Journey Deny Tapegate "rumours"

[Rockindeano]

FUCKING ABITAMAN!

[Abitaman]

F**KING ABITAMAN!

Hopefully after Monday, well Thursday-ERIC

[Rockindeano]

Fuck Abs, I am fuckin glad you are getting fucking better. those fucking stones are fucking painful. Hope to see you up and about real fucking soon.

[Abitaman]

Go to hospital Monday, to have them lasered, then back Thursday to have stint taken out.YEA!!!!!!!!-ERIC

[hoserama]

It's stupid for them to deny it. Eventually, someone with first hand knowledge is going to spill this story with all of the dirty details. The correct response would be something along the lines of "we were starting to rely on backing voclas a little too much and Steve's voice just wasn't cutting it....so we had to make a change."

Barb, they will never or cannot ever be sued.

The key ingredient is SOUNDBOARD tapes/discs. They will never be made public. Probably already destroyed. I can tell you NO amount of money will sway me to tell a story. NO amount.

Not all soundboards have been destroyed....

[wildone]

It's stupid for them to deny it. Eventually, someone with first hand knowledge is going to spill this story with all of the dirty details. The correct response would be something along the lines of "we were starting to rely on backing voclas a little too much and Steve's voice just wasn't cutting it....so we had to make a change."

Barb, they will never or cannot ever be sued.

The key ingredient is SOUNDBOARD tapes/discs. They will never be made public. Probably already destroyed. I can tell you NO amount of money will sway me to tell a story. NO amount.

Not all soundboards have been destroyed....

There nothing more then a fucking tribute band now!!

[Eric]

No Sherrie. They fucked up. They got away with it. I say good on that. There is a lot this band has had happen to it, much of it bad. I say we cut them a huge break and see what they deliver.

Absolutely do not admit to it.

I agree with you completely on that Dean. I'm just saying they should dodge the question or cushion the answer in some way and not just LIE about it. It could come back to bite them later. I don't want them to be disgraced.

I'm with Sherrie....dodge it forever

[Red13JoePa]

So what? Still doesn't affect my enjoyment of the band before/with/and after Augeri.
It's mildly amusing if this denial indeed happened. That's about it.

BTW I read the original piece and it was 110% ripped from Avatar and the blog.

[The_Noble_Cause]

After all this time, the band STILL has not devised a unified auto-response for confronting this pesky issue?



I expected major obfuscation from the band regarding TapeGate.
I thought Andrew's interviews was probably the shrewdest way for the guys to handle it.
Admit a singer's voice can be a very fragile thing and you have to do what you have to do.

[KCfla]

Hopefully someone can transcribe this or scan it, since a lot of us can't exactly go down to our local store and buy Classic Rock. I'd be very curious to hear what they say.

It's in the past, but I wish they'd just own up to it instead of lying.

I get Classic Rock in the mail. If no one else gets it before me- I'll scan it in for you all

[JeremyP]

I get Classic Rock in the mail. If no one else gets it before me- I'll scan it in for you all

Thanks, I'd really appreciate that.

[AlienC]

After all this time, the band STILL has not devised a unified auto-response for confronting this pesky issue?



I expected major obfuscation from the band regarding TapeGate.
I thought Andrew's interviews was probably the shrewdest way for the guys to handle it.
Admit a singer's voice can be a very fragile thing and you have to do what you have to do.

You're assuming there is someone at the helm with a vision of where to steer the thing in the first place and the integrity to stand up and take responsibility for ANYTHING.

RE-Action seems to be the mindset of the decade.
It's the fate of all "yes" men. The fear of saying the wrong thing means that fear makes all your decisions.
Innovation goes away then.

[ohsherrie]

I get Classic Rock in the mail. If no one else gets it before me- I'll scan it in for you all

Thanks, I'd really appreciate that.

Me too.

[jestor92]

So what happens if JSS blows out his voice like Augeri and Perry (supposedly) did while singing these songs, what will the band do then. (Not saying it's gonna happen or I want it to, just thinking out loud)

Also what is this talk about Lepp using tapes to sing, I've never heard anything about this

[fightingilliniJRNY]

I get Classic Rock in the mail. If no one else gets it before me- I'll scan it in for you all

Thanks, I'd really appreciate that.

Me too.

As would I, if you wouldn't mind.

[KCfla]

I get Classic Rock in the mail. If no one else gets it before me- I'll scan it in for you all

Thanks, I'd really appreciate that.

Me too.

As would I, if you wouldn't mind.

