If Perry is Right Then Neal Is A Dick ...

[SF-Dano]

SF-Dano if you are talking about me, say so. That is why I said "if Neal actually said that" because I haven't seen the article. I was just saying that I didn't think Neal came across very well in that IMO. I haven't read one article of Perry slamming Schon, probably more the opposite. So sorry to say, that article did nothing in changing my opinion that Perry's got more class. I consider myself quite open-minded, so I don't over-rationalize or ignore facts.......do I like everything Perry has said or done, NOT in the least. If the comments don't sit well, they don't sit well, no matter who it is from. We are all "Journey" fans....I'm more of a Perry fan and you're more of a Schon fan, it's all good.

Not calling you out specifically Strungout. I just got a little pissed off, when I check into this forum this morining and the first thing I see is a thread where someone is calling Neal a dick and trying to prop up Steve Perry as the ideal image of the good-guy. You are correct, we are all "Journey" fans, so IMO, we should be well beyond the point of coming here and having to see BS like that. As I said before, neither Perry or Schon is a saint. Can we all quit trying to prop one or the other up as being a better person at the expense of the other. I have never started a thread like one of these, but I will definately voice my opinion when I see one. I don't have an agenda other than being a Journey fan past, present, and future. Others have an agenda (again not directed at you strungout), and that agenda has always been to prop up Steve Perry and his contributions to the band Journey at the expense of the other members' contributions and reputations.

SF - your posts are consistently pro-Schon. There's nothing wrong with that...but I don't see much of this impartiality of which you speak.

I am a Schon fan. I am a Journey fan. I am a fan of I would say 90% of Steve Perry's work in Journey. On the questions of personalities and actions. I put a lot more weight on a persons actions than their words. I just call em' like I see em'. In this very thread, there is claimed to be an interview, that Perry told Neal and Jon in '89 that he was done with Journey. I do not dispute that interview may exist. However, there is the BTM where several sources stated that nobody knew what was going on (ie. Perry never made that alleged statement to Neal and Jon) during the whole period from '87 to the time of the proposed re-union that included Rolie and Chalfant. The list of discrepancies goes on and on. You accuse me of being pro-Scon, but I accuse you of being even more pro-Perry. I at least have actions to back up my point of you. The loons, have nothing but words and he said/she said quotes that they rely on as gospel. And revisionist history and rationalization of any actions that Perry may have made that don't come off looking so well.

As far as Neal and Perry's relationship, I think Neal was pro-Perry for as long as he could take it and sometimes to his own detriment to be honest. Neal stood by Perry, when Perry decided to "fire" Valory and Smith. Neal decided to go along with the TBF Perry reunion even though another type of Journey reunion was already in the works. Neal knew/knows that the big money was with Perry, so yea he is NO SAINT in going for the money all the time and that position does not sit well with me. It doesn't make him a dick either, it makes him what Herbie described himself as, an "unabshed capitalist". Neal knows there is money to be made using the name Journey. And there is nothing wrong with him using the name of the band that he helped create and the songs he helped create.

I am content to move on from these discussions, however, without fail someone, generally a "Loon", will post something such as the title of this thread to spark the old flames and animosities all over again. The Carousel goes round and round and .........

[Red13JoePa]

Crack up if you will, but how many tours did the Schon/Cain-led Journey just up and cancel in the middle?

None - because when the singer burned out this time they ploughed on regardless...and we all know what happened next....

If it was decisive, perhaps Cain/Schon would NOT have had to ask him what his intent was in '89?

True - but if Schon and Cain had been decisive then they wouldn't have asked....

Wonder what would've happened if at THAT time instead of doing BE they announced an intended new Journey album with Augeri or Chalfont singing.

Same thing. Karaoke. Collapse of album sales. Relentless tours.

1) We know the reasons behind tapegate unlike with Perry bailing in the middle of the ROR tour.
"Toast?"


2) Kinda true, the ballz on Schon/Cain asking Perry if he felt like doing something in 1989. They should've ASSUMED w/ out the asking that he was still "toast" 3 years after first getting toasted. They should've just known that they should do whatever they wanted at that point (long's it didn't "crack stone ," mind you, as we saw what happened later when they tried the stone-cracking of Journey: a Chalfont-led Journey aborted by a tourless TBF and gag-orders for the band and no-show singing gigs for perry).

3) You that sure a perry-less Journey would've bombed in the '89 climate?

4) Wanted to debate you quoting points with rebuttals followed by your points but I can't use a computer.

[SF-Dano]

Crack up if you will, but how many tours did the Schon/Cain-led Journey just up and cancel in the middle?

None - because when the singer burned out this time they ploughed on regardless...and we all know what happened next....

If it was decisive, perhaps Cain/Schon would NOT have had to ask him what his intent was in '89?

True - but if Schon and Cain had been decisive then they wouldn't have asked....

Wonder what would've happened if at THAT time instead of doing BE they announced an intended new Journey album with Augeri or Chalfont singing.

Same thing. Karaoke. Collapse of album sales. Relentless tours.

1) We know the reasons behind tapegate unlike with Perry bailing in the middle of the ROR tour.
"Toast?"


2) Kinda true, the ballz on Schon/Cain asking Perry if he felt like doing something in 1989. They should've ASSUMED w/ out the asking that he was still "toast" 3 years after first getting toasted. They should've just known that they should do whatever they wanted at that point (long's it didn't "crack stone ," mind you, as we saw what happened later when they tried the stone-cracking of Journey: a Chalfont-led Journey aborted by a tourless TBF and gag-orders for the band and no-show singing gigs for perry).

3) You that sure a perry-less Journey would've bombed in the '89 climate?

Well debated Red.

[fredinator]

Maybe Journey's like the Liberty Bell, you know? Keeps on going even with a crack in it...

I agree with you SF; I listened to BTM a couple of weeks ago, and I might be wrong, but Jon said he got a call from SP and was very wary since he hadn't talked to or seen "the guy" in 10 years... It sounds to me like they hadn't talked to him from 1986...

[JeremyP]

I think that in 1989 Steve was working on his "Against The Wall" album. So he might have been thinking, "Sorry, I'm not ready to go back to Journey, I'm gonna follow up my hit debut album and continue my solo career."

[Red13JoePa]

I think that in 1989 Steve was working on his "Against The Wall" album. So he might have been thinking, "Sorry, I'm not ready to go back to Journey, I'm gonna follow up my hit debut album and continue my solo career."

Yep, bigger and better things to do at that time, right?

He at least started recording that in '88 not '89 and Columbia thought so much of that it's still awaiting a release date.

[whocares]

so... where exactly IS the problem with band members going solo whether temporary or not?

[Red13JoePa]

so... where exactly IS the problem with band members going solo whether temporary or not?

Problem's nowhere until the boundaries of "temporary" begin to push the decade mark.
Then bands get restless, recording sessions begin sans sabatticaling members then recording sessions are halted and superceeded by those sabatticaling members amidst promises to be a team player and tour supporting the record.

[Deb]

SF-Dano if you are talking about me, say so. That is why I said "if Neal actually said that" because I haven't seen the article. I was just saying that I didn't think Neal came across very well in that IMO. I haven't read one article of Perry slamming Schon, probably more the opposite. So sorry to say, that article did nothing in changing my opinion that Perry's got more class. I consider myself quite open-minded, so I don't over-rationalize or ignore facts.......do I like everything Perry has said or done, NOT in the least. If the comments don't sit well, they don't sit well, no matter who it is from. We are all "Journey" fans....I'm more of a Perry fan and you're more of a Schon fan, it's all good.

Not calling you out specifically Strungout. I just got a little pissed off, when I check into this forum this morining and the first thing I see is a thread where someone is calling Neal a dick and trying to prop up Steve Perry as the ideal image of the good-guy. You are correct, we are all "Journey" fans, so IMO, we should be well beyond the point of coming here and having to see BS like that. As I said before, neither Perry or Schon is a saint. Can we all quit trying to prop one or the other up as being a better person at the expense of the other. I have never started a thread like one of these, but I will definately voice my opinion when I see one. I don't have an agenda other than being a Journey fan past, present, and future. Others have an agenda (again not directed at you strungout), and that agenda has always been to prop up Steve Perry and his contributions to the band Journey at the expense of the other members' contributions and reputations.

I can totally understand that, because there has been many a Perry bashing thread that has pissed me off too (AR ). Actually somebody calling Neal a dick is quite mild compared to some of the names/trashing that Perry's been called on here.....just saying put the shoe on the other foot for a minute. And I agree 'agendas' don't belong on a fan forum......some prop up Schon at Perry's expense and others prop up Perry at Schon's expense. People's preferences/opinions are always going to differ........IMO it is all in how those opinions are brought forward.

[NoMoreTails]

In my previous post, I simply stated my opinion of what any observer can see from the outside, sans the referral to the BTM comment about Perry using Neal as an excuse to do a solo record.

I'd say it was more a motivation than an excuse.

Perry's motivation was to build a solo career that would be successful enough for him to ultimately leave Journey. This was undoubtedly what he had in mind way back when he first heard Jon's song Faithfully as he (per Jon) asked if he could have it for his solo album. Surely even you loons can see that Neal's recording a couple of side projects that took about two weeks each had an entirely different purpose than Perry, who dedicated basically the entire year of '84 to his solo venture. Even HSAS took only about a month to write and perform four or five live shows.... 'course if Dano's opinion is going to be dismissed as being biased, mine undoubtedly will be as well as the name celebrates the fact that the band carried on without the pelican.

[brywool]

Neal's album sounded NOTHING like Journey. Steve's did. That's the difference to me at least.

[yogi]

The only way that Steve would not sound like Journey is if he would of sung Polka, Country, or maybe rap. The funny thing was that is what he was going to do until fate stepped in.

There is an article I have somewhere where Neal told Steve to please do a rap album so as it wouldnt sound too much like Journey. Steve agreed to do this provided that Neal would hook Steve up with Dr. Dray(SP) or M.C. Hammer. Steve told the good Dr. that he was cool with the West Coast sound of his rap music.

Two drive bys later Steve was still willing to do a rap album. The problem was that they( lable) wanted Vanilla Ice to do two or three guest spots on Street Talk. Steve was willing to allow him two guest spots until he saw The Ice Man hitting on his longtime girlfriend Sherrie.

This entire ordeal is what inspired Steve to do another rock album with the first release being Oh Sherrie.

I know this wasnt Neals fault, but it really soured Steve on West Coast rap.

When I find the article I will post it here for all of you to read.

[SF-Dano]

The only way that Steve would not sound like Journey is if he would of sung Polka, Country, or maybe rap. The funny thing was that is what he was going to do until fate stepped in.

There is an article I have somewhere where Neal told Steve to please do a rap album so as it wouldnt sound too much like Journey. Steve agreed to do this provided that Neal would hook Steve up with Dr. Dray(SP) or M.C. Hammer. Steve told the good Dr. that he was cool with the West Coast sound of his rap music.

Two drive bys later Steve was still willing to do a rap album. The problem was that they( lable) wanted Vanilla Ice to do two or three guest spots on Street Talk. Steve was willing to allow him two guest spots until he saw The Ice Man hitting on his longtime girlfriend Sherrie.

This entire ordeal is what inspired Steve to do another rock album with the first release being Oh Sherrie.

I know this wasnt Neals fault, but it really soured Steve on West Coast rap.

When I find the article I will post it here for all of you to read.

Holy Crap. I know your just joking, but holy crap anyway.

[Red13JoePa]

The only way that Steve would not sound like Journey is if he would of sung Polka, Country, or maybe rap. The funny thing was that is what he was going to do until fate stepped in.

There is an article I have somewhere where Neal told Steve to please do a rap album so as it wouldnt sound too much like Journey. Steve agreed to do this provided that Neal would hook Steve up with Dr. Dray(SP) or M.C. Hammer. Steve told the good Dr. that he was cool with the West Coast sound of his rap music.

Two drive bys later Steve was still willing to do a rap album. The problem was that they( lable) wanted Vanilla Ice to do two or three guest spots on Street Talk. Steve was willing to allow him two guest spots until he saw The Ice Man hitting on his longtime girlfriend Sherrie.

This entire ordeal is what inspired Steve to do another rock album with the first release being Oh Sherrie.

I know this wasnt Neals fault, but it really soured Steve on West Coast rap.

When I find the article I will post it here for all of you to read.

Holy Crap. I know your just joking, but holy crap anyway.

I think he took a 98 MPH fastball to his earhole when he playied professional baseball, Dano, thereby "enhancing" the creativity of the left side of his brain.

[Aaron]

LOL, Yogi you're pretty funny mate! I'm you, Perry should have changed his voice completely for Street Talk.

If you go by the release dates Neal did go solo before Steve.

If Steve would have just sung his songs using a large bath towel to muffle his voice Neal would have been happy. He asked Steve repeatedly to change his voice for Street Talk. Steve is such a prick he wouldnt do it.

All he had to do was muffled his voice & Neal would of been happy. What an ass for not doing it.

[Aaron]

Larry,

I see it the same as you do. That was my interpretation as well. If Journey was important to Neal then he should have thought about the consequences of doing the outside project. On the other side of the coin, I'm not sure I'd be on board with all of Perry's direction at the time either. My favorite Journey stuff are their first 3 with Perry.

L8r mate,

Aaron

I just finished listening to the Perry interview tonight. Perry said that he objected to Schon doing his first solo record and communicated that to Herbie. From there Schon did a second record and then Steve P did "Street Talk." If that is how it went down, then Schon must be a dick. Thoughts?

aaron , i think its as easy as this:.... perry saw he and neal as a team, when neal went outside he took potential journey riffs and material with him that was normally at perrys disposal.. so the word "betrayed" came up.. perry ran journey at the time and neal wouldnt always play that game.. street talk was created from perry being hurt by neal... street talk was fabulous... hsas was too!! but 3 or 4 songs on both schon and hammer songs were all that were great..should have been used for journey..

[Classic Rock]

Whocares,

My point was that if Perry made it an issue that he wasn't comfortable with Neal doing a solo gig (like a married person having a mistress) and he brought the issue up to Neal as a problem. If Neal ignored the issue and did another record as Perry claims (I don't know the time line) then Neal is a dick in my opinion.

So Neal is a dick because he didn't do everything Perry wanted? You wanted the whole band to be held hostage by Perry even earlier than 1986-1996?

Perry didn't hold Journey hostage. He was totally clear with Schon and Cain in '87 that he didn't want to continue...and Schon and Cain moved on and enjoyed their most successful period without Perry.

NIG said even EARLIER than 1986.

People have the right to believe whatever interviews they want to be believe as SF-DANO was saying earlier in this thread. I choose to believe the Herbie Herbert interview for the most part and I find the following interesting and not hard to believe:

“Steve Perry's solo record in '84, he had a gun to Journey's head. He said, 'Herbie, if you don't kick ass and perform for me on this solo record there is never gonna be another Journey again.' I said, 'Steve, you don't have to do that. You don't have to do that to me. I don't know second gear; I only know high gear and full speed ahead. I don't downshift. You know that.' It's the full court press cause I don't know any other way. I'm gonna move heaven and earth for this record. I don't have any goals on this record, any more than I've ever had a goal for Journey. I'm gonna go as far as I can go. If I had set goals, they would've been far beneath what we've achieved already.' And I did move heaven and earth. I got "Sherrie" to I think number two - another one of my hauntings. I got "Foolish Heart" top ten, and a couple other songs top twenty on that record. It went double platinum in America. At the time (it was) the second most successful solo album by an artist leaving a major group - second only to Bella Donna by Stevie Nicks. Whether it's Daryl Hall and John Oates, or the members of Pink Floyd, or the members of the Cars, or the members of Foreigner, or the members of Boston - every guy that ever tried a solo album - it was just a prescription for failure. No way. Stevie Nicks and Steve Perry were the only ones that were successful. Phil Collins' initial Face Value didn't go gold until many subsequent records brought it along. It was so hard to do that, and he publicly disparaged my performance for him on that record every chance.”

I think if Neal Schon wanted his solo projects to be commercial successes he would have had Herbie do what Perry made him do for his. If by chance Schon’s solo records would have been commercial hit records I don’t believe he would hold a gun to Journey’s head as Perry did.

[Aaron]

Dano,

I like your perspective, thanks for that. Your post spawned one thought, Soul SirkUS. If it would have been as successful as everyone thought, do you think their would be a Journey today? I know its a slightly different twist but I think Neal would have dropped Journey in a heart beat if SS would have taken off. What do you think?

L8r,

Aaron

Lets see, from the 2 Schon and Hammer recordings you guys can come up with two "straight forward" sounding songs in "No More Lies" and "In Self Defense". Personally I would not say ISD is straight forward, but anyway. 2 tunes from 2 records worth of music, well that really sounds like they were out to write a bunch of hit sogns . And they made a video for one. Gee did ya' maybe think they might want to make a little money off the project. As for HSAS, I would say maybe 3 or 4 straight forward rock songs, but the rest of that recording had a more experimental jam vibe to it also.

Street Talk, whatever genre you want to describe it as, pop/R&B/rock, was not experimental or jam oriented. It was music created to produce hits and make alot of money, and to ultimately allow Perry to test the waters for a solo carreer.
I do not think, nor is there any evidence Neal was ever going for a solo or spinoff carreer with his side projects. Now, I can agree that maybe a small arguement can be made against Neal regarding HSAS, but not the Schon and Hammer stuff. But even with HSAS, I don't think they were going for hit songs. Don't tell me that writers like Hagar and Neal could not put together a more hit oriented albut than Through the Fire if that was their goal.

Lastly, if Neal is a dick, then Perry comes across as a whinny, dickless child, crying to Herbie, if Neal gets to do it why can't I. Childish. Perry needed cues from others to make his descisions and still does sometimes it seems. Did he want to continue with Journey after Frontiers (he couldn't decide right away), did he ever officially retire from or quit Journey after ROR (he couldn't decide, had to leave that door open, but only for himslef), could he decide what he wanted to do after TBF( well not for at least two years, we know that). So Neal is the dick? I am sure neither Perry or Neal is a saint, but it seems to me Perry rates much higher on the dick meter that Neal does. Sorry for the rant, but the title of the thread got me a little upset this mornign.

[Aaron]

Brywool,

If Perry is singing then how is it not going to sound like Journey? Its not like he can change the setting on his amp to change is voice, ya know?

L8r,

Aaron

Neal's album sounded NOTHING like Journey. Steve's did. That's the difference to me at least.

[SF-Dano]

Dano,

I like your perspective, thanks for that. Your post spawned one thought, Soul SirkUS. If it would have been as successful as everyone thought, do you think their would be a Journey today? I know its a slightly different twist but I think Neal would have dropped Journey in a heart beat if SS would have taken off. What do you think?

L8r,

Aaron

quote]

Let me preface my response by saying what follows is pure speculation as this scenario did not happen in reality and it can not be compared with what happened in the 80s, because it is a different time and different music business then it was then:

Neal may have moved on with SS, I can agree that was a strong possibility. But, I also think that if Ross as an original member and say Jon would have wanted to continue using the name Journey, I feel, and it is just my opinion, that Neal would let them do it. They would be a touring band only, playing the hits, something like Creedence Clearwater Revisited or Mickey Thomas's Starship. Just my opinion though. Now if they wanted to bring Perry in after Neal left, well that opens up a whole different can of worms......

Let me also say that in my opinion, Planet US and later Soul Sirkus was Neal's attempt to test the waters for life after Journey. I believe Neal was discontent with the decreasing abilities of Augeri for at least a year and half before tapegate broke. As I stated before Neal is not dumb, he has made plenty of poor decisions, but he knows where the money is. And right now the money is with the name "Journey".

[Enigma869]

No, because as Neal has emphasized repeatedly, what he was doing was nothing commerical or even in the same musical class as Journey. Perry's solo music, on the other hand,.....
Let's just say there's a reason many people mistake "Oh Sherrie" as a Journey song.

