My thoughts on Ames

[Monker]

We were almost late, for various reasons, including stopping at Outback for dinner. We sat down as Don Vaughan was wrapping up an intro set with Jonathan on harmonica and Ross on bass. I wish I had seen more of him...he seemed pretty good.

Journey started a little late, which was a good thing for us. The intro was still "Won't Be Fooled Again" into the Star Spangled Banner. They performed the usual GH set, which has been posted here many times before. Deen sang, "Who's Cryin Now", "Open Arms" and "Faithfully". JSS was definitley 'on' and he nailed all the songs. He gets the crowd involved with the clapping, lighter/cell phones on lights, etc. There definitely needs to be some updating with the big screens. There were some good moments with it, "Lights", and "Faithfully" in particular...but over all it is underused. The sound was the best I have heard at a Journey concert...not overpowering at all as it has been on past tours. I think the highlights for me anywy, were "Separate Ways", "Faithfully" and DSB.

I think the set list definitley needs tweaking...people around me just didn't seem to 'get' "Dead or Alive" or "Edge of the Blade"...The set seems a bit convoluted or something. It doesn't flow as well as it has in the past.

I wasn't expecting much out of DL...just from what people have been saying...But, geez, they are incredible. I wouldn't say they 'blow away' Journey...but they definitley upstage them in about every way. From the intro of "We Will Rock You", to the stage set up itself, to how they (ALL OF THEM, not just the lead singer) use the stage, to the use of the big screens, to promoting the bands future, to the solos, it all upstages Journey. I was very impressed....and would love to see DL again.

I said the similar things for the Main Event tour, compared to Styx...it's a bit disapointing that Uourney has not learned the lessons. The difference between now and then is Journey had a history with Augeri. JSS gives 210% to do whatever it takes to get that connection to the audience but it takes time to get it completely. It takes more then just songs and talent to perform them to put on an excellet show, too...DL has it all together, IMO...Journey is obviously still working on it.

[The_Noble_Cause]

We were almost late, for various reasons, including stopping at Outback for dinner. We sat down as Don Vaughan was wrapping up an intro set with Jonathan on harmonica and Ross on bass. I wish I had seen more of him...he seemed pretty good.

Journey started a little late, which was a good thing for us. The intro was still "Won't Be Fooled Again" into the Star Spangled Banner. They performed the usual GH set, which has been posted here many times before. Deen sang, "Who's Cryin Now", "Open Arms" and "Faithfully". JSS was definitley 'on' and he nailed all the songs. He gets the crowd involved with the clapping, lighter/cell phones on lights, etc. There definitely needs to be some updating with the big screens. There were some good moments with it, "Lights", and "Faithfully" in particular...but over all it is underused. The sound was the best I have heard at a Journey concert...not overpowering at all as it has been on past tours. I think the highlights for me anywy, were "Separate Ways", "Faithfully" and DSB.

I think the set list definitley needs tweaking...people around me just didn't seem to 'get' "Dead or Alive" or "Edge of the Blade"...The set seems a bit convoluted or something. It doesn't flow as well as it has in the past.

I wasn't expecting much out of DL...just from what people have been saying...But, geez, they are incredible. I wouldn't say they 'blow away' Journey...but they definitley upstage them in about every way. From the intro of "We Will Rock You", to the stage set up itself, to how they (ALL OF THEM, not just the lead singer) use the stage, to the use of the big screens, to promoting the bands future, to the solos, it all upstages Journey. I was very impressed....and would love to see DL again.

I said the similar things for the Main Event tour, compared to Styx...it's a bit disapointing that Uourney has not learned the lessons. The difference between now and then is Journey had a history with Augeri. JSS gives 210% to do whatever it takes to get that connection to the audience but it takes time to get it completely. It takes more then just songs and talent to perform them to put on an excellet show, too...DL has it all together, IMO...Journey is obviously still working on it.

Initially, your chief concern seemed to be JSS's vocals.
Did he put those fears to rest, or is he an awkward-fit for Journey?