No problem! It will give me an excuse to use the darn thing- I think I've used it twice in the year I've owned it

[wildone]

So what happens if JSS blows out his voice like Augeri and Perry (supposedly) did while singing these songs, what will the band do then. (Not saying it's gonna happen or I want it to, just thinking out loud)

Also what is this talk about Lepp using tapes to sing, I've never heard anything about this

He'll be cut out faster the when SS went down!!!

[Wheels Of Fyre]

...but the pair did address the Augeri rumours with reasonable calm and good grace - one denying them more emphatically than the other.

I've never cared. I figured if they were lipping then it was for good reason(s). No different than when a stage actor is sick and your $150 ticket is reduced to the performance of a stand-in. THE SHOW MUST GO ON. I'm an old theatre actor and I fully understand this motto. Many who believe tapes were used will say that SA was more deceiving than noble. Even if tapes were used I would acknowledge that I don't know enough of the surrounding details to pass judgment. I believe in "innocent until proven guilty". I don't know that SA or JOURNEY were guilty of anything other than doing what was necessary in order to keep the show on the road. Should SA have "been a man" and stepped down previously? Maybe. Again, I don't know enough details to pass that judgment. It's quite possible that he wanted to but couldn't for whatever reason.

The fact of the matter is that NOTHING played live is "live". It's ALL modified electronically in some capacity. Every instrument is technologically enhanced to some degree. It's strange to me that so much latitude is given to a guitar being "tricked" through filters and amps but heaven forbid that a singer have any of it!

It seemed to me that tapes were used to some extent simply because JOURNEY seemed to "confess" with their playing of The Who's "Won't Get Fooled Again" to open some concerts. This recent denial forces me to reconsider that perhaps they were trying to send a different message.

If Neal and Ross deny the tapes then I'm going to value that over anything else simply because it doesn't really matter to me. Ultimately, there's A LOT that goes on behind closed doors regarding contracts, etc. that I'll never know or fully understand therefore getting all worked up about something of which I haven't full knowledge doesn't improve the quality of my life.

[squirt1]

WOW ! Don't you expect a gallon of gas coming through that meter when you pay for a gallon of gas? When I pay big $$$ to see a live concert I don't want to see cd's played. It is fraud ! If it is free then then that is O K. I believe it was a crime . I asked some state reps why they could not check into this. I think many groups are doing it,so why have a concert . We can just stay home and turn on the stereo.

[wildone]

...but the pair did address the Augeri rumours with reasonable calm and good grace - one denying them more emphatically than the other.

I've never cared. I figured if they were lipping then it was for good reason(s). No different than when a stage actor is sick and your $150 ticket is reduced to the performance of a stand-in. THE SHOW MUST GO ON. I'm an old theatre actor and I fully understand this motto. Many who believe tapes were used will say that SA was more deceiving than noble. Even if tapes were used I would acknowledge that I don't know enough of the surrounding details to pass judgment. I believe in "innocent until proven guilty". I don't know that SA or JOURNEY were guilty of anything other than doing what was necessary in order to keep the show on the road. Should SA have "been a man" and stepped down previously? Maybe. Again, I don't know enough details to pass that judgment. It's quite possible that he wanted to but couldn't for whatever reason.

The fact of the matter is that NOTHING played live is "live". It's ALL modified electronically in some capacity. Every instrument is technologically enhanced to some degree. It's strange to me that so much latitude is given to a guitar being "tricked" through filters and amps but heaven forbid that a singer have any of it!

It seemed to me that tapes were used to some extent simply because JOURNEY seemed to "confess" with their playing of The Who's "Won't Get Fooled Again" to open some concerts. This recent denial forces me to reconsider that perhaps they were trying to send a different message.

If Neal and Ross deny the tapes then I'm going to value that over anything else simply because it doesn't really matter to me. Ultimately, there's A LOT that goes on behind closed doors regarding contracts, etc. that I'll never know or fully understand therefore getting all worked up about something of which I haven't full knowledge doesn't improve the quality of my life.

so where was our reduction in admission????????

[Wheels Of Fyre]

WOW ! Don't you expect a gallon of gas coming through that meter when you pay for a gallon of gas? When I pay big $$$ to see a live concert I don't want to see cd's played. It is fraud ! If it is free then then that is O K. I believe it was a crime . I asked some state reps why they could not check into this. I think many groups are doing it,so why have a concert . We can just stay home and turn on the stereo.

Like so many others you sound surprised. You speak as though using tapes is a NEW concept. It's been going on FOR YEARS with MANY artists.

Milli Vanilli is perhaps the most notable "violators" however their "crime" doesn't even compare. MV PURPOSELY tried to deceive consumers. They had a couple good singers who weren't so easy on the eyes so they put the pretty boys faces on the albums purely to increase album sales.

