OT: Patriots Are DONE!

[Michigan Girl]

Nice assumption.....WRONG! I'm a Lions fan.....nice try though.

Well then....you're REALLY having a bad day today!!

Hey, hey, hey.........friend......

Yeah but your Cowboys whooped on my Browns.....so today isn't a wash for you!!

True....But the Lions have my heart.....

Well in that case....I feel your pain girlfriend!!

& I feel yours.......

[RossValoryRocks]

Name a more talented player than this guy

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

[Michigan Girl]

Name a more talented player than this guy

God, I miss him.......

[S2M]

Name a more talented player than this guy

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

You're tripping.....Barry was 10x the backs they were.

And when you are done hanging with my AV - let me know....

[Luvsaugeri]

Nice assumption.....WRONG! I'm a Lions fan.....nice try though.

Well then....you're REALLY having a bad day today!!

Hey, hey, hey.........friend......

Yeah but your Cowboys whooped on my Browns.....so today isn't a wash for you!!

Ill apologize in advance for next week!!

[RossValoryRocks]

Name a more talented player than this guy

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

You're tripping.....Barry was 10x the backs they were.

And when you are done hanging with my AV - let me know....

You are out of your mind bro. Jim Brown might be the best back EVER for any era. Have you ever actually watched some of his games?? UNREAL what he did.
Payton was the best back since Brown. Sanders was a phenomenal player on a terrible team, but there are other backs who were as good if not better.

[conversationpc]

You are out of your mind bro. Jim Brown might be the best back EVER for any era. Have you ever actually watched some of his games?? UNREAL what he did.
Payton was the best back since Brown. Sanders was a phenomenal player on a terrible team, but there are other backs who were as good if not better.

Yeah, I would have to agree that Jim Brown is still the best running back in the history of the game but Sanders isn't far behind.

[S2M]

Name a more talented player than this guy

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

You're tripping.....Barry was 10x the backs they were.

And when you are done hanging with my AV - let me know....

You are out of your mind bro. Jim Brown might be the best back EVER for any era. Have you ever actually watched some of his games?? UNREAL what he did.
Payton was the best back since Brown. Sanders was a phenomenal player on a terrible team, but there are other backs who were as good if not better.

If Barry had an O-line, he'd have had 25,000 yards. Guy NEVER got hit. Broke more ankles than a Bank got dimes. Sure, he wasn't a powerback, but why hold THAT against him.

I'd like to hear a case for Payton, and Brown.

[conversationpc]

If Barry had an O-line, he'd have had 25,000 yards. Guy NEVER got hit. Broke more ankles than a Bank got dimes. Sure, he wasn't a powerback, but why hold THAT against him.

I'd like to hear a case for Payton, and Brown.

Barry got hit plenty. My guess is he led the leage almost every year in tackles for losses but, then again, that's probably mostly due to his crap offensive line.

However, Brown scored more touchdowns, 106 to 99, than Sanders in over 700 less rushing attempts. He also averaged more yards, 5.2 to 5.0, than Sanders. I don't know about Brown's offensive line, though, since he played back in the 50s and 60s, I doubt we could even compare the o-lines of the two teams.

[Enigma869]

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

I believe the consensus of most NFL historians is that Jim Brown was the greatest running back ever. Having watched many films of Brown, it's tough to argue against it. I would also say that comparing Brown and Sanders is like comparing Larry Bird to Michael Jordan. They were both great players, but really had nothing in common (style wise). Brown ran over people, and Sanders ran away from people. Brown couldn't be tackled, and Sanders couldn't be caught!

As for Payton being better than Sanders...I don't agree. I saw Payton's entire career and he was a GREAT player, and a better person. That said, he didn't have half the moves Sanders had. Sanders was a GREAT, GREAT, GREAT running back, who played on HORRENDOUS Lions teams (not that there is any other kind of Lions team). The other thing that most football fans don't quite comprehend is just how important an offensive line is. Sanders had ZERO help on the line, his entire career! Sanders is the only guy I ever saw (including Brown) get pushed back 15 yards, only to come out on the other side of the field and gain 40 yards. He was simply a remarkable football player that never got the credit he deserved, because he was forced to toil away in obscurity for that god-awful Lions franchise!


John from Boston

[RossValoryRocks]

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

I believe the consensus of most NFL historians is that Jim Brown was the greatest running back ever. Having watched many films of Brown, it's tough to argue against it. I would also say that comparing Brown and Sanders is like comparing Larry Bird to Michael Jordan. They were both great players, but really had nothing in common (style wise). Brown ran over people, and Sanders ran away from people. Brown couldn't be tackled, and Sanders couldn't be caught!