[Lula]

So, did you enjoy the show?

As far as stage set-up goes, Journey loads in last and out first. They do not have 'access' to DL's set up. I'd say they are making great use of what little stage they have been given. As far as images being projected, I know Jon is wanting to do something about that. I am looking forward to another show .

[JrnySuxBalls]

Big screens, stage set up...hmm does that make a good show? Musicianship maybe?

Maybe it's a bunch of shirtless guys onstage...whats the secret??

[larryfromnextdoor]

great realistic review monker!! best sound ever?? oh i have to catch this one before its too late,,,thanks dude!!!

[Monker]

Big screens, stage set up...hmm does that make a good show? Musicianship maybe?

Maybe it's a bunch of shirtless guys onstage...whats the secret??

No, it's the total package. DL upstages Journey in every way. Musicianship? How about the Vivian/Collen trade off solos? How about the bass intro to "Rock On"? Over all - DL puts on the better show. Journey's not there yet. It seems that everything Journey does, DL does too, and kicks it up one more notch.

[Blueskies]

I agree with the whole stage setup thing and visual's...when I saw them Def's was better, of course, because they had the whole stage to work with...Journey only half a stage.....what's most important here is the music...not visual's and use of stage........at my concert Journey blew Def away musically IMO...........Elliott was rougher vocally then Soto...this was in July in the beginning with Jeff.....even then he was better vocally then Joe imo...and I was very critical of him...still thought Journey was better musically!

[MartyMoffatt]

I saw five shows at the end of August, and I felt that in all but the last show (Seattle) Journey were by FAR the better band, both musically and in their connection with the audience. True, Def Leppard had the better lights and visuals (as expected), but they appeared to be just going through the motions most of the time.

Joe Elliot's growl (singing's maybe too kind a word for it nowadays) very rarely raised itself to the level that he is still capable of. Also the mixing for DL was poor. At Shoreline I couldn't hear anything apart from the bass and drums - vocals and guitars were completely lost, and it was SO loud where we were it was painful and we had to leave early. I've been a fan of Def Leppard since 1978 (I have an original copy of their Bludgeon Riffola EP) and have seen them many times, but I felt that in several of these shows they looked like they were intimidated by how good Journey had been before them.

Journey by contrast came out all guns blazing at every show. JSS always gives it everything and is very audience friendly. They rest of the band were enjoying themselves like never before, and that positivity communicated to the audience, who lapped it up. Journey's sound mixing was much better too.

The exception in the five shows I saw was Seattle, where Def Leppard finally raised their performance to the level of Journey and it made for a fantastic evening's entertainment - two bands on absolute top form.

Marty

[AR]

Def Leppard is not very good live on this tour. It's a setlist of songs designed for fans of Queer Eye for the Straight Guy. I've seen Leppard 11 times, and this tour has left me less than impressed. Not enough rockers in what is a very poorly conceived list of tunes. I will agree though that their stage looks good.

Just shows how we all see things very differently.

[JrnySuxBalls]

Big screens, stage set up...hmm does that make a good show? Musicianship maybe?

Maybe it's a bunch of shirtless guys onstage...whats the secret??

No, it's the total package. DL upstages Journey in every way. Musicianship? How about the Vivian/Collen trade off solos? How about the bass intro to "Rock On"? Over all - DL puts on the better show. Journey's not there yet. It seems that everything Journey does, DL does too, and kicks it up one more notch.

I still think the screens, the stage and the shirtless guys left U dazzled.

Phil is good, but c'mon. Neal owns.

[Argus]

A well penned review although I disagree about the "show" aspects. I think it's a matter of personal taste when viewing a show. Theatrics have never impressed me, which is why I prefer watching folks like the Who, Stones, Springsteen. They just play the music and the singer has their patented moves. The lighting/stage setup and theatrics don't matter to me as long as the sound and songs are great. Journey has never been big on theatrics at any time and I say good for them.