What JOURNEY has alleged to do is nowhere near this sort of thing. In fact nobody knows EXACTLY what transpired. The fact that no one has put together a class action law suit for consumer fraud makes it clear that the so-called evidence is not without question.

[Wheels Of Fyre]

...but the pair did address the Augeri rumours with reasonable calm and good grace - one denying them more emphatically than the other.

I've never cared. I figured if they were lipping then it was for good reason(s). No different than when a stage actor is sick and your $150 ticket is reduced to the performance of a stand-in. THE SHOW MUST GO ON. I'm an old theatre actor and I fully understand this motto. Many who believe tapes were used will say that SA was more deceiving than noble. Even if tapes were used I would acknowledge that I don't know enough of the surrounding details to pass judgment. I believe in "innocent until proven guilty". I don't know that SA or JOURNEY were guilty of anything other than doing what was necessary in order to keep the show on the road. Should SA have "been a man" and stepped down previously? Maybe. Again, I don't know enough details to pass that judgment. It's quite possible that he wanted to but couldn't for whatever reason.

The fact of the matter is that NOTHING played live is "live". It's ALL modified electronically in some capacity. Every instrument is technologically enhanced to some degree. It's strange to me that so much latitude is given to a guitar being "tricked" through filters and amps but heaven forbid that a singer have any of it!

It seemed to me that tapes were used to some extent simply because JOURNEY seemed to "confess" with their playing of The Who's "Won't Get Fooled Again" to open some concerts. This recent denial forces me to reconsider that perhaps they were trying to send a different message.

If Neal and Ross deny the tapes then I'm going to value that over anything else simply because it doesn't really matter to me. Ultimately, there's A LOT that goes on behind closed doors regarding contracts, etc. that I'll never know or fully understand therefore getting all worked up about something of which I haven't full knowledge doesn't improve the quality of my life.

so where was our reduction in admission????????

Simple. Collect all of your evidence to support that you've been duped and sue them.

[The_Noble_Cause]

You're assuming there is someone at the helm with a vision of where to steer the thing in the first place and the integrity to stand up and take responsibility for ANYTHING.

No, I’m assuming each band member has a vested stake in walking away from this malodorous issue as unscathed as possible.
Mutually agreeing on how to handle a tightrope issue (destined to rear its ugly head), doesn't require natural born leadership; isn’t it just a matter of good common sense?

Neal never toed the line when it concerned Perry's brittle hip charges.
So why is he now taking the gym sock from his jeans and clamping down on it to prevent releasing the fire in his belly towards SA?
Straight talk from the band would be a much-needed good will gesture to fans everywhere right now.

JSS's cussing prevents me from doubting his sincerity.
Let's hear some more of that.

[ohsosoto]

You're assuming there is someone at the helm with a vision of where to steer the thing in the first place and the integrity to stand up and take responsibility for ANYTHING.

No, I’m assuming each band member has a vested stake in walking away from this malodorous issue as unscathed as possible.
Mutually agreeing on how to handle a tightrope issue (destined to rear its ugly head), doesn't require natural born leadership; isn’t it just a matter of good common sense?

Neal never toed the line when it concerned Perry's brittle hip charges.
So why is he now taking the gym sock from his jeans and clamping down on it to prevent releasing the fire in his belly towards SA?
Straight talk from the band would be a much-needed good will gesture to fans everywhere right now.

JSS's cussing prevents me from doubting his sincerity.
Let's hear some more of that.

-OOOHHH!

[Red13JoePa]

So they are denying it. Not avoiding it or moving on, but actually DENYING it?

Yeah, your criticsm is deserved on the three remaining guys, however, I know you are a Perry fan. He has his share of fucking people over too, trust me, he is anything but innocent.

Agreed, Dean!

[Jana]

So they are denying it. Not avoiding it or moving on, but actually DENYING it?

Yeah, your criticsm is deserved on the three remaining guys, however, I know you are a Perry fan. He has his share of fucking people over too, trust me, he is anything but innocent.

Agreed, Dean!

plus one.

[Red13JoePa]

This may piss some people off, but I don't give a shit. Since when have I ever given a shit if I pissed someone off?


I hope they never acknowledge it. Screw it. It's over with and done. I am pro fucking Journey and will always be, as long as they are Journey.

Fantastic sentiment very big of you.

[Don]

I love how this two year old post got dug to be on top of the leader board.
Since we are in the mood for reminiscing, here's Swedish Producer Svante Pettersson with some more info.

DATELINE Mon, Jun 12 2006 12:15 am

I am just back from Sweden Rock Festival, one of Europe's biggest hard
rock festivals. At the festival, I was working for Swedish Radio as a
producer for some of the live recordings done for the radio. Normally,
I am a live sound engineer but once a year, I tag along with my old
friends at Swedish Radio to have some fun on this great festival.