As for Payton being better than Sanders...I don't agree. I saw Payton's entire career and he was a GREAT player, and a better person. That said, he didn't have half the moves Sanders had. Sanders was a GREAT, GREAT, GREAT running back, who played on HORRENDOUS Lions teams (not that there is any other kind of Lions team). The other thing that most football fans don't quite comprehend is just how important an offensive line is. Sanders had ZERO help on the line, his entire career! Sanders is the only guy I ever saw (including Brown) get pushed back 15 yards, only to come out on the other side of the field and gain 40 yards. He was simply a remarkable football player that never got the credit he deserved, because he was forced to toil away in obscurity for that god-awful Lions franchise!


John from Boston

You might have convinced me about Payton here. But Brown is still IMO the best ever.

You are right about different styles for sure.

[S2M]

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

I believe the consensus of most NFL historians is that Jim Brown was the greatest running back ever. Having watched many films of Brown, it's tough to argue against it. I would also say that comparing Brown and Sanders is like comparing Larry Bird to Michael Jordan. They were both great players, but really had nothing in common (style wise). Brown ran over people, and Sanders ran away from people. Brown couldn't be tackled, and Sanders couldn't be caught!

As for Payton being better than Sanders...I don't agree. I saw Payton's entire career and he was a GREAT player, and a better person. That said, he didn't have half the moves Sanders had. Sanders was a GREAT, GREAT, GREAT running back, who played on HORRENDOUS Lions teams (not that there is any other kind of Lions team). The other thing that most football fans don't quite comprehend is just how important an offensive line is. Sanders had ZERO help on the line, his entire career! Sanders is the only guy I ever saw (including Brown) get pushed back 15 yards, only to come out on the other side of the field and gain 40 yards. He was simply a remarkable football player that never got the credit he deserved, because he was forced to toil away in obscurity for that god-awful Lions franchise!


John from Boston

You might have convinced me about Payton here. But Brown is still IMO the best ever.

You are right about different styles for sure.

The difference in their stats is negligible.....I guess you just prefer Brown.

[Michigan Girl]

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

I believe the consensus of most NFL historians is that Jim Brown was the greatest running back ever. Having watched many films of Brown, it's tough to argue against it. I would also say that comparing Brown and Sanders is like comparing Larry Bird to Michael Jordan. They were both great players, but really had nothing in common (style wise). Brown ran over people, and Sanders ran away from people. Brown couldn't be tackled, and Sanders couldn't be caught!

As for Payton being better than Sanders...I don't agree. I saw Payton's entire career and he was a GREAT player, and a better person. That said, he didn't have half the moves Sanders had. Sanders was a GREAT, GREAT, GREAT running back, who played on HORRENDOUS Lions teams (not that there is any other kind of Lions team). The other thing that most football fans don't quite comprehend is just how important an offensive line is. Sanders had ZERO help on the line, his entire career! Sanders is the only guy I ever saw (including Brown) get pushed back 15 yards, only to come out on the other side of the field and gain 40 yards. He was simply a remarkable football player that never got the credit he deserved, because he was forced to toil away in obscurity for that god-awful Lions franchise!


John from Boston

As usual, John, you have such a way with words.... I have to agree, although I will say Barry Sanders was ELECTRIFYING!!!

[JrnyScarab]

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

I believe the consensus of most NFL historians is that Jim Brown was the greatest running back ever. Having watched many films of Brown, it's tough to argue against it. I would also say that comparing Brown and Sanders is like comparing Larry Bird to Michael Jordan. They were both great players, but really had nothing in common (style wise). Brown ran over people, and Sanders ran away from people. Brown couldn't be tackled, and Sanders couldn't be caught!

As for Payton being better than Sanders...I don't agree. I saw Payton's entire career and he was a GREAT player, and a better person. That said, he didn't have half the moves Sanders had. Sanders was a GREAT, GREAT, GREAT running back, who played on HORRENDOUS Lions teams (not that there is any other kind of Lions team). The other thing that most football fans don't quite comprehend is just how important an offensive line is. Sanders had ZERO help on the line, his entire career! Sanders is the only guy I ever saw (including Brown) get pushed back 15 yards, only to come out on the other side of the field and gain 40 yards. He was simply a remarkable football player that never got the credit he deserved, because he was forced to toil away in obscurity for that god-awful Lions franchise!


John from Boston

As usual, John, you have such a way with words.... I have to agree, although I will say Barry Sanders was ELECTRIFYING!!!

I only watched a few games that Sanders played in. I have to tell you -- I was completely amazed at that mans ability to bounce off people and stop and change directions instantly. It was like watching a pinball bounce around in a pinball game. You were never quite sure where he was going.