[Clasicrockldy]

Big screens, stage set up...hmm does that make a good show? Musicianship maybe?

Maybe it's a bunch of shirtless guys onstage...whats the secret??

No, it's the total package. DL upstages Journey in every way. Musicianship? How about the Vivian/Collen trade off solos? How about the bass intro to "Rock On"? Over all - DL puts on the better show. Journey's not there yet. It seems that everything Journey does, DL does too, and kicks it up one more notch.

So what about the Viv/Collen trade off solos? DL has two guitarists, Journey only one ( not counting Jon when he plays guitar, sometimes), but that one is better than two...........

[lights1961]

The Journey stage since the vacation over tour has been just plain anyway.. at this time in their lifes does Journey need a big lights and stage production?? The answer for this tour is a resounding NO.. The crowd and the music has spoken for itself!! especially since JSS has taken control of the reins.. The Def Leppards stage suits them well as their players still like to roam around... Joruneys guys dont roam all that much anymore, so no reason to have a full stage.. again----is about the stage or the MUSIC.. my mind is you remember the music far longer than you remember the production of it all.

Rick

[Rockindeano]

No, it's the total package. DL upstages Journey in every way. Musicianship? How about the Vivian/Collen trade off solos? How about the bass intro to "Rock On"? Over all - DL puts on the better show. Journey's not there yet. It seems that everything Journey does, DL does too, and kicks it up one more notch.

You just proved without a shadow of a single fucking doubt, how incredibly stupid your are and the axe you are trying to grind.

Dude, there is NO way, no fucking way, Def Lippard can even compete with the New Journey. No way in Hell. They lose at every position.

[Natalie]

No, it's the total package. DL upstages Journey in every way. Musicianship? How about the Vivian/Collen trade off solos? How about the bass intro to "Rock On"? Over all - DL puts on the better show. Journey's not there yet. It seems that everything Journey does, DL does too, and kicks it up one more notch.

You just proved without a shadow of a single fucking doubt, how incredibly stupid your are and the axe you are trying to grind.

Dude, there is NO way, no fucking way, Def Lippard can even compete with the New Journey. No way in Hell. They lose at every position.

Somebody shoot me now, I'm actually agreeing with Deano! Def Leppard looks and sounds old! Ok, so the majority of the Journey guys may be older than they were back in the day, but I don't think that reflects in their show. Listening to Def Leppard sing, I wouldn't have believed it was the same band if I hadn't seen it myself!

[Monker]

I agree with the whole stage setup thing and visual's...when I saw them Def's was better, of course, because they had the whole stage to work with...Journey only half a stage.....what's most important here is the music...not visual's and use of stage........at my concert Journey blew Def away musically IMO...........Elliott was rougher vocally then Soto...this was in July in the beginning with Jeff.....even then he was better vocally then Joe imo...and I was very critical of him...still thought Journey was better musically!

That's only partialy true. If it were completely true, I wouldn't read comments from Journey fans saying they were 'bored' at Yes concerts.

The bottom line is it's a CONCERT and I'm there to be entertained and get my $200 worth. Jeff and Journey put on a great show...but there ARE shortcomings that they had that DL didn't. Get over it...that's my opinion.

[Monker]

True, Def Leppard had the better lights and visuals (as expected), but they appeared to be just going through the motions most of the time.

Didn't see that here...they seemed to be truly into the show.

Joe Elliot's growl (singing's maybe too kind a word for it nowadays) very rarely raised itself to the level that he is still capable of.

He wasn't quite as 'on' as JSS, but good enough for a rock show. He wasn't perfect, but he wasn't average either.

Also the mixing for DL was poor. At Shoreline I couldn't hear anything apart from the bass and drums - vocals and guitars were completely lost, and it was SO loud where we were it was painful and we had to leave early.

Funny you say that...there were times I felt JOURNEY's bass was turned up too high...but not outrageously so. DL mix was spot on, IMO. I don't have a real complaint about either side.

