Live Show vs Bootleg Files

[MartyMoffatt]

I have an observation about the reviews and opinions on the JSS fronted shows so far, and I’d like to get some of your opinions about those reviews.

It seems to me that the vast majority of concert reviews from people that were there have been overwhelmingly impressed with JSS’ vocals. There have been a few adverse comments but these are much fewer and, being from the very same shows, I’m inclined to think they were either located in a part of the audience where the sound mix was poor or they have some ulterior motives for their comments.

However, much more in the way of adverse remarks have come from people basing their opinions on the few bootleg files that have been doing the rounds. A lot of these comments are coming from people who haven’t seen a show live and have ONLY heard the boots.

Why is this? Why is there such a difference in opinion based on whether you were there or are just listening to a recording captured on handheld equipment? It’s a genuine open ended question – no pre-determined agenda.

I don’t know. My opinion is leaning towards the fact that the boots don’t accurately represent the sound at a live concert. I have NEVER heard any bootleg tape or file which sounded any good, but I tend not to listen to them anyway so I don’t have that many. Perhaps somebody more technical can explain why the vocals in particular always seem to sound so poor on bootleg files, no matter who is singing.

However, I’m willing to be convinced otherwise.

Marty

[cetera]

A bootleg can NEVER recreate the aural & visual sensations, energy and amazing vibe of being at a great rock and roll show.... That is why opinions seem to differ so much....

I myself have been to (& played) gigs where the atmosphere was electric and the band sounded great only to hear a bootleg later and be disappointed/unimpressed....

[conversationpc]

However, much more in the way of adverse remarks have come from people basing their opinions on the few bootleg files that have been doing the rounds. A lot of these comments are coming from people who haven’t seen a show live and have ONLY heard the boots.

I listened to the Atlanta boots and thought the pop-oriented tunes sounded kinda bad. The rock tunes I thought sounded pretty good.

I attended the show in Indianapolis on Saturday and, from my vantage point, it all sounded pretty good. However, since I sat so close to the stage, I'm not sure how accurate that is since the sound can be kinda muddled in that section (although it sounded clear from where I was).

Why is this? Why is there such a difference in opinion based on whether you were there or are just listening to a recording captured on handheld equipment? It’s a genuine open ended question – no pre-determined agenda.

I'm sure the pre-determined agenda has a good bit to do with it. Truthfully, I didn't know what to expect but was pleasantly surprised. It wasn't quite as much of a surprise as when Augeri initially joined the band in '98, though. I had never heard Augeri before at all where with Soto, I am familiar with his background to a small degree.

I have NEVER heard any bootleg tape or file which sounded any good, but I tend not to listen to them anyway so I don’t have that many. Perhaps somebody more technical can explain why the vocals in particular always seem to sound so poor on bootleg files, no matter who is singing.

I have lots of Journey boots that sound pretty good, both from the Perry and the Augeri eras.

[joybringer1]

Good topic for discussion - I've been marvelling myself at the discrepancies in comments between people who were there live and those, like myself, who've only heard the 2 boots. I don't think the boots could lie because the quality was excellent, the band sounded amazing and so did Deen. Jeff sounded pretty rough but he's told us to wait until he's had a couple of weeks off so I'm willing to reserve judgement until then.

I can only think that the atmosphere of a live gig, especially with a front-man as powerful and charismatic at JSS, can cause the eyes to play tricks with the ears, fooling you into thinking that what you're hearing is as good as what you're seeing.

[RedWingFan]

MartyMoffatt
Live Show vs Bootleg Files
I have an observation about the reviews and opinions on the JSS fronted shows so far, and I’d like to get some of your opinions about those reviews.

It seems to me that the vast majority of concert reviews from people that were there have been overwhelmingly impressed with JSS’ vocals. There have been a few adverse comments but these are much fewer and, being from the very same shows, I’m inclined to think they were either located in a part of the audience where the sound mix was poor or they have some ulterior motives for their comments.

However, much more in the way of adverse remarks have come from people basing their opinions on the few bootleg files that have been doing the rounds. A lot of these comments are coming from people who haven’t seen a show live and have ONLY heard the boots.

Why is this? Why is there such a difference in opinion based on whether you were there or are just listening to a recording captured on handheld equipment? It’s a genuine open ended question – no pre-determined agenda.

I don’t know. My opinion is leaning towards the fact that the boots don’t accurately represent the sound at a live concert. I have NEVER heard any bootleg tape or file which sounded any good, but I tend not to listen to them anyway so I don’t have that many. Perhaps somebody more technical can explain why the vocals in particular always seem to sound so poor on bootleg files, no matter who is singing.