[Enigma869]

Sources: Brady out with ACL tear
By Michael Silver, Yahoo! Sports
2 hours, 55 minutes ago

New England Patriots quarterback Tom Brady is expected to miss the rest of the 2008 season with a torn anterior cruciate ligament in his left knee, according to a source familiar with the injury.

While New England coach Bill Belichick said in his postgame press conference that he had no update on the status of Brady’s injury, two sources indicated it involved serious damage to the knee.

“It’s bad,” a team source said. “We’re going to have to play without him.”

Brady was hurt as he stepped up in the pocket to make a throw to wideout Randy Moss. Chiefs safety Bernard Pollard, who was on the ground, lunged forward and struck Brady’s leg, which buckled as he released the ball.

Brady was helped off the field and was later led down a staircase by team officials, presumably to undergo tests.

Fourth-year quarterback Matt Cassel, who had thrown just 39 passes in his career before Sunday, replaced Brady and completed 13 of 18 passes for 152 yards and a touchdown. Cassel, who backed up Carson Palmer and Matt Leinart at USC, hasn’t been a starting quarterback since high school. He won a competition with Matt Gutierrez during the preseason to retain the job as Brady’s primary backup.



Hmmmmm....Who was the guy who called this exact injury at the beginning of this thread! See that...If you watch enough football, you don't even need x-rays Rumor is that the Patriots are bringing in Chris Simms (Phil's kid) for a physical tomorrow (god, help me). All I can say is...the rest of the AFC should have some fun this season, because the Patriots will NOT be going to the playoffs! My prediction is that Pittsburgh beats Dallas in the Super Bowl!


John from Boston

[Michigan Girl]

Sources: Brady out with ACL tear
By Michael Silver, Yahoo! Sports
2 hours, 55 minutes ago

New England Patriots quarterback Tom Brady is expected to miss the rest of the 2008 season with a torn anterior cruciate ligament in his left knee, according to a source familiar with the injury.

While New England coach Bill Belichick said in his postgame press conference that he had no update on the status of Brady’s injury, two sources indicated it involved serious damage to the knee.

“It’s bad,” a team source said. “We’re going to have to play without him.”

Brady was hurt as he stepped up in the pocket to make a throw to wideout Randy Moss. Chiefs safety Bernard Pollard, who was on the ground, lunged forward and struck Brady’s leg, which buckled as he released the ball.

Brady was helped off the field and was later led down a staircase by team officials, presumably to undergo tests.

Fourth-year quarterback Matt Cassel, who had thrown just 39 passes in his career before Sunday, replaced Brady and completed 13 of 18 passes for 152 yards and a touchdown. Cassel, who backed up Carson Palmer and Matt Leinart at USC, hasn’t been a starting quarterback since high school. He won a competition with Matt Gutierrez during the preseason to retain the job as Brady’s primary backup.



Hmmmmm....Who was the guy who called this exact injury at the beginning of this thread! See that...If you watch enough football, you don't even need x-rays Rumor is that the Patriots are bringing in Chris Simms (Phil's kid) for a physical tomorrow (god, help me). All I can say is...the rest of the AFC should have some fun this season, because the Patriots will NOT be going to the playoffs! My prediction is that Pittsburgh beats Dallas in the Super Bowl!
John from Boston

Awwww, man, if you're gonna be right with your predictions don't say that!!!

[JrnyScarab]

All I can say is...the rest of the AFC should have some fun this season, because the Patriots will NOT be going to the playoffs! My prediction is that Pittsburgh beats Dallas in the Super Bowl!


John from Boston

John, we can only hope the Pats defense is extremely stingy this year and Cassel just manages a conservative game like the Pats of 2001 when Brady first stepped in.

[Enigma869]

John, we can only hope the Pats defense is extremely stingy this year and Cassel just manages a conservative game like the Pats of 2001 when Brady first stepped in.

Cassel will NOT be the QB of this team, all season. I'm not sure who it will be, but it won't be him. There is a reason the Patriots are bringing in Chris Simms already for a tryout. I wouldn't be shocked if the next call goes to Daunte Culpepper!


John from Boston

[JrnyScarab]

John, we can only hope the Pats defense is extremely stingy this year and Cassel just manages a conservative game like the Pats of 2001 when Brady first stepped in.

Cassel will NOT be the QB of this team, all season. I'm not sure who it will be, but it won't be him. There is a reason the Patriots are bringing in Chris Simms already for a tryout. I wouldn't be shocked if the next call goes to Daunte Culpepper!


John from Boston

Culpepper! They definitely have screwed up by not having a QB on the roster with experience other than Brady. Whoever they go after will have to learn the system on the fly. I'm not getting my hopes up this year. This is gonna suck!

