MR

I was just listening to ROR for the first time in a long time, and, well, say what you want about the style of Journey that was presented in that album, but I think it contains some of Perry's best vocal performances, especially the end of WCTNGOF (for brevity's sake!!!)...

Yes, he has a sh*tload of delay and other effects on there but he just sounds so damn GOOD.

Hands down, without a shadow of a doubt, the finest vocal performance of any rock singer I have ever heard. Ever. Also Journey's finest power ballad.

Gideon wrote:Hands down, without a shadow of a doubt, the finest vocal performance of any rock singer I have ever heard. Ever. Also Journey's finest power ballad.

I always appreciated his way with an audience as well.........he just made you feel great, music, persona and all. Sigh......miss those days.........cannot tell you how great they were. Sad they could not end their differences, they were so pheonminal.............

artist4perry wrote:

Gideon wrote:Hands down, without a shadow of a doubt, the finest vocal performance of any rock singer I have ever heard. Ever. Also Journey's finest power ballad.

I always appreciated his way with an audience as well.........he just made you feel great, music, persona and all. Sigh......miss those days.........cannot tell you how great they were. Sad they could not end their differences, they were so pheonminal.............

And the fact that Perry can't sing this shit anymore.

The vocal performance (which is the closest thing to audio perfection) notwithstanding, the keyboard intro is fantastic and the duet between Neal and Perry at the end is sublime.

It almost makes up for the fact that the bastard fired Smith and Ross; if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

Gideon wrote:

artist4perry wrote:

Gideon wrote:Hands down, without a shadow of a doubt, the finest vocal performance of any rock singer I have ever heard. Ever. Also Journey's finest power ballad.

I always appreciated his way with an audience as well.........he just made you feel great, music, persona and all. Sigh......miss those days.........cannot tell you how great they were. Sad they could not end their differences, they were so pheonminal.............

And the fact that Perry can't sing this shit anymore.

The vocal performance (which is the closest thing to audio perfection) notwithstanding, the keyboard intro is fantastic and the duet between Neal and Perry at the end is sublime.

It almost makes up for the fact that the bastard fired Smith and Ross; if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

Me thinks you hateth Perry much? He spoke of regretting that choice. How old are you Gideon? You never answered me.

Gideon wrote: if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

At the risk of having the "L" word thrown at me (although its got nothing to do with that)... I really do not want to hear anyone else singing that. Its 100% perfect as is and can't be done proper justice.

bluejeangirl76 wrote:

Gideon wrote: if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

At the risk of having the "L" word thrown at me (although its got nothing to do with that)... I really do not want to hear anyone else singing that. Its 100% perfect as is and can't be done proper justice.

LOON!

Gideon wrote:
And the fact that Perry can't sing this shit anymore.

Give Arnel 1 or 2 years he wont be able to sing any of it either.

I agree it is one of their best power ballads ....Perry nailed it perfectly.

Ehwmatt wrote:

bluejeangirl76 wrote:

Gideon wrote: if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

At the risk of having the "L" word thrown at me (although its got nothing to do with that)... I really do not want to hear anyone else singing that. Its 100% perfect as is and can't be done proper justice.

LOON!

artist4perry wrote:Me thinks you hateth Perry much?

Not at all.

The glaring misconception is that SJ and I hate Perry. Of course we don't, but we don't feel the need to have our heads buried clavicle-deep in the man's ass. History has demonstrated that when it came to making decisions relative to the band, Steve Perry was every bit as big of a bastard as Neal Schon or Jonathan Cain. Actually, to be quite fair, he was moreso. Leading the boys on for TBF, firing Ross and Smith, barring Jonathan Cain from attending one of his concerts, tossing out Herbie, and then bitching about "fracturing the stone"? The very essence of hypocrisy.

After all, he canned two essential members and saw fit to make another "Journey" album. But when the tables finally turned and he was the one being cast aside? Then the band became an institution above 'fractures'.

I tolerate hypocrisy from no one. Not even the great Steve Perry.

He spoke of regretting that choice.

Unless the words were "I am so incredibly sorry I fucked up, it was inexcusable and a decision made at the height of idiocy," I'd have difficulty accepting it.

How old are you Gideon? You never answered me.