I've been a fan of Def Leppard since 1978 (I have an original copy of their Bludgeon Riffola EP) and have seen them many times, but I felt that in several of these shows they looked like they were intimidated by how good Journey had been before them.

I didn't even care to see DL. I was even considering leaving early. I haven't cared much for DL since Pyromania, which, IMO, is the one best hard rock album of the 80's. I never saw them in concert, and never really wanted to.

I didn't catch any 'intimidation' vibe at all. Journey did their thing, DL did theirs. Both put on the best show they could...I just feel that Journey is one step behind them.

The exception in the five shows I saw was Seattle, where Def Leppard finally raised their performance to the level of Journey and it made for a fantastic evening's entertainment - two bands on absolute top form.

There you go...except Journey has problems with their setlist being a bit too adventurous with album cuts and losing the audience...and not using the technology and stage as well as DL....Therefore, DL puts on the more entertaining show.

[Blueskies]

I agree with the whole stage setup thing and visual's...when I saw them Def's was better, of course, because they had the whole stage to work with...Journey only half a stage.....what's most important here is the music...not visual's and use of stage........at my concert Journey blew Def away musically IMO...........Elliott was rougher vocally then Soto...this was in July in the beginning with Jeff.....even then he was better vocally then Joe imo...and I was very critical of him...still thought Journey was better musically!

That's only partialy true. If it were completely true, I wouldn't read comments from Journey fans saying they were 'bored' at Yes concerts.

The bottom line is it's a CONCERT and I'm there to be entertained and get my $200 worth. Jeff and Journey put on a great show...but there ARE shortcomings that they had that DL didn't. Get over it...that's my opinion.

Get over what??? Monker, you make no sense! Out of all the comment's here you attack mine! Not a surprise! Think you need to get over it!

[Monker]

Def Leppard is not very good live on this tour. It's a setlist of songs designed for fans of Queer Eye for the Straight Guy. I've seen Leppard 11 times, and this tour has left me less than impressed. Not enough rockers in what is a very poorly conceived list of tunes. I will agree though that their stage looks good.

Just shows how we all see things very differently.

This is the type of talk that gave me the impression that DL was all show and not worth seeing. It may be your opinion, but my experience left me thinking the exact opposite. The set list is just fine, IMO, JOURNEY is the one who had songs that lost their audience, NOT DL.

[Monker]

Phil is good, but c'mon. Neal owns.

Neal owns the national anthem, that's true. But, DL owns guitar rock, not Journey.

Journey isn't all about Neal, or the vocals. It's about a ballance of all things. I have ALWAYS felt that when they lose that ballance, they lose Journey. They need to find that ballance again...which is the main thing I have been very much afraid of since JSS came on board. I don't want a Journey that does nothing but 'rock' with a few ballads thrown in to pacify people any more then a Journey that does nothing but ballads with a few rock songs thrown in to pacify people. One is just as bad as the other, and NEITHER is Journey at their best.

My point about Phil and Viv trading solo's...THAT is showing off the musicianship in the band and entertaining the crowd at the same time...It was very cool. It was things such as that, the bass solo intro to "Rock On", or simply the entire spectacle of "Rock It', that simply out did any memories of Journey...and I wasn't even there to see DL.

[Monker]

A well penned review although I disagree about the "show" aspects. I think it's a matter of personal taste when viewing a show. Theatrics have never impressed me, which is why I prefer watching folks like the Who, Stones, Springsteen. They just play the music and the singer has their patented moves. The lighting/stage setup and theatrics don't matter to me as long as the sound and songs are great. Journey has never been big on theatrics at any time and I say good for them.

I would say that Journey has always used the technology available to them to their fullest advantage, especialy for the Frontiers and ROR tour. Even Herbie said on the F&B video, about the lights not swinging around and falling onto the piano or killing the lead guitar player was awesome, "it's better then sex."

I'm NOT saying all that takes the place of a good performance...it ENHANCES it. It makes it bigger then life.