[YoungJRNY]

Depth is SO important in todays NFL it isn't even funny. The backup reserved should be ready at all costs and Cassel proved it today by looking good. KC has to be the most embarrassing team I've ever watched, but give credit when credits due. The Pats have the easiest schedule in the league and it couldn't have come at a better time, but it got just a tad bit harder with TB goin' down. Givin the time frame, someone like Byron Leftwhich would of been a good emergency pickup, or Culpepper. There isn't much left on the table as far as Simms goes..maybe they could make a push for a proven vet like Charlie Batch who might be cleared for trade bait the next couple weeks. They need to do something and act fast because defensive coordinators will rest easy tonight knowing the beast has just fallen. We will see.

[Arianddu]

I've been trying to follow this thread with some vague idea of comprehension, but I have to confess, I now have this overwhelming desire to stick my fingers in my ears, close my eyes and sing Rugby songs very, very loudly after reading all of this thread.

[Journey/Survivor]

Name a more talented player than this guy

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

You're tripping.....Barry was 10x the backs they were.

And when you are done hanging with my AV - let me know....

You are out of your mind bro. Jim Brown might be the best back EVER for any era. Have you ever actually watched some of his games?? UNREAL what he did.
Payton was the best back since Brown. Sanders was a phenomenal player on a terrible team, but there are other backs who were as good if not better.

Jim Brown may be the greatest FOOTBALL player of all time?

[RossValoryRocks]

Name a more talented player than this guy

Jim Brown...Walter Payton...to name just 2...

You're tripping.....Barry was 10x the backs they were.

And when you are done hanging with my AV - let me know....

You are out of your mind bro. Jim Brown might be the best back EVER for any era. Have you ever actually watched some of his games?? UNREAL what he did.
Payton was the best back since Brown. Sanders was a phenomenal player on a terrible team, but there are other backs who were as good if not better.

Jim Brown may be the greatest FOOTBALL player of all time?

RB...I think you have to look at the individual positions.

[Enigma869]

RB...I think you have to look at the individual positions.

Journey/Survivor thinks Bernie Kosar is one of the best players of all-time, also. If they played for Cleveland, nobody could possibly be better! Now, back to reality...I agree with you that it is impossible in football to say one guy was "the greatest player ever". It simply doesn't work, and it has to be looked at, by position. Comparing Jim Brown to Joe Montana is simply moronic. If someone wants to say that Jim Brown is the greatest running back ever, I'll at least listen to the argument. I won't listen to an argument for any one player who is "the greatest of all time", because it's just not something that can be intelligently argued, when discussing NFL football.


John from Boston

[7 Wishes]

You cheat.....it comes back to bite you!!

Fuck you.

[Journey/Survivor]

RB...I think you have to look at the individual positions.

Journey/Survivor thinks Bernie Kosar is one of the best players of all-time, also. If they played for Cleveland, nobody could possibly be better! Now, back to reality...I agree with you that it is impossible in football to say one guy was "the greatest player ever". It simply doesn't work, and it has to be looked at, by position. Comparing Jim Brown to Joe Montana is simply moronic. If someone wants to say that Jim Brown is the greatest running back ever, I'll at least listen to the argument. I won't listen to an argument for any one player who is "the greatest of all time", because it's just not something that can be intelligently argued, when discussing NFL football.


John from Boston

First off, fuck off.

Second of all I've never been a Kosar fan, I think a QB should be able to move better than Frankenstein. I was a much bigger Brian Sipe fan.

You can argue that Jim Brown was more dominating at his position than say Joe Montana was at his.

Who was a better Baseball player, Ted Williams or Oil Can Boyd? Williams was an outfielder and Boyd a pitcher so therefore obviously not playing the same position. Yet it's clear as day that Williams was the better player and to argue otherwise would be ridiculous. You can fairly compare a RB and a QB.

[7 Wishes]

That was pretty close to being a cheap shot. You don't take a guy out from below the knee like that when he's already released the damned ball.

[stevew2]

everyone is drunk or dead

[Saint John]

For all of you Patriot haters, it's time to celebrate! The Pats are DONE! Brady is out of the game with what looks to be a serious knee injury. No official word yet, but based on my personal experience, looks to be an ACL injury. If that's the case, he's done for the season, and the Patriots won't win 5 games. Looks like the Jets are winning the AFC East!


John from Boston

You're out of your fucking tree. Pats are still an 11-5ish team. They'll be fine. Belichick will use this injury for motivation and get the very best out of each and every player. They are still a very good football team.

[conversationpc]

That was pretty close to being a cheap shot. You don't take a guy out from below the knee like that when he's already released the damned ball.

Nah...He was in the process of throwing the ball when he got hit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDj0rzxJkq0