Seventeen, ma'am.

bluejeangirl76 wrote:

Gideon wrote: if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

At the risk of having the "L" word thrown at me (although its got nothing to do with that)... I really do not want to hear anyone else singing that. Its 100% perfect as is and can't be done proper justice.

Lesbian?

A lot of people thought that about the entire catalogue in general. Hell, I once thought that with "When You Love A Woman." In terms of technical skills, it's not one of Perry's finest; but there was a certain vocal quality that made it nigh-untouchable. Arnel nailed it. And so I want him to practice his little ass off and try to tackle the greatest ballad of all.

Ehwmatt wrote:

bluejeangirl76 wrote:

Gideon wrote: if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

At the risk of having the "L" word thrown at me (although its got nothing to do with that)... I really do not want to hear anyone else singing that. Its 100% perfect as is and can't be done proper justice.

LOON!

Not knockin Arnel, but the topic was on ROR. Steve's performance. We have enough comparisons to Arnel. Yes I am sure he can sing it.............But unless you lived during the time, actually seen both performers sing I cannot explain it. I was there during the ROR tour. His voice was wonderful. I have also seen Arnel, and to his credit he is good. But Steve was better.

And Giddy, as far as his being unable to sing..................how do you know? A clip of him singing DSB after yelling his lungs out at a ball game during the World Series? When the man sings for us then we can say if he can sing or not.

Gideon wrote:Hands down, without a shadow of a doubt, the finest vocal performance of any rock singer I have ever heard. Ever. Also Journey's finest power ballad.

I've always said this is my number one ballad by Journey. One of Perry's best vocal performances when you add the emotion he gave to the song.

artist4perry wrote:And Giddy, as far as his being unable to sing..................how do you know? A clip of him singing DSB after yelling his lungs out at a ball game during the World Series? When the man sings for us then we can say if he can sing or not.

Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

Long story short: everything we've heard him do since the '80s makes it clear that he was losing it. Will he always have a great voice in terms of tone? Sure. But he can't tackle this shit anymore. He clearly doesn't possess the other factors.

Gideon wrote:

artist4perry wrote:Me thinks you hateth Perry much?

Not at all.

The glaring misconception is that SJ and I hate Perry. Of course we don't, but we don't feel the need to have our heads buried clavicle-deep in the man's ass. History has demonstrated that when it came to making decisions relative to the band, Steve Perry was every bit as big of a bastard as Neal Schon or Jonathan Cain. Actually, to be quite fair, he was moreso. Leading the boys on for TBF, firing Ross and Smith, barring Jonathan Cain from attending one of his concerts, tossing out Herbie, and then bitching about "fracturing the stone"? The very essence of hypocrisy.

After all, he canned two essential members and saw fit to make another "Journey" album. But when the tables finally turned and he was the one being cast aside? Then the band became an institution above 'fractures'.

I tolerate hypocrisy from no one. Not even the great Steve Perry.

He spoke of regretting that choice.

Unless the words were "I am so incredibly sorry I fucked up, it was inexcusable and a decision made at the height of idiocy," I'd have difficulty accepting it.

How old are you Gideon? You never answered me.

Seventeen, ma'am.

Do you plan on becoming a lawyer? Because if not, you should think about it.

artist4perry wrote:

Ehwmatt wrote:

bluejeangirl76 wrote:

Gideon wrote: if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

At the risk of having the "L" word thrown at me (although its got nothing to do with that)... I really do not want to hear anyone else singing that. Its 100% perfect as is and can't be done proper justice.

LOON!

Not knockin Arnel, but the topic was on ROR. Steve's performance. We have enough comparisons to Arnel. Yes I am sure he can sing it.............But unless you lived during the time, actually seen both performers sing I cannot explain it. I was there during the ROR tour. His voice was wonderful. I have also seen Arnel, and to his credit he is good. But Steve was better.

And Giddy, as far as his being unable to sing..................how do you know? A clip of him singing DSB after yelling his lungs out at a ball game during the World Series? When the man sings for us then we can say if he can sing or not.