Sorry TNC...Don't agree with this at all. Anything Perry sings is going to have a Journey connection, somewhere. He was the voice that was Journey, so I don't think someone coming to the conclusion that "Oh Sherrie" (and I heard the same thing about other Perry solo songs, as well) sounds like it could be Journey isn't exactly some earth-shattering revelation. Ever listen to Don Henley??? Tell me one song the guy sings that couldn't have been an Eagles song!!!!

The second part of this argument about Neal is laughable to me. For the record, I think Neal is as good as any guitarist that I've ever listened to. That said, your statement about Neal sort of implies that Neal could have had commercial success, on par with Journey, if he was simply in the mood for it. I think anyone who is honest about Neal, sans Journey, would have to say that couldn't be further from the truth. Neal may not like it, but his success and legacy will forever be intertwined with Journey, and even more specifically, his connection with Perry and Cain!

John from Boston

[Matthew]

In this very thread, there is claimed to be an interview, that Perry told Neal and Jon in '89 that he was done with Journey. I do not dispute that interview may exist. However, there is the BTM where several sources stated that nobody knew what was going on (ie. Perry never made that alleged statement to Neal and Jon) during the whole period from '87 to the time of the proposed re-union that included Rolie and Chalfant. The list of discrepancies goes on and on. You accuse me of being pro-Scon, but I accuse you of being even more pro-Perry. I at least have actions to back up my point of you. The loons, have nothing but words and he said/she said quotes that they rely on as gospel. And revisionist history and rationalization of any actions that Perry may have made that don't come off looking so well.

Actually, I was mistaken - Perry told Schon and Cain he was "done with Journey" only once - in '87.

The interview with Jonahan Cain appeared in an article called SCHON & CAIN USE "BAD ENGLISH" TO DEAL WITH PAST by David Huff and it was broadcast in August 1989. The full transcript is in the archive section of Perryville.

http://steveperry-perryville.com/Cain_Interview.html

Here are a few quotes from the interview:

"(In '87 Steve Perry) didn't want us waiting on him six to eight months down the road, a solo album later, to tell us that he wasn't ready for Journey because it wasn't in his gut to do so. He came clean with me, and said, "Hey, I can't do it again. I don't feel like I have what it takes to do another album for some reason....

He was the leader of the show who finally said, "No more!" We couldn't go on without him. Rather than talking about putting a new Journey together without Steve Perry, rather than forging ahead and trying to put a facelift on the situation like so many bands in the past have tried to do but failed miserably at, Neal and I chose to leave the legacy alive, and that's not taking anything away from the two of us, Journey is just not recognized as Journey without Steve Perry singing the music."

Come on Jonathan, there is more to journey than just the voice. You wrote the songs, Neal's powerful guitar work took the music to another level, and Steve Perry put in the emotion.

"Listen to me, Steve Perry was a lot of the face and the fire, and when he lost the direction and said, "You know, I don't know anymore," that was the point where everything should be laid to rest.

I know Stephen didn't make the decision to leave Journey overnight. He really thought about this from his heart. I don't want Steve Perry's confusion to come across as the only reason Journey broke up."

So was there confusion on your part and that of Neal's?

"All I can say is that collectively, all of us are held responsible for the outcome of the band....

At least Stephen had the guts to say he couldn't do it anymore. Someday, hopefully, he'll figure out why, but now he can't."

How did your meeting with him leave you emotionally?

"I was unhappy when I talked to Stephen at first, and I was in shock. It was a loss for me to think about not making Journey records or not working with Stephen because frankly, I want to reserve that time again for Journey. Stephen can go writing with other people in L.A. or whoever else he wants to, but he knows that if he calls me, it is going to be for Journey. He knows that when Jonathan Cain and Steve Perry sit down, then it's Journey, period.

Neal Schon is Journey, don't get me wrong, but the two of us together doesn't constitute claiming the name whatsoever. We'd be jipping the people out of something that is real special."

When you called Journey's manager, Herbie Herbert with Perry's decision, what did you say to him?