However, I’m willing to be convinced otherwise.

Marty

I attended the Indy show and sat on the lawn center section, prior to the show I listened to the horrid Charlotte boot of "Be good to yourself". I like sitting back on the lawn because I can hear the music more clearly, rather than being right infront of a tower of speakers distorting the sound. The band sounded fine as did Deen, but Soto sounded just as bad as the boot for as long as he was able to hold my attention. (after 3 or 4 songs I gave up hope and went to get my wife a bottled water and peanuts) I knew I wouldn't miss much.
As for your question about difference in opinion between boots and an actual show, I could only guess that in a show you have distractions like the lights, energy and Soto's unbuttoned shirt for the ladies to distract from the horrid vocals. Hope this helps.

[brywool]

great points... for me, the boots don't lie. They take all the visual out of it and you can actually HEAR exactly what's going on without distraction. You can hear how off the mark the vocals are, and on one of them, the band even hits some clams (which I've rarely heard from Journey). I will say that one of the boots was a LOT worse than the other and the one that was better (atlanta?), while not great, showed more promise.

[RedWingFan]

Another reason could be the personal attachment some have with the band due to meet and greets and such. I don't know anything about these guys, but what they put on cd and what they do on stage. It's nothing personal. I just want to hear great music, and what I heard vocally in Indy was not. I'm sure JSS is a great guy like everyone says, but I'm not in the crowd saying, "man this guy is butchering these songs, but he's a great guy and he rocked out man!" He butchered the songs! It was sad to see, it was bad enough that it convinced me that this is my last Journey concert unless they make a major upgrade.

[jreed]

Morons!! Please read
Ive been here some time now...decided to sign up...this forum is riddled with repulsive, small minded, and small-dicked, (evidently), little toss-pots

I dont know who the moderators are here.. but they should be shot..... the language used here is excessive...and the abuse seems very personal

What Monker says is correct

There seems to be about half a dozen people here who are ignoring Andrew's requests...and plainly just not interested in keeping this forum "clean and informed" they quite clearly are just "taking the piss" out of Andrew..and have no respect for his wishes at all .....

It all makes for pretty pathetic reading, from an "outsiders" point of view.. I think a few have lost the plot here.... the place needs to be "cleansed" of the detritus, .. (I think the word "morons, was used..how apt..as the standard of post here is pretty moronic) and needs to be rebuilt

Adios to some of you I think, when normality returns







Morons!! Please read
Ive been here some time now...decided to sign up...this forum is riddled with repulsive, small minded, and small-dicked, (evidently), little toss-pots

I dont know who the moderators are here.. but they should be shot..... the language used here is excessive...and the abuse seems very personal

What Monker says is correct

There seems to be about half a dozen people here who are ignoring Andrew's requests...and plainly just not interested in keeping this forum "clean and informed" they quite clearly are just "taking the piss" out of Andrew..and have no respect for his wishes at all .....

It all makes for pretty pathetic reading, from an "outsiders" point of view.. I think a few have lost the plot here.... the place needs to be "cleansed" of the detritus, .. (I think the word "morons, was used..how apt..as the standard of post here is pretty moronic) and needs to be rebuilt

Adios to some of you I think, when normality returns






Morons!! Please read
Ive been here some time now...decided to sign up...this forum is riddled with repulsive, small minded, and small-dicked, (evidently), little toss-pots

I dont know who the moderators are here.. but they should be shot..... the language used here is excessive...and the abuse seems very personal

What Monker says is correct

There seems to be about half a dozen people here who are ignoring Andrew's requests...and plainly just not interested in keeping this forum "clean and informed" they quite clearly are just "taking the piss" out of Andrew..and have no respect for his wishes at all .....

It all makes for pretty pathetic reading, from an "outsiders" point of view.. I think a few have lost the plot here.... the place needs to be "cleansed" of the detritus, .. (I think the word "morons, was used..how apt..as the standard of post here is pretty moronic) and needs to be rebuilt

Adios to some of you I think, when normality returns



Morons!! Please read
Ive been here some time now...decided to sign up...this forum is riddled with repulsive, small minded, and small-dicked, (evidently), little toss-pots

I dont know who the moderators are here.. but they should be shot..... the language used here is excessive...and the abuse seems very personal

What Monker says is correct

There seems to be about half a dozen people here who are ignoring Andrew's requests...and plainly just not interested in keeping this forum "clean and informed" they quite clearly are just "taking the piss" out of Andrew..and have no respect for his wishes at all .....

