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Journey's Treatment Of Singers

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:26 am
by Saint John
I've been doing a lot of thinking lately about the board flare ups when the talk of how Neal, Jon and management have handled past singers. I'll start by saying this is a thread moreso about Neal and Jon than it is management. I'll start with Perry. Perry was toured too hard. That was a decision management made and Perry agreed to (unfortunately). Then the sudden work stoppages. He left after Frontiers to record Street Talk. They waited for a few years and he came back for ROR. Then he stopped a bit short of finishing that tour. Again the band waited til about 1995, when Perry miraculously had the urge to sing again because the band had Rolie and Chalfant cutting songs. In 1996 they recorded TBF and had the big reunion tour ready. Hip goes bad (insert nasty comment here :lol: ). They wait again over a year and when Perry isn't any closer to making a decision than he was 13 months prior they move on.

Enter Steve Augeri. After bidding The Gap adios he steps in for Steve Perry. The band works hard, they practice and then they hit the road. After some gigs go by, Steve finds a nice groove. He does well and more importantly, he draws well. He cuts a nice album, is backed by a label and is more than decent in concert. However, the album, in terms of past popularity, is a colossal failure. It moves less than 400,00 units, generates no interest, and gets virtually no radio spins.
The lineup moves forward as a touring act and they do so relentlessly. They tour virtually every year. They release 1 and a half excrement laden albums, the second being while Augeri is battling major throat problems. The band decides for whatever reason(s) that they're going to add artificial, prerecorded elements to their shows and proceed to do that til they can't do so anymore. Exit Augeri and enter Soto.

Jeff Scott Soto steps in and does a nice job on short notice. Jeff is eventually named lead singer (to dump water on TapeGate and effectively end the Augeri era). They tour a bit in the states, continue to receive nice reviews and head off to Europe. They fulfill a grueling European leg and return to the states. Soto, like Augeri, now had a certain contingent of fans following him (though they weighed several hundred pounds less :lol: ). However, after playing their last gig for the year they decide Jeff is not the right person for the path they have chosen. They publically thank Jeff and begin the process of looking for a new singer. Until he's named I'll leave that chapter open.

The bottom line is this. Journey gave Steve Perry a shot. He maximized it, added to the band and helped them soar. Then, for whatever reasons he decided to be a detour or roadblock every couple of years. The band waited several times until they saw the last bit of light fading and knew they had to move on this time. Hell, they afforded him (along with his talent) the luxury of being an enigmatic, semi-reclusive, rich old fart these days that wants to do nothing but talk about how he misses singing. God bless him. Steve Augeri was yanked from The Gap and was so surprised about the call he thought it had to be fake. He toured for 7 out of 8 years I believe and made enough money that he's wildly rich. They held on to him after the initial failure of Arrival and the dreadful Red 13. They continued to tour and show faith in him as their singer because the crowds were still virtually all there. JSS was summoned next. Out of nowhere, a name virtually no concert goers ever heard of, emerged as the new singer. He seized upon a mutually beneficial opportunity and gave Journey what they needed...a temporary shot in the arm, a means to extinguish TapeGate and a nice rendition of the classics. He made a boatload of dough, got to tour with the big boys and made a name for himself a bit on U.S. soil.

In summation, Journey has seemingly been patient and fair with their singers. Have they made a few bad decisions? Sure....we all have. Journey made Perry rich, Augeri rich and put a ton of dough in JSS's pocket. They owe these guys nothing. They're a business, a corporation and an entity that makes money. THAT'S the bottom line. I'm embarrassed as hell about my actions during TapeGate and the Soto firing. All of that hullaballoo over two guys that were given an ENOURMOUS opportunity they would have otherwise NEVER had. Imagine Steve Smith, arguably the world's greatest drummer, reading the reaction we made over that. Shit, when he was fired hardly a peep was muttered by him or anyone else. He moved on. Time we do the same, along with Augeri and Soto. I'm over it...completely. These guys have fucked over one singer and one singer only....Kevin Chalfant. He's the ONLY one they owe ANY sort of apology to. I'm excited about seeing these guys again. Short of a few partially lipped concerts, they haven't done a damn thing to me. And I now completely understand the business aspect of that decision. Journey gives singers a chance. It might last a decade, close to decade or less than a year, but they give you a chance. In the end, that's all you can ask for in business...a chance. I will continue to love this band, its music and its shows. For those that will discontinue going to their shows, I completely understand that is your right as a paying customer and respect that choice. God bless.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:32 am
by StevePerryHair
Wow Dan, that is a LOT of thinking :shock: Nice retrospect, but I wonder how much dough those guys really got in their pockets. And they may still owe JSS an apology too maybe? For how it was handled? Thanks for respecting my decision not to attend 8) (unless Perry were to show up of course :lol: )

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:34 am
by SteveForever
Does anyone have the cliff notes for this post?

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:36 am
by Rockindeano
With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:37 am
by Blueskies
SteveForever wrote:Does anyone have the cliff notes for this post?
:lol:

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:42 am
by ohsherrie
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:48 am
by ohsherrie
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Wish I hadn't. Image

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:50 am
by Red13JoePa
I read the whole thing, Juanno.

Good on you and the fat joke (vintage you) in the middle had me rumbling :lol:

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:51 am
by Saint John
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys? Correct.
They never did anything wrong? Not to me or anyone else that isn't a crybaby.
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance? "a chance."
JSS made a boatload of money? Relative to the amount of time he was there and the money he would have made otherwise, yes.
What in THE fuck are you drinking?
Aquafina tonight.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:51 am
by SteveForever
Red13JoePa wrote:I read the whole thing, Juanno.