"I told him that there wasn't any way possible that Journey could continue on in it's present state."

And this was after your heart to heart talk with Perry?

"We spoke non-stop for four hours. That's about as heart to heart as you can get. It was the last five minutes however where Stephen said basically, this is it. I admired him for being honest and saying it the way it was."

And how was it?

"It wasn't going to happen, and he didn't want to hang up Neal's life, or my own, on whether or not he was going to participate on a Journey album. He didn't want to leave us with the impression that Journey was going to happen. He knows Journey was a great thing for all of us. However, he felt itwas time to go our separate ways."

[Carlitto H@kk]

Hell, in my opinion, they are BOTH dicks in their own special way.
Face it, they are both perfectionist that have dissimilar ideas
on what is right and wrong for this band and, instead of ever
really coming to some common ground that would
allow them to keep being productive together,
they've parted ways, taken small pot-shots at eachother in the press
and have left fans always wondering, "How could you guys just let
it all fall apart when you were on top of the world?"
Add Cain and his ego/desires to the mix and you actually have 3 perfectionist
dicks that let their personl gains get in the way of remaining a truly
great band. But hey, thats Rock&Roll

[Aaron]

Damn it CH, that kills my Perry is a dick post schedule for next week. Thanks for reading ahead.

Hell, in my opinion, they are BOTH dicks in their own special way.
Face it, they are both perfectionist that have dissimilar ideas
on what is right and wrong for this band and, instead of ever
really coming to some common ground that would
allow them to keep being productive together,
they've parted ways, taken small pot-shots at eachother in the press
and have left fans always wondering, "How could you guys just let
it all fall apart when you were on top of the world?"
Add Cain and his ego/desires to the mix and you actually have 3 perfectionist
dicks that let their personl gains get in the way of remaining a truly
great band. But hey, thats Rock&Roll

[treetopovskaya]

sp sounded like journey before he even joined journey. }:C)

[Carlitto H@kk]

Damn it CH, that kills my Perry is a dick post schedule for next week. Thanks for reading ahead.

Hell, in my opinion, they are BOTH dicks in their own special way.
Face it, they are both perfectionist that have dissimilar ideas
on what is right and wrong for this band and, instead of ever
really coming to some common ground that would
allow them to keep being productive together,
they've parted ways, taken small pot-shots at eachother in the press
and have left fans always wondering, "How could you guys just let
it all fall apart when you were on top of the world?"
Add Cain and his ego/desires to the mix and you actually have 3 perfectionist
dicks that let their personl gains get in the way of remaining a truly
great band. But hey, thats Rock&Roll

Sorry...
but trying to argue over "who's been the biggest Dick at times outa these 2"
is like playing 'Motor-Boat' with Scarlett Johansson's jugs and trying to decide
which one you like better, the right or the left

[squirt1]

As far as being ego driven perfectionists, how about the only child/youngest of the family approach. THe only child is spoiled and the youngest knows how to get their way. I see them as abount the same. Not great negotiators,but stake out territory and defend.

[Enigma869]

As far as being ego driven perfectionists, how about the only child/youngest of the family approach. THe only child is spoiled and the youngest knows how to get their way. I see them as abount the same. Not great negotiators,but stake out territory and defend.

Huh? I think Sigmund Freud might be scratching his head on this one!


John from Boston

[Carlitto H@kk]

As far as being ego driven perfectionists, how about the only child/youngest of the family approach. THe only child is spoiled and the youngest knows how to get their way. I see them as abount the same. Not great negotiators,but stake out territory and defend.

Huh? I think Sigmund Freud might be scratching his head on this one!


John from Boston

Yea, alittle over my head too...

Of course, I'm still thinking about being a
"Motorboatin' Sumbitch" on these pups

[squirt1]

Maybe I had too many kids, but doctors have talked about the oldest of the family, the middle children and the youngest as having certain roles. They discussed if 2 oldest chidren married there is war or 2 youngest children married- war. Middle children are the negociators. Why wouldn't it apply in bands or relationships in general or the workplace. I won't even get into A & B type personalities.