It all makes for pretty pathetic reading, from an "outsiders" point of view.. I think a few have lost the plot here.... the place needs to be "cleansed" of the detritus, .. (I think the word "morons, was used..how apt..as the standard of post here is pretty moronic) and needs to be rebuilt

Adios to some of you I think, when normality returns

[johnroxx]

Ummm...didn't Andrew say there were new mods watching over this place in his absence?

If so, why are these jreed and mallet characters still posting this spam on every single thread here?

Just curious...

;^)

[conversationpc]

Another reason could be the personal attachment some have with the band due to meet and greets and such...I'm sure JSS is a great guy like everyone says, but I'm not in the crowd saying, "man this guy is butchering these songs, but he's a great guy and he rocked out man!"

If you're referring to the comments on the show from Stu and I, I don't think either one of us said that we could tell if he was hitting any sour notes or anything like that. I'll say it again...It sounded good from where I sat BUT YOU CAN'T ALWAYS TELL SITTING THAT CLOSE WITH ALL THE NOISE THAT OCCURS FROM BEING NEAR THE AMPS, PA SYSTEM, etc. Lawn seats are much better to HEAR the show. Anyway, it IS possible to enjoy the show even if JSS wasn't hitting all the high notes to the satisfaction of the crowd.

[joybringer1]

Another reason could be the personal attachment some have with the band due to meet and greets and such.

That's an interesting angle I hadn't thought of. Due to the emotional involvement the mind subconciously refuses to register anything other than a stellar performance. And so they genuinely believe it sounded fantastic. I'm no expert but it sounds feasible to me.

[conversationpc]

That's an interesting angle I hadn't thought of. Due to the emotional involvement the mind subconciously refuses to register anything other than a stellar performance. And so they genuinely believe it sounded fantastic. I'm no expert but it sounds feasible to me.

I don't necessarily think that applies to everyone...I've got a personal attachment to the band Kansas yet I'll be the first to admit that Steve Walsh sounded flat-out horrible for a long period of time.

[joybringer1]

That's an interesting angle I hadn't thought of. Due to the emotional involvement the mind subconciously refuses to register anything other than a stellar performance. And so they genuinely believe it sounded fantastic. I'm no expert but it sounds feasible to me.

I don't necessarily think that applies to everyone...I've got a personal attachment to the band Kansas yet I'll be the first to admit that Steve Walsh sounded flat-out horrible for a long period of time.

I fully agree with you but people on the inside are equally varied as on the outside, wouldn't you say!

[MartyMoffatt]

That's an interesting angle I hadn't thought of. Due to the emotional involvement the mind subconciously refuses to register anything other than a stellar performance. And so they genuinely believe it sounded fantastic. I'm no expert but it sounds feasible to me.

I don't necessarily think that applies to everyone...I've got a personal attachment to the band Kansas yet I'll be the first to admit that Steve Walsh sounded flat-out horrible for a long period of time.

I agree. My all time favourite band is Rush, but I think even Geddy Lee would admit his vocals are an... erm... acquired taste! I'm also a fan of Whitesnake, but saw them last month in Wolverhampton and thought Mr Coverversion's voice was absolutely shocking.

Marty

[conversationpc]

I'm also a fan of Whitesnake, but saw them last month in Wolverhampton and thought Mr Coverversion's voice was absolutely shocking.

Seriously, Coverdale is one of my favorite singers but the above comment is hilarious.

[A Fire Inside]

Ummm...didn't Andrew say there were new mods watching over this place in his absence?

If so, why are these jreed and mallet characters still posting this spam on every single thread here?

Just curious...

;^)

Becuase this forum is like a Lord of the Flies experiment and no one cares to moderate.

[NealIsGod]

Ummm...didn't Andrew say there were new mods watching over this place in his absence?

If so, why are these jreed and mallet characters still posting this spam on every single thread here?

Just curious...

;^)

Becuase this forum is like a Lord of the Flies experiment and no one cares to moderate.

I would LOVE to moderate...

[mallet]

Ummm...didn't Andrew say there were new mods watching over this place in his absence?

If so, why are these jreed and mallet characters still posting this spam on every single thread here?

Just curious...

;^)

Becuase this forum is like a Lord of the Flies experiment and no one cares to moderate.

I would LOVE to moderate...

hey "Nip shit" welcome back..... did you kill Pitman too??

[NealIsGod]

hey "Nip shit" welcome back..... did you kill Pitman too??

Unlike you, I have respect for the deceased.