Schon bewildered by Perry silence

[The Sushi Hunter]

Pix of them together, they aren't pissed. So why is it that sometimes there is talk that they had this huge falling out and hate each other's guts?

[JRNYMAN]

Without sourcing your comments (which I assume is Neal), you know what you are stating is pure speculation,

If there's one thing I've learned about this site over the years, it's to NEVER state anything as fact if you can't provide verifiable sources or you will be crucified. And, in this case, the points I cited I feel are common knowledge-enough in this forum that I sincerely felt providing links to each statement would be seen as an insult to the regular readers/participants here.

...and because you cannot have Perry's side of the story, there's no way you can have an objective perspective on it..

To some extent you're correct but due to Perry's silence on the statements/accusations when he's had ample opportunities and time to "set the record straight", as it were, it only helps to strengthen the belief in what has been stated by Neal, Herbie, journalists, etc.

While I don't doubt there is some truth in your comment, you also have to remember that Herbie was with Neal a LONG time, and considered him a son... and had no such history with Perry.. that will slant Herbie's opinion...

Oh most definitely. Herbie's relationship with Neal most assuredly slanted his opinions but as someone who had a front row seat to the implosion of the band and the damage left in Perry's wake and perhaps more importantly was/is not bound by the confidentiality agreements et al, brought by Perry, Herbie's statements about Perry's actions and the persona only seen by Journey insiders can be believed as fact. Rest assured if anyone associated with the band were to state publicly anything that was untrue about Perry, they'd find themself in a whirlwind of legal proceedings very quickly.
Certainly, my own personal feelings about what happened are blatantly peppered in with my statements because I'm bitter. However, if you edit the portions of my post which are basically biased adjectives, you're left with statements which are absolutely true and factual and have been discussed in this very forum numerous times by longtime members.

Besides, it still doesn't disprove my point.. that currently it is Neal who is the one bringing up Perry publicly... not the other way around (Perry bringing up Neal)

Agreed and nothing I posted attempted to dispute your statement.

I know you used to play, not sure how many bands you've been in... but I've been in enough bands to know that being in a band is like marrying 4 or 5 people all at the same time... its a Pandora's box from Hell personality-wise... NO ONE sees eye-to-eye...

You're preaching to the choir my friend! In my early 20's I ended up living with some or all or the band members a few times. That arrangement takes personality issues/clashes to a new level entirely!

At the end of the day, what it all boils down to is it didn't/doesn't have to be this way. Both Perry and Neal are incredibly passionate about Journey and what it accomplished and for that they can both be very proud. But at some point, the anger and personal feelings were allowed to not only interfere with but erode the foundation upon which Journey was conceived and created which ultimately became something extremely personal and important to the fans. We Journey fans are a breed apart with regard to our passion and appreciation for the music that was so much a part of who we are and how we got to where we are now and to still have the band who's songs were the soundtrack to my teenage years, then my young adult years, then my middle years, still around and creating music is a very rare and wonderful thing. What makes it so damned frustrating and perhaps even heart-breaking is the fact that those individuals who are responsible for creating and providing the music we hold so dear are still alive and could put their differences aside if they wanted to but won't because of personal pride, egos, etc. and as far as I'm concerned, that's nothing more than selfishness. They are on record as stating that Journey is much bigger than any single one of them yet, it's their individual stubbornness that keeps things where they are currently.

[Onestepper]

Take it for what it's worth, but a buddy of mine is a local DJ for a station that was sponsoring the Journey show in St. Louis a few summers ago. He told me that he was backstage and asked NS if he ever thought Perry would return. Schon told him in no uncertain terms that he hated Perry. He literally said "he told me that he hates his guts for what he did to the band" And he felt the feeling was genuine. My point is that if he really felt that way, I'm pretty sure it's gotten back to Perry at some point. Who knows.

I'd be hard pressed to believe Schon, as tactless and cold-blooded as he can be, would make a statement that candid and that specific to some DJ who managed to get himself backstage and close enough to Neal to get his attention long enough to ask a question he's heard more times than any other question in his life. I mean, why would Neal change the canned answer he's been giving for eons to something that blunt to some guy he doesn't know from Adam?
Nah.... there's no way he put himself out there like that - especially to someone who has the ability to reach thousands and thousands of listeners.

That's cool. I don't expect everyone to take 3rd party story telling. I believe him because he's my friend of 15 years, and he had no reason to lie to me or even fabricate something. But to think Neal doesn't just say or do stuff off the cuff is silly. There is plenty of documentation of that for you to see for yourself. I don't put it past anyone saying anything about anyone else when emotions are involved.

[DracIsBack]

to the implosion of the band and the damage left in Perry's wake and perhaps more importantly was/is not bound by the confidentiality agreements et al, brought by Perry, Herbie's statements about Perry's actions and the persona only seen by Journey insiders can be believed as fact.

Or his version of them. Not that I disagree that the evidence against Perry is damning, but:

a) A lot of people in this forum act as though they were personally there to witness all this ... they weren't.
b) Every time Herbie opens his mouth about what an asshole Steve Perry was, he comes across as a completely arrogant asshole himself.

