Eclipse Billboard - Flop

[conversationpc]

You'd better not speak for me...

It's a good thing I didn't; I wouldn't want a scary hardass like you on my bad side.

LMFAO!

Frank is scary and funny as shit when he's pissed and in bash mode.

Fixed

Right, goes w/out saying. Who can ever forget his manifesto on BT?

I don't remember that.

[Gideon]

Evolution (lol) as in, "progressive, well crafted songs, yet largely unmarketable to a larger audience" to "great songwriting, hooky, with generation spanning melodies".... to "sonically excellent, progressive, yet likely unmarketable"?

1. Pre=Perry Journey: while progressive, had really interesting melodic sensibilities and was listenable..
2. Perry-era Journey: pretty self explanatory
3. Post Perry to Pre-Eclipse: numerous attempts at recapturing the legacy sound
4. Eclipse: has none of the melodic intricacy of the Pre-Perry stuff and none of the appeal of the Perry-era or the post-Perry/pre-Eclipse era

I'm not sure I'd call that evolution.. surely, good/bad, right/wrong... it is moving away from having a broader appeal..

As I indicated, I was referring to a music formula. There was clear transition from one style to another, even during the Perry years, or do you consider "Precious Time" to be in the same vein as, say, "Positive Touch"?

[Red13JoePa]

You'd better not speak for me...

It's a good thing I didn't; I wouldn't want a scary hardass like you on my bad side.

LMFAO!

Frank is scary and funny as shit when he's pissed and in bash mode.

Fixed

Right, goes w/out saying. Who can ever forget his manifesto on BT?

I don't remember that.

You posted in the thread Dave it's called "Backtalk Creator Weighs In" from 2006 posted by me. Skirmishes and dustups aplenty broke out...might be worth a posthumous bump

[Saint John]

You posted in the thread Dave it's called "Backtalk Creator Weighs In" from 2006 posted by me. Skirmishes and dustups aplenty broke out...might be worth a posthumous bump

http://forums.melodicrock.com/phpBB/vie ... 01&start=0

[conversationpc]

You'd better not speak for me...

It's a good thing I didn't; I wouldn't want a scary hardass like you on my bad side.

LMFAO!

Frank is scary and funny as shit when he's pissed and in bash mode.

Fixed

Right, goes w/out saying. Who can ever forget his manifesto on BT?

I don't remember that.

You posted in the thread Dave it's called "Backtalk Creator Weighs In" from 2006 posted by me. Skirmishes and dustups aplenty broke out...might be worth a posthumous bump

OK...I thought you meant he posted it over at BT not here ABOUT BT.

[Red13JoePa]

You posted in the thread Dave it's called "Backtalk Creator Weighs In" from 2006 posted by me. Skirmishes and dustups aplenty broke out...might be worth a posthumous bump

http://forums.melodicrock.com/phpBB/vie ... 01&start=0

Dean starts in on Monker instantly.

[slucero]

Evolution (lol) as in, "progressive, well crafted songs, yet largely unmarketable to a larger audience" to "great songwriting, hooky, with generation spanning melodies".... to "sonically excellent, progressive, yet likely unmarketable"?

1. Pre=Perry Journey: while progressive, had really interesting melodic sensibilities and was listenable..
2. Perry-era Journey: pretty self explanatory
3. Post Perry to Pre-Eclipse: numerous attempts at recapturing the legacy sound
4. Eclipse: has none of the melodic intricacy of the Pre-Perry stuff and none of the appeal of the Perry-era or the post-Perry/pre-Eclipse era

I'm not sure I'd call that evolution.. surely, good/bad, right/wrong... it is moving away from having a broader appeal..

As I indicated, I was referring to a music formula. There was clear transition from one style to another, even during the Perry years, or do you consider "Precious Time" to be in the same vein as, say, "Positive Touch"?

Precious Time and Positive Touch are both good songs, period... stylistically different... but nonetheless well written and easily listenable. I'm not talking commercial viability here.. just that the songs are easily listened to.

Even within "styles".. there is good writing and bad writing... and of course, ultimately the writer must satisfy their own muse first...

"listen-ability" is largely the domain of "us"... typically construed as "commercial appeal" and measured in unit sales by the bean counters at labels.. the unfortunate truth is that the songs that garner most commercial appeal will typically have something about them that is formulaic I'd also venture listeners (such as us) hear and dismiss music that we think has been intentionally written with some formulaic intent.

On Eclipse - I hear two listenable songs: "Somebody" and "Anything Is Possible"... and there are bits of other songs where I think "yea here it comes" (like the amazing Hendrix licks NS is playing in the 1st verse of "To Whom It May Concern" ) and then poof... instant disconnect again...

If the intent was to write something that is "not like legacy Journey", a departure if you will, then I'm not getting where they're going.. because to my ears this certainly is not progressive in a Journey sense. IMHO the pre-Perry progressive Journey is more listenable than the progressive Eclipse..

Where this album goes musically is not clear.. it's certainly not "Back to their progressive roots"... and it's definitely not their legacy sound... maybe it just goes in circles.. which, as JC said was the concept and the intent.

[Gideon]

That's where we differ, because I hear all of the major Journey elements and components on Eclipse.
The same style tenor, the same style guitar, the uplifting lyrics and melodies. It's just that there's more to it than that and they're branching out, exploring dimensions that had only been lightly touched on other albums: 'One More', 'Edge of the Moment', 'The Time', etc.

I'm not interested in hearing the same shit or Journey going back and doing another Arrival or Revelation. I have those albums. As long as the tenor doesn't become a baritone and the piercing solos become Nirvana-era grunge, this will do.