Good on you and the fat joke (vintage you) in the middle had me rumbling :lol:


speaking of, did anyone see "Chuck and Larry?" the opening scene is extremely funny!

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:52 am
by Saint John
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:54 am
by ohsherrie
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:55 am
by Perrydise
Interesting SJ. But I will stick with a lifelong phrase.

There are three sides to every story. Side A, Side B and THE TRUTH.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:00 pm
by Saint John
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P



Quit breathing and it'll go away.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:05 pm
by ohsherrie
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P



Quit breathing and it'll go away.


You quit breathing and I won't have to. :twisted:

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:08 pm
by scarygirl
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P



Quit breathing and it'll go away.


You quit breathing and I won't have to. :twisted:


Get a room you two!

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:10 pm
by Saint John
scarygirl wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P



Quit breathing and it'll go away.


You quit breathing and I won't have to. :twisted:


Get a room you two!



Join us for a threesome and I'll do it. :lol: :evil:

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:11 pm
by Rick
scarygirl wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P



Quit breathing and it'll go away.


You quit breathing and I won't have to. :twisted:


Get a room you two!
Yeah, you couldn't cut the sexual tension between you two with a knife. :lol:

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:11 pm
by ohsherrie
scarygirl wrote:
Get a room you two!


Good idea, then I can smother him with the pillow. Image

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:11 pm
by bluejeangirl76
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P



Sorry, but I had to laugh at that. Carry on with your duel. Image

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:16 pm
by Rockindeano
Saint John wrote:
Join us for a threesome and I'll do it. :lol: :evil:


Fucker is funny.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:17 pm
by ohsherrie
Rick wrote:
scarygirl wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P



Quit breathing and it'll go away.


You quit breathing and I won't have to. :twisted:


Get a room you two!
Yeah, you couldn't cut the sexual tension between you two with a knife. :lol:


OMG, OMG, OMG, OMG, please tell me you're not a republican.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:19 pm
by ArnelRox
Dan what a well thought out & intelligent post. Thanks for having the guts to post it. I've come to much the same conclusions as u. A few months ago, Fredinator posted a mini-version of these thoughts & I jumped down her throat. I've apologized to her for that since b/c I was wrong & she made perfect sense.

Journey is a band & a business. I'm sure they'd love to have Steve Perry back as their lead vocalist but he doesnt want to do that for whatever reason. That's not my business. It's also not my business what happened w/Augeri or Soto or what they do from this point on. It was easy to jump on the bandwagon & crucify them, but when it all comes down to it, if they stepped into my world, I wonder what they'd think of the way I run my business. Moreover would I want them to tell me? The answer is a resounding no.

Matthew said something here a few times that I've been thinking about. If I didnt give up on Journey after Perry left, why give up now? He's got a good point. Bands replace members, members step down, that's the nature of the business. That doesnt make it a tribute band. It's just the next incarnation. Look at most bands' histories & there are lineup changes.

We the fans dont run the band. If we dont like what they're doing, we can make a choice & not attend concerts or buy albums.

For me, Journey's given me the gift of their music for almost 30 yrs now. I play it all the time & I love it. I've had a good time at every concert I've been to & they've delivered a nite of great entertainment. That's all they ever owed me & they haven't failed to deliver so how can I fault them? I want more of the same & I'm looking forward to having them bring that to me. Let's Journey on into 2008.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:20 pm
by Rick
ohsherrie wrote:
Rick wrote:
scarygirl wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Saint John wrote:
ohsherrie wrote:
Rockindeano wrote:With all due respect, that is a 100% bullshit post. What a load of shit.

You can't wait to see these guys?
They never did anything wrong?
They gave these guys(singers) a fair chance?
JSS made a boatload of money?

What in THE fuck are you drinking?


I wasn't even going to try to read the post until I read this response. Now I have to see what kind of stupid shit is in the post. :?


Fuck you.


Not tonight, I have a headache from reading your post. :P



Quit breathing and it'll go away.


You quit breathing and I won't have to. :twisted:


Get a room you two!
Yeah, you couldn't cut the sexual tension between you two with a knife. :lol:


OMG, OMG, OMG, OMG, please tell me you're not a republican.


Rick Bethune, proud member of the Transport Workers Union, local 513 for 24 years. :D

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:31 pm
by Saint John
ohsherrie wrote:
scarygirl wrote:
Get a room you two!


Good idea, then I can smother him with the pillow. Image



You could put one on my face as long as the other one was over your face. :lol: :x :twisted: :P

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:32 pm
by ohsherrie
Rick wrote:Rick Bethune, proud member of the Transport Workers Union, local 513 for 24 years. :D


I've been sitting here for several minutes trying to think of a worthy response, but you have effectively dumbfounded me Rick. Thank you. :D

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:34 pm
by AR
They won't be able to mess with Kamala. He's a beast!

Image

The racists are against it though. He is a great singer, just can't annunciate or introduce songs. He eats members of the audience though which makes his stage precense cool. He works for dead chickens.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:34 pm
by Rick
ohsherrie wrote:
Rick wrote:Rick Bethune, proud member of the Transport Workers Union, local 513 for 24 years. :D


I've been sitting here for several minutes trying to think of a worthy response, but you have effectively dumbfounded me Rick. Thank you. :D


You asked if I was a Republican, or your post asking that was under mine, so I assumed you were asking me. There are scarce few people in a union that are Republican. I'm certainly not one.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:35 pm
by Ratgirl
LMAO.. love the avatar Dean.. very festive :lol: :lol:

Image

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:35 pm
by mistiejourney
WOW! I don't agree with everything you posted, but that was a damn good post!!!!!!! :wink: