A Message To Andrew and Everyone Else From Tito

[Blueskies]

Come on Dan....you guys have been pushing the envelope attacking Soto for a long time...

Neither of us has ever attacked Soto!!! Show me defamatory words. Show me nasty photoshops. Show me vile or mean-spirited comments. Sorry that we don't think he walks on water like some do. Sorry that we had to point out his concert attendance after MONTHS of hearing how Journey was "done" and how he was going to "soar." We slapped people in the face with the cold hard truth after MONTHS of hearing RIDICULOUS forecasts for his future and that of Journey. We were dead right and others were dead wrong. That's what this is all about.

What's up with the dude and his hating on Soto anyway?

You can't handle a differing opinion. Where's the same rhetorical question regarding Neal, Jon and Journey in general. Fucking hypocrite.

What has Soto done to cause such vehemence ?

It's a message board. Again, I could ask the same about Neal, Jon and Journey. And mind you, we have NEVER called Soto one name...ever. See last sentence of prior response please.

...because he surely can't be faulted on his talent

No, but we can certainly point out facts and figures when his name is held in the same regard as some of the greatest singers ever...and our persective of his talents seem to be much more accurately aligned with his sales, hits and concert numbers. Again, truth hurts. eh?

...or for what he did for the band by jumping in short notice and finishing a tour for them

No one had a gun to his head and I doubt he did it for free. Worked out well for both sides if you ask me.

1.) no...no snow job can be done now..I've been reading here too long and things Tito has said can certainly be seen as attacks, imo.
2.) Why not wish Soto the best with concert attendance? Why not wish Journey the best with theirs?..I don't get you with what you just said...I don't think Soto or anyone else for that matter "walks on water"....I think that was Jesus, not Soto. ...I don't idolize any person...I just respect and appreciate their talent so don't lump me in....I gave you my opinion but your coming back with what others have said....which wasn't me.
3.) Your the one that doesn't seem to be able to handle a differing opinion ...this is the first time I have given mine on this subject...and in all my posts I think I have only made maybe one or two that may have been critical of the band... which was right after learning of Soto being dismissed...I challenge you to find anything more.....so you can't lump me into all that and call me a hypocrite.
4.) I could care less about sales and concert numbers...if I like something I buy it and maybe go to a concert...if I don't like it then I don't buy it...it's up tp others whether they like it or not....you take this stuff entirely tooo seriously....whats it to you? are you in the business? does it affect you?.....just relax already and enjoy the music!
5.)No...not a gun...a friend called him in need and he complied to that request....he should be commended for that. Personally, I feel he is better off now doing his own thing anyway...but again...that is only my opinion as well.

[Moon Beam]

Again, you and T are not getting the point. It was NOT that thread...it was the combination of 12 months worth of butting his head into things I asked him not to. I just lost my patience with him.

This is what I felt when you first posted of your peeveness in THAT thread.
Warnings., warnings, warnings from past waywardness......then Wombat snaps.
Good call from my seat, sorry Tito, you earned it.

[Allied Forces]

You guys are falling into the same trap those before you did.

I'm not being nasty and I'm debating civilly. Big difference from "those before me."

You yourself once said, if I am not mistaken, that this forum should be about music. Now you and your friends have become personalities. Therefore you will be subject to the same backlash by others whether they are right or wrong. You enjoy the attention, that's obvious, but with that you will become a target. I've read here longer than I've been posting and the pattern is always the same.

Whether you, Tito, or others perceive your posts as civil or less nasty will be in the eye of the beholder. You have put yourselves out in the forefront, and I've seen this all before.

Not criticizing, mind you, just an observation.

[Rick]

Ok, in short, why was Tito banned?

IMHO, SteveW's post have been much more offensive than anything Tito posted.

But in the long run, they both have the right to say what they want as long as it's within Andrews rules.

Just my opinion...

Bring back Tito!!!

Stevew2 says a lot about Jon, but he doesn't argue the point that Jon isn't as good of a musician that others think he is. Steve is just having a little fun at Jon's expense. No harm, no foul. Tito on the other hand argues the point with other board members and with Andrew and with Jeff himself. That's a huge difference. When Andrew asks Steve to stop, he says ok. Not Tito. He questions Andrew and argues that he's done nothing wrong. Big difference.

I like Tito, I'm just explaining why I think he's not here, while Stevew2 is.

I'd love to see Tito back, but you can't question the owner of the sites authority over and over and expect to survive on their board. That's just not realistic.

Thanks Rick. That being said, i hopeTtito pms drew and gets it straightened out We cant do only tito can

Me too. Titos a good dude, and I think that will happen. He's just got to give one certain subject a rest.

[Saint John]

Stevew2 says a lot about Jon,

Gee, ya think so?

but he doesn't argue the point that Jon isn't as good of a musician that others think he is.

Mainly because we're not silly enough to mention him in the same breath as the greatest keyboard players of all-time!!! If we did, people would sure as shit rumble in and debate us...and that would be ok!!! We wouldn't get hypersensitive and go cry to Andrew, and I doubt Jon Cain would pop in here either. He's "bulletproof."

Steve is just having a little fun at Jon's expense. No harm, no foul.

Well shit, Rick. Consider us doing the same at Soto's expense if it's that simple. Only we don't call him names, photoshop him, question his sexuality or rip him daily!!!

Tito on the other hand argues the point with other board members and with Andrew and with Jeff himself.

Wow...arguing on a message board. Whould've thunk it?!?! Without vitriol, vulgarity and name-calling I might add.

That's a huge difference.

You got that right. Schon and Cain are waxed mercilessly about their sexuality, height and intelligence and Soto gets a few facts and factually grounded opinions thrown his way and we're the anti-Christs!!!

When Andrew asks Steve to stop, he says ok.

Has he even been asked to? If so, he sure hasn't!!!

Not Tito.

No more facts, Tito. Got it?

He questions Andrew and argues that he's done nothing wrong.

Can't say I agree with Andrew's issuing of justice around here, but I certainly can't argue with you on this point.

I like Tito, I'm just explaining why I think he's not here, while Stevew2 is.

That answer is simple...it's ok to rip Schon, Cain and Journey to shreds, but you can't even so much as debate how good Soto is, even when merely using facts and figures to do so. I understand the rules and will either comply or get banned, but don't tell me I'm fucking wrong about that. The proof is there.

I'd love to see Tito back, but you can't question the owner of the sites authority over and over and expect to survive on their board. That's just not realistic.

Agreed.

[Deb]

[4.) I could care less about sales and concert numbers...if I like something I buy it and maybe go to a concert...if I don't like it then I don't buy it...it's up tp others whether they like it or not....you take this stuff entirely tooo seriously....whats it to you? are you in the business? does it affect you?.....just relax already and enjoy the music!

Bingo! And Dan, rattling off the same attendance stats over and over to the actual people that were at those shows is kind of ridiculous....no? Got ya the first couple hundred times and obviously has no baring on how I chose my music. You have your passion for Journey music, so why not allow others to have theirs? Quick run, I can see mimi coming and she's carrying a big stick!

[Saint John]

And Dan, rattling off the same attendance stats over and over to the actual people that were at those shows is kind of ridiculous....no?

Funny you should mention that. I've never given the actual numbers. You know what they are, though.

[Deb]

And Dan, rattling off the same attendance stats over and over to the actual people that were at those shows is kind of ridiculous....no?

Funny you should mention that. I've never given the actual numbers. You know what they are, though.

Actually no, was to busy rockin' out to count heads.

You've never given the actual numbers, cuz you don't know them freakoid. What do you do, phone the places and ask what the tix sales for each show are? If you're not a fan, why is Soto's concert attendance so vitally important to you?

[treetopovskaya]

sj been meaning to ask...

how can you miss someone who is sitting right next to ya?

};C))

(referring to your other sig "i miss tito")

[Rick]

sj been meaning to ask...

how can you miss someone who is sitting right next to ya?

};C))

(referring to your other sig "i miss tito")

[Saint John]

PS Deb and Rick...any chance of you guys getting appreciation threads is out the window now!!!

[Andrew]

And Dan, rattling off the same attendance stats over and over to the actual people that were at those shows is kind of ridiculous....no?

Funny you should mention that. I've never given the actual numbers. You know what they are, though.

You don't know when to stop either do you?

[Deb]

PS Deb and Rick...any chance of you guys getting appreciation threads is out the window now!!!

