JIM STEINMAN

by **r@y** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:13 am

Got this idea after posting a thread a short moment ago..

What do you guys think if Journey actually worked with Jim Steinman in the future..?

Do you think he could provide the shot in the arm Journey could use right now...?

I say maybe....Steinman is an excellent songwriter....and who knows..? Maybe it could be good for the band..?

Ray

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:23 am

rubiconman wrote:Got this idea after posting a thread a short moment ago..

What do you guys think if Journey actually worked with Jim Steinman in the future..?

Do you think he could provide the shot in the arm Journey could use right now...?

I say maybe....Steinman is an excellent songwriter....and who knows..? Maybe it could be good for the band..?

Ray

Sounds good...just one question
Who the fuck is Jim Steinman?

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:23 am

Wait...is he the guy who did "Bat out of Hell" with Meatloaf?

Look, Journey needs to find chemistry within Journey right now. To resort to outside influence would be a collosal step backwards. We already went down that road with "Arrival".
Granted, the results were largely good, but if you're a rock band, then be a band...that includes writing together, y'know?
If this lineup can't create magic on their own, then perhaps they shouldn't have been so zealous to call themselves "Journey". Neal said part of the criteria for hiring Augeri was his writing. Then he did an about face and said last year that the band was just now finally beggining to "gel" as a creative unit.

by **r@y** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:24 am

The_Noble_Cause wrote:Wait...is he the guy who did Bat out of Hell with Meatloaf?

Yup, that would be the guy....

Ray

by **jrnyman28** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:03 pm

He is also responsible for "Making Love Out Of Nothing At All", the only listenable Air Supply song IMO.

And he did a Celine Dion song...I will forgive him that because it sounded much better than her usual drivel.

by **jrnyman28** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:05 pm

OK, just saw Rubiconman's post in the other thread....

BTW, I agree with TNC that Journey needs to lock themselves in a room together and kick their own chemistry in the ASS!!

by **Red13JoePa** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:20 pm

Ah, but TNC the results on Arrival speak for themselves. track for track a major triumph over Trial By Fire. I'm not opposed to continued outside assistance/collaborations (Arrival had Bazillian and Blades 2 masters) . Seems to be the trend in music today. The Cain/Schon magic needs to be the cornerstone, but beyond that.... Agree on the premise that more schon/cain/augeri fruit would be welcome.... hell listen to Faith In The Heartland and we can hear what the hell's possible.

by **r@y** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:34 pm

jrnyman28 wrote:And he did a Celine Dion song...I will forgive him that because it sounded much better than her usual drivel.

Its All Coming Back...or something like that...agree with you on the better than her usual drivel point...

Yeah, I agree that the guys should find chemistry amongst themselves, but I gues it would not hurt to have Steinman on board a song or two ( co-writing with maybe JS/NS )...

Ray

by **cubby69** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:41 pm

Red13JoePa wrote:Ah, but TNC the results on Arrival speak for themselves. track for track a major triumph over Trial By Fire.

Are you kidding me, Arrival is no way shape or form better than TBF. Now it is not my favorite Journey album and was ballad heavy. But overall, TBF kicks Arrivals ass every day and twice on Sunday.

by **Angiekay** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:59 pm

jrnyman28 wrote:He is also responsible for "Making Love Out Of Nothing At All", the only listenable Air Supply song IMO.

And he did a Celine Dion song...I will forgive him that because it sounded much better than her usual drivel.

Yes, "It's All Coming Back to Me Now". He also wrote Bonnie Tyler's "Total Eclipse of the Heart" but do you really think Journey needs a twelve minute song!?

by **Andrew** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:04 pm

Steinman is an absolute genius, but also quite nutty and his style of production/writing/music does not fit with a band that writes all their own music already...

Not a good fit this one...

by **jrnyman28** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:43 pm

Angiekay wrote:but do you really think Journey needs a twelve minute song!?

Sounds good to me. As long as it is all song. The Intro to State Of Grace and the Intro to FITH are cool. But they sound like that...intros. Not really part of the song.

by **Angiekay** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:47 pm

jrnyman28 wrote:Sounds good to me. As long as it is all song.

Guess it won't be a radio single then unless it's played at 5am on a Sunday morning! lol!

by **r@y** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:17 pm

Andrew wrote:Steinman is an absolute genius, but also quite nutty and his style of production/writing/music does not fit with a band that writes all their own music already...

Not a good fit this one...

Yeah Andrew, but maybe a left turn could be a welcome change for the band..?

They could try tho....

Ray

by **r@y** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:25 pm

[/quote]
But overall, TBF kicks Arrivals ass every day and twice on Sunday.[/quote]

LOL

But I have to agree with ya, Cubby....whilst Arrival is a good album, but to say that it beats TBF track by track is a little far fetched...

Ray

by **NealIsGod** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:06 pm

Sorry, Cubby, but to me TBF was by far the worst Perry-era Journey CD. TBF is the reason I would not be happy if Prodigal Perry was back in the group. I MUCH prefer Arrival and Gens, esp. Gens. I don't see why there is concern about chemistry. FITH, TPIYH, OOHW, NTL, ABL, Gens yielded some true Journey gems.

by **Red13JoePa** » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:26 pm

rubiconman wrote:

But overall, TBF kicks Arrivals ass every day and twice on Sunday.[/quote]

LOL

But I have to agree with ya, Cubby....whilst Arrival is a good album, but to say that it beats TBF track by track is a little far fetched...

Ray[/quote]

Track for track a better album. Nothing on TBF is in the league of Higher Place. Fetch that.

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:13 am

NealIsGod wrote:I don't see why there is concern about chemistry. FITH, TPIYH, OOHW, NTL, ABL, Gens yielded some true Journey gems.