Until Perry decides to sing for us (I believe he still can), I'll take Arnel or Jeremey doing it any day. Sadly for me, that's the only way I'll ever get to see these songs in the near future (probably forever). I know Jeremey can do it, and I THINK Arnel can do it on these kind of songs, since ballads seem to suit him well.

Gideon wrote:Unless the words were "I am so incredibly sorry I fucked up, it was inexcusable and a decision made at the height of idiocy," I'd have difficulty accepting it.

Well, he doesn't use those words, but here:

Fast-forward to 4:36:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdLUmkQr ... re=related

Gideon wrote:

bluejeangirl76 wrote:

Gideon wrote: if Arnel could work on the control, I'd really like to hear him tackle this. The song's slower paced and so I'm not sure that his accent would be an obstacle, and he certainly has the tone.

At the risk of having the "L" word thrown at me (although its got nothing to do with that)... I really do not want to hear anyone else singing that. Its 100% perfect as is and can't be done proper justice.

Lesbian?

A lot of people thought that about the entire catalogue in general. Hell, I once thought that with "When You Love A Woman." In terms of technical skills, it's not one of Perry's finest; but there was a certain vocal quality that made it nigh-untouchable. Arnel nailed it. And so I want him to practice his little ass off and try to tackle the greatest ballad of all.

They all made mistakes, they all said horrible things to and about each other. Am I one to hold a grudge? no......Some of the things Neal said to the press was awful. But who knows what really went on? You can read all kinds of press releases, and interviews.........I don't know.
I don't beleive Perry was without fault, but I also don't believe he was without regrets. We all have them. It was between them and that is where I personally will leave that feud. I am not too into playing Monday night quarterback with their lives. Can't stop anyone from doing it, just don't see the point. We were not there.

Gideon wrote:Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

What he lost in range, he made up for with control.
Even with the Rod Stwewart-rasp creeping in, some of the FTLOSM performances are stunning.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Gideon wrote:Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

What he lost in range, he made up for with control.
Even with the Rod Stwewart-rasp creeping in, some of the FTLOSM performances are stunning.

Exactly. Trial by Fire is incredible. I love the vocal performances on every single one of those tracks, even the songs I don't like. Don't listen to FTLOSM too often, to be honest.

Gideon wrote:

artist4perry wrote:And Giddy, as far as his being unable to sing..................how do you know? A clip of him singing DSB after yelling his lungs out at a ball game during the World Series? When the man sings for us then we can say if he can sing or not.

Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

Long story short: everything we've heard him do since the '80s makes it clear that he was losing it. Will he always have a great voice in terms of tone? Sure. But he can't tackle this shit anymore. He clearly doesn't possess the other factors.

High notes does not make you a great singer. Personally I like his lower ranges. To say he cannot sing is not the same as he cannot sing as high as he used to. I liked TBF. I also liked the solo stuff he did......Melody, a gorgeous song. After ROR. I Stand Alone........powerful and lovely. But if you don't care for it that is your choice.

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Gideon wrote:Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

What he lost in range, he made up for with control.
Even with the Rod Stwewart-rasp creeping in, some of the FTLOSM performances are stunning.

Absolutely, but you're misinterpreting my statement. I don't mean to imply that he became worse as a singer; I've gone on record saying I much prefer his '83 - '94 era. The quality of his voice improved when he reached that state.

And all of the FtLoSM performances (on the album, anyways) are divine. But he was clearly weakening on all technical aspects, including control. Even in TBF, there are times when he hits some notes that make me cringe. He couldn't do it anymore. Not like what the catalogue demanded and continues to demand.

Gideon wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Gideon wrote:Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

What he lost in range, he made up for with control.
Even with the Rod Stwewart-rasp creeping in, some of the FTLOSM performances are stunning.

Absolutely, but you're misinterpreting my statement. I don't mean to imply that he became worse as a singer; I've gone on record saying I much prefer his '83 - '94 era. The quality of his voice improved when he reached that state.

And all of the FtLoSM performances (on the album, anyways) are divine. But he was clearly weakening on all technical aspects, including control. Even in TBF, there are times when he hits some notes that make me cringe. He couldn't do it anymore. Not like what the catalogue demanded and continues to demand.

TBF examples please.

Ehwmatt wrote:Don't listen to FTLOSM too often, to be honest.

I meant the live performances archived on YouTube.
A few lousy, but many still inspire awe.
Arnel and Augeri swing their voices around and hope for the best.
Perry became something more, a vocal artisan, a technician.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-kOyVRlMlM[img]

This is becoming one of my favorite songs. If I am blue, or just need to unwind.........soothing.........for an old fart who could not sing anymore..................... [/img][/url]

Ehwmatt wrote:

Gideon wrote:

The_Noble_Cause wrote:

Gideon wrote:Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

What he lost in range, he made up for with control.
Even with the Rod Stwewart-rasp creeping in, some of the FTLOSM performances are stunning.

Absolutely, but you're misinterpreting my statement. I don't mean to imply that he became worse as a singer; I've gone on record saying I much prefer his '83 - '94 era. The quality of his voice improved when he reached that state.

And all of the FtLoSM performances (on the album, anyways) are divine. But he was clearly weakening on all technical aspects, including control. Even in TBF, there are times when he hits some notes that make me cringe. He couldn't do it anymore. Not like what the catalogue demanded and continues to demand.

TBF examples please.

The entirety of "Castles Burnin'" springs immediately to mind. The only thing that saves that song is Neal's fretwork.

Gideon wrote:

artist4perry wrote:And Giddy, as far as his being unable to sing..................how do you know? A clip of him singing DSB after yelling his lungs out at a ball game during the World Series? When the man sings for us then we can say if he can sing or not.

Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

Long story short: everything we've heard him do since the '80s makes it clear that he was losing it. Will he always have a great voice in terms of tone? Sure. But he can't tackle this shit anymore. He clearly doesn't possess the other factors.

Nothing some cold-knife surgery couldn't have restored somewhat...

artist4perry wrote:

Gideon wrote:

artist4perry wrote:And Giddy, as far as his being unable to sing..................how do you know? A clip of him singing DSB after yelling his lungs out at a ball game during the World Series? When the man sings for us then we can say if he can sing or not.

Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

Long story short: everything we've heard him do since the '80s makes it clear that he was losing it. Will he always have a great voice in terms of tone? Sure. But he can't tackle this shit anymore. He clearly doesn't possess the other factors.

High notes does not make you a great singer. Personally I like his lower ranges. To say he cannot sing is not the same as he cannot sing as high as he used to. I liked TBF. I also liked the solo stuff he did......Melody, a gorgeous song. After ROR. I Stand Alone........powerful and lovely. But if you don't care for it that is your choice.

I never said he couldn't sing. I simply said he couldn't sing "this shit" (i.e. Journey) anymore. Nor have I ever condemned his solo vocals or later-era works. TBF is my favorite Journey album.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-kOyVRlMlM

This is becoming my favorite song from him. Sooths me when I am blue.............not too shabby for an old fart who lost his ability to sing.............

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sde4Wy9pZFQ

If I ever do an annimated film........he can sing whatever he wants............

Gideon wrote:

artist4perry wrote:

Gideon wrote:

artist4perry wrote:And Giddy, as far as his being unable to sing..................how do you know? A clip of him singing DSB after yelling his lungs out at a ball game during the World Series? When the man sings for us then we can say if he can sing or not.

Because the man has been losing range since the mid-'80s. His TBF work was demonstrably weaker in all vocal categories and even on those rare occasions when he has sang backing vocals for various celebrities, you can hear that though he continues to maintain a pleasant tone, his range, power, breath control, and stamina are sub-par relative to what he used to be.

Long story short: everything we've heard him do since the '80s makes it clear that he was losing it. Will he always have a great voice in terms of tone? Sure. But he can't tackle this shit anymore. He clearly doesn't possess the other factors.

High notes does not make you a great singer. Personally I like his lower ranges. To say he cannot sing is not the same as he cannot sing as high as he used to. I liked TBF. I also liked the solo stuff he did......Melody, a gorgeous song. After ROR. I Stand Alone........powerful and lovely. But if you don't care for it that is your choice.

I never said he couldn't sing. I simply said he couldn't sing "this shit" (i.e. Journey) anymore. Nor have I ever condemned his solo vocals or later-era works. TBF is my favorite Journey album.

Understand...............Still love what he has done, past, present, and future?...........Steve?