That's ok, I just flushed your Christmas present.

[Saint John]

And Dan, rattling off the same attendance stats over and over to the actual people that were at those shows is kind of ridiculous....no?

Funny you should mention that. I've never given the actual numbers. You know what they are, though.

You don't know when to stop either do you?

[Rick]

PS Deb and Rick...any chance of you guys getting appreciation threads is out the window now!!!

[Blueskies]

PS Deb and Rick...any chance of you guys getting appreciation threads is out the window now!!!

That means I get one?? YAHOO!!!...about time!

[Saint John]

PS Deb and Rick...any chance of you guys getting appreciation threads is out the window now!!!

That's ok, I just flushed your Christmas present.

Chocolate souffle? My favorite.

[Deb]

PS Deb and Rick...any chance of you guys getting appreciation threads is out the window now!!!

That's ok, I just flushed your Christmas present.

Chocolate souffle? My favorite.

Ewww! I wasn't even thinking that, I was thinking booze. That'll teach me to post before I think it thru.

[stevew2]

I will not comment any further on this thread. It upset my stomach, and that messed up my drinkin .Tito talk to Andrew. Peace to you all.I hear enough shit from home.

[larryfromnextdoor]

I will not comment any further on this thread. It upset my stomach, and that messed up my drinkin .Tito talk to Andrew. Peace to you all.I hear enough shit from home.

dude.. everyone is foolin man.. they will work it out.. your tops man.. this is old news next week.. betcha

[artist4perry]

PS Deb and Rick...any chance of you guys getting appreciation threads is out the window now!!!

That's ok, I just flushed your Christmas present.

[Blueskies]

I will not comment any further on this thread. It upset my stomach, and that messed up my drinkin .Tito talk to Andrew. Peace to you all.I hear enough shit from home.

It's ok, personally, I think the problem is Dan and Tito have a man crush on Soto, don't you? ...(not that there's anything wrong with that...just saying) All the women know how they feel so we can't blame them for feeling that way....just wish they would stop fighting the feeling and embrace it.

[Allied Forces]

Well, I hate to see anyone go. Longtime reader, several month poster here. A lot of knowledgeable members have departed. From what I can tell, some voluntarily, some not.

The "too cool for school" crowd changes over every few months or so. This is no different.

Bring the discussion back to the music, and not to personalities and everything will be fine for all concerned.

[Shadowsong]

Last I looked this was Andrews Forum
He pays for it
It's his livlihood & he works very hard to keep this forum going!!!!!
He offers it to us out of the goodness of his heart.
I don't feel some of us are aware of this & if they are they are just plain disrespectful & should be on Holiday!

The way I see it Andrew has the right to maintain an atmosphere conducive to his business.

Why is JSS special you may ask?
Well obviously he is more special to some of us than others
but he is special for no other reason that he is Andrews friend & he is a member of Melodic rock.
I don't think Andrew cares much for all the various attacks on the likes of Schon, & Cain but he lets it slide
since they are NOT Actual members of this forum so he allows the indescretions to maintain his sanity which some of us stretch to the breaking point!

JSS is a member & he is also an artist & deserves some respect for Andrews sake if nothing else.

Yes, Gunbot must be that Puerto Rican VooDoo got a hold of me!

Yeah, got to love a good shaman...


Bottom line is it's Andrews call
It;s Andrews dime!
Let's show Andrew some respect!!!!!

[Deb]

ahhahahaahhaahahaha..... cold hard truth?? .. are we still talking about the 80's band Journey???

Yes, I think so.

look dan.. your the best of the best.. your buds know that ..

I guess.

but when you say "we" ... come on..

the fact that ,just because someone is your friend,, dont get him to your level.. he can fight his own fights.. no?

um, ok.

ps... and edit.. ive never had my ramblings conjigated up with quotes.. it would be cool just once!!

There ya go Lar.

[larryfromnextdoor]

.............................. as Berlin sang.. No More Words!!

[artist4perry]

Can Tito come out now?

[Blueskies]

Can Tito come out now?

Thats great!

[Deb]

Can Tito come out now?

[Shadowsong]

Can Tito come out now?

Ahhh phooey
those aren't tears
He's just taking a piss....