Quiet asshole vs. Obnoxious asshole ... but still two assholes.

[Kor'n]

Neal needs to make up his mind about who's mad at who... because in all the years, of all the interviews Perry has done..Perry has been nothing but gracious about the Neal.

He has definitely made himself look like the bigger man in interviews/speaking publicly- No question about it. He speaks of the Journey years that included him reverently and respectfully as if that moment in time were sacred and he portrays the relationship he had with Neal as something so very special and unique.

Yep, "silence is golden." Maybe, but "if it were not for the music probably would not be together." (TBF 1996)

It's what isn't or can't be discussed that makes Perry a snake in the grass. Just like Herbie stated in the Castles Burning interview, (paraphrasing...) "Perry would sell his own mother if he....."

Don't think any person in his/her right mind would question Steve Perry's devotion to his mother, with the exception of that bitter Herbie, whose words are worthless and could not be believed if his tongue came notarized. I believe Herbie dismissed Robert F. b/c of his wanting to maintain his own management. "Didn't move under Herbie."

Behind the scenes he was a control freak who did and said whatever it took to gain complete control and to ensure no one would ever know just what kind of ruthless, sleazy prick he really was and to protect the image the entire world had of him, he got injunctions and gag orders that were so iron clad that not even Herbie - who had/has waaaaaaaaaay more money to spend on attorneys than Perry ever could - could find a way to quash them. But, that wasn't enough for the spoiled little mama's boy.

Don't know whether to laugh or respond here so will do both. Sounds like you are describing Herbie to perfection, the self-proclaimed "unabashed capitalist." What reasons would Perry have given when he supposedly got all those "gag orders" and who would have signed off on them? Herbie spoke of Perry in the VH1 Behind the Scene as being "shy" when he entered the band. Guess Herbie thought he could manipulate SP as he supposedly tried with Robert F. Guess he found out Perry was the "sharpest."

That "waaaaaaaaaay" part gets the laugh[s]. Guess Perry was supposedly a tough tough guy since all the wealth in the world seemingly could not stop him.

He orchestrated a deal that paid him an equal share of anything the band made while on tour for a full decade whether he got out of bed or not.

Hopefully, he got to watch "Big Bird" while he was in "bed." Would think they probably made Steve Perry an equal partner for his bringing "all the success to the band." NS VH1 Behind the Music. With that said, they either payout in a lump sum or pay in installments, as probably they had to do since the band had been out of commission for so long. So good if SP "orchestrated a deal" that did not leave him empty-handed, after their touring him into the ground.

So yeah.... Neal basically got swindled, legally bullied, threatened with HUGE fines and even criminal action if he dared talk about the raping he took from Perry. And then, as icing on the proverbial cake, he added one last twist of the knife in Neal's back.... he made it impossible for Neal to have any direct communication with him without the threat of legal action.

It was supposedly Neal's band with his holding all the cards so how could Neal be "swindled, legally bullied, threatened with HUGE fines if he dared talk about" it. Seems not enough "icing" was put on the "proverbial cake," if Neal is as dingy as you portray him. In Perry's supposedly making "it impossible for Neal to have any direct communication with him," how was that done and who signed off on it. I would not think "legal action" was necessary. Did Neal persist in trying to get Perry back in the band as he did before all at 2005 Hollywood Walk of Fame star they got?

Kinda sounds a lot like a Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde situation when you look at the big picture. Perry made sure the control he manipulated away from Neal didn't fizzle when he decided he was done with Journey. He wanted to make sure that cash cow would keep on producing a paycheck for as long as possible. Like Herbie said, Perry was never in it for anything other than the money. Period. No matter what it took. No matter who got screwed. No matter who got hurt.

Sure, when it's coming from a seemingly "Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde." Herbie is a bitter painter so would not care to "look at the big picture." His "big picture" wreaks of dripping paint. Since Perry supposedly had so much "control," he did not seem to use it to stop that "don't crack the stone" as was shown on VH1? I would think Perry was in it because of his love for the music (GQ 2008). If not, he probably would have hit that stage in any condition, as Augeri (lipping) or Pineda (mimicking).

Herbie referred to his "like a son, Neal" as not being the "sharpest knife in the drawer. " Seem Neal ("like a son") and Jon had no problem getting rid of Herbie. Guess Perry twisted their arms or something like that.

Mission accomplished douche bag!

You probably remember S. Augeri. Neal and the rest of the band seem to have forgotten him, after what, his eight years. Don't think he made it to that "Everyman's Journey-DSB" film. Think JSS learned of his dismissal in the News. When Herbie sneaked Perry on stage, while Robert F. was away, was that Perry's doing? Nah, wasn't even a part of the band then. Herbie needed to see who could "bring home the bacon." Guess that gave Perry a foregleam of what he could expect from Herbie, the self-proclaimed "unabashed capitalist."

"Mission accomplished douche bag!"[s]!

[Abitaman]

I'd love insights into the brief "Chalfant" era of Journey.

Same here

[SF-Dano]

This is not an arguement.....this is simple contradiction!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQFKtI6gn9Y