2 which were initially intended to go on Planet Us and then on the Sirkus album.
That fact alone should be a disconcerting red flag to Journey fans everywhere concerning this band's chemistry.
Tell me, if the chemistry is so darn great, why is Neal shopping his best material to every other band besides Journey?

Also, while the titles you mentioned are indeed gems. The album has a few substandard turkeys as well. Jon once said that it was his job to "fill the holes" in Neal or Perry's writing.
So where was he to fix porous swiss cheese compositions like "Believe" or "Butterfly"?
It's pretty apparent that Augeri was left to his own devices while Jonathan did his own thing. Even Steve said that "it wasn't until the last moment of doing this record that [Jon] came in - literally into the studio with a few masterpieces.."
That's not how a band operates.
That's a bunch of solo musicians vying for their moment in the sun.

by **cubby69** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:52 am

NealIsGod wrote:Sorry, Cubby, but to me TBF was by far the worst Perry-era Journey CD. TBF is the reason I would not be happy if Prodigal Perry was back in the group. I MUCH prefer Arrival and Gens, esp. Gens. I don't see why there is concern about chemistry. FITH, TPIYH, OOHW, NTL, ABL, Gens yielded some true Journey gems.

Are you on drugs? ROR is by far the WORST Perry era Journey album ever. So much so, it basically was a Perry solo album listed as a Journey album. While there are a couple of songs that actually liked, overall it sucked BIG TIME!

by **NealIsGod** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:57 am

cubby69 wrote:
NealIsGod wrote:Sorry, Cubby, but to me TBF was by far the worst Perry-era Journey CD. TBF is the reason I would not be happy if Prodigal Perry was back in the group. I MUCH prefer Arrival and Gens, esp. Gens. I don't see why there is concern about chemistry. FITH, TPIYH, OOHW, NTL, ABL, Gens yielded some true Journey gems.

Are you on drugs? ROR is by far the WORST Perry era Journey album ever. So much so, it basically was a Perry solo album listed as a Journey album. While there are a couple of songs that actually liked, overall it sucked BIG TIME!

YES, ROR sucked as well. But at least it had some merit as an easy listening CD. MOL is the only song I like on TBF. I have no interest in Perry returning if it means more TBF style dreck.

by **Rockindeano** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:04 am

What don't you guys understand?

Journey doesn't give a crap about writing anything new. They could care less about making new music.

Journey cares about cashing in on the greatest hits.

An outside songwriter? If anyone, they go out and get Jim Vallance. One of the best songwriters of all time. However, for Journey to do that is proof that they have in fact become nostalgic. That for me is why this band is pointed south in the conventional wisdom paradign. That, coupled with the fact their singer is so bad he can't sing anylonger, just keep am eye on the road around the corner , and you can see the end of Augeri and/or Journey.

If I hear Augeri is great one more fucking time, I am going to puke.

Oh, and ROR and TBF both kick the shit out of Arrival any day of the week.

by **NealIsGod** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:06 am

Rockn'deano wrote:If I hear Augeri is great one more fucking time, I am going to puke.

Augeri is fucking GREAT!

by **The_Noble_Cause** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:07 am

cubby69 wrote:Are you on drugs? ROR is by far the WORST Perry era Journey album ever. So much so, it basically was a Perry solo album listed as a Journey album. While there are a couple of songs that actually liked, overall it sucked BIG TIME!

Correct.

by **Rockindeano** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:23 am

NealIsGod wrote:
Rockn'deano wrote:If I hear Augeri is great one more fucking time, I am going to puke.

Augeri is fucking GREAT!

Naw, you need to say it with a straight face. He DOES suck, and that is a fact.

by **r@y** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:27 am

Red13JoePa wrote: Fetch that.

WTF..???

Saying that track by track of Arrival is better than TBF is your opinion...just your opinion....

And you are substantiating that by....what, sales..? chart success..?? what...?

I mean, back up what you say with something...not just a plain statement of your opinion by saying all songs on Arrrival is better than TBF..

Arrival is a good album...but TBF was not an entirely crappy album as well...it did better sales than Arrival and earned the boys their 1st grammy nomination ever...again, this is all jusy my opinion, nothing more...

Go fetch my @$$....

Ray

by **Red13JoePa** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:35 am

rubiconman wrote:
Red13JoePa wrote: Fetch that.

WTF..???

Saying that track by track of Arrival is better than TBF is your opinion...just your opinion....

And you are substantiating that by....what, sales..? chart success..?? what...?

Ray

By how often I and like-minded fans play it compared to TBF. Fetch your ass, gimme a fucking break.

by **r@y** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:40 am

[/quote]

By how often I and like-minded fans play it compared to TBF. .[/quote]

What-fuckin'-ever, man....

That has to be the lamest one so far that I came across on this board...

Ray

by **NealIsGod** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:41 am

An Arrival vs. TBF poll would settle this, guys...

by **Red13JoePa** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:45 am

nope, what he doesn't get is it's settled in my mind. period.
Yes it charted for a month in 1996 when it had $ behind it and before radio refused to touch new classic rock.
WYLAW got nominated for a grammy. I know that, and if I forgot, Cain reminds me every single time he introduces it live.

I've still played it once in the last 2 years.

by **NealIsGod** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:46 am

Red13JoePa wrote:nope, what he doesn't get is it's settled in my mind. period.
Yes it charted for a month in 1996 when it had $ behind it and before radio refused to touch new classic rock.
WYLAW got nominated for a grammy. I know that, and if I forgot, Cain reminds me every single time he introduces it live.

I've still played it once in the last 2 years.

That's once more than I have.

MR

JIM STEINMAN

JIM STEINMAN

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