[slucero]

That's where we differ, because I hear all of the major Journey elements and components on Eclipse.
The same style tenor, the same style guitar, the uplifting lyrics and melodies. It's just that there's more to it than that and they're branching out, exploring dimensions that had only been lightly touched on other albums: 'One More', 'Edge of the Moment', 'The Time', etc.

I'm not interested in hearing the same shit or Journey going back and doing another Arrival or Revelation. I have those albums. As long as the tenor doesn't become a baritone and the piercing solos become Nirvana-era grunge, this will do.

Ya we definitely differ.. cause all I'm hearing is "plod~n~roll"

[Gideon]

Ya we definitely differ.. cause all I'm hearing is "plod~n~roll"

Loons are characterized by their their audial and cognitive deficits... you wouldn't happen to be one, would ya?

[slucero]

Ya we definitely differ.. cause all I'm hearing is "plod~n~roll"

Loons are characterized by their their audial and cognitive deficits... you wouldn't happen to be one, would ya?

And a bigot is characterized as "a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group with hatred and intolerance"

So I won't call you a bigot.. if you won't call me a loon.. fair enough?

[Michigan Girl]

Ya we definitely differ.. cause all I'm hearing is "plod~n~roll"

Loons are characterized by their their audial and cognitive deficits... you wouldn't happen to be one, would ya?

And a bigot is characterized as "a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group with hatred and intolerance"

So I won't call you a bigot.. if you won't call me a loon.. fair enough?

But I will ...

[Gideon]

And a bigot is characterized as "a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group with hatred and intolerance"

So I won't call you a bigot.. if you won't call me a loon.. fair enough?

I've been called so much worse, if you can believe it.
On the other hand, I can't think of anything more insulting than being associated with the members of Mr. Perry's zealous ah... "family."

[Gideon]

But I will ...

Only if I can call you a "big'un."

[Michigan Girl]

But I will ...

Only if I can call you a "big'un."

Sure, if I can call you little 'un ...get it!!

[Gideon]

Sure, if I can call you little 'un ...get it!!

I'm not fat?

[Michigan Girl]

Sure, if I can call you little 'un ...get it!!

I'm not fat?

You're either so fat you can't see your penis
or your penis is so little it can't see you?!?!
I don't know,your girlfriend didn't
specify?!? We've already got a thread going for this ...

[Gideon]

You're either so fat you can't see your penis
or your penis is so little it can't see you?!?!
I don't know,your girlfriend didn't
specify?!?

I specifically asked her to keep quiet about that.

We've already got a thread going for this ...

Can't catch your breath even on the internet, eh?
Fine, fine, we'll limit it to one thread at a time, since your fingers are probably as generating as much friction as your thighs do while lumbering into the kitchen.

[strangegrey]

That's where we differ, because I hear all of the major Journey elements and components on Eclipse.
The same style tenor, the same style guitar, the uplifting lyrics and melodies.

Yeah, I'm not getting those things at all....It definitely shows our ears show us different things.

I really had hoped that we'd see more 'change for the better' style anthemic rockers on this record....and a few clear, cut and dry ballads mixed in.

I hear none of that with eclispe. Every song is ruined with really an extended solo break peppered with bad guitar playing.....wrapped by a song that really isn't very good.


I don't mind a band branching out musically......but Eclipse is withering/dying on the vine. Not good.


I'm still not giving up. I continue to play it....but now that I got my hands on the new Night Ranger, the chances of me giving it much more time are dwindling.....as the new Night Ranger is a true classic.

[slucero]

And a bigot is characterized as "a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group with hatred and intolerance"

So I won't call you a bigot.. if you won't call me a loon.. fair enough?

I've been called so much worse, if you can believe it.
On the other hand, I can't think of anything more insulting than being associated with the members of Mr. Perry's zealous ah... "family."

lmao.. nice...


if a "loon" means someone who believes Perry was the best singer Journey ever had.. then I'm flappin' away...

But I'm old enough to have been a fan of the band before Perry...

[Argus]

You posted in the thread Dave it's called "Backtalk Creator Weighs In" from 2006 posted by me. Skirmishes and dustups aplenty broke out...might be worth a posthumous bump

http://forums.melodicrock.com/phpBB/vie ... 01&start=0

Well, that thread is a deja vu and I am so so happy that is in the dim past. LOL Some will win, some will lose... ya'll know the drill. 'Nuf said

[Archetype]

My Walmart has over 100 copies of Eclipse. They were expecting to sell a lot more. Yet they did no promotion whatsoever. So strange.

[slucero]

Hey Don... what's the latest sales numbers?

[Don]

Hey Don... what's the latest sales numbers?

I believe they were at 44k last count. I sort of gave up on it it.

[slucero]

44k????

[Don]

44k????

Well, perhaps 49k this week, total life time sales of course. It s moving between 4 and 5k a week at the moment

[Toph]

44k????

Well, perhaps 49k this week, total life time sales of course. It s moving between 4 and 5k a week at the moment

What is the Billboard chart position this week?

[The_Noble_Cause]

On Eclipse - I hear two listenable songs: "Somebody" and "Anything Is Possible"....

In other words, the two most safe, commercial tracks on the album. Songs like "Edge of the Moment" and "Human Feel" don't have huge hit-you-over-the-head Journey choruses, but they're musically interesting and have a great groove. Lots of replay value.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I really had hoped that we'd see more 'change for the better' style anthemic rockers on this record....

Unless the band collaborates with Blades again, I don't think we'll be getting that. Arrival was chockful of 'em, but not because of Schon and Cain.

[The_Noble_Cause]

The same style tenor, the same style guitar, the uplifting lyrics and melodies. It's just that there's more to it than that and they're branching out, exploring dimensions that had only been lightly touched on other albums: 'One More', 'Edge of the Moment', 'The Time', etc.

I think you mean "Edge of the Blade." Otherwise, that's a good way of explaining it, and what I hear too.