MR

Someone in one of the other threads mentioned combining "Red 13" with "Generations"...Here's my take after combining the two and pruning a few tracks...

1. Faith in the Heartland
2. State of Grace
3. The Place in Your Heart
4. A Better Life
5. Butterfly (She Flies Alone)
6. Believe
7. Out of Harms Way
8. Better Together
9. The Time
10. Beyond the Clouds
11. Walkin' Away from the Edge
12. Never too Late

Anyone else got another take on this?

It's already a shit thread,.

You took out EG, which sucks, and kept butterfly, which sucks more? WTH?

Rockn'deano wrote:It's already a shit thread,.

You took out EG, which sucks, and kept butterfly, which sucks more? WTH?

Butterfly barely made the cut...Wanted to keep it at 12 tracks.

conversationpc wrote:Someone in one of the other threads mentioned combining "Red 13" with "Generations"...Here's my take after combining the two and pruning a few tracks...

1. Faith in the Heartland
2. State of Grace
3. The Place in Your Heart
4. A Better Life
5. Butterfly (She Flies Alone)
6. Believe
7. Out of Harms Way
8. Better Together
9. The Time
10. Beyond the Clouds
11. Walkin' Away from the Edge
12. Never too Late

Anyone else got another take on this?

"Believe" should never have been included on "Generations" to begin with.
Just a singsong keyboard part on a one way tragectory to nowhere.
Probably about the worst Journey song ever written (and YES, I am factoring in all the pre-Perry jam songs as I type this).
To hell with "chronic throat problems", for this offense alone he should've been hauled off the tour bus.

I have nothing useful to add except that Audio CD's these days should be filled to the maximum time limit. I don't care what's on them, as long as they're good.

I don't think I can even fill a CD with songs from either of the Augeri era music, that I'd listen to, much less buy.

Overall I think including Red 13 would've improved "Generations".
But "State of Grace" with it's synth-intro and protracted running time is too similar in structure to FITH.
So I would leave that one off.
The others are all fine by me.

I always held out hope that the bluesy-rock vibe of "The Time" hinted at the new direction Augeri-Journey was going in.
Sadly, with the exception of "Better Together", none of "Generations" relected this.
Still, a good album.

I could go for some bluesy rocky stuff, if they went that way. But I guess that's saved for solo CD's. A new direction might have been ideal, but we'll never really know now.

whocares wrote:I could go for some bluesy rocky stuff, if they went that way. But I guess that's saved for solo CD's. A new direction might have been ideal, but we'll never really know now.

Well, with "Tall Stories" and "Shine" being so solid, I always anticipated Augeri's imprint on Journey's sound.
"Butterfly" is reminiscent of many songs he's been involved with previously, however, overall his writing contributions added up to a scant nothing.

He admittedly wrote a bulk material that at one point was set to comprise much of "Generations", but ultimately Steve willingly took a backseat to Cain because "he needed to be represented – let's face it – Jon Cain needed to be on this record first and foremost before the newcomer Steve. So he came up with some great songs that took front seat, and I'm glad he did, because it is a better record for it."

As the interview serves to show, 8 years after his inclusion Steve was still referring to himself as the "newcomer" and sporting an inexplicably subserviant and downright mopey attitude.
That's not frontman material for ANY band.

We need someone with a pair the size of grapefruits...like JSS.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:As the interview serves to show, 8 years after his inclusion Steve was still referring to himself as the "newcomer" and sporting an inexplicably subserviant and downright mopey attitude.
That's not frontman material for ANY band.

Totally agree, but the part I quoted here, made me think instantly of Perry's comment about never feeling a part of the band. Difference of night and day between the two Steve's, until I think of that comment.

TNC says; "We need someone with a pair the size of grapefruits...like JSS."

Absolutely, that's what they need...and they've got it with Soto. I think he'll push forward with some new ideas after this tour, to get things back on track.

As far as Perry's statement about not feeling like part of the band, at least it didn't stop him from getting his ideas for songs and melodies heard. If it weren't for him pushing all the time, I don't think we'd have the material from Journey that we do now. He seemed like a dude on a mission in those early days and it paid off. I know the music biz has changed, but maybe if Soto has half the guts Perry showed, he can make some changes for the better with this line-up. God knows they need somebody leading that band.

I still say the only decent song on Generations is FITH. Butterfly? I won't even go there.

I don't know why you guys can't stand Butterfly...as ballads go, it's got a great melody in my opinion.....Now let's talk Open Arms..that's a pussy friggin' ballad if I ever heard one.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:"Believe" should never have been included on "Generations" to begin with.
Just a singsong keyboard part on a one way tragectory to nowhere.
Probably about the worst Journey song ever written (and YES, I am factoring in all the pre-Perry jam songs as I type this).
To hell with "chronic throat problems", for this offense alone he should've been hauled off the tour bus.

Why do some of you people have to consistently turn every thread into a mud slinging contest? All I simply asked were your opinions on the songs, not your personal crap to be thrown at whoever you don't like in the band.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

whocares wrote:I could go for some bluesy rocky stuff, if they went that way. But I guess that's saved for solo CD's. A new direction might have been ideal, but we'll never really know now.

Well, with "Tall Stories" and "Shine" being so solid, I always anticipated Augeri's imprint on Journey's sound.
"Butterfly" is reminiscent of many songs he's been involved with previously, however, overall his writing contributions added up to a scant nothing.

