MR

From Andrew's front page:

Journey Bus Drivers Runs The Gauntlet - Frontiers Records received and sent along this letter from JOURNEY's Jonathan Cain:

"We had a strange way to begin our European tour last week. Starting in Madrid, Spain we heard about a trucker's strike days before we arrived where Spanish truck drivers would be protesting the price of gas. Rumor had it the strike was to begin on Sunday at midnight. With our first concert to begin on that same Sunday in Madrid at the La Riviera, it put our crew on notice causing us all to pause before we committed doing a show and having our gear stuck at the border between Spain and France. There were 14 shows scheduled for to play in Germany, UK, Holland and Ireland.
It put our band in a “dammed if we do or dammed if we don't” situation. We realized we couldn't cancel a show based on rumours. Going ahead with the show in Madrid, the strike happened at midnight as rumors had suggested. Typically these drivers blockade the borders and major arteries in and out of the country causing drivers who are not co-operating, detainment, bodily harm and damage to the vehicles.
Our crew loaded out of La Riviera and truckers hit the road at 1 AM in the morning to the French border. German driver Andy U, of Trucker's Service, a firm out of Koln, got to the French border at around 7 AM where he found a semi cab which had been vandalized, windshield broken and the tires slashed. The driver had allegedly been beaten and taken to the hospital.
Waiting for nearly five hours beside the vandalized cab, Andy and his partner noticed a French construction crew making it's way toward the blockade. Not being part of the strike they were allowed to pass. Andy took the initiative to follow the crew in through the blockade. Realizing they had slipped through their blockade, angry truckers hurled rocks and stones at their trucks but they were able to make their way into France and onto Germany where we had a show scheduled for Tuesday at E-Werk.
Driving the back roads to the border the truckers had driven 200 hundred extra miles and put on another driver to cause their journey to be nearly twenty-six hours. They had saved the entire tour for us! After sound check we thanked them both for their bravery and resilience." - Jonathan Cain.
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Great job by the bus drivers. F-ckin' unions. Also, do you see this all you naysayers. They (Cain and Journey) are nice people. They thanked the drivers, privately and publicly, for saving an entire tour.

SCABS???

Tito wrote:From Andrew's front page:

Journey Bus Drivers Runs The Gauntlet - Frontiers Records received and sent along this letter from JOURNEY's Jonathan Cain:

"We had a strange way to begin our European tour last week. Starting in Madrid, Spain we heard about a trucker's strike days before we arrived where Spanish truck drivers would be protesting the price of gas. Rumor had it the strike was to begin on Sunday at midnight. With our first concert to begin on that same Sunday in Madrid at the La Riviera, it put our crew on notice causing us all to pause before we committed doing a show and having our gear stuck at the border between Spain and France. There were 14 shows scheduled for to play in Germany, UK, Holland and Ireland.
It put our band in a “dammed if we do or dammed if we don't” situation. We realized we couldn't cancel a show based on rumours. Going ahead with the show in Madrid, the strike happened at midnight as rumors had suggested. Typically these drivers blockade the borders and major arteries in and out of the country causing drivers who are not co-operating, detainment, bodily harm and damage to the vehicles.
Our crew loaded out of La Riviera and truckers hit the road at 1 AM in the morning to the French border. German driver Andy U, of Trucker's Service, a firm out of Koln, got to the French border at around 7 AM where he found a semi cab which had been vandalized, windshield broken and the tires slashed. The driver had allegedly been beaten and taken to the hospital.
Waiting for nearly five hours beside the vandalized cab, Andy and his partner noticed a French construction crew making it's way toward the blockade. Not being part of the strike they were allowed to pass. Andy took the initiative to follow the crew in through the blockade. Realizing they had slipped through their blockade, angry truckers hurled rocks and stones at their trucks but they were able to make their way into France and onto Germany where we had a show scheduled for Tuesday at E-Werk.
Driving the back roads to the border the truckers had driven 200 hundred extra miles and put on another driver to cause their journey to be nearly twenty-six hours. They had saved the entire tour for us! After sound check we thanked them both for their bravery and resilience." - Jonathan Cain.
-----

Great job by the bus drivers. F-ckin' unions. Also, do you see this all you naysayers. They (Cain and Journey) are nice people. They thanked the drivers, privately and publicly, for saving an entire tour.

"F-ckin Unions" my dying ass. You think corporate greed is bad now? Or maybe YOU don't, but it is. If it weren't for unions, it would be infinitely worse. Everyone without a continued education would be making minimum wage. I say fuck corporate greed, go unions. Every argument the antiunion people give anymore doesn't even apply to todays unions, or at least the ones I'm familiar with.

Actually I don't mind unions. I do hate their corrupt leadership though. My point was, their strike is going to have zero effect on gas prices and more importantly I do not think they should commit property damage and assult people who do not agree with their strike.

Tito wrote:Actually I don't mind unions. I do hate their corrupt leadership though. My point was, their strike is going to have zero effect on gas prices and more importantly I do not think they should commit property damage and assult people who do not agree with their strike.

This is true....I remember back in the day if a GM employee drove a foreign car into the parking lot
they walked home!!! Michigan...we're serious about that stuff!!

Tito wrote:Actually I don't mind unions. I do hate their corrupt leadership though. My point was, their strike is going to have zero effect on gas prices and more importantly I do not think they should commit property damage and assult people who do not agree with their strike.

Would love to see TNC's spin on this... haha.

Michigan Girl wrote:

Tito wrote:Actually I don't mind unions. I do hate their corrupt leadership though. My point was, their strike is going to have zero effect on gas prices and more importantly I do not think they should commit property damage and assult people who do not agree with their strike.

This is true....I remember back in the day if a GM employee drove a foreign car into the parking lot
they walked home!!! Michigan...we're serious about that stuff!!

Now that I don't mind. Although, I've become tolerant of foreign company owned cars made in the U.S.A.

Tito wrote:Actually I don't mind unions. I do hate their corrupt leadership though. My point was, their strike is going to have zero effect on gas prices and more importantly I do not think they should commit property damage and assult people who do not agree with their strike.

I agree totally, and our union is not like that. Not that I've ever heard or seen. We're all about negotiating and helping each other out. Not about taking down a company.

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

With employees that can't afford to buy or use the products they help to produce.....

Rick wrote:"F-ckin Unions" my dying ass. You think corporate greed is bad now? Or maybe YOU don't, but it is. If it weren't for unions, it would be infinitely worse. Everyone without a continued education would be making minimum wage. I say fuck corporate greed, go unions. Every argument the antiunion people give anymore doesn't even apply to todays unions, or at least the ones I'm familiar with.

What's wrong with your ass?

Michigan Girl wrote:

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

With employees that can't afford to buy or use the products they help to produce.....

Poppycock. That's because of lifestyle not wages. The majority smoke, drink and gamble. The majority of UAW workers look they just walked out a trailer park. I've been around union workers all my life...through family, friends, and people I served at the 2 bars I worked at for 7 years. Unions are a way for people to stick their hands in the cookie jar by brainwashing mainly lower educated people that somehow they're getting fucked. All the while they use "dues" as their personal ATM.

Tito wrote:Driving the back roads to the border the truckers had driven 200 hundred extra miles and put on another driver to cause their journey to be nearly twenty-six hours.

Guess they aren't worried about the cost of fuel..

Saint John wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

With employees that can't afford to buy or use the products they help to produce.....

Poppycock. That's because of lifestyle not wages. The majority smoke, drink and gamble. The majority of UAW workers look they just walked out a trailer park. I've been around union workers all my life...through family, friends, and people I served at the 2 bars I worked at for 7 years. Unions are a way for people to stick their hands in the cookie jar by brainwashing mainly lower educated people that somehow they're getting fucked. All the while they use "dues" as their personal ATM.

My family IS GM on both sides of the desk....I see something COMPLETELY different than what you decribe...although, I do agree with some of what you describe (with todays workers)!! The union was not formed to brainwash people into believing they're getting fucked !!! Do your research!!!
Prior to UAW~the autoworkers were overworked, underpaid and treated horribly....it sounds to me as though you are referring to the employees of today!!!!

Rip Rokken wrote:Would love to see TNC's spin on this... haha.

The history of the labor movement speaks for itself.
Not the least of which being the eight-hour workday and the five-day work week.
'Nuff said.

I don't agree with the violent aspect of it, but if truckers did that here in America, I think it would DAMN WELL have an effect!!! And from what I've heard, many of them are considering something similiar (not blocking roads, just parking their trucks and refusing to make their runs)
Someone has got to have the guts to send these greedy bastards a message!

Rick wrote:

Tito wrote:Actually I don't mind unions. I do hate their corrupt leadership though. My point was, their strike is going to have zero effect on gas prices and more importantly I do not think they should commit property damage and assult people who do not agree with their strike.

I agree totally, and our union is not like that. Not that I've ever heard or seen. We're all about negotiating and helping each other out. Not about taking down a company.

Maybe not so much lately, but in the past - yes. There is still some verbal threats being lobbed and a rare physical or property damage.

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

Agreed, especially as far as pensions and other retirement benefits.

Saint John wrote:Poppycock. That's because of lifestyle not wages. The majority smoke, drink and gamble. The majority of UAW workers look they just walked out a trailer park. I've been around union workers all my life...through family, friends, and people I served at the 2 bars I worked at for 7 years. Unions are a way for people to stick their hands in the cookie jar by brainwashing mainly lower educated people that somehow they're getting fucked. All the while they use "dues" as their personal ATM.

I'll never forget your "discussion" with Dennis (?) at Dick's in Cal City several years ago. "You're full of shit!!!"

Saint John wrote:All the while they use "dues" as their personal ATM.

Today's front page of the Chicago Sun Times http://www.suntimes.com/news/education/ ... 12.article

Teacher unions are the worst. Actually, ALL government (excluding Police and Fire) unions are the worst. BTW, how the f-ck do you ring $500,000 in meals.

X factor wrote:I don't agree with the violent aspect of it, but if truckers did that here in America, I think it would DAMN WELL have an effect!!! And from what I've heard, many of them are considering something similiar (not blocking roads, just parking their trucks and refusing to make their runs)
Someone has got to have the guts to send these greedy bastards a message!

They have already had strikes (typically small in nature). No effect. They're getting f'd. We need to drill (except ANWR).

Tito wrote:

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

Agreed, especially as far as pensions and other retirement benefits.

What is wrong with UAW pensions?

Michigan Girl wrote:

Tito wrote:

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

Agreed, especially as far as pensions and other retirement benefits.

What is wrong with UAW pensions?

They're way too expensive. A nice 401k would be better and cheaper.

Another major and biggest complaint about unions, where the fuck are they in the immigration debate. They used to be for immigration restrictions, now they either turn a blind eye or embrace these wage cutters. Why? So, they can unionize them and get more dues. Who care if the worker is making less. Rat Bastards.

Tito wrote:

Michigan Girl wrote:

Tito wrote:

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

Agreed, especially as far as pensions and other retirement benefits.

What is wrong with UAW pensions?

They're way too expensive. A nice 401k would be better and cheaper.

Another major and biggest complaint about unions, where the fuck are they in the immigration debate. They used to be for immigration restrictions, now they either turn a blind eye or embrace these wage cutters. Why? So, they can unionize them and get more dues. Who care if the worker is making less. Rat Bastards.

GM offers 401K....I own 1/2 of one!!

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

BAM!

X factor wrote:I don't agree with the violent aspect of it, but if truckers did that here in America, I think it would DAMN WELL have an effect!!! And from what I've heard, many of them are considering something similiar (not blocking roads, just parking their trucks and refusing to make their runs)
Someone has got to have the guts to send these greedy bastards a message!

That's the part I don't fucking get.
Those French(?) truckers don't own the fucking roads, so why block 'em?
In my country, everybody goes on strike from time to time, but they
aren't given a fre pass to inconvenience others.

If someone have a gripe against management, take it to management.
They start hassling other folks, they get arrested.
"First world country" my ass....

wech.

Saint John wrote:

Rick wrote:If it weren't for unions

...we might still have a steel industry, an automobile industry, and an airline industry.

Yeah, I guess at $5.00 an hour they could survive. The problem is, you are paying less for an airline ticket now than you did in 1979.