When Styx took the stage on the Main Event tour, with their silhouettes at the top of the stage, and then the band walking out from behind to take their place, as if they stepped directly out of 1978...it made me think, "My God, what a perfect way to start this concert."

DL taking the stage after the crowd stomping, clapping, and singing "We Will Rock You" is much more adrenilzing then Neal stepping out after "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss". Which has the collective hearts of the audience pumping harder? THAT is what I am getting at. It takes the experience to another level...and it is something Journey should have started doing years ago.

[Monker]

So what about the Viv/Collen trade off solos? DL has two guitarists, Journey only one ( not counting Jon when he plays guitar, sometimes), but that one is better than two...........

I'll put it this way: When Augeri was in the band, there were several different songs that allowed for ad-libbing with Augeri, Neal, and Jonathan...that doesn't happen so much any more. There is nothing stopping Neal and Jonathan doing something interesting...guitars/keybaords. But, they don't. They do things strictly by the book...the tried and accepted way.

[Monker]

The Journey stage since the vacation over tour has been just plain anyway.. at this time in their lifes does Journey need a big lights and stage production??

It was posted in this forum that this lineup can now make a 'comeback'. If they can't even equal what DL does on tour, how can that happen?

The answer for this tour is a resounding NO.. The crowd and the music has spoken for itself!! especially since JSS has taken control of the reins.. The Def Leppards stage suits them well as their players still like to roam around... Joruneys guys dont roam all that much anymore, so no reason to have a full stage.. again----is about the stage or the MUSIC.. my mind is you remember the music far longer than you remember the production of it all.

Rick

The one thing that I remember is how perfect "Rock It" was...the music, the video, the extended bits in the middle. Did Journey have a moment that I feel competes with that? Not really. The closest they come is "Faithfully".

[NealIsGod]

The one thing that I remember is how perfect "Rock It" was...the music, the video, the extended bits in the middle.

I don't like to watch TV when I go to a concert.

[Natalie]

Monker-Are you going to be done soon? I'm getting bored!!!!!

[Monker]

I agree with the whole stage setup thing and visual's...when I saw them Def's was better, of course, because they had the whole stage to work with...Journey only half a stage.....what's most important here is the music...not visual's and use of stage........at my concert Journey blew Def away musically IMO...........Elliott was rougher vocally then Soto...this was in July in the beginning with Jeff.....even then he was better vocally then Joe imo...and I was very critical of him...still thought Journey was better musically!

That's only partialy true. If it were completely true, I wouldn't read comments from Journey fans saying they were 'bored' at Yes concerts.

The bottom line is it's a CONCERT and I'm there to be entertained and get my $200 worth. Jeff and Journey put on a great show...but there ARE shortcomings that they had that DL didn't. Get over it...that's my opinion.

Get over what??? Monker, you make no sense! Out of all the comment's here you attack mine! Not a surprise! Think you need to get over it!

Oh, I'm not singling you out...I think that should obvious now, LOL!

[Monker]

The one thing that I remember is how perfect "Rock It" was...the music, the video, the extended bits in the middle.

I don't like to watch TV when I go to a concert.

Fine, then listen to the awesome music, stand up and sing along, and scream for more...Because there is more there then JUST a video. My point is that it gave EVERYTHING.

[Monker]

Monker-Are you going to be done soon? I'm getting bored!!!!!

Not even close.

[JrnySuxBalls]

Phil is good, but c'mon. Neal owns.

Neal owns the national anthem, that's true. But, DL owns guitar rock, not Journey.

Neal owns alot more than that. DL might own overly layered bg vocals but guitar rock?

[The Ghost Rider]

Somebody help me out here...

I know I'm relatively new to MR...well, posting on the forum, anyway. Somebody (Monker in this case) posts his honest opinion...which he was ASKED for (in another thread) by the way...and pretty much everyone lines up to shit on everything he has to say. I know there must be a history here that I don't know. Without opening up a shit-slinging slamfest...oh what the hell, every thread seems to end up that way anyway...can somebody tell me WTF? Intelligently, please? I'm easily confused.