He admittedly wrote a bulk material that at one point was set to comprise much of "Generations", but ultimately Steve willingly took a backseat to Cain because "he needed to be represented – let's face it – Jon Cain needed to be on this record first and foremost before the newcomer Steve. So he came up with some great songs that took front seat, and I'm glad he did, because it is a better record for it."

As the interview serves to show, 8 years after his inclusion Steve was still referring to himself as the "newcomer" and sporting an inexplicably subserviant and downright mopey attitude.
That's not frontman material for ANY band.

We need someone with a pair the size of grapefruits...like JSS.

Disagree that Augie's not his own guy. And let me reiterate my choice of Believe as one of the top 4 songs on Generations. Me and you have already been there 100 times, though. BBBUUUTTTTT. What an intriguing quote, indeed you brought up. Reading it on the screen, it's almost like he started down a path then caught himself and went down a safer road. Would've loved to have HEARD IN CONTEXT his answer to the question to listen for tone and hesitations and such.
Also agree w/ you on The Time. I hear another thing in that song every time. Be it a guitar line, a voc, drum fills by Deen SOMEthing that sounds like, "holy shit, where did they come up with this?" In a good way/.

EightyRock wrote:TNC says; "We need someone with a pair the size of grapefruits...like JSS."

Absolutely, that's what they need...and they've got it with Soto. I think he'll push forward with some new ideas after this tour, to get things back on track...

The Loon agrees

jrnyjetster wrote::? I don't know why you guys can't stand Butterfly...as ballads go, it's got a great melody in my opinion.....Now let's talk Open Arms..that's a pussy friggin' ballad if I ever heard one.

One of the best (non-power) ballads in band history.

This album already exist,Saga released it in 1995.

Kaj wrote:This album already exist,Saga released it in 1995.

You're right. I'm only slightly familiar with Saga but, after looking up their discography, I do see "Generation 13" listed.

I guess I'd replace Beyond The Clouds w/ I Can Breathe. That might be it....WAFTE would not be there either. So we're at 16 including SOG, The Time and ICB, dropping BTC and adding the Bonus The Pride Of The Family (Big middle finger sticking up to King Records for that, I stole the damn thing anyway). Dunno about the sequencing yet.

I personally love Butterfly. The song reminds me of my daughter.

conversationpc wrote:Someone in one of the other threads mentioned combining "Red 13" with "Generations"...Here's my take after combining the two and pruning a few tracks...

1. Faith in the Heartland
2. State of Grace
3. The Place in Your Heart
4. A Better Life
5. Butterfly (She Flies Alone)
6. Believe
7. Out of Harms Way
8. Better Together
9. The Time
10. Beyond the Clouds
11. Walkin' Away from the Edge
12. Never too Late

Anyone else got another take on this?

I would probably switch Believe and Better Together for something else. But other than that, would be a jam up cd!!!

conversationpc wrote:Why do some of you people have to consistently turn every thread into a mud slinging contest?

I'm not engaging in arbitrary character assasination, I'm offering up my opinion and elaborating on why I feel the way I do. Unlike yourself, I didn't omit and include tracks from Red 13/Generations without offering a scintila as to "why".

I wish I could participate in this thread. But sadly, can't even look at the Generations or Arrival CD cover, let alone ever listen to this shit again.

Too bad, because there is some quality tunes, but it is soured me immensely.

I am now starting to hate each one equally. Neal, Friga, Valory and Fraugie. I am giving Deen a free pass though.

Before anyone gets on me for "bringing this up" again, it doesn't matter. It's returning in a big way next month; and no, I am not behind it this time.

Rockn'deano wrote:Before anyone gets on me for "bringing this up" again, it doesn't matter. It's returning in a big way next month; and no, I am not behind it this time.

Interesting ... any idea who and why now?

StyxCollector wrote:

Rockn'deano wrote:Before anyone gets on me for "bringing this up" again, it doesn't matter. It's returning in a big way next month; and no, I am not behind it this time.

Interesting ... any idea who and why now?

O yeah, I know. But this time I ain't telling squat.

Rockn'deano wrote:

StyxCollector wrote:

Rockn'deano wrote:Before anyone gets on me for "bringing this up" again, it doesn't matter. It's returning in a big way next month; and no, I am not behind it this time.

Interesting ... any idea who and why now?

O yeah, I know. But this time I ain't telling squat.

Deano. You mean the situation from before is coming back up, or something different?

Rockn'deano wrote:

StyxCollector wrote:

Rockn'deano wrote:Before anyone gets on me for "bringing this up" again, it doesn't matter. It's returning in a big way next month; and no, I am not behind it this time.

Interesting ... any idea who and why now?

O yeah, I know. But this time I ain't telling squat.

This is how tapegate started, with hint dropping. If you don't want to tell, then why even drop hints?

The other shoe is not dropping till August? Beginning, middle, or end?

Deano,
Why does Deen get a "free pass" as far as you are concerned?

Deen is the best thing the band still has going for them IMO.

EightyRock wrote:Deano,
Why does Deen get a "free pass" as far as you are concerned?

He really doesn't, but you know what, I am sick of this shit...Even I am tired of it.

I just place less blame on DC because he is 4th or 5th on the pecking order and probably is not a decision maker. this falls on NS, Friga and Valory. Those guys are greedy scumbags. Then I put Fraudgeri up there right behind them or level, because he could have stopped the runaway train before it derailed and chose not to. As far as Grandpa, I am not so sure he knew about this until the heat was turned way way up.