The biggest topic of discussion among our crew during the festival was
without doubt the Journey show. Things started off weird in the
afternoon when we realised that not only had they brought their
producer and studio engineer Kevin Elson along to mix the show, he had
also set up his FOH world at the very back of the house, backstage! He
was standing behind our recording truck with his stuff, listening to
the mix through two stage wedges standing on top of his console.

We were recording the show for the radio and the SRF dvd but beside our
48 track Pro Tools recording, we were told by Elson numerous times that
we also needed to record his mix that went to the PA. Fine, an extra
stand alone CD recorder was brought in.

I watched the show from out front and had a great time. The band
sounded excellent. I decided to watch the rest of the show from the
recording truck. Good sound and tv monitors with a feed from the big
screen out front. Even better than watching in your living room. :^) I
went backstage and on the way, I checked out Kevin Elson in action at
the same time.

When I got into the truck, our engineers was making funny faces and
saying things like, "poor guy!" Lead singer Steve Augeri could not sing
at all! No, it's not the old rethoric of calling a singer with a bad
day someone who "can't sing". Steve Augeri was constantly out of tune
and when he tried to reach the high parts, his voice just died in a sad
croak. But didn't it sound good in the PA out front? I went out to
check again. Yes, the vocals sounded terrific. Was I going insane?

I went back into the bus and the engineers started to question my
sanity too as nothing could be done out front to fix this disaster. The
main project manager for our business at the festival showed up and was
as surprised and puzzled as I was when he heard what was coming down
that vocal line to the truck.

After a lot of running back and forth and scratching of heads, one of
the recording engineers plugged in a pair of headphones into the CD
recorder that was recording Elson's house mix. In that mix, the vocals
were perfect. With one headphone on and the other listening to our feed
in the bus it was obvious that something fishy was going on.

We looked at our surveillance camera on stage and noticed a guy sitting
a bit out of place to the left of the drum tech. I went up on stage to
have a look and there was a guy with two digital multitrack recorders,
apparently sending a prerecorded, correct vocal to the house mix but
not to our bus. There were also some prerecorded synth pads and backing
vocals but we got those to the bus.

This raised so many questions and things running in our heads:

* This was not a temporary solution to help a guy having a bad day on
tour. You don't bring that rack with recorders and one extra guy on
tour to have a backup in case the singer gets a cold. Ok, the rack and
the operator could have been flown in but wouldn't it have been easier
to just cancel the show if the guy was sick?

* Another thing suggesting this was not just a guy with a bad throat
was that in our feed, the "real" live vocal line, Mr. Augeri was not
holding back like he probably should have done if he had a bad throat.
He was launching head first into the performance screaming his lungs
off. If he has a throat problem, it will only get worse by this
behaviour.

* Neal Schon of Journey has said in interviews that Augeri had throat
problems on the last tour, forcing them to use the drummer to sing lead
vocals on some songs. On the last album, Augeri sings half the songs
and the other members sing the rest. "Because it was fun" according to
interviews with band members. Yeah, maybe so but maybe also to help a
singer who can't sing?

* If the singer really is this bad, why not just kick him out?

* The other band members put on a stellar show. How do they feel on the
bus every night knowing they have to substitute their singer with a
tape? How fun can that be?

* How could Kevin Elson think that our recording engineers wouldn't
notice anything? Wouldn't it have been easier to feed the prerecorded
vocals to our bus too, or just deny us to record the band. We get to
record many bands but there are those that refuse too, without giving
any particular reasons. The first time one of our engineers went out to
talk to Elson during the show, Elson had the fixed vocals in his
monitors but he told our guy that "we probably have to take this home
and fix the vocals", as if Augeri had a bad day. Why lie a colleague
right in the face like that? Later, the cd from the FOH mix was
approved for broadcast the next day. No fixing needed because it was
already fixed.

I don't have any strong feelings against spicing up a live show with
some fatter backing vocals or backup things that makes the show better
but substituting the lead vocals? Reverse karaoke? I'm a big Journey
fan and I don't get sad or angry, just very confused.

/Svante

[Jana]

This may piss some people off, but I don't give a shit. Since when have I ever given a shit if I pissed someone off?


I hope they never acknowledge it. Screw it. It's over with and done. I am pro fucking Journey and will always be, as long as they are Journey.

Fantastic sentiment very big of you.

I agree with Deano. Interesting reading from back then.

[Red13JoePa]

I love how this two year old post got dug to be on top of the leader board.

You guys are a better tagteam than The Hart Foundation was in the 80s.

Hm, wonder who plays the Jimmy "Mouth Of The South" Hart role.