not want to it to be closed. Okie dokie?

I, also, enjoy a good arguement and look forward to reading most of the posts (whether fore or against) on the subject. By all means, my dear argue till it hurts!

Peace to all and Journey On!

[The_Noble_Cause]

They didn`t want to use that Elmo face from the Frontiers cover.

Elmo was Perry's idea. All the covers were initially supposed to be scarabs.

[The_Noble_Cause]

So...how much was ready to go, was there alternate album artwork, were the songs different...etc?

Some people say nearly a whole album of material was scrapped. I don't know for certain. Check out Herbie's first notorious interview for more details.

[Big J]

What's the Freedom album...what was this gonna be?

Freedom became ROR.Change of the 'one word'-named albums and change of artwork.

So...how much was ready to go, was there alternate album artwork, were the songs different...etc?

HH:"They just wanted to change everything. They wanted to change the album art. They didn’t want to use Kelly and Mouse all of a sudden. They wanted to do anything to change my formula. Instead of the Freedom album, they made Raised on Radio."

They didn`t want to use that Elmo face from the Frontiers cover.Instead,Perry came up with the image of a radio station from Hanford.As for the songs...I guess we`ll never know how many were initially written for Freedom,IF there were any...

That's funny, because I've lived in Fresno all my life, with family in Hanford so I've been there consistently throughout my life too. There's nothing like that in Hanford anywhere.

[Red13JoePa]

So what, BigJ?

What DoubleH says is DOGMA. Got it? If he said Hanford it was there.

[*Laura]

That's funny, because I've lived in Fresno all my life, with family in Hanford so I've been there consistently throughout my life too. There's nothing like that in Hanford anywhere.

KIGS 620AM,a Portuguese radio station.It`s on Highway 198 between Hanford and Visalia.

[Big J]

Still standing? That's funny. Of course, it's on 198, that's why I've never seen it.

[Lula]

Didn't Neal say he liked the title Freedom for what became Generations? I can barely tolerate ROR. I despised the actions of Perry for firing Ross and Smitty and for putting out the dreadful ROR as a Journey album. Jon and Neal could have stepped up as well. I'm so glad to learn that Herbie made sure Ross and Smitty were paid as though they were touring as well. Herbie Herbert created Journey, made them a ton of money, and has every right to say what he says- pretty or not. It's good to see the actual human side exposed for a change. At the very least- a good read .

[Herbies'_Large_Gut]

Damn right I was, and still am right.

Everybody better get that through your collective heads.

[Monker]

I really think Herbie washed his hands of Journey back before ROR had finished being recorded. It seems Perry wanted to take over the management of Journey, and the rest of the band backed Perry instead of Herbie. I think that was the start of ALL of this. In the end, I think Neal and Jonathan found it was a mistake to back Perry...and Herbie is now rubbing their noses in it. They needed Herbie MUCH more then Perry, and much, MUCH more then Herbie needed them.

When Journey moved on without Perry, and with Chalfant, I have to wonder if Herbie, and maybe Gregg, felt like it was like starting Journey all over again. They had to feel betrayed when Neal and Jonathan backed reuniting with Perry, instead of continuing on without him. When Herbie was asked to step aside (I believe him when he basicaly says they did not have the power to 'fire' him) , it had to be the last straw.

What do people expect from somebody who has been through all of that? To top it all off, he's retired. He doesn't have to worry about what anybody thinks. It shouldn't matter to him what the band, other bands, the industry, or the fans think. His reputation is based in the past...nothing said or done today is going to change it.

I also think he hates it when he isn't given the credit he believes he deserves. I'll bet anything Herbie wanted to release the Escape concert on VHS and vinyl...back in the early 80's...and Perry refused to allow it. Now it finaly gets released and Perry takes all the credit. How infuriating that must be. The truth is this should have been released twenty-five years ago...and then remastered on DVD and released again...back in the 90's. It was a huge missed opportunity...which is also what I have been saying for a long time.

IMO, Herbie was the visionary who made Journey rise above many of the other melodicrock bands. It wasn't Perry, or any other one member...It was Herbie and when his influence left in favor of Perry's, Journey fell apart. That should be obvious.

[*Laura]

the dreadful ROR

ROR is usually labeled as "dreadful" because some people associate it with the inside story which was going on at the time.I agree that ROR might not be the best Journey album,but no one can say that BGTY,WCTNGOF or GCHI are "dreadful" songs. JMO.

"Herbies'_Large_Gut" ??



I think I know you...

[Herbies'_Large_Gut]

the dreadful ROR

ROR is usually labeled as "dreadful" because some people associate it with the inside story which was going on at the time.I agree that ROR might not be the best Journey album,but no one can say that BGTY,WCTNGOF or GCHI are "dreadful" songs. JMO.

"Herbies'_Large_Gut" ??



I think I know you...

You haven't a clue as to who I am. lease don't insinuate that you do. I have been lurking for a month or two, and finally this topic put me over the top, and I felt to register.

The only thing you may possibly know is I am large.

[*Laura]

You haven't a clue as to who I am. lease don't insinuate that you do. I have been lurking for a month or two, and finally this topic put me over the top, and I felt to register.

The only thing you may possibly know is I am large.

Gotcha.

[Lula]

ROR is usually labeled as "dreadful" because some people associate it with the inside story which was going on at the time.I agree that ROR might not be the best Journey album,but no one can say that BGTY,WCTNGOF or GCHI are "dreadful" songs. JMO.

I am simply not a fan of ROR. Of course there are some that hold it as their favorite, I do not. The beauty of music is that it is subjective.

[Rockindeano]

The beauty of music is that it is subjective.

Wow, you two carry on a good conversation.

Music is subjective? I didn't know that.

[mnmsjrny]

What's the Freedom album...what was this gonna be?

Freedom became ROR.Change of the 'one word'-named albums and change of artwork.

So...how much was ready to go, was there alternate album artwork, were the songs different...etc?

HH:"They just wanted to change everything. They wanted to change the album art. They didn’t want to use Kelly and Mouse all of a sudden. They wanted to do anything to change my formula. Instead of the Freedom album, they made Raised on Radio."

They didn`t want to use that Elmo face from the Frontiers cover.Instead,Perry came up with the image of a radio station from Hanford.As for the songs...I guess we`ll never know how many were initially written for Freedom,IF there were any...

That's funny, because I've lived in Fresno all my life, with family in Hanford so I've been there consistently throughout my life too. There's nothing like that in Hanford anywhere.

Yes there is. Some friends & I found it a few years ago... I think the station is KIGS or something like that. I've got pix somewhere...

[mnmsjrny]

That's funny, because I've lived in Fresno all my life, with family in Hanford so I've been there consistently throughout my life too. There's nothing like that in Hanford anywhere.

KIGS 620AM,a Portuguese radio station.It`s on Highway 198 between Hanford and Visalia.

LOL... shoulda kept reading

[Lula]

The beauty of music is that it is subjective.

Wow, you two carry on a good conversation.

Music is subjective? I didn't know that.

I believe music is subjective. It is about preference just like a piece of art. We tend to like what speaks to us or moves us in one way or another. Of course, Dean, this is all in my humble opinion

[*Laura]

Music is subjective? I didn't know that.

Lula`s right.Music is subjective.Like any other form of art.The beauty is in the eye of the beholder,remember?In this case,it`s in the ears (soul) of the listener.
That`s why we cannot describe the Journey albums in an objective way.
But when an album like ROR has at least 4 songs that were unanimously acknowledged as major hits,we can talk about a noteworthy album.
Sure,ROR was an experiment,but it wasn`t bad...says my ear.

[Rockindeano]

You like ROR because you are a Euro. You Euros like that crap.

PS- just because they were documented hits does not make a good song. Two things.

ROR had 5 charting hits, and WCTNGOF was the worst tracking one of the bunch.

BGTY,GCHI, Suzanne, and IBAWY were all higher than WCTNGOF.

Anyway, Journey had those five "hits" on name recognition alone. Like Madonna. She can put out a pure shit record and it's getting recognized. Journey used to be able to do that.